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behrskins
04-22-2011, 05:01 PM
What exactly triggers a chase? I've been playing since day one and still have no clue what triggers it. Some times I can be running full speed in full view of my target and nothing happens. Other times, I'll be running away from my contract not in view and chase will trigger.

Something that should be an instant trigger for a chase is if you are on the ground and you spot your pursuer on the roof and lock on them. It would help curb the roofing since they are very easy to spot and forcing them into a chase makes roofing a less desirable option.

This would curb a lot of roofing, but it would also force the roofers to act more like an assassin trying to maintain cover. It's kind of hard to remain incognito when on a roof, but the game doesn't work they way...yet

persiateddy95
04-22-2011, 05:04 PM
Just look at the detection bar. When it gets empty you'll triger a chase.

It drops from Incognito to Silent, from Silent to Discreet, and from Discreet you're in a chase.

It goes down if you run when in sight of your target. Even if you're running to the oposite side of your target and he's in sight, the detection bar will still drop.

In Assassinate mode, when you lock into your pursuer he's automatically put into Discreet, and if he starts running he'll automatically enter a chase.

E-Zekiel
04-22-2011, 05:06 PM
Chases are triggered when your incognito bar runs out.

Your incognito bar runs down when running in sight of your target.

If you run in full view of your target and do not trigger a chase, it means you were close enough to kill them before it triggered.

If you trigger it while not going after them, they were in line of sight while you were moving.



And no, spotting someone on the roof doesn't mean a chase should trigger. Just because someone is on the roof doesn't mean they're after YOU. That would be too easy for the one on the defense.

I've tricked rooftop runners into walking right up to me by acting like I wasn't their pursuer, but after somebody else.

Shaitaan1986
04-22-2011, 06:16 PM
Originally posted by E-Zekiel:

I've tricked rooftop runners into walking right up to me by acting like I wasn't their pursuer, but after somebody else.

Yeah, this is a really nice trick.
Lean over an edge and make it look like your looking at someone else. Often works, just make sure you don't run so there's no red mark above you.
Ps, even if your "silent" and not incognito, doesn't mean hes noticed your after him. Many players are paranoid however and wont get close to you, though. Its a broad specter of skill/play style in this game, try to notice who plays cautiously and who doesn'thttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

behrskins
04-22-2011, 10:01 PM
And no, spotting someone on the roof doesn't mean a chase should trigger. Just because someone is on the roof doesn't mean they're after YOU. That would be too easy for the one on the defense.

Nope, it doesn't, but someone on the roof is very out of place and obvious so it should trigger a chase if you are on the ground and they are on the roof. If you are both on the roof, then no.

Being on the roof is not normal behaviour so if you are spotted on a roof that should trigger a chase and end any chance of the person the roof getting any sort of bonus point kill.

Ritzy-Cat
04-22-2011, 10:17 PM
Whether we like it or not, some people use roofing as their tactic. And if they can pull it off and get high scores, we should not sabotage it simply for the sake of the stealthy players or ones that do not go on roofs.

Being "spotted" on a roof would ruin aerial and acrobatic kills, UNLESS the person one the ground is absolutely clueless and/or is caught by surprise...

AntiChrist7
04-23-2011, 03:01 AM
I gues ubisoft puts the introduction session there for fun

behrskins
04-23-2011, 10:06 AM
My proposal doesn't ruin it for roofers, it just makes it more realistic. And you are right, you shouldn't be able to get an aerial or acrobatic kill unless the target is clueless. In real life, if I see someone on a roof or crouching on a rail, then I'm guessing something is very wrong. It should be the same way in the game. Unfortunately, the way the game is now, I can spot someone on a roof and have no realistic way of shaking them and getting them to lose the contract. I'll run pretty much any time a see a roofer after me but a chase never seems to be initiated. That's part of the reason why I asked the original question. How is that I can spot my pursuer on a roof, start running away from them and a chase still doesn't get initiated even when they are running full speed to keep up with me? If I spot them and run, a chase should be initiated.

I don't have a problem with those that want to play on roofs all game long. My problem with the play style is that in reality, it would be much more difficult to pull off bonus point kills because you are no longer acting in a very stealthy manner but the game mechanics reward you for a not so stealthy play style. My suggestion is a simple to tweak that would correct that problem and make it more realistic. It doesn't kill roofing, it just makes more difficult to get high point kills.

Serrachio
04-23-2011, 01:14 PM
Roofing is fine as it is, so there's no real need to 'negate' any bonuses if they are spotted.

If you see someone on the roof and you think that they're your pursuer, run under some cover or walk out of their aerial range.

If you see them move to a different rooftop, run.

They'll likely drain their bar when trying to follow you, and then you can lead them to an open area where you can pull off stuns.

behrskins
04-23-2011, 01:34 PM
This is one stance I'm really firm on because a roofer can lock onto someone and keep tracking them even when they lose LOS while someone on the ground can't do anything to force the hand of the pursuer that is being so blatantly obvious.

When your pursuer is being anything but stealthy, then you should be able force their hand. There isn't much defense against it otherwise. You have to hope you are near a ledge with enough cover or far enough away that they can't jump on you.

When it's obvious who your pursuer is, that should be it. There should be a chase and either end in a 100 pt death or an escape. The roofer shouldn't be rewarded for sloppy play because they can hang out on a roof and keep their meter from going down even when it's obvious they don't belong on a roof.

Serrachio
04-23-2011, 01:42 PM
Originally posted by behrskins:
This is one stance I'm really firm on because a roofer can lock onto someone and keep tracking them even when they lose LOS while someone on the ground can't do anything to force the hand of the pursuer that is being so blatantly obvious.

When your pursuer is being anything but stealthy, then you should be able force their hand. There isn't much defense against it otherwise. You have to hope you are near a ledge with enough cover or far enough away that they can't jump on you.

When it's obvious who your pursuer is, that should be it. There should be a chase and either end in a 100 pt death or an escape. The roofer shouldn't be rewarded for sloppy play because they can hang out on a roof and keep their meter from going down even when it's obvious they don't belong on a roof.

Why punish someone for using the environment to their advantage?

You may think of it as sloppy, but it would be a valid tactic for someone else.

The game isn't confined to the ground, players are allowed to move around as they like.

behrskins
04-23-2011, 02:19 PM
I'm not saying it's not a viable strat, but the point is that you are supposed to be stealthy when you try to kill someone. Being on a rooftop is stealthy to a point, but when you are spotted, your cover is blown and it should be reflected in the game play.

Most people roof because their isn't a heavy enough penalty for getting spotted and it's a lazy way to score a lot of points. I can roof as well as the next person, but I choose not to because I like being able to hide from my pursuer was well as kill my contract. Most people have weak ground games, so they head to the roof because you can score better up there without having to be as careful on the ground.

Serrachio
04-23-2011, 02:39 PM
Originally posted by behrskins:
I'm not saying it's not a viable strat, but the point is that you are supposed to be stealthy when you try to kill someone. Being on a rooftop is stealthy to a point, but when you are spotted, your cover is blown and it should be reflected in the game play.

Most people roof because their isn't a heavy enough penalty for getting spotted and it's a lazy way to score a lot of points. I can roof as well as the next person, but I choose not to because I like being able to hide from my pursuer was well as kill my contract. Most people have weak ground games, so they head to the roof because you can score better up there without having to be as careful on the ground.

I have a fairly good ground game and I use rooftops too.

The aim of the game is to kill your target, how stealthily (or not stealthily) you kill them is up to you.

obliviondoll
04-23-2011, 03:16 PM
We shouldn't need it, but search for "three pillars"

You should find a whole bunch of posts by me.

Most of them are me quoting myself, while quoting one of the devs, who clearly states that the running and climbing and movement is one of the core features they felt was necessary for the multiplayer.

Why would the want to punish players who choose to use that core feature?

Also, just TRY roofing people in Wanted.

If you're saying it's easy, and sloppy, and cheap, and whatever else, you obviously haven't.

Getting good kills, and even getting a lot of half-decent kills (as opposed to getting 1800 points from 15 kills like some people do) is A LOT harder than you'd think when you're on the ground.

Also, going roofer for a while will make your stealth game better. I know it did for me.

E-Zekiel
04-23-2011, 03:56 PM
Originally posted by behrskins:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">And no, spotting someone on the roof doesn't mean a chase should trigger. Just because someone is on the roof doesn't mean they're after YOU. That would be too easy for the one on the defense.

Nope, it doesn't, but someone on the roof is very out of place and obvious so it should trigger a chase if you are on the ground and they are on the roof. If you are both on the roof, then no.

Being on the roof is not normal behaviour so if you are spotted on a roof that should trigger a chase and end any chance of the person the roof getting any sort of bonus point kill. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

While unstealthy, AGAIN, as I said...You don't know that that specific person is specifically after you.

You just don't, period, unless there is a red arrow over their head.

Your idea makes the defense game too convenient.

If you spot someone on a roof that you think is after you, you already have the convenience of them singling themselves out on the roof for you. Keep your eyes on them, if you're sure it's them, and employ defensive procedures from there forward.

If you're in a roof-vulnerable area and not under the overhang, it's your fault you're going to die for not having a better strategy. Generally? If I'm in an area where I can't keep a good eye on the roof, I hang out under an overhang so I can't be assassinated while I look around. From the roof, anyway. If I notice someone approaching from a roof and I'm in a weak area? I start moving low-profile to somewhere I can defend myself.

I've even done that in high-profile. I was alone in the street with an overhang by me. Saw a shadow on the ground ahead of me, coming from the roof. Taking my time woulda got me killed. I bolted immediately under the overhang across the street next to me, and made it. I then saw the shadow jump straight down off the roof, smoked, stunned him when he landed in my smoke.

Conversely, from the roofing perspective. I ONLY use really high up rooftops for assassinations. Low rooftops are too easy to be seen from. If I am on a low roof and I have identified my target and I think there's a good chance they may have seen me. I drop off the opposite side and find a crowd to enter with, low-profile.


Use strategies mang. Rooftop mechanics are fine as they are. Only things wrong with the game right now are firework cooldowns in assassinate (assassinate sucks, but I could play it if they made fireworks have an assassinate-specific cooldown), and lag. Apart from that everything is fun really.

There are strategies for everything. Sometime I'm gonna have to upload a how to win 4 vs 1 manhunt when you're the 1 video.

Vey03
04-23-2011, 11:39 PM
The only problem with roofers, is they tend to also be shooters. And some will do that all game, every game http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

So if you see someone standing on top of a building, you need to move.
Morphing, disguise, if they have locked onto you, you're dead anyway.
And if they haven't, seeing you do that will might make them suspicious.
Sending a decoy might work though.
Probably best not to run, because if they haven't locked onto you, they will when you start running.
Go behind your nearest building, pillar, whatever, so they can't aim. Make them move, and make them come to you.
This is especially good if you're not sure if the person's after you or not.
Because they will have to either jump/drop down, or jump from one building to another, to get a better aiming position, which puts them in high profile, which will bring up the red arrow if they are after you.

I don't have a problem with going on roofs. Do it myself. Especially when there's people running around like headless chickens all game.

Daidarapochi
04-23-2011, 11:53 PM
Roll with knives. The best feeling in the world is knifing a pursuer and making them fall down. And you can always draw a pursuer away from the roofs. There are roofless areas in every level, so find them and use them. In some cases they will descend from a roof, and combat roll into your fist with a nice red arrow over their head.