PDA

View Full Version : POST YOUR COMBAT TIPS AND ADVICES



adarwinter
03-12-2008, 06:19 AM
Instead of someone writing a long tutorial for combat i decided to start a thread about combat tips and advices.

if u have a tip to give that was not given, post it's title in bold and tell us what it is.

lets skip the obvious tips like "u can counter an attack" and get slightly deeper

i will begin:

hidden blade counters - most of u know this already but if u counter while using the hidden blade u will get an instant kill against any target.

quick attacks and slow attacks - if u attack a guard when u r closer to him than u will perform a faster attack than if u had attacked from farther away.

stronger power attack (?) - i am not sure about this but maybe u can check this out for yourself and see if im right - if u make a powerful attack (hold attack button) from far away than your attack will be stronger and might break through the defence of a common guard. i think it has a higher chance of hitting.

side dodge - u can dodge to the sides and not just backwards. im not sure how helpful that is. maybe its slightly faster... dunno.


now you :
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

ScytheOfGrim
03-12-2008, 06:50 AM
Woah there...

Maybe you should slow down on the thread making spree...

There already is a "Combat, Weapons and Strategy" thread.

Made by Z if I remember correctly... >_>

Malidictus
03-12-2008, 10:39 AM
I had a look at the Official "Weapons, strategy and combat system" discussion thread (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/5251069024/m/5481080884/p/1) and, unless I'm looking at the wrong thing, it seems to be mostly speculation on what the weapons of Assassin's Creed will be. It ends at around September of last year, with a more recent post from someone asking about the crossbow.

Granted, I didn't check all 23 pages, but judging by the dates, it doesn't seem to house any tactics relevant to the actual game. If there is a more current one, I'd love to have a look at it, as I have some questions, myself.

As far as a guide goes, I'm pretty much determined to write one, but I'd like to replay the game before I do that. I'm not playing it right now, and my experience may be a little hazy. And besides, I gotta' double-check everything http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

ScytheOfGrim
03-12-2008, 10:48 AM
Well, if the thread was made before the game's release, would you not expect the dates of the posts to be way back when? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

It does not justify the cause to make a whole new thread for the purpose of a guide that, chances are, most people would not care about.

It's a waste of bandwidth, nonetheless.

Crash_Plague
03-12-2008, 12:45 PM
wait, wait, before you close this thread, I have a really good combat strategy!!!!

It's a little spoilerish, so only look below if you have completed at least 3 of the Assassinations.



.
Ok, here is my strategy.

Try as hard as you can to kill people.....

That's it.

adarwinter
03-12-2008, 12:51 PM
the thread in question is indeed old and there are 22 pages of speculations prior to the 17 of november.
yes, AC is 5 months old now and the ppl most eager to read about it are PC gamers which will probably start visiting these boards soon.
i did create about 3 threads in the past 3 days but 2 of them are legit (IMO) since they provoke ppl to suggest and discuss key features about this game. whether ppl will read malidictus' tutorial or this thread or not shouldnt be a deciding factor if to condone the subject or let it slide. i think , with the absence of a similar living thread, that this one is legit and should be open for discussion. for some, like u, scytheofgrin, it has no appeal probably since u r over the game and know all u need of it, but for others, new comers such as myself, it is an interesting matter which many would love to discuss. i still see others that just recently discovered that they can dodge to the sides and use the hidden blade to counter. i think that they alone can justify a thread like this one.
this isnt a "i hate this person" nor it is a "where's the PC version" kinda thread. its legitimate subject.

so please - if u have any combat tips on the game, lets hear 'em.

p.s. - pardon my english. aint my 1st tongue.

Malidictus
03-12-2008, 04:22 PM
Actually, the reason I support this initiative more than anything else is because I looked for guides for the game, and all of the ones I was able to find were walkthroughs. I don't consider Assassin's Creed a complicated game, so I never really got into one, other than what to do in "the real world," as Desmond's interaction controls are terrible.

What I DID NOT find, however, was a combat guide that told me what the powers we gained did, when to use them, what they were good for and what the dangers of using them were. Perhaps most people are just content to Counter the whole game through and don't care, but I do. I knew you could dodge to the side, but only because I did it accidentally. I know how Combo Kills work reasonably well just from trying the game, but even so I'm still not certain. To this day I'm not certain what Regain Balance does.

A guide that focuses on game mechanics is, I would believe, important, especially for new people looking for a leg up. Let's face it - the game is something like 80% mechanics, 20% plot and playthrough. If you know the mechanics, you can figure the rest out AND you can make the game a load of fun along the way.

Me... I'll have to play the whole game all over again, this time WITH knowledge of how to play it so that I can experience it to its fullest. I enjoyed my first time through, but all the stumbling in the dark I had to do was NOT part of that enjoyment.

Soon as I get done with some rather pressing responsibilities and get the chance to play through the whole game again, I'll see about making one such, then probably submit it to you guys for evaluation.

Crash_Plague
03-12-2008, 08:00 PM
@Malidictus: Regain balance is basically for this purpose; if you are running in a crowd and you bump into one person, Altair will fall, but then roll and get back up, continuing his run without stopping.

Also, if you are about to fall off a ledge, Altair will back up instead of falling off and catching the ledge.


Hope you understand now.

ZmeySPB
03-12-2008, 08:03 PM
I always run up to enemy and kill them with the hidden blade, then quickly move and do a combo kill, then wait for someone to attack me and do a counter kill, and then combo kill again.

Longjocks
03-12-2008, 08:11 PM
Gotta love forums with so many unofficial moderators around.

The best tip I can give is to not actually hold the right trigger when not making an attack. If you need to block or counter then only hit it when someone swings at you. Same thing in regard to attacking.

Whether or not others experience the same thing, I seemed to be grabbed a lot less and counters when being attacked from behind seemed to be more successful. It may have been that by doing this I forced myself to be more patient and thoughtful during combat rather than this being part of the gameplay mechanic. When I get the game back off my mate I shall test it out and see if it's all in my head.

ScytheOfGrim
03-12-2008, 09:01 PM
whether ppl will read malidictus' tutorial or this thread or not shouldnt be a deciding factor if to condone the subject or let it slide. i think , with the absence of a similar living thread, that this one is legit and should be open for discussion. for some, like u, scytheofgrin, it has no appeal probably since u r over the game and know all u need of it, but for others, new comers such as myself, it is an interesting matter which many would love to discuss.

I never said this thread isn't legit, I just said that there already was a similar thread, and it would have been better had he posted this there, there is no need for a new thread, although I am not asking for it to be locked.

Of course there are people that don't understand some of the game mechanics!
And that's why I think one of these combat and strategy threads (preferably the first, original one) should be stickied right at the top of the forums.
It would save a lot of people the time.


Gotta love forums with so many unofficial moderators around.

So only mods are allowed to give good advice from now on? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif


I didn't intend this to g into "argument mode", I merely wished to point it out.

Because there are more and more people visiting the forum daily, we need to spread the use of the "find" feature.
You don't want another thirty threads like this, do you?

adarwinter
03-13-2008, 05:40 AM
Originally posted by Crash_Plague:
@Malidictus: Regain balance is basically for this purpose; if you are running in a crowd and you bump into one person, Altair will fall, but then roll and get back up, continuing his run without stopping.

Also, if you are about to fall off a ledge, Altair will back up instead of falling off and catching the ledge.


Hope you understand now.

i dont. is it an active action? should i press something to regain balance or is it automatic?

also, a question - if the crowd supposed to be this moving obstacle (jade use the football comparison) but altair can knock over ppl than what is the big deal about the corwd, than? whey cant really block me cuz i can knock them out of my way? and it barely slows me down from my sprint :/

get pushed into objects - when i get grabed and then pushed i tend to make myself get slammed into object so i wouldnt go into a long roll and get back into the fight quikly.
this may not be a good advice but it what i do :P feel free to suggest otherwise with your own reasons...

loveboof
03-14-2008, 02:48 AM
regain balance is automatic. And you get an ability that enables you to roll and get up straight after being thrown - so dont get in the habit of trying to fall into things.

Crash_Plague
03-14-2008, 07:53 PM
Originally posted by adarwinter:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Crash_Plague:
@Malidictus: Regain balance is basically for this purpose; if you are running in a crowd and you bump into one person, Altair will fall, but then roll and get back up, continuing his run without stopping.

Also, if you are about to fall off a ledge, Altair will back up instead of falling off and catching the ledge.


Hope you understand now.

i dont. is it an active action? should i press something to regain balance or is it automatic?

also, a question - if the crowd supposed to be this moving obstacle (jade use the football comparison) but altair can knock over ppl than what is the big deal about the corwd, than? whey cant really block me cuz i can knock them out of my way? and it barely slows me down from my sprint :/

get pushed into objects - when i get grabed and then pushed i tend to make myself get slammed into object so i wouldnt go into a long roll and get back into the fight quikly.
this may not be a good advice but it what i do :P feel free to suggest otherwise with your own reasons... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

As loveboof has said, yes, the action is automatic, and you don't really need to to do anything, it is just one of the upgrades that helps you whenever you actually need it.

adarwinter
03-15-2008, 06:12 AM
i think i found something that is better in dodge compared to counter -

dodging a defense break - i might be wrong about this since there were so many guards around but i think that if a guard used defense break on you than u can dodge the next hit.

Malidictus
03-15-2008, 06:42 AM
dodging a defense break - i might be wrong about this since there were so many guards around but i think that if a guard used defense break on you than u can dodge the next hit.

You can, and that's one of the beautiful moves in the game, especially when used on stronger guards who will themselves dodge and counter. Take this often-seen scene, for example.

I'm staring down a large group of guards, waiting to make sure there aren't any adventurous *******s who'll want to rush me when out of nowhere I take a guard break. Noticing Altair flailing his hands, I know this was a guard break and I'm about to take a sword to the face, so I dodge, and immediately counter-attack. The guard blocks one hit, parries the other, then dodges back himself and returns for a counter-attack. Thinking ahead, I put on my defence stance once again and parry his incoming attack. If the fates have their eye on me, I could do a counter or maybe another dodge, but usually we just return to stand-off mode.

But hot dang, that looks so incredibly cool. It's like the fight with the fat guy or with the vizier in the ORIGINAL Prince of Persia game http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

*note*
When I say "original Prince of Persia game," I'm not talking about Sands of Time, I'm talking about the first one that ever came out, called just "Prince of Persia," back before even "The Shadow and the Flame."

*edit*

@Malidictus: Regain balance is basically for this purpose; if you are running in a crowd and you bump into one person, Altair will fall, but then roll and get back up, continuing his run without stopping.
Also, if you are about to fall off a ledge, Altair will back up instead of falling off and catching the ledge.
Hope you understand now.

And before I forget, thank you KINDLY for the info. That makes sense when I think about it. I read somewhere that it had to do with getting up from a grab faster, but that didn't seem to be the case when a friend of mine started the game from scratch.

Is is me, though, or is the not being able to drop off a ledge due to "regain balance" a bit annoying? I mean, why would I run into an edge unless I wanted to drop off of it? And even if I did, what's the big deal with hanging off and then climbing back on? Seems a bit silly.

adarwinter
03-15-2008, 04:24 PM
When I say "original Prince of Persia game," I'm not talking about Sands of Time, I'm talking about the first one that ever came out, called just "Prince of Persia," back before even "The Shadow and the Flame."


oh i thought about this as well http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif the old school POP http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif classic.

but sadly the fights still doesnt seem very balanced. the guards dont use defense break enough and when they do now i see i can dodge it?! that makes holding the block button even more un-balanced and over powered http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif and dont ask me to ignore the moves i can do! that is not a fix for the well-too-easy combat.

oldman765
03-15-2008, 04:30 PM
Has anyone else nottice that sometimes if you don t lock onto the guard and you slash em or whatever that you will sometimes do a cinematic counter . But when i try again i seem to only fail but it just randomly happens there re quite cool and are just like the counters you get when your locked on but yea

Malidictus
03-15-2008, 04:46 PM
but sadly the fights still doesnt seem very balanced. the guards dont use defense break enough and when they do now i see i can dodge it?! that makes holding the block button even more un-balanced and over powered

Combat in Assassin's Creed depends on what skills you have. Once you have them all, you quite literally have an answer to everything. There is NOTHING the soldiers can do that you cannot protect yourself against. But then, when you think about it, most games are like that. Even Street Fighter doesn't give the CPU attacks you can't escape from if you know when to act and what to do.

It's true that you can parry a Guard Break (which I believe shouldn't be allowed, but there you go), and it's true that you can dodge the follow-up of the Guard Break. However, both the Guard Break and the follow-up come out pretty dang fast, leaving you with a VERY small window of opportunity to react. If you're expecting them, it's incredibly easy to respond, but if you're not, it can come as quite a shock. Keep in mind there are often 20 people vying for a crack at your skull.

Also, it's true that soldiers in general don't do a lot of Guard Breaks. However, Templars and elite soldiers do perform them, and with good frequency. They also parry, dodge and counter a lot, too. It's just that there's usually one of those per group of soldiers and you can usually kill them in some dumb way before they can really let rip. But in a melee with a lot of strong soldiers, when you need to spot not only who it is that's attacking, but also exactly what it is they're doing, it isn't always as easy.

Personally, I believe that if you can beat all the guards easily and you've grasped the exact timing of combat, it's time to start over and try your luck over again without all the skills. Personally, I intend to do just that when I get the time to replay the game, and I'll pretend that Flags and Templars don't exist. Too hard to collect and they spoil the fun of the game for me.

The combat IS easy, I'll admit. I find it exciting and pretty, but it IS easy. However that's combat towards the very end. Combat in the beginning, when your Synch bar is short and your bag of tricks mostly empty, it isn't quite as easy. The game just gives you progress, and at the end, you're at the peak of your power. It should come as no surprise that you can kill everyone. If you don't enjoy staging pretty battles with many enemies, play over. It's what I did with all of Ubi's Prince of Persia games like 10 times over http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

adarwinter
03-15-2008, 05:10 PM
a game that becomes easier towards the end.
what a notion...

heres a discovery i found out (perhaps its just me that woke up late, but it is a shocker to me at least) - the guards dont block. what seems like a block is actually them taking the hit. i found out that when im attacking a guard he will always manage to block 4 times before getting that hit that kills him. or that a common guard will always block the first power-attack and the second one will kill him. that's when i realized that enemies dont block, they just appear that they do but that's how they look when they get hit.
if that is the case than what is all the comotion about getting the combo timing right?

guards also have a "hit" animation with some blood in it. what is that, than? does that imply that i made more damage? cuz it doesn't look like it.
so if whatever i do causes damage to enemies than besides the very rare counters they have nothing against al-tair. maybe they only dont take damage if they are in "defense" mode http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif which usually doesnt happen.

Malidictus
03-16-2008, 09:45 AM
the guards dont block

What looks like a block is actually a "one point" hit, like when you get hit while not in High Profile mode. Most low-level guards indeed do not block. But watch the elite ones and they DO parry, and a lot, at that. It's hard to spot if you're not looking for it, but they do. Templars especially will parry a lot of hits and eventually counter.

Weaker guards are just weak, while stronger guards ARE noticeably stronger. Specifically, taking on those roaming squads in the Kingdom will show you who the weak guards are and who the strong ones are.

Also, hits that strike flesh do indeed hurt more than hits that strike a "block." I've taken out guards with a single big attack from full health, and taken elite guards in a few good hits, as opposed to a dozen hits banging on their block.

adarwinter
03-16-2008, 04:10 PM
that's a shame.
lets say the guards have 4 levels -
common guard (the most common ones, that dont block)
easy ones (in damascus they have grey helmets)
tough ones (in damascus they wear gold helmets)
elite ones (with that large helmet with the nose bridge defender)

the common and easy dont seem to block... the easy ones take more damage but... i dunno. its another thing that disappointed me to see about the combat.

i hope that the PC version will have mods for it though i doubt it so much! i really dont think this game will sell well on the PC... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif so not many moders will be on it.

Toyotama
03-16-2008, 06:22 PM
Originally posted by adarwinter:
that's a shame.
lets say the guards have 4 levels -
common guard (the most common ones, that dont block)
easy ones (in damascus they have grey helmets)
tough ones (in damascus they wear gold helmets)
elite ones (with that large helmet with the nose bridge defender)

the common and easy dont seem to block... the easy ones take more damage but... i dunno. its another thing that disappointed me to see about the combat.

i hope that the PC version will have mods for it though i doubt it so much! i really dont think this game will sell well on the PC... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif so not many moders will be on it.

There are only 3 types of guards... I heard it in an interview and also applied my powers of observation to it:
Common Guard: No helmets (Saracens generally have funny hats) or armor and crappy fighting skills (they almost always run if they see too much carnage)
Elite Guards: All have helmets (Note: Crusader guards have small helms and Saracens have gold conical hats), but these helmets are generally small and they can put up a fight (sometimes they run)
Leader Guards: VERY easy to distinguish, generally found leading groups of lesser guards, and found to be heavily (Crusaders wear huge and sometimes colored head-and-face helmets, while Saracens either wear silver conical ones or domed helmets with a flower-thing on top) armored (NEVER, NOT EVER found to run away) plus they can kick your booty much easier than other guards

Other than that there are the Templars (which counter, block, and dodge a lot) which are pretty easy to find.

(Note: Crusader guard rank is also told by the length of their kilts/skirts, which go in least to greatest in length)
(Another Note: Saracen leaders have silver plates for body armor)
(Yet Another Note: Leaders are usually singular in number in fights)
(Oh Look! It's A Note: Common guards always speak English, while stronger guards always say things that sound like gibberish)

adarwinter
03-17-2008, 04:58 AM
thanks for the insight, toyotama.
so u r saying that the guards with the gold helmets and the silver helmets are of the same skill? just a dfferent look? (the ones from jerusalem and damascus).
i wouldnt call them elite...
none of the bunch is difficult cuz if u hit them with a very long combo they all die after a few strikes if they do not counter.

sivlar74
04-21-2008, 02:31 PM
I just picked up the PC version last week and have been playing for a bit. I think I am about halfway through memory thread 3.

Was hoping for some combat tips regarding two things.

Attack Combos - Having a hell of a time getting these to work. Yet, in tutorial mode when I select combo practice I can rip them off left and right. Fighting guards, I never ever seem to be able to pull them off.

Throw Counters - Templars and Knights seem to do this a lot to me, I go to throw them and they knee me right in the nuts. Is there some special way to counter throws? I can counter attack no problem but cannot seem to counter throw anyone.

Any suggestions on this? Possible timing issues? Or possibly I am just getting old and my hand/eye coordination is not what it used to be heh.

mikeslasher86
04-21-2008, 03:09 PM
yeahh!!!!!!

moqqy
04-21-2008, 03:25 PM
Originally posted by sivlar74:
I just picked up the PC version last week and have been playing for a bit. I think I am about halfway through memory thread 3.

Was hoping for some combat tips regarding two things.

Attack Combos - Having a hell of a time getting these to work. Yet, in tutorial mode when I select combo practice I can rip them off left and right. Fighting guards, I never ever seem to be able to pull them off.

Throw Counters - Templars and Knights seem to do this a lot to me, I go to throw them and they knee me right in the nuts. Is there some special way to counter throws? I can counter attack no problem but cannot seem to counter throw anyone.

Any suggestions on this? Possible timing issues? Or possibly I am just getting old and my hand/eye coordination is not what it used to be heh.

Countering throws: Press the BLOCK button and then your empty hand button when they grab you.

Attack combos: Yes, they work a lot better in the training area in Masyaf. You need to get the timing much better with real guards.

adarwinter
04-22-2008, 05:47 AM
for me the hardest thing to pull off is the defense-break-dodge. i didnt know this but apparently u can dodge if the guard broke your defense. it has a very small window but it works.

p.s. - silvar74, maybe u havent gained the grab-counter ability yet.
but actually getting out of grabs is not that important since grabs and throws dont take away any of your health. i dont get it. i think they should hurt al-tair a bit.

moqqy
04-22-2008, 11:33 AM
Originally posted by adarwinter:
for me the hardest thing to pull off is the defense-break-dodge. i didnt know this but apparently u can dodge if the guard broke your defense. it has a very small window but it works.

p.s. - silvar74, maybe u havent gained the grab-counter ability yet.
but actually getting out of grabs is not that important since grabs and throws dont take away any of your health. i dont get it. i think they should hurt al-tair a bit.

Why? Grabs and throws like the guards do DON'T hurt you in real life either. It is unrealistic though that they can't get through your defence with swords but they can with their hands. I, for one, would cut their hand off with the blade if they grabbed me, instead of just kicking them away

the_assassin_07
04-22-2008, 12:25 PM
I would like to post a combat tip.

"Stick them with the pointy end"

Courtesy of ALT+CTRL+DEL.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

adarwinter
04-23-2008, 06:30 AM
Originally posted by moqqy:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by adarwinter:
for me the hardest thing to pull off is the defense-break-dodge. i didnt know this but apparently u can dodge if the guard broke your defense. it has a very small window but it works.

p.s. - silvar74, maybe u havent gained the grab-counter ability yet.
but actually getting out of grabs is not that important since grabs and throws dont take away any of your health. i dont get it. i think they should hurt al-tair a bit.

Why? Grabs and throws like the guards do DON'T hurt you in real life either. It is unrealistic though that they can't get through your defence with swords but they can with their hands. I, for one, would cut their hand off with the blade if they grabbed me, instead of just kicking them away </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

why? cuz when altair reverses a grab he does hurt the guards. why would they get hurt and not altair? there are waaaay too many things going for altairs favour and cuz of things like these the game is so easy. right now when i get grabbed, 80% of the time i really dont mind getting tossed around. why would i mind? it doesn hurt and the chances of falling off a roof are way to slim and i mostly fight on the ground.

if the guards would used the defense break a lot more often than the combat would pbecome much more challenging, forcing the player to block with good timing and not just holding block forever.