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GunnarGunderson
06-18-2011, 09:00 PM
Do you think Altair will be able to teach Ezio what it means? because last time I checked blowing up a lighthouse and setting an armada ablaze doesn't technically qualify as discreet. Please Ubisoft, better stealth mechanics.

Eric_490
06-18-2011, 09:05 PM
I think the scripted epic fights are okay and the exploding lighthouse and such. Ezio is pretty much a master badass who can fight and kill a group of fifty people using only their weapons and his fists single-handedly.

What I do want is open ended assassinations like AC1. Where you could attack from ten different areas in five different ways. It may be that because their are just so many assassination and missions and explosions now, it seems like their are less of these open ended assassinations missions. Maybe their arent less, just more explosions and epic battles.

But yah some more stealth would be good.

Calvarok
06-18-2011, 09:06 PM
They would certainly need help if those were their stealth mechanics. Since they were set-piece mechanics, and Ezio has no actual way of stealthing a boat over a chain and past an angry fleet that's preventing anyone from leaving, I think Ezio's doing just fine.

There will be stealth in the game. Chances are it will be improved. Wait and see before judging.

GunnarGunderson
06-18-2011, 09:23 PM
There will be stealth in the game. Chances are it will be improved. Wait and see before judging. I do have my doubts, the way Amancio worded it, it seems his definition of stealth is using a smoke bomb and killing everyone before it clears instead of using a shrapnel bomb

Calvarok
06-18-2011, 09:43 PM
Originally posted by BradKinn:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> There will be stealth in the game. Chances are it will be improved. Wait and see before judging. I do have my doubts, the way Amancio worded it, it seems his definition of stealth is using a smoke bomb and killing everyone before it clears instead of using a shrapnel bomb </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's a way to not be detected. Which is part of being stealthy. But there will be ways of avoiding getting into a situation requiring bombs in the first place, otherwise, why would they have upgraded eagle sense to make it easier to figure out a guard's patrol route?

Stowdace
06-18-2011, 09:49 PM
I'm pretty sure Ezio broke the second tenet of "hide in plain sight" a long time ago.

masterfenix2009
06-18-2011, 09:53 PM
So you are going to suggest to ezio that it would be better to swim out of Constantinople? There was a barrier. Ezio had to destroy it,or he wouldn't be able to leave.

Calvarok
06-18-2011, 09:58 PM
Originally posted by Stowdace:
I'm pretty sure Ezio broke the second tenet of "hide in plain sight" a long time ago.

He fought when there was no other way around it. The Assassin's Creed was not meant to be an inhibitor that got you screwed if you had no other way out of a situation than breaking it. It was a guideline for the most perfect scenario. But perfect scenarios rarely happen.

Nothing is true, breaking the Creed is permitted.

Eric_490
06-18-2011, 11:28 PM
Was just replaying brotherhood memories and like I thought there is ample stealth in the game. Its just at players choosing not to use it.

There is one memory where you are required to kill 20 french soldiers for their armor. You can rush in an kill them all but for full sync you have to kill all of them without being detected.

This allows us to figure out multiple ways to take down the guards and at the end you have just assassinated TWENTY people without being detected ONCE for full Ezio sync.

Then theres another where you must escort a senator for quite a distance across Rome and for full sync you MUST remain undetected the entire time.

Then theirs the one where you assassinate the banker. You have to get to the bench without being detected through the entire memory and kill him from the bench to get full sync.

The game is FULL of stealthy missions and there are more stealth missions then their are scripted explosive big missions. Those are just big set pieces meant to be epic.

There always has been, is, and always will be stealth in assassins creed. For the most part its up to the player to do it that way, some of mine were 50% sync because I just ran in and killed everyone, but after playing them how they are supposed to be played, I got a lot more enjoyment and time out of ACB.

ThaWhistle
06-18-2011, 11:34 PM
altair is like europe trying to fix a situation through diplomacy and careful and delicate methods.

ezio is like america coming in all "merka, **** yeah, lets just blow them thar light houses up, and if you don't like it than you cna git out."

or something like that. I reckon the devs have seen all our complaining. I'd atleast expect the altair stuff to be AC1 like, but maybe not the ezio stuff.

and drunk whistle can't be held responsible for bad analogies.

Turkiye96
06-19-2011, 06:53 AM
Originally posted by BradKinn:
Do you think Altair will be able to teach Ezio what it means? because last time I checked blowing up a lighthouse and setting an armada ablaze doesn't technically qualify as discreet. Please Ubisoft, better stealth mechanics.

ok look first of all this was shown for E3 to impress and so its probabally gona be one of the most epic missions in the game
2 its only 1 mission in the game
3 This mission is the last stand Ezio makes against the Templars of Istanbul! so it has to be really epic, u know?

for an epic mission its really good and im sure there will be a lot of stealth missions

samward
06-19-2011, 06:55 AM
ok so I LOVE stealth missions, I think they are challenging and brilliantly fun. But I also like the big onslaught missions... it makes the game more realistic. I would think it is safe to assume, that there is not an assassin on the face of the earth, real or fictional, that has not been caught up in some big public display at one point or another.

I mean look at the James Bond franchise. He has missions where he undetectable, but there is at least once in every film that he comes out guns blazing, explosions filling the sky, and him shrieking down the road in one of his Aston Martin's.

Or how about the Bourne series/...Road to Perdition....my head is buzzing with films with assassins in them... and I cant think of one that is all stealth...

Now Bond, and these other characters are obviously purely fictional... But what I am trying to get at is that the key to being a good assassin is not determined by how invisible you are; but is determined by your skill of selecting an approach to a mission that will yield the most advantageous outcome.

Sometimes that means laying low and being patient in order to not be discovered. Other times it requires you to use speed and make a bit of a scene. The object of an Assassin is to get the job done and not get caught.

In the case of the lighthouse, Ezio has no other options, he could tip toe around it all day, but that lighthouse is not going away, where as by blowing it to bits he created a distraction that gave him the upper hand to use his speed, to kill those who opposed him and escape.

I think it is great and all to speculate what ACR will bring...it seems to me that a lot of people have given up speculating and have gone on to assuming and deciding what the new game will bring. Ubi have hardly released any video coverage of the game yet. There will be so much more in the next few months...lets just wait and play the game before we decide what the game will be like...

iN3krO
06-19-2011, 07:03 AM
hey dude, it's not ezio who must learn such things... it's ubisoft that must learn what was the best things of Ac1 and what sucked in Ac2 and AcB.

And it looks like if they didn't learn anything at all -.-''

El_Sjietah
06-19-2011, 07:32 AM
Originally posted by Calvarok:
That's a way to not be detected. Which is part of being stealthy.
It is, but it shouldn't be. Bombs are quite noisy, so throwing one would at least call for investigation by a nearby patrol. In AC, this never happens though. You can kill anything the smoke and simply walk away without even hiding the bodies. No bypasser will alert the guards and no guard will wonder what that noise was. The way they designed the AI shows that Ubi themselves don't view AC as a true stealth game. Try doing what Ezio does in a Splinter Cell game and see how far that gets you.


Originally posted by assassino151:
So you are going to suggest to ezio that it would be better to swim out of Constantinople? There was a barrier. Ezio had to destroy it,or he wouldn't be able to leave.
Sure, he had to destroy the barrier.

However, he didn't have to set the entire harbor ablaze, leaving the corpses of dozens of guards behind.

I'm okay with this being one of the options, but at least give us an alternative.

For example, let us sabotage the war ships before blowing up the lighthouse. Then, instead of going on a killing spree, dive in the water, swim to your boat and sail off. That'd be a much cleaner way of doing things.

BingChandler
06-19-2011, 07:39 AM
Completely agree, OP.

While the E3 footage certainly looked stunning, I think quite a few people were taken aback by how little respect the Creed seemed to receive. So much for the innocents aboard the ships, perhaps in the lighthouse, etc. The whole Golden Horn seems to be awash with violence and death, simply because Ezio couldn't be bothered to find more discreet methods.

I suppose I would not really have such an issue with that sequence if it was not indicative of the rest of the gameplay, but I fear that it very well may be. The Creed seems to be being buried under an avalanche of Michael Bay-inspired set pieces. Which is bothersome, especially when you weigh the objectives of the Creed against how ridiculously easy Ubisoft has made it to obliterate anything and everything in your path. I believe I saw reference to "Renaissance Rambo" the other day on these boards, and I thought it was particularly perfect for describing the new paradigm of playstyle.

Hopefully playing through the game the same way one played through AC1 will at least be an option, but I fear that very well may not be the case. The AC that we love may have already changed too much to be returned to the simpler, stealthier gameplay you would expect of an assassin. Release cycles and profit charts are powerful motivators when it comes to making a much more nuanced game (AC1) into a everyman's paradise (AC:B).

That said, as long as Ubisoft keeps up the fantastic storytelling they've had in all previous AC games I'll still be enamored, I'm sure. I can't really turn my back on my favorite new IP in years just because the developers want to change the gameplay to make it more accessible to everyone (as much as I wish they wouldn't). Truth be told, the chance to play through Constantinople less that 100 years after its fall is just too appealing to pass up, and I'm sure Ubisoft knows that.

So, yes, I agree with you 100 percent, but at the same time find myself powerless to resist. However Revelations turns out, I'll just try to play it as closely to the tenants of the Creed as the devs allow (hopefully possible)! One of the many reasons I'm still in favor of difficulty settings and stealth rewards.