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XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 12:49 PM
I have gradually started to use trim to make level flight easier and am looking forward to cracking formation flying someday soon.

Can someone give me some rough pointers for trimming in combat please so I can see what all the fuss is about?

I'd like to put trim on a slider as well but have no idea how to go about creating a map for my stick (CH 568 Combatstick USB). Same with prop pitch too. Control Manager seems to be in English but can't say I actually understand it...

Actually, come to think of some other posts, I should say that this is a serious queston!http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_redface.gif

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_07.gif


She turned me into a newt, but I got better.

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 12:49 PM
I have gradually started to use trim to make level flight easier and am looking forward to cracking formation flying someday soon.

Can someone give me some rough pointers for trimming in combat please so I can see what all the fuss is about?

I'd like to put trim on a slider as well but have no idea how to go about creating a map for my stick (CH 568 Combatstick USB). Same with prop pitch too. Control Manager seems to be in English but can't say I actually understand it...

Actually, come to think of some other posts, I should say that this is a serious queston!http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_redface.gif

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_07.gif


She turned me into a newt, but I got better.

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 12:57 PM
RBJ, enlighten this poor soul, will you? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

<center>http://users.pandora.be/vnnet/FBforum/sig9.jpg
sorriest s.o.b. in all WW2</center>

michapma
08-08-2003, 01:05 PM
To "put controls on a slider" you do this: from the main menu click Controls, then scroll all the way to the bottom of the controls menu where it says HOTAS. Simply click on the right-hand side of the row of the control you want to assign to a slider and move the slider. The assignment is finished, though you might be careful about + and &minus;. Obviously your slider has to be working properly first.

Good luck,
Mike

<table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="10"><tr valign="middle" bgcolor="#3e463b"><td height="40" colspan="3" align="center">The ongoing IL-2 User's Guide project (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/)</a></td></tr><tr bgcolor="#515e2f"><td width="40%">FB engine management:
Manifold Pressure sucks (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182081-1.html)
Those Marvelous Props (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182082-1.html)
Mixture Magic (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182084-1.html)
Putting It All Together (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182085-1.html)
Those Fire-Breathing Turbos (Part 1 of 6) (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182102-1.html)</td><td align="center">

=69.GIAP=Chap

69.GIAP (http://www.baseclass.modulweb.dk/giap/)</p></td><td width="40%" align="right" valign="top">Hardware:
Flight Simulation Performance Analyzed (http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_062a.html)
Building a home-made throttle quadrant step by step (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkavv)
Sound Can Be Hazardous for Games (http://www6.tomshardware.com/game/20030405/index.html)</td></tr></table>

michapma
08-08-2003, 01:06 PM
Oh, and in FB the elevator trim won't help you in combat unless you go to some effort to redefine some joystick settings. You'll have to ask someone else about that though. Nice to have precision slider control of course, but the delay time makes it hard to use.

<table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="10"><tr valign="middle" bgcolor="#3e463b"><td height="40" colspan="3" align="center">The ongoing IL-2 User's Guide project (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/)</a></td></tr><tr bgcolor="#515e2f"><td width="40%">FB engine management:
Manifold Pressure sucks (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182081-1.html)
Those Marvelous Props (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182082-1.html)
Mixture Magic (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182084-1.html)
Putting It All Together (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182085-1.html)
Those Fire-Breathing Turbos (Part 1 of 6) (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182102-1.html)</td><td align="center">

=69.GIAP=Chap

69.GIAP (http://www.baseclass.modulweb.dk/giap/)</p></td><td width="40%" align="right" valign="top">Hardware:
Flight Simulation Performance Analyzed (http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_062a.html)
Building a home-made throttle quadrant step by step (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkavv)
Sound Can Be Hazardous for Games (http://www6.tomshardware.com/game/20030405/index.html)</td></tr></table>

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 02:33 PM
thanks - tried the HOTAS route a while back and that didn't work as other controls somehow programmed into appropriate sliders which a simple attempt to redefine won't fix.

I figure I'll need to make a map but CH Cotrol Manager makes no sense to me. hey ho.


http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_07.gif


She turned me into a newt, but I got better.

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 02:45 PM
Elevator trim is a must in combat.

Ever since the first week of the original IL2, aces have been using copious ammounts of elevator trim to out-turn their opponents at high speeds.

Since FB, nothing has changed. You can still use lots of elevator trim to out-turn opponents at high speeds. The FM is the same. Only the speed at which the trim tabs move has been changed. So you have to pre-trim before combat.

Unfortunately this can result in you having to fly with the stick pressed forward in order to have lots of trim avaialable. Fortunately, you can just recalibrate your joystick and also redo your spring FFB file and smooth a few settings out in your FB joystick hardware settings screen (RBJ Shift) and fly level and hands free, with near maximum trim ready at hand, ready to out-turn noobs at will.

Good thing Oleg didn't really fix trim. And now only those who are REALLY in the know can use it well! (less whinning)

<img src=http://lafayettefederation.com/screenshots/repository/turo/tn-Numbaone.jpg>
"The Force is strong with this one." -What an ace said of RayBanJockey during a fight when he was still a newbie.
<a href=http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612109283>news update</a>

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 04:06 PM
Thanks - I'll see if it works for me!

Now, what I'm having trouble with is this.

I have a CH Combatstick USB which is fine, except, one slider works for the throttle and the other 2 cover elevator and ailerons (like the cursors on keyboard). I'd like the two spare sliders to cover trim and prop pitch instead.

Reassignment on HOTAS doesn't work, so does anyone know how to make a map using CH Control Manager? I think that's what I need to do, but Help in CH CM only seems to help if you already know how to program a joystick, which I don't.

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_07.gif


She turned me into a newt, but I got better.

michapma
08-08-2003, 04:16 PM
Not to be rude, but have you tried the forum of your stick manufacturer? The folks there probably have the specific knowledge you need.

Cheers,
Mike

<table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="10"><tr valign="middle" bgcolor="#3e463b"><td height="40" colspan="3" align="center">The ongoing IL-2 User's Guide project (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/)</a></td></tr><tr bgcolor="#515e2f"><td width="40%">FB engine management:
Manifold Pressure sucks (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182081-1.html)
Those Marvelous Props (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182082-1.html)
Mixture Magic (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182084-1.html)
Putting It All Together (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182085-1.html)
Those Fire-Breathing Turbos (Part 1 of 6) (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182102-1.html)</td><td align="center">

=69.GIAP=Chap

69.GIAP (http://www.baseclass.modulweb.dk/giap/)</p></td><td width="40%" align="right" valign="top">Hardware:
Flight Simulation Performance Analyzed (http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_062a.html)
Building a home-made throttle quadrant step by step (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkavv)
Sound Can Be Hazardous for Games (http://www6.tomshardware.com/game/20030405/index.html)</td></tr></table>

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 06:19 PM
THESE KIND OF POSTS ARE BULLCHIT...
WHY IS RBJ ALLOWED TO RUN AROUND THIS FORUM TEACHING OTHERS HOW TO CHEAT ITS MADNESS THIS IS CRAP IN THE HIGHEST LEVEL

RBJ YOU CHEATING BASSAD!!!!!!!!!


RayBanJockey wrote:
- Elevator trim is a must in combat.
-
- Ever since the first week of the original IL2, aces
- have been using copious ammounts of elevator trim to
- out-turn their opponents at high speeds.
-
- Since FB, nothing has changed. You can still use
- lots of elevator trim to out-turn opponents at high
- speeds. The FM is the same. Only the speed at
- which the trim tabs move has been changed. So you
- have to pre-trim before combat.
-
- Unfortunately this can result in you having to fly
- with the stick pressed forward in order to have lots
- of trim avaialable. Fortunately, you can just
- recalibrate your joystick and also redo your spring
- FFB file and smooth a few settings out in your FB
- joystick hardware settings screen (RBJ Shift) and
- fly level and hands free, with near maximum trim
- ready at hand, ready to out-turn noobs at will.
-
- Good thing Oleg didn't really fix trim. And now
- only those who are REALLY in the know can use it
- well! (less whinning)
-
- <img
- src=http://lafayettefederation.com/screenshots/rep
- ository/turo/tn-Numbaone.jpg>
- "The Force is strong with this one." -What an ace
- said of RayBanJockey during a fight when he was
- still a newbie.
- news update (http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.p
-)



<center><FONT COLOR="white">ӚFJ-M œ R D ˜ ӡ[/i]</font>

<center> http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/ah_109_1059752328.jpg </center>

<center><FONT COLOR="white">
I am He who lives, and was dead
and behold
I am alive forevermore.
I am the Alpha and the Omega
the Begining and the End.[/i]</font>

XyZspineZyX
08-08-2003, 06:31 PM
I like it short on the sides and neck,little longer at the top.That´s how I trim it.

<img src="http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/ah_113_1060360404.jpg"



Message Edited on 08/08/0305:53PM by Superluminal

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 04:10 AM
OK...again good airmanship versus stoopidity, Trim in combat is a NO NO ( In real life=trim neutral)

trim is to be used ONLY on straffing runs, or flight conditions that require stability, like level bombing or stabilized take off, cruise and landing.


Hi Ven...how is it going on the moderator...business?


dont let an asshat ruin the fun of flying a simulation, trim in a dogfight is simply a distraction that will cost you the fight

http://mywebpage.netscape.com/kurbalaganda/Bf109G6+trim+instructions.pdf

http://mywebpage.netscape.com/kurbalaganda/trim1.jpg


http://mywebpage.netscape.com/kurbalaganda/trim2.jpg


http://mywebpage.netscape.com/kurbalaganda/trim+expanded.jpg


http://mywebpage.netscape.com/kurbalaganda/trim350mph.jpg


http://mywebpage.netscape.com/kurbalaganda/Loco-S.gif

[B]Burning Avgas at alarming rates since 1990. [B]
<G>Visit http://www.aopa.org<G>
I love the Me 109 but... "Ich bin ein Würgerwhiner"!! too /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 05:05 AM
Real aces used trim all the time. It became so natural it was like riding a bike or driving a car. This was excellently modelled in IL2. In FB, however, it's a different story.

<img src=http://lafayettefederation.com/screenshots/repository/turo/tn-Numbaone.jpg>
"The Force is strong with this one." -What an ace said of RayBanJockey during a fight when he was still a newbie.
<a href=http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612109283>news update</a>

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 05:10 AM
AFJ_Murdoc wrote:
- THESE KIND OF POSTS ARE BULLCHIT...
- WHY IS RBJ ALLOWED TO RUN AROUND THIS FORUM TEACHING
- OTHERS HOW TO CHEAT ITS MADNESS THIS IS CRAP IN THE
- HIGHEST LEVEL
-
- RBJ YOU CHEATING BASSAD!!!!!!!!!

Wow... mommy didn't hug you enough when you were little?

Sheesh... calm down man.

Ronnie

<center>http://www3.sympatico.ca/corporon2001/First_Kill.jpg </center>
<center>Woot! First online Kill!</center>

"The proletarians have nothing to lose but their chains. They have a world to win."
-Karl Marx, Friedrich Engels, "The Communist Manifesto"

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage."
-John Steinbeck, "The Grapes of Wrath"

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 05:37 AM
Dude..show the money...proof, so far you talk about hearsay and imaginary stuff.

BTW...I can kick your virtual self into tiny little pieces online...if you ever gather the guts to go there..


RayBanJockey wrote:
- Real aces used trim all the time. It became so
- natural it was like riding a bike or driving a car.
- This was excellently modelled in IL2. In FB,
- however, it's a different story.


http://mywebpage.netscape.com/kurbalaganda/Loco-S.gif

[B]Burning Avgas at alarming rates since 1990. [B]
<G>Visit http://www.aopa.org<G>
I love the Me 109 but... "Ich bin ein Würgerwhiner"!! too /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 05:42 AM
Loco-S, If I ever fought you online I would give you a heart attack. I am that kind of player. I used to make my friend throw up kicking his butt in NBA Live'98. I don't wish this fate on anybody.

<img src=http://lafayettefederation.com/screenshots/repository/turo/tn-Numbaone.jpg>
"The Force is strong with this one." -What an ace said of RayBanJockey during a fight when he was still a newbie.
<a href=http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612109283>news update</a>

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 05:56 AM
Dude its pretty simple. Trim yer ride up in route, Big time if you want to t&b. And do it before hand. Fuels not a real issue here so you can ride yer beast ruff if you want.

It's a major pain if you have to mash a button in a fight. Or try and get the trim on a slider junk working for you.

Gawd knows that is how they did it back in the day. Trim wheels in 09s and the rest. Just pull the stick into yer gut with both hands and reach down with the other hand and crank it for all yer worth. Just like the pros did it.



Heh.Joke. Trim as you must. But do it before hand. Adjusting trim in the middle of a black out bank is bogus. Everyone knows it.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 06:18 AM
try me...the bet is still on. with all the cheats you want to use and all I own you.


RayBanJockey wrote:
- Loco-S, If I ever fought you online I would give you
- a heart attack. I am that kind of player. I used
- to make my friend throw up kicking his butt in NBA
- Live'98. I don't wish this fate on anybody.


http://mywebpage.netscape.com/kurbalaganda/Loco-S.gif

[B]Burning Avgas at alarming rates since 1990. [B]
<G>Visit http://www.aopa.org<G>
I love the Me 109 but... "Ich bin ein Würgerwhiner"!! too /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 06:44 AM
i wish i had as much insight into how aces flew as rbj does

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 06:55 AM
I love RBJ...I would let him do me without the KY....you know he is an animal in bed.

Happy hunting and check six!

Tony Ascaso, RN

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 06:59 AM
Dude...he barely knows how to pick his own nose.....



Timmothias wrote:
- i wish i had as much insight into how aces flew as
- rbj does
-
-



http://mywebpage.netscape.com/kurbalaganda/Loco-S.gif

[B]Burning Avgas at alarming rates since 1990. [B]
<G>Visit http://www.aopa.org<G>
I love the Me 109 but... "Ich bin ein Würgerwhiner"!! too /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 07:06 AM
AFJ_Murdoc wrote:
- THESE KIND OF POSTS ARE BULLCHIT...
- WHY IS RBJ ALLOWED TO RUN AROUND THIS FORUM TEACHING
- OTHERS HOW TO CHEAT ITS MADNESS THIS IS CRAP IN THE
- HIGHEST LEVEL
-
- RBJ YOU CHEATING BASSAD!!!!!!!!!

LOL!!!! Use of trim is not cheating!!! LOL... I ant believe this one has reared it's ugly head again!!! LMAO /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif ... If it is in the sim and it was on real planes and dont think for a second that a pilot in combat wouldnt have used trim if he thought it could give him even the slightest edge.....you are dreaming!!!

<CENTER>http://www.world-wide-net.com/tuskegeeairmen/ta-1943.jpg <marquee><FONT COLOR="RED"><FONT SIZE="+1">"Straighten up.......Fly right..~S~"<FONT SIZE> </marquee> http://www.geocities.com/rt_bearcat

<CENTER><FONT COLOR="ORANGE">vflyer@comcast.net<FONT COLOR>
<Center><div style="width:200;color:red;font-size:18pt;filter:shadow Blur[color=red,strength=8)">99th Pursuit Squadron

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 07:15 AM
All online aces use every exploit possible.

If it's in the game, it's in the game.

<img src=http://lafayettefederation.com/screenshots/repository/turo/tn-Numbaone.jpg>
"The Force is strong with this one." -What an ace said of RayBanJockey during a fight when he was still a newbie.
<a href=http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612109283>news update</a>

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 07:24 AM
this thread looks like fishing to me,so here is a fish

http://members.optusnet.com.au/~andycarroll68/fishwim.gif


No1RAAF_Pourshot


http://members.optusnet.com.au/~andycarroll68/CAC-15.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 07:24 AM
I've aced hundreds of times online. I have trim on a button. I pop it when I need to.

Granted I haven't played il in a long while. Or fb either for that matter.

Heck I rarely dogfight when I'm on line.

But I'd beat you rbj.



Care to be my huckleberry?



/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 04:39 PM
RayBanJockey wrote:
- Loco-S, If I ever fought you online I would give you
- a heart attack. I am that kind of player. I used
- to make my friend throw up kicking his butt in NBA
- Live'98. I don't wish this fate on anybody.
-

Now this would truly be a sight to see! Have any pics? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Ronnie

<center>http://www3.sympatico.ca/corporon2001/First_Kill.jpg </center>
<center>Woot! First online Kill!</center>

"The proletarians have nothing to lose but their chains. They have a world to win."
-Karl Marx, Friedrich Engels, "The Communist Manifesto"

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage."
-John Steinbeck, "The Grapes of Wrath"

XyZspineZyX
08-09-2003, 07:24 PM
nope not fishing, was a genuine question believe it or not.

I've seen a lot of stuff about trim here that was mostly having a laugh at RBJ's expense (and I make no comment in saying that!).

I don't know much about flying and I just wanted to understand the function of trim in game and RL a little better and now I know more than I did before. I even smiled wrily in a couple of places too.

But thanks for the fish. That's my first one.

Cheers


http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_07.gif


She turned me into a newt, but I got better.