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Eat_My_Shortz
08-24-2005, 02:10 AM
It's true! They're back!
(If you recall Uru, it was a huge disappointment that there were no flybys)...

Well, i'm pretty sure they ARE in Myst V. I played the demo. If you stand in Direbo and cross over the gate on the right (to Taghira, the snow bubble) and walk all the way over to the end of the gate, you can see a linking book.

If you squint real hard, you can see that the pixels are changing colour which sort of indicates that there will be flybys http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Layniel
08-24-2005, 03:56 AM
really? i didnt notice anything change... though i do have crappy texture quality

ivanxuereb
08-24-2005, 04:12 AM
Let's see if someone develops a flypatch.

jackoalan2004
08-24-2005, 09:48 AM
Yes, I noticed that if you avi folder in the eoa directory, there is a bink file of the flyby. There are also a few files of esher's live action face.

ivanxuereb
08-24-2005, 11:35 AM
Myst 5 takes place during/after Uru! The book links to Watson's refuge in to D'ni.

Mowog
08-24-2005, 01:57 PM
Myst 5 takes place during/after Uru! The book links to Watson's refuge in to D'ni. Well, remember that that room (an Eder Tomahn) was there well before Watson discovered it. Unless the panel showed Watson's belongings, that is, which would guarantee that the Myst V story happens after Uru.

JustBrett
08-24-2005, 02:52 PM
Originally posted by Mowog:
Unless the panel showed Watson's belongings, that is, which would guarantee that the Myst V story happens after Uru.
Did the D'ni ever build wooden folding cots, or is that something the DRC would have brought in? Somehow the cot doesn't seem very D'ni to me. I would think that they would have just carved another niche in the wall or something.

ivanxuereb
08-25-2005, 04:49 AM
Did you watch the scene? It's here if you installed it in the defult location: C:\Program Files\Ubisoft\Cyan Worlds\Myst V Demo\avi\restStop1.bik
You need a *.bik player to see the clip.

Eat_My_Shortz
08-25-2005, 06:35 AM
Originally posted by ivanxuereb:
Myst 5 takes place during/after Uru! The book links to Watson's refuge in to D'ni.
Err... actually in the Myst universe, it is possible for a place to exist in more than one time period. Crazy, I know, but Cyan thought it would help the stability of the game's plot.

</sarcasm> - sorry, couldn't resist.

But uhh, yeah that place is actually the place where Atrus and Gehn stopped off on the way down the first time Atrus went to D'ni (see: Book of Atrus). Watson explains this in his journal.

U can pretty much guarantee that MV takes place in between MIV and Uru.

JustBrett
08-25-2005, 10:19 AM
Originally posted by Eat_My_Shortz:
U can pretty much guarantee that MV takes place in between MIV and Uru.
Hmmm. You seem pretty confidant of that, but the meager evidence I've seen so far suggests to me that it takes place after Uru. However, the evidence is so slim that I would hesitate to place a bet either way.

yaycc
08-26-2005, 08:19 PM
So help me to understand, there are the linking books outside the bubbles on Direbo, and there are slates on pedistals inside the bubbles. Any ideas on what their different functions are?

They appear to be different technologies (D'ni/Bahro).

Might the use of them be part of the "choice" we have to make? Could we travel only one way, once we've "chosen"?

Or do they link to different places/Ages?

JustBrett
08-27-2005, 06:42 AM
Originally posted by yaycc:
So help me to understand, there are the linking books outside the bubbles on Direbo, and there are slates on pedistals inside the bubbles. Any ideas on what their different functions are?
It appears from the demo that at least one of the linking Books leads to the eder tomahn (rest stop) in the Great Shaft. I believe the Direbo linking Book is there, because we have a screen shot of the Direbo Book on a Nexus pedestal, and we know from Uru that there was a Nexus pedestal in the eder tomahn. Putting it all together, it looks to me like Direbo is our hub to the Ages through the bubbles, while we use the Books to travel between Direbo and D'ni. We must have to use a Book to get to each island, so we can unlock the bridge gates on that side.

That's my theory, and I'm sticking to it. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Layniel
08-27-2005, 06:59 AM
Rand would be proud of you!

also he would like to punch you for telling everyone their secret plans


thats most likely what is going to happen, specially because by every other bubble there is a linking book (3 in total i think) but there is only one flyby file in the avi folder (and that is to eder tomahn)

yaycc
08-27-2005, 09:53 AM
As I can't visit Uru on my Mac, some of these names and places are not familiar to me, other than from reading the forums. I keep meaning to read the strategy guide for Uru: Complete Chronicles . . .

I played Riven for six months before playing Myst -- being stuck and thinking that I might learn something there that would help me finish Riven. But, so much of what I learned in Riven gave me a quick trip through Myst. I enjoyed having to follow my gut reaction to the boys, and all went well.

I haven't finished Exile or Revelation, as I can't sit at the computer long enough (health reasons). End of Ages will, I hope, stand on its own and will allow us to venture forth innocently.

When I got Riven, I'd never played a computer game, and there were no instructions with the disks I got. I found it just like life, though. Not knowing what to do, we just begin and move forward, learning as we go. What a trip!

Layniel
08-27-2005, 11:44 AM
none of the ages from "end of ages" were mentioned in Uru (i think) but most of them were mentioned on the "d'ni restoration council" site as work in progress (i think noloben was almost finished... at least everyone was expecting it to be finally released)

i dont know if eder tomahn was mentioned in Uru, but it was mentioned in the books as the resting place between D'ni and the surface. (though it wa mostly used by Atrus' family)

the nexus pedestals were some pedestals (only used in D'ni) which had a linking book on it. It was activated by a KI (uhm dont remember what it stands for... its kinda a digital watch with many neat features) the linking book linked to a room (on another age) which had a collection of Books which linked to different districts of D'ni (though you needed the coordinates of the place you wanted to go)

dunno if you klnow but you cant directly link to a different place on the same age, you first have to link off the age, and then link back with a different linking book.

i guess for now, thats pretty much info http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

yaycc
08-27-2005, 12:28 PM
Thanks for taking the time to share insights. I'll have to go check out the DRC archives and learn more.

I trust that there will be an intro to orient those of us less in the know, once we get our M5 DVDs, not too long in the future now. I like to explore before rushing to solve anything too quickly, and that'll be the basis for forming my direction re Yeesha and Esher.

Can't resist speculations though. Yay!

LordTulla
08-27-2005, 01:37 PM
Here are the ages (outside of the cavern) & their status as of 2/2/2004 from the DRC website:
Ahnonay Phase Three Suspended
Dahtamnay Phase One Suspended
Dereno Phase Two Suspended
Eder Gira Phase Five Suspended
Eder Kemo Phase Five Suspended
Er'cana Phase Four Suspended
Gahreesen ----------- Suspended
Kadish Tolesa Phase Five Suspended
Kahlo Phase Four Suspended
Kalamee Phase One Suspended
Laki Phase Two Suspended
Negilahn Phase Four Suspended
Noloben Phase Two Suspended
Pento Phase One Suspended
Pirahnay Phase One Suspended
Rebek Phase Two Suspended
Teledahn Phase Five Suspended
Todelmer Phase Four Suspended
Uran (Silo) Phase Four Suspended
Venalem Phase One Suspended
0023 Unknown Phase Two Suspended

Eat_My_Shortz
08-30-2005, 08:15 AM
none of the ages from "end of ages" were mentioned in Uru (i think) but most of them were mentioned on the "d'ni restoration council" site as work in progress (i think noloben was almost finished... at least everyone was expecting it to be finally released)

i dont know if eder tomahn was mentioned in Uru, but it was mentioned in the books as the resting place between D'ni and the surface. (though it wa mostly used by Atrus' family)

As Crash pointed out, many of the Myst 5 ages are actually ages originally planned for Uru. Then Uru failed. So they reused the design.

Noloben and Todelmer were certainly planned for uru. We actually saw some screenshots of these 2 ages IN URU before they were cancelled.

Noloben itself was actually mentioned in uru. There is a note on Sharper's desk which says "The house on Noloben is not empty. There is a D'ni man living there, we will have to talk to him." (Misquoted from memory)
So I believe originally Esher was planned for Uru, on Noloben.

Now, even if myst 5 is planned to be set closer chronologically to myst 4 than uru, its still possible for the note in uru to refer to Esher, due to the long life of the D'ni.

Eder Tomahn was not only mentioned in Uru, but we got to visit it too. It seems to be almost exactly the same room as in Uru: To D'ni.

Finally, the round room in K'veer which is at the start of Myst V has also appeared many times: End of Myst, beginning of Riven and end of Uru: Path of the Shell.

Oh, and the Cleft appeared in Uru, but I'm not sure if we'll be seeing the same spot or just a spot nearby.

Aside from that as far as I know it's all new stuff.

Layniel
08-30-2005, 05:34 PM
yeah i know eder tomahn was there (hey, i was there too) i just mean, i dont know if the name itself was mentioned.

hey we even got to visit myst library in uru


mmhm some of the ages on the drc suspended list were in uru/to dni/pots ... so why are they marked as suspended

Gahreesen ----------- Suspended

gahreesen dindt even enter a phase

is this one of the older lists, or why is it like that?

Eat_My_Shortz
08-31-2005, 01:44 AM
Gahreesen and the others used to be "active" or something. THen when the DRC pulled out (as the story goes... this is the "To D'ni" story), all ages got suspended.

I don't think Eder Tomahn was mentioned, you'd have to check Dr. Watson's journal. Also you could check the filename of the place in the save folder... sometimes theyre named correctly others not. It's not considered "canon" if its just a file name though.

Kad.
09-03-2005, 11:54 AM
My belief: after IV but before URU. Why:

1. Yeesha is an adult...so it's after IV, although maybe she's just a projection like in URU (doubtful, and then I still don't know how to interpret ABM's ending when we see Yeesha in person).
2. The Shaft: in the trailers for V it seems clear that the shaft is in much better shape (note all the support beams and such) than it was when we attempted to scale it in URU. The bottom looks the same, but the shaft itself looks newer.

Eat_My_Shortz
09-04-2005, 05:44 AM
Ah good point.

Also lets not forget that Yeesha was PROBABLY dead in uru! Remember, "For the D'ni and for Yeesha, it was death that moved them."

The recordings were recordings, and seeing her in the flesh at the end, well I assume she's somehow "returned" to us in death, to put things right.

Hence that's a good excuse for her looking younger in Uru. If you recall in the latest release of Return of the Jedi, Anakin returns as a spirit at the conclusion, played by Hayden Christensen, and appearing as he did in Episode III before becoming Vader. The idea being that he returns in his "good" form, back to an earlier stage of his life.

Yeesha could very well be the same. Also obviously theres no proof that she IS older in myst 5 than uru, its all very subjective (although I'll agree that she does look it).

Hence we can't take the apparent age of Yeesha into account when trying to work out the time period.

I much prefer to observe that there is no sign that DRC are or ever were here in Myst 5, so its before uru.

uecasm
09-05-2005, 06:16 AM
I think "it was death that moved them" is more likely to mean "death that motivated them" -- ie. broke them out of their comfortable niche and got them doing something else.

In the case of the D'ni, it was the death of most of their civilisation that prompted a regrowth of sorts, moving to a new world and following slightly altered ideals.

For Yeesha, perhaps it was the death of Atrus that prompted her to go exploring Uru (the D'ni caverns), which in turn led to her other discoveries.

Eat_My_Shortz
09-05-2005, 06:56 AM
Atrus isn't dead!!! Nooooooo!

JustBrett
09-05-2005, 07:30 AM
Originally posted by uecasm:
For Yeesha, perhaps it was the death of Atrus that prompted her to go exploring Uru (the D'ni caverns), which in turn led to her other discoveries.
Yeesha talks about how both the D'ni and she, herself, became proud, and how death was the cure for that pride in both cases. "Only death can conquer pride so strong," she says, "it was death that moved me to return." But "return" doesn't mean physically returning to D'ni; it means "give back", which is a regular theme of her speeches.

My theory is that she's talking about the death of Teacher (as shown in the bahroglyphs in the lower Bahro cave in PotS) in her case. That death shocked her out of the pride she had developed after learning the lessons he had to teach. I believe it was at this point that Yeesha's pride in her new powers led her to revive Kadish, who killed Teacher. After Yeesha won the battle, she realized that her pride was responsible for the whole situation, and tore up the note in the second vault because of her shame.

Boyue65
09-06-2005, 02:11 AM
Those glyphs were a pain to take. Are they posted anywhere on the Web? I don't have the patience to pop up / down the ages five different times.

EDIT: to rehash a bit, my take is that Myst 5 takes place after Uru. The trail of evidence exists and is the most logical to follow. At the core of it is the out-of-story assumption that the material supplied by Cyan to Ubisoft was built for Uru, and makes the most sense to keep it in the Uru timeline. Much of the basic design work parallels with it. There's also the place that Yeesha left us; the reference to the house on Noloben being inhabited by Suthorford to Sharper; the same reference indicating that the Bahro were known to the D'ni; and the mere fact that Esher knows how to speak English. Were this set after Myst IV, he'd be jabbering at us in D'ni, and none but the most enthusiastic would be able to follow him.

The largest / most glaring problem with it is the assumption that we aren't playing the same Stranger any longer, but I'd have to suggest that since the original Stranger was human, he's long dead -- Yeesha ain't young anymore. In fact, to look that old in D'ni, she's have to be, oh, almost two hundred years old. Incidently, that puts her at about the right place for Uru. Now, that doesn't take into account her convoluted bloodline; we don't know what Moiety blood will do, but we DO know that Human blood will at the very least buff her disease resistance and reproductive rate but cut her lifespan in half -- and she's roughly 1/8th human, 3/8th D'ni, and half Moiety. Lots of unknowns there. At any rate, the idea is that the Stranger would have dropped dead of old age if nothinge else.

The idea of Yeeshae being dead in the modern time is a novel one, but seeing as we saw her in the flesh in the alternate Tomahna, we can conclude that she was at least alive at that time. We saw her handiwork once after that, in that she gave us a ride and a lightshow at the end of Path of the Shell.

And that's what I think. We'll find out soon enough, now.

uecasm
09-06-2005, 02:41 AM
the mere fact that Esher knows how to speak English. Were this set after Myst IV, he'd be jabbering at us in D'ni, and none but the most enthusiastic would be able to follow him. Except that Anna originally spoke English. She taught it to Atrus, who taught it to Yeesha. We know that Yeesha and Esher have come into contact (she enlisted his help, though it didn't work out in the end). It's not unreasonable to presume that either Atrus or Yeesha taught English to Esher.

Besides which, Anna lived in D'ni for several years before the Fall. She could have given English lessons to the D'ni -- *some* of them at least would have been curious enough to learn it.

Layniel
09-06-2005, 04:22 AM
yes, yeesha could have taught Esher to speak english, but only after uru, since when the DRC met Esher they couldnt communicate.
though it is possible that the stranger learned D'ni and so he understands what Esher says. Maybe we only hear him speak in english because the stranger was originally able to understand what Esher said


@Boyue65
we also know Yeesha has the power to time travel, she might have gone to the future, to meet the people for the new Uru

JustBrett
09-06-2005, 06:14 AM
Originally posted by Boyue65:
Those glyphs were a pain to take. Are they posted anywhere on the Web?
Yes, indeed! All of the bahroglyphs, including the PotS glyphs, are posted at the Web site of the Bahroglyph Study Group (http://linguists.bahro.com/domahreh/glyphs/images.html) of the D'ni Linguistics Fellowship (http://linguists.bahro.com/home.html). There is also a page by Dreamerblueon with an analysis (http://ca.geocities.com/dreamerblue@rogers.com/yeesha_glyphs_new.html) of the PotS glyphs, which makes a good starting point, though I don't entirely agree with the narrative.

Eat_My_Shortz
09-06-2005, 07:50 AM
Let's see...
Yeah Esher could know english. To those who say "maybe the player understands D'ni", I say, yes it could be that the game is "translating" the D'ni into english for the sake of the player (as many other games do), but I don't think so. It's never been done before.

The player has always understood only english, and whenever another character has spoken to us, its been unintelligible, OR english. Even remember that Gehn "wrote his journals in a language his men couldn't understand" - that language was English, the language used by his mother, which is why the player could understand them.

So I think Esher is speaking english, with a d'ni accent.

BUT i believe its set before uru.
As for Yeesha being alive in Uru, well the fact she's a physical body at the end doesn't prove much. So was Jesus. So was Medivh in Warcraft. So were a lot of "prophets" its a very prophetty thing to do i think, to come back to redeem yourself.

Why do you think Yeesha is able to talk to us in echoey voices in POTS... they ain't messages they are live. She's a spirit thingy at that stage.

In Myst V she isn't. Also as far as the story we've seen tells it, Yeesha is pretty UN-powerful in Myst V, she can't complete the quest. Obviously she got a lot more powerful since then.

JustBrett
09-06-2005, 10:58 AM
Originally posted by Eat_My_Shortz:
Also as far as the story we've seen tells it, Yeesha is pretty UN-powerful in Myst V, she can't complete the quest. Obviously she got a lot more powerful since then.
As I understand the premise, she DID complete the quest, but then misused the tablet somehow, so access to it was taken away from her. Thus, she needs a stooge or assistant to fetch the tablet and use it a different way. In the bonus video it appears that she's about to wave her hand and send you popping off to the volcano to begin the quest, so she has the same powers that she showed us in Uru.

uecasm
09-07-2005, 03:13 AM
Originally posted by CyberCrrash75:
yes, yeesha could have taught Esher to speak english, but only after uru, since when the DRC met Esher they couldnt communicate. He could just have been trying to be difficult. It's a fairly common diplomatic tactic to pretend you don't understand a language that you do, both as a stalling tactic and to potentially overhear comments the other people don't think you'll understand.

Or possibly they were just referring to his bad accent. I imagine in the intervening century or two he wouldn't have had much opportunity to speak English, so may be out of practice.

Layniel
09-07-2005, 03:14 AM
well i always believed myst 5 to be before Uru, but i just cant forget that the DRC couldnt communicate with Esher...

yeah yeesha definately did it, as did Esher (to some point, before he decided not to help Yeesha). I wonder if its the Bahro which reset the puzzles every time someone new comes.

i understand why Yeesha can link at will, but why can Esher? Did he just get a special Watcher's cloth which he can touch to link at will?

Eat_My_Shortz
09-08-2005, 08:50 AM
What do you mean "yeesha definitely did (the quest)"?

I'm a bit puzzled by this theory of everyones that she "did" this quest. How do we know she did anything?

JustBrett
09-08-2005, 10:45 AM
Originally posted by Eat_My_Shortz:
I'm a bit puzzled by this theory of everyones that she "did" this quest. How do we know she did anything?
It isn't just a theory; we have the words right from Yeesha's own lips.

In the bonus video she tells us that she once held the Tablet, but can hold it no longer. At least one of the preview articles has told us that she released the Tablet, but then did something wrong so it will no longer let her touch it. She then sent Esher to release the Tablet, but he also screwed up. Now it's our turn to go on the quest to release the Tablet. (As the bonus video says, many have tried.)

Boyue65
09-08-2005, 11:11 AM
After reading that analysis, Brett, I'mma have to say that they're a bit off. For instance, I don't see that guy as the Watcher. Nor do I see the other guy as either Kadish OR Yeesha's pride. Yeesha's pride is expressed in the panel where she tried to stand alone against the unknown enemy and got pounded for it.

JustBrett
09-08-2005, 05:41 PM
Originally posted by Boyue65:
After reading that analysis, Brett, I'mma have to say that they're a bit off.
Well, I've been wrong before a time or two. I'm always open to better theories.


For instance, I don't see that guy as the Watcher.
My evidence for that idea is a little thin. Still, of all the characters we know, who is a better candidate for the role of Teacher than the Watcher? Who else is more qualified to guide the Grower than the man who has the word straight from Yahvo's mouth? (Of course, it is possible that Teacher is someone we don't yet know, but that hypothesis takes all the fun out of it. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif)


Nor do I see the other guy as either Kadish OR Yeesha's pride. Yeesha's pride is expressed in the panel where she tried to stand alone against the unknown enemy and got pounded for it.
There's certainly room for that interpretation. But I see it as the bad guy getting the drop on Yeesha when she wasn't looking. If it is Kadish, he must have been furious with Yeesha when he found out that she was the true Grower, and may well have pretended friendship until he could get a shot at her. Kadish appears to have motive and opportunity, though we don't yet understand the means used in the battle, and my theory also explains Yeesha's motive for reviving him and the torn note in the vault. Otherwise we're back to hypothesizing another complete stranger with no explanation for his presence or actions.

Eat_My_Shortz
09-09-2005, 05:40 AM
Hmm.. I shall have to watch that 2nd trailer again then.
Are you saying that Esher is the Watcher?? Intriguing.

JustBrett
09-09-2005, 08:01 AM
Originally posted by Eat_My_Shortz:
Are you saying that Esher is the Watcher?? Intriguing.
No! I'm afraid I drifted off topic a little, talking about the bahroglyphs in PotS. Esher has nothing to do with it.

Though it does look like Esher is a follower of the Watcher's teachings, since that is a version of the Watcher's symbol on the cloth he uses to link. That might explain why there's a relationship between Esher and Yeesha, since Yeesha is the Grower prophesied by the Watcher.

Takua-Kaita-600
09-20-2005, 04:27 PM
Tell me what any of this has to do with the Link panel flybys. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/353.gif

Trunkuza
09-25-2005, 02:09 AM
Originally posted by Eat_My_Shortz:
I much prefer to observe that there is no sign that DRC are or ever were here in Myst 5, so its before uru.

I'd hate to be continuing an out-of-topic discussion here, but i have to point out. There *is* signs of the DRC being in Myst 5... if you look carefully on one of the wall indents, there's a schematic with the DRC logo on it.

*Edit* To be more exact, the room at the very top, with the linking book to Direbo that puts you nearest to the Taghira linking... bubble... thing... it's on the indent in the wall right in front of you as you enter the room... sitting on top of a nearly-same-colored cloth... it wasn't easy to notice at first ^_^ but in the lower left corner, you can clearly see the DRC logo.. a downer though, that reminded me painfully of Uru, was that i could not pick up the green shirt laying on the "bed" indent right next to it...

*Edit x2* continuing through the game, i reached the bottom floor of the cavern... this one is my own speculation here, but i'd like to point it out, as well: read the white book third row down, third column across... she mentions "those who came" ... i think there, she means us, when we went to D'Ni in Uru Live...

uecasm
09-26-2005, 03:47 AM
Yeah, but you'll note that the earlier discussion was before the game was released. All we had to go on was the demo, which contained nothing DRC-related. Now that the game is out, though, it's obvious that it's set after Uru.

And thread necromancy is bad, m'kay?