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C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-01-2010, 03:08 PM
Let's at the very least gather what info/pics we have.

From the Ubisoft facebook pages....

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs312.ash2/59286_1661273330893_1208978427_1829546_1567986_n.j pg
The Lich.

Higher ranking Necromancers (the priests of the Spider Goddess) are given a life-prolonging elixir that is “milked from the venom of the Goddess’s sacred spiders, and that they must mix their food.
This “treatment” turns them into Asakkus, or “Liches”, their bodies desiccated but now freed from the passions of the flesh. They keep aging however, until they look little more than walking mummies... The venom mixture also colors their whole eyes bright green.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs333.ash2/61378_1661272850881_1208978427_1829545_6130388_n.j pg
The Arch Lich is an upgraded Lich.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs334.ash2/61464_1661270530823_1208978427_1829541_4726385_n.j pg
The Vampire.

As they grow in power, Liches may earn the right to be embraced by the Spider Goddess herself to die and be reborn as Akhkharus, or “Vampires”. They undergo an excruciating ritual but gain a rejuvenated body, cleansed from all defects. Vampires don’t need to eat, drink, sleep or breathe anymore as all their organs are “petrified” and it is not blood, but the sacred spider’s venom, that now flows in their veins.
However, they need to drink human blood on a regular basis to thin this venom down, and prevent it from dissolving their body from the inside.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs010.snc4/33874_440704139587_161184829587_4952195_1100562_n. jpg
The Vampire Lord is an upgraded Vampire.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs682.snc4/62270_1661268330768_1208978427_1829520_803473_n.jp g
The Juggernaut Ravager is an upgraded Juggernaut.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs345.ash2/62498_1661267010735_1208978427_1829518_36317_n.jpg
The Juggernaut. You've seen him in the trailer. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Servants of the Demon Overlord of Destruction, Juggernauts are easily identified by their immense horns and their basalt-covered fists and hooves. In battle, they rush violently (and sometimes blindly) into the enemies lines, impaling their enemies with their horns, crushing them with a swing of their massive arms, or trampling them to a bloody pulp. When needed, they even make good battering rams.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs024.snc4/33579_455724009587_161184829587_5223646_431583_n.j pg
The Ghost

Upon their death, the children of the Dragon Gods rise as spirits to the moon, to pass into eternity under the guiding hand of Asha. However, traumatic events can cause the creation of a Ghost, a spirit bound to the material world by a powerful, negative emotion.

By performing a specific ritual, Necromancers can convert Ghosts into loyal servants, under their absolute control.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs125.ash2/39597_455724019587_161184829587_5223647_6647487_n. jpg
The Spectre is the upgraded Ghost.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs416.ash2/69460_455724049587_161184829587_5223650_2457212_n. jpg
The Skeleton

Skeletons are nothing more than dead, decaying bodies animated by the will of a Necromancer. Combining blind loyalty, indifference to hunger and thirst, and a lack of any sense of fear or doubt, the Skeleton is considered to be an excellent servant.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs794.snc4/67470_455724034587_161184829587_5223648_6290157_n. jpg
The Bone Guard is the upgraded Skeleton.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs918.snc4/73135_455724104587_161184829587_5223652_5398431_n. jpg
The Ghoul

Ghouls are ravenous spirits of the dead, bound by magic in lifeless corpses. Ghouls are tormented beings, filled with hatred for the living.
Powerful Necromancers can control them, but otherwise they are wild and destructive. Transformation into a ghoul is used as the ultimate punishment in Heresh, and is a means of permanently removing a soul from the cycle of death and transformation.
Ghouls feed on corpses and often carry diseases in their blood and saliva.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs947.snc4/74039_455724114587_161184829587_5223653_2442486_n. jpg
The Grave Ghoul is the upgraded Ghoul.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs004.snc4/33586_451529544587_161184829587_5154582_3341612_n. jpg
The Hellhound.

Cerberi are servants of the Demon Overlord of Voracity. These two-headed fire breathing mastiffs outclass even the sabretooth tigers or dire wolves in size, speed and ferocity.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs379.ash2/65736_451529494587_161184829587_5154580_4847475_n. jpg
The Cerberus is the Hellhound upgrade.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs656.snc4/61626_439197619587_161184829587_4922377_3242530_n. jpg
The mighty Sentinels are the first line of defense for the Holy Empire. They are volunteers who have proven their loyalty to the Emperor and their devotion to Elrath. They have sworn an oath to protect their brothers-in-arms with their heavy shield and, if needed, their lives. For their own personal protection, they rely entirely on their faith.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs606.snc4/58591_439197654587_161184829587_4922378_578997_n.j pg
The Praetorian is an upgraded Sentinel.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs807.snc4/68706_447464904587_161184829587_5084751_4120908_n. jpg
Here is the Crossbowman.

Many stories are told about how Ronan Falcon, armed only with courage and honor, triumphed over the human clan lords and united them to form the Empire that would bear his name. But it is closer to the truth to say that the crossbow is the true reason why he was victorious. To this day, the Crossbowmen of the Empire are still feared in every corner of Ashan!

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs830.snc4/68996_447464914587_161184829587_5084752_3990725_n. jpg
The Crossbowman upgrade is the Marksman.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs450.ash2/72367_447464969587_161184829587_5084755_6819550_n. jpg
Griffins were created in the Mythic Age from the spontaneous magical fusion of lions and eagles. At that time, the surface of Ashan was irrigated by dragon-veins, remnants of the Dragon Gods’ wars; and animals that drank of these untamed rivers of dragon blood and magic were permanently altered by it. It is said that an act of compassion by an eagle who rescued a lion being carried away by the current of a dragon-vein rise to this formidable species.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs450.ash2/72367_447464974587_161184829587_5084756_4049767_n. jpg
The Griffin upgrade is the Imperial Griffin.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-01-2010, 03:21 PM
And from Black Hole's facebook pages....

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs329.ash2/60905_152123891479020_151871054837637_356093_70732 67_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs659.snc4/59900_153843624640380_151871054837637_367203_74389 57_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs639.snc4/59900_153843627973713_151871054837637_367204_32238 43_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs323.ash2/60359_153843611307048_151871054837637_367202_14114 8_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs353.ash2/63298_154884617869614_151871054837637_372457_54435 72_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs607.snc4/58747_151874878170588_151871054837637_355075_49698 1_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs314.ash2/59437_151874898170586_151871054837637_355076_61161 21_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs314.ash2/59437_151874901503919_151871054837637_355077_73114 08_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs614.snc4/59437_151874904837252_151871054837637_355078_16803 63_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs310.ash2/59065_151874941503915_151871054837637_355079_40028 64_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs610.snc4/59065_151874948170581_151871054837637_355080_57896 19_n.jpg

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-01-2010, 03:23 PM
Let the discussion.....BEGIN! :O)

EBugle
11-01-2010, 04:32 PM
Necromancers still look the same as ever!

Though the description of the ghoul is quite different from the how zombies played before, maybe we'll see a new type of unit in that slot now.

Juggernaut looks cool, but do the inferno really need more beatsticks? =P

Haven's looking pretty similar to before too.

Resources: I'm kind of dissapointed they kept both wood and ore. I thought it was going to be ore and gems like in clash, thus keeping one basic resource and 2 rare resources (gems and this new dragon stuff), but I guess now we have two basic and one rare? that seems backwards to me. It also seems backwards that the dragon blood stuff looks like gems.

Initiative bar: looks fine. It doesn't show heroes, though, so do heroes work outside of initiative as they did in I-III? that'd be nice, I never liked havign to wait for my turn to cast a spell and instead casting it when it's most important.

Not much else to say...

D.Jaskowski
11-01-2010, 04:52 PM
@ Chuckles: Thanks for the thread. Actually the other day I was thinking of asking one of the moderators to come up with a thread like this, but you are way ahead of me as always. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

@ Moderators: Maybe you could sticky this thread, so everybody can see the news, without the need of looking for the thread among other ones.

@ Ebugle: I do believe I've read at heroescommunity that that would be exactly the case as you mention, that the heroes act the same as in Heroes I to III. And no initiative system is supposed to be included.

Last but not least, love the new Necropolis designs. Especially the Lich and Skeleton, but I dare say that the upgraded Ghoul looks plain silly with all those spikes around. Also not sure if I like the Griffin's helmet. But I can live with it as long as they don't make the same mistake with other creatures from Haven, since the upgardes go towards quite a "parade" like look.

SandroTheMaster
11-01-2010, 05:27 PM
I'm not falling in love with the Necropolis Upgrades... The Vampire Lord in special is ridiculous, specially in contrast to the normal vampire, who not only looks dignified, but noble. The Vampire Lord looks like a Sauron knockoff.

I find it interesting this continuity nod of the Liches of old, being actually prototype liches, and thus inferior to the Vampires. In the other hand those vampires are now the ultimate forms of liches? This is just weird. Vampires are usually warriors, the idea of them first having been a necromancer is strange.

And what happened to the idea of skeletons being humbly equipped shock troops? Why they have to be skirmishers?

And this design choice of making upgrades just spiky versions of the regular is bordering on the ridiculous in some cases.

EDIT: BTW, Sir Charles, are you going to update your site? Because it quite a bit outdated, and still you keep it in your sig.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-01-2010, 05:52 PM
In regards to the Necro's & their upgrades...I agree. The addition of more accessories or more BULKY accessories does not scream "upgrade" to me. However...hold off your judgment until you see the OTHER units. Wowsers. :O)


Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
EDIT: BTW, Sir Charles, are you going to update your site? Because it quite a bit outdated, and still you keep it in your sig.

I'd like to. But with a 55 hour per week job, a wife and 4 daughters....and no help on the site...it's become a "wait and see" affair. I have worked on some of the pages, but I didn't bother to update the news page. It's a bit dusty in there to be sure.

I have a feeling though, with the release of a new game...the blood will start flowing again and the urge to work on the site will increase in priority.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-01-2010, 06:29 PM
Btw...if you look closely, in the first picture I posted from the Black Hole pages, you can see an undisclosed Haven unit floating above the Haven army. Gotta look closely folks.

Same picture...floating above the Necro army...another previously undisclosed unit.

:O)

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs329.ash2/60905_152123891479020_151871054837637_356093_70732 67_n.jpg

http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/images/h6_artwork/necro_flying_unit.jpg
Notice the bat-like wings compared to the griffin on the right side.

http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/images/h6_artwork/haven_flying_unit.jpg
Almost looks like some kind of light-elemental to me.

http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/images/h6_artwork/haven_horse_unit.jpg
You can clearly see the two rearing horses heads. And they also seem to be glowing like that floating elemental-like unit.

Something to think about. :O)

SandroTheMaster
11-01-2010, 08:21 PM
That mysterious figure is indeed intriguing.

I can't discern if the winged creature is hooded or bulky.

Maybe the new form of the Wight? Or a flying death knight?

Xenofex_086
11-02-2010, 01:57 AM
Actually all of these pictures have already been disected multiples times is CH and AoH. The Necropolis army is hardly intriguing as we are almost certain about all of its creatures. Apart from the released 5, one can clearly see the half-woman, half-spider over the skull of one of the skeletons on the lower left of Svetlana - this should be the avatar of Asha and is most likely the Champion. The flyer looks like a WarCraft III Devourer (I think this was the name) - a flying sphinx-like creature, being probably the third Elite. By the way the fact that the Skeletons are engaged in hand-to-hand combat should mean that they have No Melee Penalty. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif
As for Haven - in the far distance there is a small winged figure, which doesn't look like a Griffin. Hardly surprising, this should be the Angel. The long-haired light figure over the pikeman is an unknown Elite or summoned creature. The other figure of light on the back look a bit like valkyries - probably too part of the normal Elite line-up. The rest is too blurry for me.

As for the normal creatures and the upgrades - the continuation of the Heroes V trend is obvious. What is a bit spiky receives more spikes, what is a bit shiny becomes more shiny and what is not in flames receives more magma and fire. Some upgrades... But I am more interested in the actual functions of the creatures.

znork
11-02-2010, 10:57 AM
Cudos to chuck. i have to agree i wonder why they dont post them in this forum.

I feel the necros look they what they should this time. The skellys are steal fathttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

The gouls are rather cool thouge.

dchalfont
11-03-2010, 06:51 AM
http://img41.imageshack.us/img41/6706/12254a885fadccc3b.gif

Kudos dude, awesome thread. I love the new look of the unit. Not 1 criticism. The developers have taken it to a whole new level. Loving the ghoul too, the zombies were really lame so hopefully the ghoul is their replacement.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-03-2010, 09:30 AM
Wow. Not everyday I see a Citizen Kane reference. Nice. Orson Wells looks so freaking young then.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-03-2010, 09:37 AM
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs483.ash2/75603_457729639587_161184829587_5268335_6284899_n. jpg
Pit Fiend

Punished and jailed, Urgash, the Dragon-god of Chaos, is consumed by hatred for Asha and her creations. Ur-Haazheel, Demon Overlord of Hate, is the expression of that endless enmity and the mighty Pitfends are his most spectacular agents. Surpassed in their violent natures by only the most vehement Arch Demons, Pitfiends are the most dangerous creatures found in the Infernal legions.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs027.snc4/33692_457729609587_161184829587_5268334_4488709_n. jpg
The Pit Lord is the upgraded Pit Fiend.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1139.snc4/148171_458234184587_161184829587_5277176_1693497_n .jpg
The Tormentor

Tormentors are the servants of Ur-Traggal, Demon Overlord of Pain. Tormentors are consumed by the endless suffering of Urgash and inflict upon their own bodies unthinkable horrors. They draw power from their own agony, and use their deformations to strike their enemies. The Tormentors' skeleton is his principal weapon, as he is able to tear out pieces of his body to use in combat. His ribs can pierce through his chest to pin an adversary: his bones can elongate and project through his fingers to provide him with razor-like talons.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1145.snc4/148785_458234154587_161184829587_5277175_5957291_n .jpg

The Excruciator is the upgraded Tormentor.

znork
11-03-2010, 12:20 PM
poor Excruciator cant be easy trying to get girls withe that look.

Must be realy anoying trying to curl up in a ball withe thos horn on he knees.

If he falls hill kill him self.

Oakwarrior
11-04-2010, 03:12 AM
If he falls hill kill him self.

But he'll take pleasure in it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

SandroTheMaster
11-04-2010, 04:34 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

I'll be damned, the Pit Lord actually looks pretty badass.

The Tormentor needs some work though... He looks like some necropolis reject with way too much meaningless spikes. He managed to have the dubious honor of making the vampire lord up there look dignified and contained.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-05-2010, 04:20 PM
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs967.snc4/76066_459136204587_161184829587_5289475_5158363_n. jpg
Seraph

Physically imposing and striking in their perfection, the Angels of the Light are Elrath's messengers – and shock troops – on the face of Ashan. They are taller than normal humans, far more beautiful, and project an aura of power and confidence. Seraphim, on the other hand, are smaller and more human-like in their appearance. They started to appear after the creation of the Falcon Empire. Their true origins remain a mystery, but their devotion to Elrath is total. In battle they wield the twin blades of Judgment and Mercy

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs496.ash2/76937_459136174587_161184829587_5289474_5023038_n. jpg

The Celestial is the upgraded Seraph .

SandroTheMaster
11-05-2010, 05:26 PM
Weird name change...

And while I believe an angel's design is uninspired in general, two swords doesn't seem right. I need to know if there's a purpose for those.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-06-2010, 07:21 AM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
Weird name change...

And while I believe an angel's design is uninspired in general, two swords doesn't seem right. I need to know if there's a purpose for those.

Notice the bio for the Seraph...
Physically imposing and striking in their perfection, the Angels of the Light are Elrath's messengers – and shock troops – on the face of Ashan. They are taller than normal humans, far more beautiful, and project an aura of power and confidence. Seraphim, on the other hand, are smaller and more human-like in their appearance. They started to appear after the creation of the Falcon Empire. Their true origins remain a mystery, but their devotion to Elrath is total. In battle they wield the twin blades of Judgment and Mercy

To me that says that Angels are still part of the game world, and Seraphs are not them but rather some new creature. As for the twin swords...just the Seraph's preferred method of attack with his named blades.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-06-2010, 07:34 AM
btw...and this is PURE SPECULATION on my part...with the comments on the creature bio's and the creatures released (and the conspicuous absences too), it's making me think that the traditional level 7 units (Devil, Angel, Dragons, etc) are being left out of the standard town lineups. Pit Lord is the top unit for Inferno...what about the devils? Seraphim looks like the top unit for Haven...what about angels? It makes me wonder if we won't see those standard level 7 units as neutrals? Or summonable spells like the Summon Phoenix in H5? I mean has ANYBODY seen a H6 dragon yet?!?

And to reiterate, this is NOT a "hint" or anything like that...just speculation on my part as I've not seen the neutral units as of yet.

EBugle
11-06-2010, 11:22 AM
This is taken directly from a forum post from celestial Havens (which was taken from elsewhere), but this seems like the thread for it. I don't have time to disect it, but Chuckles's question about dragons reminded me about this:


Originally posted by Pitsu in Celestial havens
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Avonu
Copy/Paste from Heroes Community (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=24719&pagenumber=79):

Here some info from Igromir posted by LaBoule (http://forums.ag.ru/?board=heroes5&action=display&s=0&num=1288009102) / Heroic Corner (http://heroes.ag.ru/) (translation):

1) The system of heroes abilities is completely reprocessed. Now there are no primary and secondary skills or abilities, aren't present perks, there are no separate spells. All abilities which hero can receive, now earning by "ability points". This system is similar to system World of Warcraft.

2) About magic I wasn't described: now magic is ability too, so magic spells are added as ability, instead of are learned in Magic guild or somewhere. (Accordingly, the Magic guild is eliminated).

3) Depending on reputation the hero can choose one of three directions: Life, Death and Neutral and to receive corresponding Advanced class. Initially in each fraction two classes of heroes: Might and Magic, then occurs a branching on Advanced class (3 possibilities), total it turns out on 6 various types of heroes Advanced classes in each race. These types are really unique, as besides racial abilities there are also ?class abilities?.

4) The Beta test will be obligatory, and ?extending circles?, gradually covering all most part of "fans". And these "circles" will start with offices Ubisoft to France and the USA, and also from Hungary (where Heroes are developed) and Romania (where they are "plentifully tested). At present still it is considered that game is at an alpha version stage as not still placeholders are replaced with real elements.

5) The Fourth race won't be divulged yet.

6) Dragons will disappear in Heroes VI as units of 7th level, but will appear in it as "bosses". It is made intend: too strong units dragons turn out but if absolutely to clean them from game ? it turns out boringly (and doesn't match the game Universe).

7) The Damage magic will be strongly weakened, that the Magic-hero couldn't take out the whole army of Might-hero almost alone. The magic will play "a support" role along with another traditional abilities.

ALL WRITTEN ABOVE SHOULDN'T BE UNDERSTOOD AS TRUE IN LAST POINT. I HAVE WRITTEN THAT AS I HAVE UNDERSTOOD.

However, he lost in tranlsation one point:

The economic component of "Heroes" is simplified and done it on purpose: as heroes - not "economic simulator, and nothing to distract the heroes of the truly heroic Affairs (charging character, the selection of the army, fighting). Then followed the question: is not it too all of you simplify? Simplified the economy, introduced by simplifying the capture of Mines ("control points") and the hiring of monsters in the same skills can be traced a certain simplification, etc. Answer: The only simplifies learning course (the game easier to learn), but the game itself does not lose his wealth. For example: learn the rules of the game of checkers is simple, but to become a master of checkers - the years of work. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Avonu_de_Odihs
11-06-2010, 12:10 PM
Actually from what I heard, dragons will be as "tier 7" unit. Also black dragons will be in game too but unknown in which form (unit or boss).
However, I can't say how accurate this information is.

KingImp
11-06-2010, 12:23 PM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
Pit Lord is the top unit for Inferno...what about the devils?

On CH, someone else who claims to be in the know has the Pit Lord listed as an Elite unit. Not the Champion.

Question is now, who is more in the know?

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-06-2010, 01:50 PM
Originally posted by KingImp:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
Pit Lord is the top unit for Inferno...what about the devils?

On CH, someone else who claims to be in the know has the Pit Lord listed as an Elite unit. Not the Champion.

Question is now, who is more in the know? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Or maybe we're just screwing with you guys to keep you off balance? *evil grin* BWAHAHAHA!

If you're unsure, just read the bio.

Mr.Dragon
11-06-2010, 03:07 PM
Most recent info puts the Pit Lord back up to Champion status, but public belief of his rank has gone like this.

Elite (Start)
Champion (Description dissected, insider drops a hint)
Elite (Two other insiders contradict)
Champion (Same two insiders afterward say they were wrong.)

Poor pit fiend is out of breath, jogging back and forth through the hierarchy.

So by now, it's anybody guess, as to what is the truth.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-08-2010, 02:37 PM
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs970.snc4/76330_460557224587_161184829587_5315212_5110937_n. jpg
The Succubus

Some children of Asha (Humans, Elves, Dwarves, etc.), having promised themselves to Urgash and the lords of Sheogh, are raised after their death as Incubi (male) or Succubi (female).

As reincarnations of powerful Demon cultists, they usually have a relatively high and unusual rank in the hierarchy of Demonkind. However, though many think they have the wit, devotion, and power needed to achieve this desirable status, in reality many of the pretenders end as lesser Incubi/Succubi (servants, sex slaves, etc…).

Their “mortal” origins make them useful as spies, infiltrators, and diplomats. To support this role, they are granted powers of illusion, charm and shape-shifting, so as to appear almost as beautiful and charismatic as Angels, but in a "carnal", sensual way, which allows them to influence lesser minds.
Particularly in the development of the sects of Demon Cultists, it is almost inevitable that an Incubus or a Succubus will be present.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1128.snc4/149062_460557194587_161184829587_5315211_6175548_n .jpg

The Temptress is the upgraded Succubus.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-08-2010, 02:40 PM
Now, for my money's worth...this is a nice looking unit. I love the crackling lava look to the wings on the Temptress. And the hair merging into flames. Very nicely done BH. Of the units revealed thus far...this is my favorite. But only of the ones revealed thus far. :O) There's some great ones to come.

SandroTheMaster
11-08-2010, 05:29 PM
It is, indeed, a very nice unit. The only part I don't like is the breastplate (chainmail bikini much?), but the rest of the armor is of good design (well, at least in the temptress, the leather strips along the hip piece made her armor, while the regular apparently only has a metallic bikini bottom).

However, wasn't it cannon that winged demons had inverted wings? The original succubus had those and the current Pit Lords still have them inverted. Why the change? Purely cosmetic? I liked the inverted wings motif (even though it admittedly made the wings little more than a decorative appendage).

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-08-2010, 07:39 PM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
It is, indeed, a very nice unit. The only part I don't like is the breastplate (chainmail bikini much?), but the rest of the armor is of good design (well, at least in the temptress, the leather strips along the hip piece made her armor, while the regular apparently only has a metallic bikini bottom).

However, wasn't it cannon that winged demons had inverted wings? The original succubus had those and the current Pit Lords still have them inverted. Why the change? Purely cosmetic? I liked the inverted wings motif (even though it admittedly made the wings little more than a decorative appendage).

I'm just happy they aren't going overboard on the sexual theme. I can deal with a plate mail bra...it's a succubus for pete's sake. She's supposed to be alluring. I'm just glad it's fairly tastefully done is all. Nival was just nuts when it came to this kind of stuff. Jeez, just look at those 2 female dungeon units or even the Pixie/Sprite. Some strategically placed vines...totally unnecessary to do that kind of stuff in a Heroes game. But a Succubus is supposed to be a sexual creature, so I can at least see the justification for SOME skin.

But apart from all that stuff, the art design on this unit is stunning IMO. It all works together flawlessly I think. Hardly ever the case it seems.

Mr.Dragon
11-09-2010, 12:18 AM
Agreed the unit is actually classier because it isn't overdone.

Dungeon's Furies were basically cheap *****s and the Dungeon's Witches were classy *****s before the upgrade and even cheaper *****s then the furies after.
Pixie I didn't mind so much for some reason, maybe it's because she didn't also moan like an idiot when hit, they felt a lot less "human" shall we say with their weird noises.
And the previous succubus was not a very visually appealing unit either, large breasts that overcompensate for the rest of the creature which resorted to tame yet full nudity to get the point across.

This succubus is a lot more attractive because she has some subtlety compared to the girls of the previous HoMM.
Not to mention that she doesn't look like she has implants.

It's a strong sexual design, but not overdone, and that's what gives it it's quality.

EBugle
11-09-2010, 01:41 AM
Hmm, it's actually kind of interesting that I like this unit so much, because typically I hate the whole "sex sells" ridiculousness that the universe is too full of these days.

But this is actually quite classy. And, of course, being a succubus means she should be at least somewhat revealing. Can't tempt the hearts of most men and some women with a parka!

The only problem I have is the name temptress. Sucubus Temptress -maybe-, but without the sucubus part, seems kind of boring. It'd be like going from "Dragon" to "Winged Lizard Thingy" Temptress just doesn't have the mystical feal the cretaure should have.

But seriously, though, nice job!

SandroTheMaster
11-09-2010, 08:09 AM
I understand the it's a succubus argument. I just didn't like the breatplate because it fails to protect precisely the vital spot, and I think a piece that integrated the choke would be better. But then again, maybe a succubus has to show some cleavage.

And for all accounts, I think the leather strips on the temptress bottom piece not only are sensible for protection but also makes her sexier.

Also I hadn't had a problem with the pixie and dryad. They're fairies, related to nymphs.

At least I don't think Ubi's been one sided when it comes to blatant sexual units. I mean, have you seem the Titan and the War Dancer?

What about the inverted wings though? What happened to them?

Mr.Dragon
11-09-2010, 09:49 AM
Titan might be female oriented eye candy.
But the War Dancer suffers from a genetic flaw that plagues their entire race.
Being a the same sex as every other member of their race.
You see elves come in two types, girls with boobs, and girls without.
Male elves are a myth.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-09-2010, 05:09 PM
To Sandro (and any others interested), I've finally gotten off my misty-blue butt and started some work on The Genie's Lamp. It's been long overdue to be sure, but bear with me...this genie's flyin' solo.

For now, the screenshot page is up as is the concept art page. I'll add more info as it becomes available.

SandroTheMaster
11-09-2010, 07:21 PM
Originally posted by Mr.Dragon:
Titan might be female oriented eye candy.
But the War Dancer suffers from a genetic flaw that plagues their entire race.
Being a the same sex as every other member of their race.
You see elves come in two types, girls with boobs, and girls without.
Male elves are a myth.

Tell that to the Legolas fangirls (pro-tip, they are LEGION).

@Sir Charles

Good to hear, blue guy.

Mr.Dragon
11-10-2010, 12:32 AM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:


Tell that to the Legolas fangirls (pro-tip, they are LEGION).

@Sir Charles

Good to hear, blue guy.

It's best not to burst their bubble, I believe an ancient prophecy foretold it as one of the signs of the coming apocalypse.
"And so it will come to pass that swarms of women will gather onto Orlando Bloom so they may violate his person, only to find out he has been one of them all along."
"And the cries, and shrieks and spontaneous manifestation of more lesbians then the gods had planned for will have become reality."


Also I second the encouragement to our resident Master Genie.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-10-2010, 09:41 AM
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs977.snc4/77073_461632529587_161184829587_5330727_3787731_n. jpg
The Sun Rider

There are many knights in the Holy Empire, but only those deemed worthy by Elrath himself can join the Order of the Holy Sun. Commonly known as Sun Riders, these champions of the Light are riding enchanted steeds summoned from Elrath's spiritual realm. These magical mounts are said to be able to ride on the faintest ray of light.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs968.snc4/76099_461632489587_161184829587_5330726_6681132_n. jpg

The Sun Crusader is the upgraded Sun Rider.

znork
11-10-2010, 10:26 AM
What an iradieted horse? Poor reider.

but the lance is real sice wow not super bighttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Its the best weapon so farhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

EBugle
11-10-2010, 11:50 AM
Er...

Well, it certainly looks nice, and it has a cool name...

But if it's just a paladin remake, I think I'll shoot someone =(

It probably isn't, it certainly doesn'tseem like so from the description, these seem holier, but... well, let's just hope my fears are ungrounded http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

KingImp
11-10-2010, 01:28 PM
I like the look of this new Haven unit, but I hate the name. I hope that's just a placeholder until they come up with something better.

SandroTheMaster
11-10-2010, 05:52 PM
So... they summon celestial steeds to ride?

Someone has been playing a bit too much D&D 3.5

Well, at least those are both awesome steeds and sensibly armed and armored knights, instead of silly.

Justice
11-11-2010, 11:19 AM
You can't play too much D&D. That's quite simply not possible.

Other than that I second KingImp and Znork. Like how it looks and the fact that a mortal actually can lift the weapon but the name is a bit off. Sounds too simplistic somehow. Is a bit like calling an Ent a Tree or Stick Man.

znork
11-11-2010, 11:47 AM
justice yes you can. ad&d point 2.0 for the win. You young kids

Justice
11-11-2010, 12:04 PM
I play D&D 20 hours a week and am a testament to sanity and normality. Anyone disagrees and their boat suddenly sinks or Orcus appears and consumes their souls http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


On topic: One thing I'm wondering a bit about, the bio states that they are said to be "able to ride on the faintest ray of light"... The horses shine! How can that be impressive if the horses are walking flashlights http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

Mr.Dragon
11-11-2010, 01:22 PM
I want to second (third?) the statement "you can never play to much D&D" admittedly I'm one of those 3.0 whipper snappers, I got in when that was brand spanking new.
And am now also a serious 4.0 player, I still play some 3.5 when I get the chance.

DnD is fertile ground to grow your imagination's crops in, heck I often use the D20 system as a testing bed for various ideas, translating things into D20 and trying to wrap my head around how it should work.

Geeking out behind your PC screen is just not nearly as entertaining as geeking out with your friends, some snacks and good ol' pen n' paper.
(and mini's if you're so inclined.)
It's a recipe for an evening of hilarity and creativity. (or any other quantity of time really.)


Anyway, I think I wandered far enough from the original topic.

My bet is, we'll get a new unit either tomorrow or the day after.

Also betting its a Necro unit, any takers?

KingImp
11-12-2010, 02:46 AM
I don't want to post the latest Necro pics as this is Chuckles' thing and I don't want to step on any toes, but I'm gonna add what would have been my response to it. It will make more sense when the pics appear. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Dumb name (the Putrid and Festering parts, not Lamasu), but like in the case of the Sun Rider/Crusader the look of the unit makes up for the awful name IMO. Still, I hope they work on those names before they're done.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-12-2010, 06:28 AM
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs470.ash2/74363_462994079587_161184829587_5342512_5667107_n. jpg

The Putrid Lamasu

The Lamasu were a failed experiment by the wizards to create a superior breed of beastmen, by the unnatural fusion of a human being (usually a slave or criminal) and a magical creature (in this particular case, a Manticore).

The resulting creature was too unstable and was litteraly short-lived, but they still proved useful to the Necromancers. The Necromancers rose their dead bodies and infected them with pestilence. The Lamasu function as plague vector, coupled with the creature’s physical might, and its mobility make them perfect front-line troops in the Undead armies.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs983.snc4/75620_462994094587_161184829587_5342513_1361375_n. jpg

The Festering Lamasu is the upgraded Putrid Lamasu.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-12-2010, 06:33 AM
While I don't care for the name (mainly the adjectives) the unit is refreshingly new. I've seen some people refer to it as a sphinx, but what it reminds me most of is an undead Scorpicore/Manticore. I'd love to see the name Scorpicorpse/Manticorpse used. :O)

SandroTheMaster
11-12-2010, 01:15 PM
While I like the unit design, I find myself scratching my head as to where a Lamasu fits among the undead at all.

Now we're just going to pick random mythological creatures and stamp an "undead" status in it?

I mean, we always had the Bone Dragon, but 1: It's a freaking dragon made more awesome by being skeletal. 2: It was symbolical of the necromancer's power to be able to rise such a powerful beast.

You know what would be awesome? The return of the Mummies. Or some Anubis-esque monstrosity. You know, something related to the dead.

It is another creature whose whole justification bears on the internal workings of this setting. Once or twice is ok, but are they gone pull this one on every new creature?

KingImp
11-12-2010, 02:45 PM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
While I don't care for the name (mainly the adjectives) the unit is refreshingly new. I've seen some people refer to it as a sphinx, but what it reminds me most of is an undead Scorpicore/Manticore. I'd love to see the name Scorpicorpse/Manticorpse used. :O)

Same here. I definitely see more Manticore/Scorpicore than I do Sphinx with these and to me that's a good thing. I loved that unit back in H3 and even though they were in H5 as a Neutral, they just weren't that deadly. You could easily kill them before they ever reached you.

Justice
11-12-2010, 02:55 PM
I can see both point of views but lean more towards Sir Charles. The unit certainly wouldn't fit into the HoMM I - IV Necromancers, but it fits into the Necromancers of HoMM V as a splinter group of the Wizards rather than an inherent faction on their own. Makes sense that they pick up failed or too dangerous Wizard experiments and turn them into their own.

Also just the way the creature looks screams Necromancers - albeit new necromancers - when I look at it. Reminds me enough of a Sphinx to be mysterious, enough of a Manticore to be Dangerous and enough undead to be cold and intimidating.

Name... I hate the "putrid" part of it, don't like festering and Lamasu doesn't quite ring any bells. Must admit though that if it is called Scorpicorpse/Manticorpse I will have a hard time not laughing http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

Would make sense to be some variation of Manticore, especially since it looks a lot like the "real" world Manticore, but if there is some nice sounding all new name I'm quite fine with that.

evildiablo4
11-12-2010, 07:29 PM
I dont exactly understand how the putrid lamasu is upgraded. All i notice is that it has more hair and its stomach glows a bit more and a slightly paler. I know it has the ability to poison but is that it? No sharper claw or bigger wing or spikier tail? Compared to all other upgrade looks, this one looks lazily done and disappointing. Not much design added on to it.

However, I do like the story behind the creature but I hope there isnt too much new creatures we never heard of. Love all the original creatures I-IV and always good

EBugle
11-12-2010, 08:39 PM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
While I like the unit design, I find myself scratching my head as to where a Lamasu fits among the undead at all.

Now we're just going to pick random mythological creatures and stamp an "undead" status in it?

I mean, we always had the Bone Dragon, but 1: It's a freaking dragon made more awesome by being skeletal. 2: It was symbolical of the necromancer's power to be able to rise such a powerful beast.

You know what would be awesome? The return of the Mummies. Or some Anubis-esque monstrosity. You know, something related to the dead.

It is another creature whose whole justification bears on the internal workings of this setting. Once or twice is ok, but are they gone pull this one on every new creature?

I think I whole heartedly agree with Mr. Sandro. Whiole it's perfectly fine that the unit is not a bone dragon, I don't think a lamasu fits at all in the faction (Wiki pedia link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamasu )

It just seems random and tacked in, quite honestly. It's like some one was flipping through a book of fantasy creatures and stopped on the Ls and went "Oh hey, this looks awesome! I wonder where we can fit it in the game..." I'm sure the process was slightly more scientific than that, but it still just seems shoehorned in.

I think Sandro's second point about the bone dragon saysit all, really. The bone drgon fit because it showed off just how powerful necromancers could be, the lamasu shows off that necromancers can steal from the wizards they came from... something we already knew.

And from the very description of the lamasus, it would seem there are very few to even reanimate! If the project (and the creatures themselves) were short lived, then there can't be more than MAYBE a couple hundred, as opposed to the large number (comparitavely) of dead dragons that were lying around to reanimate. They were a failed experiment, it's not as though they bred like rabbits... The very lore of the creature denies its own existence! It may be true the necromancers used these as heavy hitters once... but I doubt they could have used them for a very long time...

I'm really dissapointed with this unit... despite how awesome it looks.

Ygds11
11-13-2010, 12:27 AM
If I might speak somewhat about this. I am not displeased by this particular creature and I am surprised so many seem to be. While the name itself is hardly a fitting reference to what the creature actually is, as Lamassu is a deity not just a mythological creature. I would suppose even sphinx would be preferable as the un-upgraded version (even though that too is a proper name) and Lamassu as the upgraded version, appropriately "deifying" the unit in it's upgrade.

I do however see why people are attached to the Bone dragon however. But I recall a very neat moment many years ago when it actually disappointed me that it was the top tier unit of H2. I had literally spent 6 days of playing 4hrs a day on a single game trying to earn the resources necessary to build the structure. ( I was a kid then and did not have the idea I could right click on the structure selection screen to see was "the Laboratory" produced. I had imagined in my childish brain some sort of frankenstein monster as the ultimate necromantic creation. I think I still do. While bone dragons are neat they do seem to be a little unimaginative. Their appeal to me now is nostalgic. The new lamassu comes closer to what I would imagine the pinnacle of necromancy to be.

Now do not get me wrong, Bone Dragons are AWESOME, always have been and always will be. However those who state that the Bone Dragon is a power icon of the Necromancers, I would say being able to infuse life into that which could not retain it before is much more masterful, effectively making the Lamassu (it's premise anyway) a functionally superior accomplishment in this sense. However I would still say it falls short of what I believe such high fantasy necromancers should be capable of. The Bone Dragon doesn't either (don't hurt me, please don't).

I envision their top tier as being a unique necromantic creation, a paragon of undeath. I envision something more akin to a fabricated creature, a machine of flesh, blood and bone. But not like the abominations from WC3, something much more formidable and practically designed. If anything necromancers should not be haphazard, from what we know they should be extremely neat and tidy, of course in their own putrid way. The lamassu seems to come closer to this internal wish I have had for the necromancers since I was 10.

On a side note, at least some of the ridiculous creatures from H4 have not shown up, that at least is something to be grateful for.

SandroTheMaster
11-13-2010, 01:02 AM
Originally posted by Ygds11:
If I might speak somewhat about this. I am not displeased by this particular creature and I am surprised so many seem to be. While the name itself is hardly a fitting reference to what the creature actually is, as Lamassu is a deity not just a mythological creature. I would suppose even sphinx would be preferable as the un-upgraded version (even though that too is a proper name) and Lamassu as the upgraded version, appropriately "deifying" the unit in it's upgrade.

I do however see why people are attached to the Bone dragon however. But I recall a very neat moment many years ago when it actually disappointed me that it was the top tier unit of H2. I had literally spent 6 days of playing 4hrs a day on a single game trying to earn the resources necessary to build the structure. ( I was a kid then and did not have the idea I could right click on the structure selection screen to see was "the Laboratory" produced. I had imagined in my childish brain some sort of frankenstein monster as the ultimate necromantic creation. I think I still do. While bone dragons are neat they do seem to be a little unimaginative. Their appeal to me now is nostalgic. The new lamassu comes closer to what I would imagine the pinnacle of necromancy to be.

Now do not get me wrong, Bone Dragons are AWESOME, always have been and always will be. However those who state that the Bone Dragon is a power icon of the Necromancers, I would say being able to infuse life into that which could not retain it before is much more masterful, effectively making the Lamassu (it's premise anyway) a functionally superior accomplishment in this sense. However I would still say it falls short of what I believe such high fantasy necromancers should be capable of. The Bone Dragon doesn't either (don't hurt me, please don't).

I envision their top tier as being a unique necromantic creation, a paragon of undeath. I envision something more akin to a fabricated creature, a machine of flesh, blood and bone. But not like the abominations from WC3, something much more formidable and practically designed. If anything necromancers should not be haphazard, from what we know they should be extremely neat and tidy, of course in their own putrid way. The lamassu seems to come closer to this internal wish I have had for the necromancers since I was 10.

On a side note, at least some of the ridiculous creatures from H4 have not shown up, that at least is something to be grateful for.

Don't get me wrong, I never thought the Bone Dragon should top the Undead ranks (though I did found it awesome when I played Heroes 2, a lab carefully made to build a dragon from its bones and reanimate it). By definition the Bone Dragon is weaker than its living counterpart and because of that the undead were lacking in their top tier. It is a nice pre-top tier though.

However, the idea that necromancers should give power to something that wasn't living doesn't fit for 2 reasons.

1. It seems to be an idea taken from Diablo 2.

2. That is canonically the work of the Wizards in the Might and Magic universe, even in Ashan.

While necromancy seems simpler than granting life to inanimate matter, it seems to become more complex the stronger the creature reanimated. Also, reanimated creatures seem to be somewhat more autonomous than animated Golems. All in all, the necromancers are more about preserving than creating.

Heck, I always thought the Liches should be top tier, but lacking that solution we could take another tip from D&D and make some huge shadowy monstrosity like the Night Walkers. Those always creeped me out and are more easily justified than the former H5 Wight. Or something like the One-Of-Many from NWN2: The Mask of the Betrayer, a spiritual abomination made from the saturation of thousands of souls.

http://vnmedia.ign.com/nwvault.ign.com/NWN2/creatures/MM35_PG196.jpg http://thieves-guild.net/cartography/companions/One_of_Many.jpg http://image.gamespotcdn.net/gamespot/images/2007/288/reviews/939027_20071016_embed005.jpg


I dont exactly understand how the putrid lamasu is upgraded. All i notice is that it has more hair and its stomach glows a bit more and a slightly paler. I know it has the ability to poison but is that it? No sharper claw or bigger wing or spikier tail? Compared to all other upgrade looks, this one looks lazily done and disappointing. Not much design added on to it.

Still better than some of the stuff we had in the past.

The Knight's upgrades in Heroes 2? (Well, more like all upgrades in Heroes 2 except the Mutant Zombie)

Heroes 3's Pit Fiend and Pit Lord?

Dendroid Soldier? (AKA, the only upgrade in the Homm series EVER that you always have to mouseover to check if it is upgraded even if you're not colorblind)

KingImp
11-13-2010, 07:06 AM
So Chuck, can you confirm or deny if this Lamasu is the Necro Champion unit?

Xenofex_086
11-13-2010, 08:26 AM
It shouldn't be. It does not have a description of a Champion creature - see the Pit Fiend and the Seraph for instance - and is unlikely to be above something that resembles Mother Namtaru and is most probably her lesser version or child.

Dreamwright
11-13-2010, 08:58 AM
(Not trying to defend Ubi to the teeth here, just explaining)

The Heroes VI Necropolis will be heavily influenced by Mesopotamian lore in style, culture and philosophy - the town itself can be summed up as a giant ziggurat - so it makes sense for Mesopotamian creatures to show up in its ranks. I think this was the intention even as far back as H5 (the Namtaru is in the lore (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=28702)).

And yes, I'd say it is a consequence of stronger gameplay integration with the Ashan setting, and whether or not that's either welcome or too intrusive is a matter of taste. But the main thing is that it's not just randomly thrown in there.

Note though that Cerberus, the Medusa, the Minotaur, Sirens, Pegasus and sometimes the Phoenix were all individuals rather than races of creatures, and were deified in some editions of their respective myths... not really that much of a blasphemous stretch to do this to the Lamassu http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-13-2010, 09:24 AM
Originally posted by KingImp:
So Chuck, can you confirm or deny if this Lamasu is the Necro Champion unit?

No, it is not. In general, the order is how I have them listed on my Concept Art page at the Lamp. There are obviously some units still unrevealed, and I'll add those in at the appropriate slots. However, just keep in mind that at this point in the development, nearly everything is still subject to change.

SandroTheMaster
11-13-2010, 01:24 PM
Originally posted by Dreamwright:
Note though that Cerberus, the Medusa, the Minotaur, Sirens, Pegasus and sometimes the Phoenix were all individuals rather than races of creatures, and were deified in some editions of their respective myths... not really that much of a blasphemous stretch to do this to the Lamassu http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Oh, I can accept just fine 3000 cerberus, 1000 Coautls, 800 frankensteins or 500 curupiras.

As long as they are at least tangentially related to the faction's theme.

The necromancers have an undeath theme. There are plenty of monsters out there to fill this theme. Lamasu just doesn't seem like one.

Mesopotamian theme? This is style and design, I don't think it counts as theme.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-13-2010, 01:36 PM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Dreamwright:
Note though that Cerberus, the Medusa, the Minotaur, Sirens, Pegasus and sometimes the Phoenix were all individuals rather than races of creatures, and were deified in some editions of their respective myths... not really that much of a blasphemous stretch to do this to the Lamassu http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
Oh, I can accept just fine 3000 cerberus, 1000 Coautls, 800 frankensteins or 500 curupiras.

As long as they are at least tangentially related to the faction's theme.

The necromancers have an undeath theme. There are plenty of monsters out there to fill this theme. Lamasu just doesn't seem like one.

Mesopotamian theme? This is style and design, I don't think it counts as theme. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not sure I understand this line of thinking. The Necros have re-animated dead humans as skeletons, zombies, liches & vampires...dead dragons as bone dragons...risen the spirits of the dead as ghosts...but they can't raise the corpses of dead creatures other than humans or dragons? The Lamasu isn't just "some creatue" that they stuck into the Necro faction. They are dead Manticores risen to serve the undead army. They could've chosen to raise a hydra, or a griffin, or whatever. But the poisoning aspect of the Manticore fits the Necros too. Seems like a solid fit to me.

As for the Mesopotamian theme/art style, that has nothing to do with the pick of the Lamasu as a unit. The art style was chosen prior to the units. I guess I'm just not getting your objections. *shrugs*

Dreamwright
11-13-2010, 02:59 PM
So why shouldn't Mesopotamian influence count as a thematic focus? If you play Dark Messiah you'll see it everywhere in the necromantic zones. The H6 faction isn't as broad as "just throw in anything you like as long as it has no pulse" - it's also hearkening back to its pre/sequel as appropriately as it can.

SandroTheMaster
11-13-2010, 03:37 PM
My objections are that the necromancers have reimaginated humans as several forms of undead. The dragon was the only exception but it had its symbolic status. Technically, it was just the skeleton again, but a dragon.

A lamasu is just the zombie again. But a lamasu. A dragon had its renown, a lamasu will just have people scratching their heads.

Specially because lamasus here are experiments on manticores. Weren't manticores experiments themselves to begin with as well? And creating such a creature just so it dies and you reanimate the corpse is... a bit convoluted to say the least. Why not just piece together the dead parts and reanimate it that way?

I'm sorry, the lamasu just doesn't seem like a good necromantic fit to me. They could be with the dungeon, they could be original fortress, they could be with the barbarians, but just because it has a poison it goes to the necromancers? Why not a reanimated manticore right from the bat? Why not undead spiders? Undead scorpion-men? Undead wyverns?

The design is nice but as far as I'm concerned (admittedly, no-one important) it just doesn't fit.

Dreamwright
11-13-2010, 03:48 PM
Why not undead spiders? Undead scorpion-men?

Heh, well...

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m217/kaspergm/Heroes6%20creatures/MotherNamtaru.jpg

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-13-2010, 04:23 PM
Don't forget this one too...
http://img0.liveinternet.ru/images/attach/c/0//63/31/63031048_Asha_Vopl.jpg

The first one is stated as being a Boss. But this one here is still unaccounted for. And we seem to be missing one Necro unit too. Coincidence?

SandroTheMaster
11-13-2010, 06:14 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Is that the necromancers' champion?

Good Gods, she's gorgeous.

That is the kind of frankensteinian monstrosity that can somehow fit in.

I'd still rather hope for some spiritual abomination, but not too shabby. THIS is being original.

(Errr... Chuck, I think your picture didn't upload)

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-13-2010, 06:35 PM
hmmm...it's showing up in my browser. But I'll upload it and re-link it. How's this?

http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/63031048_Asha_Vopl.jpg

This unit is unaccounted for and is OBVIOUSLY not that boss that Dreamwright posted.

SandroTheMaster
11-13-2010, 06:45 PM
Oww... its a boss.

But yeah, it is visible now.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-13-2010, 07:53 PM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
Oww... its a boss.

But yeah, it is visible now.

Okay, I'm not sure if we're on the same page or not. The picture that I posted...we don't know WHAT it is. The one Dreamwright posted is listed as a Mother Namtaru and is a boss. If I had to guess, I'd say that the unknown one I posted would just be a regular Namtaru (whatever THAT is supposed to be). In my book it looks exactly like what a Drider is supposed to look like. Driders were creatures in RA Salvatore's Forgotten Realms "Dritzz" novels. And seeing as how the Namtura has been referenced as a giant spider back in the H5 histories, I'd say it's a safe bet that would be what it's called.


To become a lord of the Necromancers is the ideal of all who have chosen this path, though there are many other forms of unlife that have relatively more or less importance. In fact a Necromancer is not necessarily one of the non-living; in particular those who go on embassies to foreign lands are often still in human form. As they gain power, however, they inevitably choose to pass through the portal of death, becoming one of the undead. Little is known of this rite of passage to outsiders, as it involves the bite of the sacred spiders, the Namtaru, who dwell in the catacombs deep beneath the capital of Nar-Heresh.

This leads me to think we might be seeing the top level Necro unit here.

SandroTheMaster
11-14-2010, 02:59 AM
Hmm...

I thought the Driders would be the ever mysterious "Faceless Ones" from the Dungeon.

Pitsu
11-14-2010, 05:04 AM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
My objections are that the necromancers have reimaginated humans as several forms of undead. The dragon was the only exception but it had its symbolic status. Technically, it was just the skeleton again, but a dragon.
A lamasu is just the zombie again.

I agree. A good way to explain it is the H5 necromancy system. Animals are raised as ghosts, magic units as liches, human like creatures as skeletons or zombies. High level monsters are rised as beast skeletons (bone dragons) or powerful spirits (wrights).
But from which creatures a undead lamassu can be raised? Only from a living lamassu. Obviously the necromancy system in H6 must be different. Raising limited only to undeads with less specific origin or there is a undead version for each unit (and ubihole can proudly announce that H6 has more units than any previous homm).

Dreamwright
11-14-2010, 06:45 AM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
The picture that I posted...we don't know WHAT it is. The one Dreamwright posted is listed as a Mother Namtaru and is a boss. If I had to guess, I'd say that the unknown one I posted would just be a regular Namtaru (whatever THAT is supposed to be) [....] And seeing as how the Namtura has been referenced as a giant spider back in the H5 histories, I'd say it's a safe bet that would be what it's called. [...] This leads me to think we might be seeing the top level Necro unit here.

Yes, for some inexplicable reason I'm led to think the very same way. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Xenofex_086
11-14-2010, 07:19 AM
Well, they didn't tell us that Necropolis' champion will be half-woman, half-spider during Igromir, so we can only speculate what is this creature from Chuckle's post. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

EBugle
11-14-2010, 10:43 AM
Originally posted by Pitsu:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
My objections are that the necromancers have reimaginated humans as several forms of undead. The dragon was the only exception but it had its symbolic status. Technically, it was just the skeleton again, but a dragon.
A lamasu is just the zombie again.

I agree. A good way to explain it is the H5 necromancy system. Animals are raised as ghosts, magic units as liches, human like creatures as skeletons or zombies. High level monsters are rised as beast skeletons (bone dragons) or powerful spirits (wrights).
But from which creatures a undead lamassu can be raised? Only from a living lamassu. Obviously the necromancy system in H6 must be different. Raising limited only to undeads with less specific origin or there is a undead version for each unit (and ubihole can proudly announce that H6 has more units than any previous homm). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I didn't even think of this...

And for the most prt, I agree. I loved V's necromancy sysatem and I can't see it staying the same way with the lamasu a part of the faction... by definition, nothing can be raised as one...

Mr.Dragon
11-15-2010, 03:02 AM
The Necromancy system as seen in the Alpha build demonstration at Igromir, and from what little other info we have on it.
CURRENTLY (may be subject to change before release) works the following way:

Whenever a unit dies your hero gains energy, this energy can be spent to heal and increase the number of units in a friendly undead stack.
Not sure if this allows you to keep raised units after battle.

torzsoktamas
11-15-2010, 05:21 AM
Hi.I'm new to the forum and I'm excited about the new Heroes VI game.

I saw all of the relesed creatures so far,and I have to say that all of them look awesome!They are brilliantly done.Tough I would prefer a male angel(seriously,war-battle is brutal business and are for men),but guess I can bare with it.

And can't wait to see the next creature!Any idea when will it be showed?..today?...tomorrow?

dchalfont
11-17-2010, 02:52 AM
Loving all the new units, the new Inferno and Necropolis units especially. I like the ethereal sun horse but as others have said, the name has to go.

Elementalist.
11-17-2010, 09:02 AM
Just noticed the genie's lamp is back in business http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif Good job sir Charcles keep it up!

Oh btw the inferno is missing a couple http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-17-2010, 09:18 AM
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs978.snc4/77096_466244539587_161184829587_5380046_3911044_n. jpg

The Maniac

Maniacs are the spawns of Ur-Vormoch, the Demon Overlord of Madness. These demons are the spirits of the unbalanced, infuriated and unpredictable nature of Chaos.
A true offspring of their creator, the Maniacs excel at spreading fear and panic. The Maniacs cry and shriek in pain when attacking, and laugh when wounded.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs472.ash2/74557_466244554587_161184829587_5380047_4143501_n. jpg

The Demented is the upgraded Maniac.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-17-2010, 09:38 AM
And yes, they've both been added to their respective pages on the Lamp. If you haven't noticed, I've been posting the units in their proper order. Technically due to the new tier system we don't really have level 1, level 2, etc...level 7 units anymore. But rather Tier's 1-3. Tier 1 (called "core") has 3 units, Tier 2 (called "elite") has 3 units, and Tier 3 (called "champion") has 1. So technically any of the first 3 units can be reshuffled into any order. But you should get the drift.

KingImp
11-17-2010, 09:58 AM
I like the look of most of these units, but I gotta comment on something. This was posted over on Celestial Heavens.

http://img833.imageshack.us/img833/5477/findthedifference.jpg

I'm sorry, but this is just downright lazy. Three different units that clearly have the same shape.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-17-2010, 10:08 AM
That's just the concept art. Not the in-game units. I wouldn't worry about it so much.

torzsoktamas
11-17-2010, 10:55 AM
In my opinion the new unit,the maniac and its upgrade looks superawesome!!!It is one of the best looking so far.And I also fail to see that "big" similarity bitween the manica,tormentor and goul.Every unit showed so far looks damn good!

mcgslo
11-17-2010, 03:00 PM
Maybe but im fine for some basic units to look alike... Dragons also look alike http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif or unikorns/hell charger and other. I dont think its a big deal yet. Other creatures they posted so far are quite diferent and unique ... so i just think some times people only see bad things ... lets stay positive, shall we http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

evildiablo4
11-17-2010, 04:10 PM
Which tier is the maniac in again? Looks a bit too skinny and small to be in core or champion.

Ygds11
11-17-2010, 08:43 PM
Things seem to be shaping up very nicely with the creature designs, so long as the concept art is relatively preserved. I remember being quite disappointed with the angel design in H5 after seeing the cinematic trailer they presented, that had an angel and devil that were much more awesome than their in-game counter parts. Anyway, I can say I am very happy with the designs coming out, especially in the Inferno. I still hate the Ashan designs for Angels and their kin, but I guess I will just have to live with that. If the gameplay lives up to the art, I think this will be a winner in the series.

dchalfont
11-17-2010, 10:32 PM
Originally posted by mcgslo:
Maybe but im fine for some basic units to look alike... Dragons also look alike http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif or unikorns/hell charger and other. I dont think its a big deal yet. Other creatures they posted so far are quite diferent and unique ... so i just think some times people only see bad things ... lets stay positive, shall we http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I agree, people see one thing not 100% to their liking and break down into tears. Life will go on. It makes sense to me that the weaker units would not have a massive muscular frame whereby the stats do not reflect the look or size of the units.

Lower tier= small, higher tier = big. Makes sense to me.

I also like the look, it's a big step up from the ******ed overweight zombies in HOMM5.

Xenofex_086
11-18-2010, 01:02 AM
I agree, people see one thing not 100% to their liking and break down into tears. Life will go on. It makes sense to me that the weaker units would not have a massive muscular frame whereby the stats do not reflect the look or size of the units. Oh yes, everybody is complaining that these creatures are skinny, not because they look like clones that have been painted differently. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

KingImp
11-18-2010, 01:06 AM
Originally posted by Xenofex_086:
Oh yes, everybody is complaining that these creatures are skinny, not because they look like clones that have been painted differently. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Somebody gets it. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-18-2010, 06:30 AM
They're Core. And to be clear, core are the lowest tier. It goes 3 Core -> 3 Elite -> 1 Champion.

As for the concept arts looking the same, I'm not disputing that fact. But the guys from 3Mages are to blame for the concept arts. Ubi & Black Hole give them mock drawings (rough sketches basically) and then have to approve the art that 3Mages design. The only point I was trying to make is that they look so similar mainly because they're in basically the same pose. Sure, they're bi-pedal humanoids...they're skinny...other than that, the similarities are in the pose for the most part. The actual in-game units...it's not a problem.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-18-2010, 06:43 AM
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1204.snc4/155618_466834454587_161184829587_5386782_4966436_n .jpg

The Priestess

The Priestesses of Elrath are devoted to the worship of the Dragon of Light. Chosen for their spiritual gifts, these women have dedicated their lives to bringing light and warmth to all the people in need.

Priestesses of Elrath are respected and loved by all the citizens of the Empire, and in war times they are on the front lines to care for the wounded.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1154.snc4/149660_466834479587_161184829587_5386783_484976_n. jpg

The Vestal is the upgraded Priestess.

wodahsa
11-18-2010, 08:37 AM
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre"> They're Core. And to be clear, core are the lowest tier. It goes 3 Core -> 3 Elite -> 1 Champion. </pre>

Hey Chuckles,
Thanks for that! I was wondering recently how those tiers are arranged (I mean how many units in which tier).
Btw very good work on these forums - you provided a lot of vital information so far. Waiting for more http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Kalah_0
11-18-2010, 08:49 AM
They look very nice. They maintain the typical pure- and goodness of the Haven faction, without overdoing it, and without putting forth big-breasted chicks in skimpy outfits.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-18-2010, 09:05 AM
Originally posted by wodahsa:
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre"> They're Core. And to be clear, core are the lowest tier. It goes 3 Core -> 3 Elite -> 1 Champion. </pre>

Hey Chuckles,
Thanks for that! I was wondering recently how those tiers are arranged (I mean how many units in which tier).
Btw very good work on these forums - you provided a lot of vital information so far. Waiting for more http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

No problem. And by the way, if you would prefer to see them altogether, I've got everything arranged over at the Lamp.

Necro Troops (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/necropolis_troops.htm)

Haven Troops (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/haven_troops.htm)

Inferno "sucks" Troops :O) ... Just for you JJ (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/inferno_troops.htm)

H6 Concept Art (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/concept_art.htm)

In-game Screenshot (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/screenshots.htm)

As for the missing units...I'd have to guess for Haven it's that glowing female unit from the Sveltana picture. For Necro I think it'll be that drider-like unit (female torso, spider body). The one everyone's in the dark about is the last inferno unit. Those are only my guesses though (attempting to show no foreknowlege) based on what's revealed thus far.

I have heard through a little birdie that due to Ubisoft releasing some rather big titles in the next few weeks, they'll be holding off the reveal of the 4th town until early December. So it doesn't get lost in all the noise of the new releases. That's of course subject to change...but I'm sure we'll take every rumor we can get, right? :O)

dchalfont
11-18-2010, 09:10 AM
The Priestess looks great. It seems they are introducing more female units into the game which is cool.

@ Xenofex_086 and KingImp

I've got a bit of a cramp and am in need of sodium so if you two could just send me some or your salty tears that would be just great.

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100318024248/southpark/images/thumb/e/e9/ScottTenormanMustDie30.gif/190px-ScottTenormanMustDie30.gif

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-18-2010, 09:28 AM
Originally posted by Kalah_0:
They look very nice. They maintain the typical pure- and goodness of the Haven faction, without overdoing it, and without putting forth big-breasted chicks in skimpy outfits.

Totally agreed. I especially like the fact that they don't have waists the size of my wrist. It's totally unheard of to see a female unit that has somewhat rational proportions. Lovely unit. IMO the most beautiful female interpretation from the entire Heroes franchise. Simple yet elegant.

And by the way, if the Priestess is indeed a flying unit as she appears to be AND the last Haven unit is that glowing elemental-ish chick...that'll give Haven FOUR flying units. WOW. Priestess, Griffin, Glowing Nymph, Seraph. Unheard of in Heroes-dom.

Pitsu
11-18-2010, 10:06 AM
Originally posted by dchalfont:
I've got a bit of a cramp and am in need of sodium so if you two could just send me some or your salty tears that would be just great.


Unfortunately i have no tears left. Sent some urine instead. Ordered fast delivery, so you can have it fresh if you want. But if you prefer fermented, just let it stand a few weeks before drinking.


Priestess is probably one of the best looking units thus far. Simple, yet elegant. Only the flying ability irks me.

BTOG46
11-18-2010, 10:08 AM
Originally posted by Kalah_0:
They look very nice. They maintain the typical pure- and goodness of the Haven faction, without overdoing it, and without putting forth big-breasted chicks in skimpy outfits.

I think in H V, the skimpy outfits had more to do with the personal sex fantasies of the Nival devs than with the series.....a bit like the Dark Mistress in Dungeon Keeper did for the devs in that game..... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

KingImp
11-18-2010, 10:32 AM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
Sure, they're bi-pedal humanoids...they're skinny...other than that, the similarities are in the pose for the most part. The actual in-game units...it's not a problem.

Good to know. Thanks.



Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1204.snc4/155618_466834454587_161184829587_5386782_4966436_n .jpg

The Priestess

The Priestesses of Elrath are devoted to the worship of the Dragon of Light. Chosen for their spiritual gifts, these women have dedicated their lives to bringing light and warmth to all the people in need.

Priestesses of Elrath are respected and loved by all the citizens of the Empire, and in war times they are on the front lines to care for the wounded.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1154.snc4/149660_466834479587_161184829587_5386783_484976_n. jpg

The Vestal is the upgraded Priestess.

Now this is more like it. Me likey ALOT! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

torzsoktamas
11-18-2010, 10:57 AM
I think that glowing and flying thing in the picture is in fact thise pristesse or its upgrade.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-18-2010, 11:24 AM
Originally posted by Pitsu:
Only the flying ability irks me.

Nothing confirmed on her flying or not. It could just be the way 3Mages decided to draw her. It wouldn't shock me at ALL if she was a walking unit. 4 fliers for one faction seems pretty high anyway. Heck, 3 is alot.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-18-2010, 11:24 AM
Originally posted by torzsoktamas:
I think that glowing and flying thing in the picture is in fact thise pristesse or its upgrade.

No way. Now it might be some summoned troop or something. But there's no chance it's the priestess.

torzsoktamas
11-18-2010, 01:26 PM
It might be a summoned one.

wodahsa
11-18-2010, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:

No problem. And by the way, if you would prefer to see them altogether, I've got everything arranged over at the Lamp.

Necro Troops (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/necropolis_troops.htm)

Haven Troops (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/haven_troops.htm)

Inferno "sucks" Troops :O) ... Just for you JJ (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/inferno_troops.htm)

H6 Concept Art (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/concept_art.htm)

In-game Screenshot (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/screenshots.htm)

As for the missing units...I'd have to guess for Haven it's that glowing female unit from the Sveltana picture. For Necro I think it'll be that drider-like unit (female torso, spider body). The one everyone's in the dark about is the last inferno unit. Those are only my guesses though (attempting to show no foreknowlege) based on what's revealed thus far.

I have heard through a little birdie that due to Ubisoft releasing some rather big titles in the next few weeks, they'll be holding off the reveal of the 4th town until early December. So it doesn't get lost in all the noise of the new releases. That's of course subject to change...but I'm sure we'll take every rumor we can get, right? :O)

WOW. Thanks for the links. I didn't know that units were divided into tiers already http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Some surprising things there - I thought Priestess would be elite as well as Succubus; I can't wait to see these units in action http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
And thanks again for the new info about new faction. Waiting till December http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

SandroTheMaster
11-18-2010, 10:08 PM
Damnit, lost a couple of updates.

Maniac: It looks very nice, though I'd rather have imps as Inferno's cannon fodder. It looks like it has a somewhat deformed or shrunk head. I think I like it but the Inferno units seem to be a bit alike. Which is a trait of the original Kreegans. Like they're all derived of some basic hellish lifeform or something.

The Priestess is gorgeous. I doubt she flyes, I believe she just hovers above the ground a bit, like the fairies in King's Bounty. In any case I find it hard to believe a man actually drawled her. Probably because it wasn't though...

MillionVoices
11-18-2010, 10:31 PM
well, most creatures look kinda good...
only some necro-troops and espc. the angels (meanin seraphims and celestials) doesnt look well ): imo, e.g. the outlook of angelic creatures in HOMM3/5 was better.
h/e, the worst appearance have the towns... the academy-city alone had a better in HOMM5 than the Heroes6 necro&haven towns together ~.+

PS: yes, the priestress looks gorgeous ^^

KingImp
11-19-2010, 02:34 AM
Love the look of the new Necro Champion unit. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-19-2010, 05:54 AM
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs468.ash2/74124_467420019587_161184829587_5393051_3678184_n. jpg

The Fate Spinner

The Fate Spinner is an avatar of the Spider Goddess, a truly divine reflection of the Death aspect of Asha. She has left the goddess's side to materialize on the surface of Ashan. The Fate Spinner will often be present at the founding of a Necropolis, fortifying the foundations and encouraging its growth.

Like the queen of a hive she nurtures the growth of a necropolis; under her protection the undead comb the region for lost souls which they then recruit to swell their ranks. The Fate Spinner can either assume the form of a spider-woman hybrid or that of a human woman with two legs and six arms.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1201.snc4/155296_467420054587_161184829587_5393052_673002_n. jpg

The Fate Weaver is the upgraded Fate Spinner.


I've been wanting to post THESE images for weeks now. I knew that some people had spotted the drider version, but the humanoid version is stunning as well. LOVE this unit!

Justice
11-19-2010, 06:00 AM
Absolutely brilliant. Got nothing bad to say about this or the priestess http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

torzsoktamas
11-19-2010, 06:31 AM
Awesome champion!Way better than the bone dragon!But how will the two forms work?

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-19-2010, 07:28 AM
Originally posted by torzsoktamas:
Awesome champion!Way better than the bone dragon!But how will the two forms work?

We've not been given the details on that, but if I had to guess, I'd say that each form has it's own set of unique abilities and at the start of combat you can choose which form she will take. Simple yet effective.

torzsoktamas
11-19-2010, 07:51 AM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by torzsoktamas:
Awesome champion!Way better than the bone dragon!But how will the two forms work?

We've not been given the details on that, but if I had to guess, I'd say that each form has it's own set of unique abilities and at the start of combat you can choose which form she will take. Simple yet effective. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
That is logic!And super awesome!

KingImp
11-19-2010, 02:02 PM
I'm wondering if this Spinner will be like a Naga in that they can hit multiple targets with all those arms and legs.

dchalfont
11-19-2010, 11:04 PM
C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s

"The Fate Spinner"

YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS.

Of all the changes that were needed a new top tier unit for Necro was right at the top for me, with so much lore to delve into why they used a generic Dragon when there were already dragons was beyond me.

This is going to be the best heroes game ever!

EDIT:

I also changed my name about the Sun Riders name, I don't think it's so bad now.

I noticed the Fate Spinner is in keeping with the more even unit genders in this game. I like that, a welcome change.

Ygds11
11-20-2010, 01:13 AM
Hell yah!! That is definitely more fitting than the bone dragon. Under the new lore, this Fate spinner is absolutely perfect. Having alternate forms is probably one of the most innovative things I have seen from what has been shown so far.

I wonder if other units will have neat characteristics like that? I sure hope so, it definitely adds uniqueness to a faction to have a non-standard unit like this one. I hope they keep up this 1unit/1-2days thing like they have been doing. It is a perfect pace that is certainly keeping me interested.

With this kind of change, I hope the fourth or fifth faction they reveal is the Faceless, dethroning the dark-elf street walkers from the last installment. If they have made such a large change as to replace the traditional top tier unit, of the Necropolis, then I am sure we can look forward to even greater and better changes.

I personally have a burning desire to see what the faceless are. I would love to see dignified and intelligent blind troglodytes (like a more upright and dominating version than the ones in H3). but this is wishlisting. Don't want to do that. Just voicing that I am so stoked for this, and may have to buy a new computer to make sure I can play it. These line-ups look fantastic.

SandroTheMaster
11-20-2010, 04:08 AM
So... the Necromantic Top tier is the Necropolis equivalent of the Angels.

I can live with that, though this religious aspect of the necromancers is one to bother me in Ashan...

I really expected something different, but is a very good design and one of the few cases where the upgrade has some massive differences. Though I'd say that choosing her form before combat would be cumbersome. Better to be able to change form during combat so you can choose whichever fits the situation, once you can only know the situation once the combat is on its track.

I think what really bothers me is the idea that the necromancers form a hive under the guide of Asha. At least before you could argue that they were rationalizing Asha by shaping it into their liking but something like that is certainly a sign of actual guidance.

Eh... I guess I just prefer the necromancers as an independent force with their own interests than a cult of a divine aspect. If you have a God backing you up it means at some level you are right of your convictions, even if there are other competing Gods. I don't know.

I was excited by the design but this lore just bothers me somehow. Sorry for being a downer. I really didn't want to. It's more a matter of personal beliefs and likings of my fantasy genres.

dchalfont
11-20-2010, 05:50 AM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:

I can live with that, though this religious aspect of the necromancers is one to bother me in Ashan...


Forgive me if I misunderstood the lore when I read it earlier, but doesn't it just suggest that the Fate Spinner/Weaver were a schism of Asha worship and that they rejected it. I don't think it says anywhere that they follow any god, just that The Fate Spinner/Weaver helps organise the Necropolis. It makes sense that someone take charge. Her lore doesn't sound very different from that of the Liches, former Mages who turned to dark arts etc.

I think the Fate Spinner is just a sign that even in chaos there needs to be order.

I like the position of power thing and it especially amuses me that the top tier unit is not female, albeit a female spider. When there were not many female characters in the game before. It's a good change.

Keep up the info I need to hoard more pics for my HOMM...I mean MMH folder of info.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-20-2010, 08:35 AM
Originally posted by KingImp:
I'm wondering if this Spinner will be like a Naga in that they can hit multiple targets with all those arms and legs.

I haven't seen confimation on it, but I can't imagine that NOT being the case.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-20-2010, 08:51 AM
A few tidbits from a Q&A on Heroes 5....


Here are exclusive examples of unique buildings:

- For Haven: the Statue of Revelation which removes fog of war in a targeted area, once a week.

- For Necropolis: the Altar of Eternal Servitude, which gathers the remains of the player’s Necropolis Creatures that fell in combat, so they can be recruited again (for a price).

I freaking LOVE these! :O)


Will mixed neutrals ala Tribes of the East be returning? Pretty please

Yes.


According to the timeline, necromancy was only discovered in 461 YSD and the rise of the Necromancers took place almost 50 years after H6, in 610. How is it possible the Necromancers are such a strong force at this point in time?

At the time of Heroes VI, Necromancers are just a group of wizards, not a full Nation. They are part of the 7 cities. But their cult is 100 years old. Heroes VI is the turning point where Necromancers come to the foreground.

If you're interested, you can read the full Q&A HERE (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=34048).

KingImp
11-20-2010, 02:59 PM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by KingImp:
I'm wondering if this Spinner will be like a Naga in that they can hit multiple targets with all those arms and legs.

I haven't seen confimation on it, but I can't imagine that NOT being the case. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Naga confirmation! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

dchalfont
11-20-2010, 04:46 PM
"For Necropolis: the Altar of Eternal Servitude, which gathers the remains of the player’s Necropolis Creatures that fell in combat, so they can be recruited again (for a price)"

That sounds amazing. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Necro units are weaker so it will be good to not have to worry about losing numbers so much in battles when you can re-recruit them.

Kartabon
11-21-2010, 04:03 AM
Originally posted by dchalfont:
"For Necropolis: the Altar of Eternal Servitude, which gathers the remains of the player’s Necropolis Creatures that fell in combat, so they can be recruited again (for a price)"

That sounds amazing. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Necro units are weaker so it will be good to not have to worry about losing numbers so much in battles when you can re-recruit them.

Sounds very OP... hope they will take their time to balance THAT :P

dchalfont
11-21-2010, 06:10 AM
Originally posted by Kartabon:

Sounds very OP... hope they will take their time to balance THAT :P

Well you do have to pay for them, maybe there is a cooldown too, like they appear in your base for hire after 7 days etc.

Elementalist.
11-21-2010, 01:31 PM
Priestesses are not flying btw http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-21-2010, 03:39 PM
Originally posted by Elementalist.:
Priestesses are not flying btw http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

I know that and YOU know that...but nobody else here does.......oops. I guess the cat's out of the bag on that one. :O)

You've got to admit that the way they did the concept art for her certainly puts forth that impression.

dchalfont
11-21-2010, 06:27 PM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:

You've got to admit that the way they did the concept art for her certainly puts forth that impression.

Flying or not, I'd still tap that.


I didn't mean to steal your glory Chuckles but the new pics are up so I figured I'd post them.
Breeder
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/8110/breeder.jpg
Mother Breeder
http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/9366/motherbreederupgradedbr.jpg

I think they're awesome, they remind me of the venom spitter unit that replaced the Lich in HOMM4

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-22-2010, 05:52 AM
Not a problem. I'm sure some people are happy to know that Imps are back. Just not in the form they expected. :O)

dchalfont
11-22-2010, 06:30 AM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
Not a problem. I'm sure some people are happy to know that Imps are back. Just not in the form they expected. :O)

If I wasn't broke I'd bet money that they are a ranged unit and that the imps are volatile and fly at the enemy and explode on impact for AOE fire damage.

Aka Lich + fire + awesomeness = Profit?

torzsoktamas
11-22-2010, 07:59 AM
I like this breeder unit!It brings more inovation to the game!

Ygds11
11-22-2010, 10:10 AM
this is a stunning example of creative integration. Thing looks like a daemonic version of a Dark young of shub-niggurath. It looks like it fits, I can see the little imp that is spawned from it being a larval form of the other daemons.

I don't know if I'm right but I think it siphon's magic points to spawn stacks of imps on the battlfield, the more breeders, the larger each stack size. It also sound like it might be a terminal creature. That it will expire during combat if it cannot get mana to reproduce, the stack size decreasing with every round. This would play out in a very interesting manner strategically.

I think it is neat that the devs are using daemonic entities from all sorts of sources. They each look very much like the things they represent. Very, very cool.

KingImp
11-22-2010, 01:40 PM
Gotta say I love this Breeder. Very cool looking.

As they say, and then there was one. Only one more Haven unit to be revealed before they move on to the next faction. What's it gonna be folks?
I want to say a Priest type unit, but I think that may be too similar to the Priestess. If I had to take a wild guess, I'd go with something like a Paladin that we had in Heroes 1 & 2.

Ygds11
11-22-2010, 02:19 PM
I can't really begin to guess what the last haven unit will be. I wonder somewhat if they will surprise us, with something totally off the wall. They have done so with the final units now in the Necropolis and Inferno. The Fate spinner and Breeder are very new to the franchise and wonderfully integrated. I wonder if we can expect the same thing from the Haven.

That light entity in the artwork is my guess, but it may be that that entity is linked to the next unit not necessarily that unit. like mentioned a summonable entity. The next unit might be the summoner of that entity.
there might be place for a longswordman type unit but i don't think it is going to be so generic. They could pull something completely new and have it be a type of artillery for the first time as a unit, not just an asset.

Anyway, Looking great Ubi.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-22-2010, 02:56 PM
Originally posted by KingImp:
Gotta say I love this Breeder. Very cool looking.

As they say, and then there was one. Only one more Haven unit to be revealed before they move on to the next faction. What's it gonna be folks?
I want to say a Priest type unit, but I think that may be too similar to the Priestess. If I had to take a wild guess, I'd go with something like a Paladin that we had in Heroes 1 & 2.

I thought we'd already decided what the last Haven unit was. Just about everybody thinks it's that glowing nymph flying above the Haven army in that Sveltana picture.

I'm not saying that's what it is...but it does seem to be the concensus.


Oh...the heck with it. Here's the final Haven unit. Enjoy.

http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/images/H3_artwork/art7.jpg

Hmmm....you guys might not like that picture. The new unit is directly behind the Medusa. Drat. :O)

evildiablo4
11-22-2010, 07:56 PM
finally, that's what im talking about. An ORIGINAL creature that actually looks INCREDIBLE and REFRESHING without the controversial. The only thing i dont get is the large mother version and the small flying version. How does that work? Same for the necro fate spinner

wdcryer
11-22-2010, 08:39 PM
Originally posted by evildiablo4:
finally, that's what im talking about. An ORIGINAL creature that actually looks INCREDIBLE and REFRESHING without the controversial. The only thing i dont get is the large mother version and the small flying version. How does that work? Same for the necro fate spinner

The flying unit is probably the imps that the breeder creates. Here is the official description:


The Breeders were the result of Urgash crafting a material form that translated some of his own primordial drives. Specifically, the drive to consume mana and the drive to populate Ashan with hordes of creatures loyal to the dictates of Chaos. Bestowed upon Ur-Mespharoth, the Demon Overlord of Proliferation, the Breeder is an obese, pulsing mass of flesh that continually creates Imps. The Imps that she births are “spit” from the various orifices that randomly appear on her body.
Though this demon is almost incapable of movement, she constantly twitches and contracts with her insatiable need to procreate. This drive to reproduce eats her from the inside out, and much of her energy is consumed in efforts to control the mutations of her body. She will occasionally consume her own Imp offspring.
She uses the mana energy that she ingests to impregnate herself, as nourishment, and to help her control the gruesome deformities that are created by her ceaseless cycle of birthing.

The Fate Spinner seems to be able to change between the two forms shown in combat.


The Fate Spinner can either assume the form of a spider-woman hybrid or that of a human woman with two legs and six arms.

Ygds11
11-22-2010, 10:30 PM
After looking at the Sveltana artwork again, I think it's got to be the light being floating above the army. However, that would definitely be a flyer. 4 flyers is alot, plus one cavalry. That seems to put the emphasis highly on mobility within Haven. Perhaps this is balanced out with low HP, and medium defense. Should this be true, it would explain the fact that the faction has a specialized healer unit in the Priestess.

It used to be that the Knight/Castle/Haven was the one faction I thought was a waste of time. I hated playing as a human. But with it's current line-up, I'm starting to re-think my position. it definitely would get points with me to have another supernatural unit in it's ranks.

mcgslo
11-23-2010, 01:25 AM
First: tnx to C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s for posting new units regulary http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Second: now we only miss one more Heaven unit... i wonder what it will be. Catapult/balista unit?

So far we have 2 Humans Sentinel and Crossbowman. One birdie Griffin and 3 Holy/Heaven Units Pristess,Sun Raider, Angels.

So one more holy/heaven unit? or more Human like unit? Peasents are out of the question since we are looking for Elite unit.

third: After last heaven unit they will have to show us next faction. I have feeling that would be Academy.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-23-2010, 07:21 AM
Originally posted by Ygds11:
After looking at the Sveltana artwork again, I think it's got to be the light being floating above the army. However, that would definitely be a flyer. 4 flyers is alot, plus one cavalry. That seems to put the emphasis highly on mobility within Haven. Perhaps this is balanced out with low HP, and medium defense. Should this be true, it would explain the fact that the faction has a specialized healer unit in the Priestess.

It used to be that the Knight/Castle/Haven was the one faction I thought was a waste of time. I hated playing as a human. But with it's current line-up, I'm starting to re-think my position. it definitely would get points with me to have another supernatural unit in it's ranks.

Actually, it would only be 3 flying units. I was teasing you guys the other day, but Elvin (Elementalist) let the truth slip out. :O) The Priestess/Vestal does NOT fly...despite how they drew the concept art. So as of right now, Haven has the Griffin & the Seraph as fliers. If the last unit ends up being the glowy-lass in the picture...then yes, it'll be 3.

dchalfont
11-23-2010, 07:21 AM
Originally posted by mcgslo:

third: After last heaven unit they will have to show us next faction. I have feeling that would be Academy.

I would give anything for you to be right.

God damn the genies will look great in the new/updated engine.

torzsoktamas
11-23-2010, 07:24 AM
I think the last Heaven unit could be a zealot/inquisitor that can summon that light entity.It would be awesome.

Ygds11
11-23-2010, 02:48 PM
sorry Chuckles. I miss counted. I was not thinking of the priestess, In fact I don't really know what I was thinking, for some reason I thought there was some other flying unit. This was likely due to being overtired from university work. Sorry, I have been keeping up with the posts and was quite aware that the priestess does NOT fly. Sorry about the confusion, and causing you to correct someone....yet again.

Still it seems to be resembling a high mobility force. I did not point out the priestess's mobility as a benefit only her ability to act as a healer of the always highly vulnerable flyer units. I was/am always careful in how I use flying units. having another non-flying unit capable of healing them would be synergetically beneficial. In my previous post I was merely positing the idea that the priestess may act as a limited-mobility hub for the flying and high mobility units in the Haven faction, to route through on their more risky tasks, let's say diving into a pile up of creature stacks.

KingImp
11-23-2010, 04:01 PM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by KingImp:
Gotta say I love this Breeder. Very cool looking.

As they say, and then there was one. Only one more Haven unit to be revealed before they move on to the next faction. What's it gonna be folks?
I want to say a Priest type unit, but I think that may be too similar to the Priestess. If I had to take a wild guess, I'd go with something like a Paladin that we had in Heroes 1 & 2.

I thought we'd already decided what the last Haven unit was. Just about everybody thinks it's that glowing nymph flying above the Haven army in that Sveltana picture.

I'm not saying that's what it is...but it does seem to be the concensus. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, it's the consensus among those that aren't in the loop. Unless of course that was your way of confirming it without actually saying so.

evildiablo4
11-23-2010, 09:52 PM
Man, with new creatures coming out, i really want a sequel/prequel to Dark Messiah Might and Magic and explore the world on a FPS level some more. I know it's hard to ask for since the poor success of Dark Messiah but damn, that game is one of the best FPS games I ever played.

Sure would like to see crossbow and battle axe in some FPS action...

mcgslo
11-24-2010, 04:34 AM
so finall unit in heaven is known... i like it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif ill let chuckles to post the name and pictures http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

KingImp
11-24-2010, 05:57 AM
Seems like a strange fit for the Haven faction, but overall I like it.

SandroTheMaster
11-24-2010, 06:35 AM
Originally posted by evildiablo4:
Man, with new creatures coming out, i really want a sequel/prequel to Dark Messiah Might and Magic and explore the world on a FPS level some more. I know it's hard to ask for since the poor success of Dark Messiah but damn, that game is one of the best FPS games I ever played.

Sure would like to see crossbow and battle axe in some FPS action...

Or, better yet, Might and Magic X.

This new Heroes is making a lot of original input into the series. I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing though... the draw of Heroes is to command and send to battle hordes of those legendary monsters of myth known and familiar to all. It feels quite differently to order 100 dragons to do your binding while you have 1000 minotaurs waiting than ordering 100 breeder to **** around while you have 1000 maniacs at your disposal. On the other hand new stuff is exciting and interesting, but won't make anyone from the outside think: "Cool! I can have Fate-spinners in this game!"

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
11-24-2010, 06:57 AM
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs992.snc4/76495_470459639587_161184829587_5433049_6888572_n. jpg

The Radiant Glory.

In the Spirit Realm, Elrath's dominion is filled with myriads of Light Elementals. Some are elevated by the Dragon-God of Light to a higher status. Vessels of the will of Elrath, sent as envoys and advisors to his most faithful followers, Radiant Glories are shining creatures who can flare into brilliance and blind their enemies. The generals of the Holy Empire soon found a use for these beings of burning light.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1193.snc4/154499_470459544587_161184829587_5433048_1433194_n .jpg

The Blazing Glory is the upgraded Radiant Glory.

dchalfont
11-24-2010, 07:02 AM
Really liking this unit.

Haven needed more supernatural units as well as a more diverse colour palette and this serves both functions.

It also enhances the light/sun theme of the faction. Before there was no theme, it was just a bunch of grey armoured humans + bird and angel :S

I hope it is fast as hell ( being a being of light and all ) like pheonix speed.

EDIT:

OMFG HD game screens

http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/8755/41531136.jpg

http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/2295/28773408.jpg

http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/1200/66914256.jpg

http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/1539/37156514.jpg

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/3276/96536280.jpg

http://img840.imageshack.us/img840/9130/94268460.jpg

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/5728/61064887.jpg

http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/3916/98708297.jpg

http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/9445/34297721.jpg

torzsoktamas
11-24-2010, 10:46 AM
On the radian/blazing glory: I think this ceature looks nice!It is something new and now Haven is not just a human town.I don't know if the big amount of female creatures in this game will be good or not,...it won't disturb me,but I still think that battle is a brutal business and is not for women,so for example male angels would be more apropriate,but...(well dosen't matter,just loud thinkng)

And about those screenshots:Man that skeleton looks awesome!He no longer looks that weak skeleton warrior that everybody laughed and killed easely.I hope they will be resonably strong now.

Pitsu
11-24-2010, 10:52 AM
HD pics? Good, goooood...
Now, fellow strategy game players, please take the last image with necropolis town and tell me from which distance (from the screen) and after how long time you identified the stack that guards the learning stone right from the town?

Ygds11
11-24-2010, 11:25 AM
Pitsu, that would be a marksman stack, 7 sec 4 inches from the screen when I made it out.

Pitsu
11-24-2010, 11:54 AM
I was sure that they do not release a screen with a unknown monster, and the screen is obviously from the (known) demo map. Thus it should be a known (haven) creature. First glance at it signaled my brain:
"swordmen".
Then another signal came:
"there are no sword wielding (live) humans". "maybe pikeman?"
"no pike visible, thus unlikely"
"one of the archers?"
"hmm, could be."
scan through all other possibilities.
"indeed, it must be the archers!"

dunno about time. over 10s sure. Had to look closer than usually too.

Of course i understand that after some playing experience and seeing animations, it is (probably http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif ) much easier to read such important strategical information from the screen.

KingImp
11-24-2010, 01:54 PM
Originally posted by Pitsu:
Now, fellow strategy game players, please take the last image with necropolis town and tell me from which distance (from the screen) and after how long time you identified the stack that guards the learning stone right from the town?

I honestly can't say for certain what it is, but since that's definitely the Haven symbol and to me that looks like a sword, I'm thinking Paladin.

Oh, and roughly 3 feet away and I made my guess around 5 seconds.

evildiablo4
11-24-2010, 01:57 PM
The close ups of the undead creatures looks amazing, especially of the skeleton.

Castle design could use some more work though. Add more detail

KingImp
11-24-2010, 02:00 PM
Okay, so as far as shooters go we know the Skeleton and the Lich shoot for Necro and the Crossbowman for Haven. After that, it's not so definitive. We could assume the Succubus does based on the fact that she did in H5 or maybe this Breeder is a shooter as well. Who is the second shooter for Haven though? I know there is no rule saying they have to have two shooters, but for as long as I can remember they have so I'm guessing the same will hold true here. I doubt it's the Priestess so I'm guessing this Glory thing can shoot.

Dark-Whisperer
11-24-2010, 02:13 PM
Originally posted by evildiablo4:
Castle design could use some more work though. Add more detail

My thoughts exactly - on both screens where we can see castles (necro and heaven) I wasn't happy about the design, but I guess those are final because we are so close to release and there is no point in asking for a change now. Also this castle looks too big on the map...

dchalfont
11-24-2010, 06:27 PM
RE: Vacant towns.

We don't know how upgraded this town it, it may only have a fort and little to no creature dwellings at this point. Wait and see, heroes towns always look epic when fully upgraded.

mcgslo
11-25-2010, 12:52 AM
KingImp: why couldnt Pristess be shooter? Priests in H5 were shooters and in H3 Monks were shooters.

What stack and what faction is creature on far left edge? (last Town picture)

Ygds11
11-25-2010, 01:30 AM
KingImp. Actually in Heroes 2 Knight/Haven/castle faction only had the archer as a shooter. It is not actually a constant for the faction. My guess is that Haven focuses on mobility, necropolis on stack size and drawn out battles and that Inferno is strongly melee based with no shooters. The succubus is carrying a whip, as is the Maniac (well chains actually). This might mean while they do not have any shooters, they may be able to strike multiple targets, focusing on splash and sweeping damage.
Just my thoughts, it would be neat to have a faction with no shooters, a real challenge.

I still recall being beaten to a pulp by ranged creatures in H2 And H3 even though my numbers were up to at least double theirs. hopefully this is balanced nicely if true.

also the creature stack on the left is a Griffon stack, unupgraded.

KingImp
11-25-2010, 07:08 AM
Originally posted by mcgslo:
KingImp: why couldnt Pristess be shooter? Priests in H5 were shooters and in H3 Monks were shooters.

Didn't say she couldn't be. I just said I didn't think she will be. From the sounds of it, she's purely a healer/support type unit. The Priests/Inquisitors/Zealots, while they did have support spells, were also fighters. I don't get that vibe from the Priestess.



Originally posted by Ygds11:
KingImp. Actually in Heroes 2 Knight/Haven/castle faction only had the archer as a shooter. It is not actually a constant for the faction.

Thus why I said "as long as I can remember." http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

To be honest, I really don't remember much about H1 or 2.

Ygds11
11-25-2010, 09:36 AM
Sorry KingImp for misunderstanding, i did not mean to offend you.

KingImp
11-26-2010, 09:27 AM
No problem and I wasn't offended in the least.

SandroTheMaster
11-26-2010, 10:38 PM
Heroes 3 Necropolis, Inferno and Fortress only had one shooter as well (Lich, Gog and Lizardman, respectively). EDIT: AND Rampart, who only had elves but escaped earlier scrutiny because I still remember it as a ranged powerhouse. But... well... Grand Elves are mighty powerful.

Heroes 4 Necropolis still only had 1 shooter.

Wizard/Tower/Academy had 3 shooters. (Well... Order had 2 shooters and 2 casters)

And shooters are essential to clearing wandering monsters with minimal losses. Every town has had a low tier (tier 1 or 2) shooter to this effect with the exception of the Necromancers, who can afford to lose a few skeletons in those skirmishes, if you catch my drift. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I wonder if wandering monsters will have mixed stacks. It makes random battles much more interesting in the long run.

dchalfont
11-27-2010, 11:54 PM
Ubisoft interview with GAMEPLAY FOOTAGE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEpAn6QntYc

Around the 2:00 mark and afterward they show some battle footage including awesome griffin flying animation and attack etc and some adventure screen movement. It also shows an animation where a Haven town is being transferred into a Necropolis, it looks bad ***...

EDIT:

lol the word a$$ was censored. Can someone tell the forum creators that an *** is a name for a Donkey...because I don't think that counts as a 'swear word'.

KingImp
12-15-2010, 02:44 PM
From Ubi's German page (why it was announced there first and nowhere else is beyond me).

The 4th faction - Stronghold (I assume as I can't read German)

http://static2.cdn.ubi.com/forums/de/mmhvi_stronghold_mauler.png

http://static2.cdn.ubi.com/forums/de/mmhvi_stronghold_harpy.png

http://static2.cdn.ubi.com/forums/de/mmhvi_stronghold_goblin.png

Doomcore
12-15-2010, 03:18 PM
Not really happy about Stronghold as the final 4th faction in this game. I hope that they will add academy, sylvan/nature, dungeon and fortress from HR3 in expansions, otherwise, this game goes down fast.

KingImp
12-15-2010, 03:32 PM
Originally posted by Doomcore:
Not really happy about Stronghold as the final 4th faction in this game. I hope that they will add academy, sylvan/nature, dungeon and fortress from HR3 in expansions, otherwise, this game goes down fast.

There is still one more faction to be announced so there is still hope for one of those in the initial product. Although they did hint that there was a brand new faction, so maybe that's not the case.

I agree though, those others need to make it into the subsequent expansions.

Ygds11
12-15-2010, 04:43 PM
I am extremely surprised this didn't show up here first, seems a little disorganized if you ask me. Though if you ask me this homepage is very bland, outsourcing most of it's core information.

But now this has been revealed, as I stated in another thread, this seems like it might actually be the Jungle tile-set faction. The colorful, Islander/Mesoamerican design, would fit well in a Jungle themed environment. The goblin holding a boomerang is especially interesting. The Ravenor (I think that's what it is called) looks like a supped up Maori warrior. The weapon itself seems to be inspired by club like weapons utilized by the Maori. I am especially glad the harpy was been brought in, it seems to fit in well, being of similar origin to the orcs. Also the harpy further supports the idea of a jungle themed environ for the orcs, as it comes from some island, Pao. I don't know enough about H5 to say where that island is, but from the look my guess is tropical. Anyway, thanks for putting the pictures here.

MillionVoices
12-15-2010, 07:32 PM
I guess that ubi `ll have to release many expansions or this game ll be a failure... A game w/o elves, titans, dragons, draws,... *wtf?* T_T

PS: as there aren`t that many german-speakin ppl here: ^^
Die Festung! Zu den Kreaturen der Festung gehören unter anderem Orks, Goblins, Zyklopen und einige weitere sagenhafte Wesen …

[engl.] The Stronghold/Fortress. (Both words have the meaning "Festung", but regardin HoMM III, Stonghold might me more accurate.) Among others, Orcs, Goblins, Cyclops and several other fabled creatures belong to the Stronghold - creatures...

Werfen wir zunächst einen Blick auf die drei Kerneinheiten der Festung:
[engl.] At first, let`s take a look at the three main Stronghold - creatures:

Der Zerfleischer (= Mangler)
[to mangle = zerfleischen]

Harpy and Goblin schould be clear http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-15-2010, 08:19 PM
Yep, it's stronghold guys. And it was a mix-up on Ubi-germany's part. It was all supposed to be revealed on Thursday. Somebody jumped the gun.

But besides the minor mix-up...I freaking LOVE that harpy. LOVE. IT. :O)

SwampLord450
12-15-2010, 08:22 PM
Chuckles, can you confirm if this is or is not a jungle town?

I'd love it if they are a Native American-themed Plains town, but if they're Jungle I'm going to be really sad for two reasons.

A), it kills any chance of Fortress getting any recognition at all (again! Two games and two expansion packs now, and you can't even throw us a neutral? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif )

B), it means that the new town will likely be a Faceless Dungeon or something, which means Dungeon as we know it will not be returning to the series in HVI.

So that would mean that not only would the core of the Barbarian town be compromised (they've always been about sparse, harsh terrain, and it feels weird having them in a lush jungle) but one other classic town would be knocked out entirely.

Please, please, pleaassee say this isn't the Jungle town...

Ygds11
12-15-2010, 09:08 PM
And it was a mix-up on Ubi-germany's part. It was all supposed to be revealed on Thursday. Somebody jumped the gun.

Really, well not the first time this has happened I suppose. There was some guy on the Warhammer page not long ago who did worse with a major reveal made months in advance because of an article update mistake. Anyway.

What can we expect as far as pace of reveal. The last factions were revealed at a rate of about 1 creature per 2-3 days. considering they also had several debut units, can it be realistically assumed that they will be giving us our fix again?

I got to tell you, I need my fix, I NEED MY FIX!!

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-16-2010, 08:51 AM
Originally posted by SwampLord450:
Chuckles, can you confirm if this is or is not a jungle town?

No, I can't. :O) *visualizes goblins roaming the open plains* Nope, can't say a thing.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-16-2010, 08:55 AM
For those of you thinking it will be Dungeon or even Fortress...remember that Ubi stated that there will be ONE brand new faction. I take that to mean a faction that's NEVER been included in Heroes before. I guess it COULD be taken to mean a faction that's been totally re-done, but that's certainly not how I read it.

SwampLord450
12-16-2010, 09:00 AM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
For those of you thinking it will be Dungeon or even Fortress...remember that Ubi stated that there will be ONE brand new faction. I take that to mean a faction that's NEVER been included in Heroes before. I guess it COULD be taken to mean a faction that's been totally re-done, but that's certainly not how I read it.

I'd be really pleased with a Naga town with just the Gorgon and the Basilisk, if even; that'd be enough of a successor to put HIII Fortress to rest, in my eyes.

Heck, even if it had a similar atmosphere but worked completely differently (they could be offensive glass-cannon spellcasters for all I'd mind), I'd be thrilled. I just want something mesoamerican lurking in the jungles or swamps! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

kodial79
12-16-2010, 09:49 AM
@SwampLord450

Orcs now do have that Mesoamerican fashion to them, that you want. I don't quite get why should there be a Naga faction though. Not that I will be displeased if the new one turns out to be the Nagas, but it seems to me that people have been asking for them only because they were in Warcraft III.

By the way, do you know what a Gorgon is? A monstrous female humanoid with apparent reptilian features. And although the appearance varied, this pretty much covers it. Medusa for example, was a Gorgon. That thing about the Gorgon being a bull with some kind of lethal breath, red eyes and scaly kinda skin? Well, that's a creature born and raised by D&D. Just like many other units used in Heroes III.

Now if I remember right, you were among those who disliked the Dark Elves riding velociraptors because they were ripped off Warhammer, and I don't blame you for this. But where's your sense of fairness, man? If you're gonna criticize the Dark Raiders for that, do so for the Gorgons, as well.


What I gather from the new line-up's so far, is that HoMM struggles to find its own unique identity, there's no place for D&D's Gorgon anymore. Especially in a Naga faction! I don't think bulls swim very well, after all...

wdcryer
12-16-2010, 09:50 AM
These orcs look totally like Aztec jungle dwellers to me. I mean, the harpy looks like a parrot. This faction has to be jungle-based.

Ygds11
12-16-2010, 10:45 AM
That thing about the Gorgon being a bull with some kind of lethal breath, red eyes and scaly kinda skin? Well, that's a creature born and raised by D&D. Just like many other units used in Heroes III.

Actually, no. The creature was in fact a Catoblepas derivative. The creature in one book on mythological creatures was also referred to as a gorgon, but came under the same description of a Catoblepas. It was dubbed a gorgon because of it's similar ugliness. The catoblepas is very consistent with the H3 gorgon, though the look was taken from D&D, disregarding such characteristics as the long mane of hair and the boars head. The creature was known for having poisonous breath, here look:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catoblepas

Other sources give different descriptions, the most divergent trait however is the lack of scales in Pliny the Elder's description. So toxic breath and a deathly stare as well as the overall characteristics of a bovine are the H3 gorgon and not just a rip off of D&D. However with that said, it did not excuse the use of beholders and gnolls, which are clear D&D offspring, with no real mythological origin as to either their anatomy or their culture.

The Gorgon is the only one that possesses of those three, an origin traceable to more reputable sources.


I don't quite get why should there be a Naga faction though. Not that I will be displeased if the new one turns out to be the Nagas, but it seems to me that people have been asking for them only because they were in Warcraft III.

Totally agree, especially since the ToE concept art was anatomically virtually identical to the Warcraft concepts. It seems they always have to make species like these where the females may be quite ugly, if not for the extreme sexual dimorphism. The only difference from Warcraft was males possessing four arms. They cultural divergence is not enough, they really need to go back to source material and gain some inspiration from Hindu artwork. Though if I recall correctly they may be justified in their directive of sexual dimorphism, so that may not be a concern. I just hope the concept is changed also, if the Naga go with a far-east concept, they might as well make it culturally relevant to medievil china and Japan, and have a more conservative dress code (no please, no more battle bikinis and precarious breast coverings). I would love to see a Naga decked out like a samuri with a mask and everything. But really if the Naga were inspired by Warcraft, then one might as well drop the idea, but if inspired by Hindu folklore and religious myth, then go for it, but keep it tasteful.

SwampLord450
12-16-2010, 11:09 AM
Originally posted by kodial79:
@SwampLord450

Orcs now do have that Mesoamerican fashion to them, that you want. I don't quite get why should there be a Naga faction though. Not that I will be displeased if the new one turns out to be the Nagas, but it seems to me that people have been asking for them only because they were in Warcraft III.

By the way, do you know what a Gorgon is? A monstrous female humanoid with apparent reptilian features. And although the appearance varied, this pretty much covers it. Medusa for example, was a Gorgon. That thing about the Gorgon being a bull with some kind of lethal breath, red eyes and scaly kinda skin? Well, that's a creature born and raised by D&D. Just like many other units used in Heroes III.

Now if I remember right, you were among those who disliked the Dark Elves riding velociraptors because they were ripped off Warhammer, and I don't blame you for this. But where's your sense of fairness, man? If you're gonna criticize the Dark Raiders for that, do so for the Gorgons, as well.


What I gather from the new line-up's so far, is that HoMM struggles to find its own unique identity, there's no place for D&D's Gorgon anymore. Especially in a Naga faction! I don't think bulls swim very well, after all...

I criticized the Dark Elves because, as a whole, they were completely ripped from Warhammer.

Heroes has ALWAYS been about plucking random monsters from mythology and stuff like D&D and putting them together in cool and interesting combinations; that's a different thing entirely from straight copying a humanoid faction from another game.

Orcs are pretty clearly going to be on Plains, imo, so they won't be the mesoamerican jungle faction I'm looking for.
Regarding Nagas; I'd MUCH rather have a Lizardman faction than Nagas, but Nagas seem to be the most likely race for a new faction, which is why I cited them.

wdcryer
12-16-2010, 12:35 PM
Originally posted by SwampLord450:
Orcs are pretty clearly going to be on Plains, imo, so they won't be the mesoamerican jungle faction I'm looking for.

Why do you think they'll be on plains? The Harpy looks like a parrot, and there is a lot of green in the Mauler/Crusher. My guess would definitely be jungle.

Ygds11
12-16-2010, 12:41 PM
Sorry Swamplord, but a plains environment would be very detached from the artistic direction of the revealed units. However this may represent a portion of their history where they started as Jungle/Tropical dwelling people, and moved to more arid environments in the centuries afterwards, perhaps pushed by another Faction. The obsidian blades sticking out of their weapons is very similar to Maya weaponry. The armor of the Orc has plates that seem to be made of Pounamu/Greenstone, the material used by Maori warriors to craft clubs called patu. The stone also serves some decorative uses. The design is overtly geared towards Jungle/Tropical Island living civilizations. With that said, it would be strikingly creative to place them in a plains environment, but not likely given the motifs.

KingImp
12-16-2010, 01:28 PM
While it's different than we are used to for this faction, I'm fine with the Orcs being in the jungle instead of the rocky plains.

While I can understand the frustration of those who want the Naga based faction (I want it too) and think they belong to the jungle, I always saw them more as a swampy, marsh based town. That's what they were in Heroes 3 afterall.
You could still have that and it could even be the new underground faction.

KingImp
12-16-2010, 01:33 PM
Oh, and even though I'm trying to convince myself this is a possibility, I keep going back to something I recently said on Celestial Heavens.

Maybe my thinking is just old fashioned, but the way I see it, the final faction has to be good natured. You have the Inferno and Necro as evil-based and Haven as good. One could only assume that this Stronghold is the neutral faction, so they need one more "good" faction to round it out.

Not sure if that's how they look at things, but for me and my need for symmetry and balance I couldn't see 4 "evil" factions and 1 "good" faction in the initial release.

kodial79
12-16-2010, 01:41 PM
Originally posted by KingImp:
You have the Inferno and Necro as evil-based and Haven as good.

For like the hundredth time, Necro is not evil and Haven is not good on Ashan. They're both kind of neutral.

KingImp
12-16-2010, 01:50 PM
Originally posted by kodial79:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by KingImp:
You have the Inferno and Necro as evil-based and Haven as good.

For like the hundredth time, Necro is not evil and Haven is not good on Ashan. They're both kind of neutral. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Then please explain why then in Heroes 5 (Ashan) there was an artifact called Edge of Balance and when equipped it added +3 to Hero's Attack and subtracted -1 from Hero's Defense for "good" races or added +3 to Hero's Defense and subtracted -1 from Hero's Attack for "evil" races.

When equipped to Dungeon, Inferno, Necro, and Stronghold it saw them as evil and when equipped to Academy, Fortress, Haven, and Sylvan it saw them as good.

Now, you could say that there is a system in place that sees factions in this way: pure good, good-neutral, neutral, evil-neutral, pure evil. In that case I could see Haven as good-neutral and Necro as evil-neutral, but they still side towards one or the other and not as a pure neutral faction.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-16-2010, 02:03 PM
Originally posted by wdcryer:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SwampLord450:
Orcs are pretty clearly going to be on Plains, imo, so they won't be the mesoamerican jungle faction I'm looking for.

Why do you think they'll be on plains? The Harpy looks like a parrot, and there is a lot of green in the Mauler/Crusher. My guess would definitely be jungle. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think he's assuming they'll be plains because I basically just said they would be plains. So let's be blunt. Stronghold's native terrain...is plains.

Now that doesn't mean the new faction has to have Jungle as their terrain type. We've still got Underground, we could have multiple towns with the same terrain type, and we could also have not revealed all the terrain types too. :O) So basically, all you know is that the last faction has to be a "NEW" faction. I'll leave the conjecture up to you guys. :O)

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-16-2010, 02:04 PM
By the way, I'll be posting some SWEET screenshots shortly. Patience. :O)

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-16-2010, 02:14 PM
I don't want to bog down the forums with these images (they're BIG), so I'll just post the link to the screenshot page (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/screenshots.htm) over at The Genie's Lamp. Enjoy guys!

I'll be putting up the Stronghold pages shortly.

kodial79
12-16-2010, 02:28 PM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
I don't want to bog down the forums with these images (they're BIG), so I'll just post the link to the screenshot page (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/screenshots.htm) over at The Genie's Lamp. Enjoy guys!

I'll be putting up the Stronghold pages shortly.

I already saw the screenshots on your site. Excellent! Centaurs are confirmed! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I kind of expected that if they would be in, they'd get a zebra twist though... Are you sure their native terrain is Plains? Despite what you said the whole thing still screams jungle!

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-16-2010, 02:33 PM
Positive. Plains terrain is the one in the screenshots pictured there.

kodial79
12-16-2010, 02:37 PM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
Positive. Plains terrain is the one in the screenshots pictured there.

Well, if you say so...

By the way, is that big nasty orc the Slayer? Wow...

SwampLord450
12-16-2010, 03:05 PM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
Positive. Plains terrain is the one in the screenshots pictured there.


And those screenshots are BEAUTIFUL; the game looks AMAZING! I really like how they rescaled the heroes. And that volcano is STUNNING. I am blown away by this, 100%. CANNOT WAIT.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-16-2010, 04:17 PM
I don't know if it was intended or not, but with those big screenshots, they revealed the entire Stronghold faction. Every unit. Now we don't know the names or their tiers...but it's pretty obvious what's what. I've added the images on the Stronghold troops page.

http://www.the-genies-lamp.com...tronghold_troops.htm (http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/heroes_6/stronghold_troops.htm)

Doomcore
12-16-2010, 04:21 PM
Damn, volcano and it's surroundings look amazing!

So, they have to reveal one more faction or....?

SwampLord450
12-16-2010, 04:35 PM
What I'm wondering is, if that's Summer Plains, than what does the jungle look like? I had that pegged as jungle for sure.

I'm hoping that means we're getting some super-thick, super-dense, dark, and atmospheric jungle like HIII's Swamp.

Gotta say I'm inclined to think the fifth faction will be Asian-influenced Naga, since Stronghold is the Mesoamerican faction.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-16-2010, 04:43 PM
http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/images/h6_images/ss10.jpg

I take some of this to be the Jungle terrain. Especially the background kind of stuff. It might be the border between 2 terrain types. But that back stuff screams "jungle" to me.

Ygds11
12-16-2010, 04:53 PM
Have to apologize to Swamplord. sorry I really didn't think you were right. But with that Zebra Centaur, I guess their going for an african feel, combined with various tribal elements. having a more complete picture from the screen shots give a much more accurate description of the orcs. The design is incredible and gives an air of gaudiness that should typify a highly structured, and advanced tribal society. The elaborate headdresses and weaponry is great, and serves very well to give a unique quality to them. These orcs don't look like rip-offs, they look original and very bad-@$$. So far I think they are my favorites.

The Centaur itself begs a question of me. Is this the same centaur in H5? That is, is this incarnation a beastman variety or the half nightmare creature we saw in H5? To me it's anatomical design seems diverged from the H5 version in more ways than just gender. The tail is a typical horses tail for example not a heavy hairless tail like in H5. Also the face lacks those weird scale plates. But overall these could be seen as small differences.

Really looking forward to info on the panther-dude, kind a jaguar warrior motif going on. The Cyclops also looks just awesome. I wonder now whether the Behemoth will make a return as a boss monster? I think that would complete the picture for me. I guess we'll see.

By the way, I got my fix.

SwampLord450
12-16-2010, 04:58 PM
Behemoth as a boss monster is a must; it needs to come back in some way!

And yeah, that valley looks very jungle-y.

wdcryer
12-16-2010, 07:35 PM
Alright, seeing Chuckles screenshots, I have to agree with Swamplord. They seem like they are going for the African savannah look. Looks-wise, this is definitely my favorite faction so far. I love what they did with the Crusher, Fury, and upgraded Centaur in particular. The colors are stunning. The other factions look pretty monochromatic in comparison.

The water really stands out to me. The reflections and the terrain underneath really pop.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-17-2010, 08:04 AM
Originally posted by SwampLord450:
Behemoth as a boss monster is a must; it needs to come back in some way!

And yeah, that valley looks very jungle-y.

I agree, that would be cool indeed. However, we may have already seen a new possible boss. Over on the Spanish fan site La Torre De Marfil (sp?) they posted a nice artwork of the stronghold hero & creatures fighting some giant worm-like monster. Reminds me of Dune's worms.

http://www.the-genies-lamp.com/images/h6_artwork/boss_fight.jpg

Ygds11
12-17-2010, 10:28 AM
Oh my gosh it's a Graboid!! Also this seems to suggest very strongly a stronghold native to Jungle terrain. Vines, roots, lots of trees with big leaves, etc etc

KingImp
12-17-2010, 11:27 AM
I don't know if you can announce this yet Chuckles, but I'll ask anyway.

Has the Beta test for this game started yet? I only ask because to me it seems like if it hasn't and this game is scheduled for a March release, it seems like they are cutting it close.

SwampLord450
12-17-2010, 12:36 PM
Originally posted by Ygds11:
Oh my gosh it's a Graboid!! Also this seems to suggest very strongly a stronghold native to Jungle terrain. Vines, roots, lots of trees with big leaves, etc etc

Chuckles has confirmed they aren't, as much as it looks like it; I'm guessing that's just a "heavy forest" plains look, as most forests also have vines & ferns and such.

dchalfont
12-17-2010, 06:27 PM
That's so awesome that it's the orc faction. Never thought it would be them, a very pleasant surprise. The harpy looks awesome. I love the colour palette. It used to range from sepia...to brown.

The new in game screenshots of the orc faction show how awesome the graphics of the game are the water looks like Red Alert 3, refracting light and such, very sexy indeed.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-17-2010, 09:20 PM
Originally posted by SwampLord450:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ygds11:
Oh my gosh it's a Graboid!! Also this seems to suggest very strongly a stronghold native to Jungle terrain. Vines, roots, lots of trees with big leaves, etc etc

Chuckles has confirmed they aren't, as much as it looks like it; I'm guessing that's just a "heavy forest" plains look, as most forests also have vines & ferns and such. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Just because the Stronghold guys are fighting in a Jungle environment doesn't mean it's their native terrain. Their main terrain is Plains. Trust me.

SandroTheMaster
12-17-2010, 10:28 PM
Cyclops are the top of the food chain in the Stronghold again. Nice.

The shaman and the jaguar warrior are the goblin and the orc again. Boo. While they're awesome in design I thought we were going to go back to variety in monsters instead of just professions and was really looking forward to a coautl of some sort.

I agree, the centaur is very different from the one in TotE. Weird. Also, they're elite now? That's a nice upgrade for them.

The upgraded cyclops just gets impractical horns growing everywhere in his body. That was disappointing. I hoped for a cyclops but I also hoped that its upgrade would have all sorts of wacky and colorful stuff the meso-americans are famous for.

Truly, the water is beautiful. But we could see some structures beneath it and some sand paths. Is there shallow water now? Will it influence the game? Were the underwater formations just eye-candy or does it serve a purpose?

kodial79
12-18-2010, 01:17 AM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
Cyclops are the top of the food chain in the Stronghold again. Nice.

The shaman and the jaguar warrior are the goblin and the orc again. Boo. While they're awesome in design I thought we were going to go back to variety in monsters instead of just professions and was really looking forward to a coautl of some sort.

The Shaman is to muscular to be a Goblin, I think it's an Orc. Even if there are units of the same race, they are looking different enough to add up to the variety and uniqueness of the faction. I see the Shaman and I see a totally different unit in looks than the Mauler, although they're both Orcs. The 'Jaguar Guy' although I think it's actually the Slayer, might also be an Orc but still he's so much different than the other units and so what if he's an Orc? Well, at least, they didn't take an Orc, double its size, leave it green and call it an Ogre. But hey, whatever Heroes III did, was cool and original, right?

Although the 'Couatl' would have been a good idea, just that calling it by that name means that you're ripping it off D&D again! This is something that D&D came up with, as the Couatl is not a creature that existed in the Meso-American mythology but D&D's watered down version of Quatzelcoatl, a deity worshipped by Aztecs and Mayans. They could just call it Feathered Serpent. I'm tired of the Cyclops though, he's quite underwhelming as a Champion unit. The Feathered Serpent could have been a nice new Champion that fits too. With that said though, Cyclopses in Greek Mythology were really strong, that even fought against the Gods in Titanomachy. It's just that in the HoMM series, they don't inspire such greatness, not even enough to compete against Angels, Dragons and Devils. Though, yeah, I know, these units aren't in any faction's line-up.

Ygds11
12-18-2010, 01:24 AM
quote:
Originally posted by SwampLord450:
quote:
Originally posted by Ygds11:
Oh my gosh it's a Graboid!! Also this seems to suggest very strongly a stronghold native to Jungle terrain. Vines, roots, lots of trees with big leaves, etc etc


Chuckles has confirmed they aren't, as much as it looks like it; I'm guessing that's just a "heavy forest" plains look, as most forests also have vines & ferns and such.


Just because the Stronghold guys are fighting in a Jungle environment doesn't mean it's their native terrain. Their main terrain is Plains. Trust me.


Yah I get it. Just wrote a huge rant on the subject and decided to cancel it. I was never under the illusion that Chuckles was not being honest or was mistaken, just that Ubi or Black Hole is doing a horrible job of casting this faction. We see jungle atire, weapons overtly inspired by Mesoamerican and Polynesian nations, especially the use of obsidian (which is very Mesoamerican) and pounamu (greenstone). They even have a Jaguar type warrior, don't tell me this was not inspired by the Jaguar warriors of the Aztecs. The shield of the Mauler is the only weapon that bears resemblance to any weapon of a savannah type nation (well the boomerang might count as I don't think Australian bush is heavily forested). Lets not forget to mention the tropical island origins of the harpies.
On top of all this they show goblins in the trees, the heroe's holding a vine and the rest of them seem to be very comfortable in the picture above, not out of place at all. And in case anyone disputes that that shows anything but a small clearing in a Jungle, get familiar with your flora, that kind (being very general here) does not do well without rainfall, not just oasis type conditions, but high humidity is required.

I have said enough and far less than what I deleted. In summary, I'm not an idiot, I get it, their a plains people. Thats all fine and dandy, actually it's better than that it's downright genius. Just wanting to see them where they belong. A developer diary would be great, I'd love to know where they came up with the idea for this mix and match culture.

SwampLord450
12-18-2010, 01:43 AM
Did the Aztecs live in thick jungle, though?

kodial79
12-18-2010, 06:39 AM
Originally posted by SwampLord450:
Did the Aztecs live in thick jungle, though?

Actually, now that I think about it, they didn't. They were living where Mexico is now, and I doubt there are many jungles there. Sure there must be some tropical forests, rainforests maybe. Aztecs however must have been living in plains and mountains or even deserts.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-18-2010, 08:21 AM
Not everything has to be rooted in reality guys. This is a "fantasy"-based game.

As for the Quetzalcoatl...we suggested that highly in the VIP forum, unfortunately it was much too late in the build phase. This was the last faction we found out about, and at that time it was fully fleshed out.

SwampLord450
12-18-2010, 10:22 AM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
Not everything has to be rooted in reality guys. This is a "fantasy"-based game.

As for the Quetzalcoatl...we suggested that highly in the VIP forum, unfortunately it was much too late in the build phase. This was the last faction we found out about, and at that time it was fully fleshed out.

Thanks for putting it out there, at least! Would have been a great unit. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Ygds11
12-18-2010, 11:03 AM
The Aztecs at their height were a very large empire, and covered a lot of territory. From deserts in the north to more rainforest type conditions in the south. I referring more to the pop-culture Idea of Aztecs, to be more fair is to say, as a large empire, they lived a variety of lifestyles, from coastal fishing traditions to agrarian and gathering traditions. A more Jungle typical people might be the Maya, which had some similarities, however with architectural differences and stylistic differences from the Aztecs. But again in reality, the Maya were a vast culture and empire themselves. This is all dependent on how well people know their history, and how divergent it is from reality. Certainly you all know that it is fallacy to relegate these Mesoamerican cultures to one biome. However most people (which I believe are not the demographic on this forum) would be inclined, due to popular media depictions of Central and South American indigenous people, to believe that Aztec-->Jungle. though as I recall the Jaguar warrior was a variety of warrior only found among the Aztecs, a man hunter meant to bring back human sacrifices. But it is very true to state that the known capital Teotihuacan (sp?), is in fact located in a valley which has certainly no Jungle. Che-Chen Itza (been there, really cool) on the other hand and Tulum are very much carved out of the Jungle, but of course those are Mayan ruins. So really when people think Aztec, they often lump the various Mesoamerican groups into a single entity, when in fact there was a diverse variety of cultures. The orcs seem to be depicted similar to this popular idea, which led me to align them with the popular stereotype.

As for the Quetzacouatl being a champion creature, I will have to be somewhat of a conservative and say I would not have been happy with the choice. The Cyclops just seems to be the right choice. After all the flying-feathered serpent is more of a God than a simple creature, in Mythology. It would appeal more to me as the figurative representation of the Orc deity Father Sky. Also it would be too much dragon again, the one faction that should have no dragons (I know not technically an archetypal dragon) in the top tier is the Orcs. Though I must agree that it would fit very nicely from a visual point of view.


Not everything has to be rooted in reality guys. This is a "fantasy"-based game.

Yes, you are quite right.

SwampLord450
12-18-2010, 01:02 PM
Wait a second...
Video Games Live-Might and Magic 2010 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LToIV81D23g)

There's snow terrain featured in this video! At 3:50! What's up with that? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

SandroTheMaster
12-18-2010, 01:50 PM
Originally posted by kodial79:
The Shaman is to muscular to be a Goblin, I think it's an Orc. Even if there are units of the same race, they are looking different enough to add up to the variety and uniqueness of the faction. I see the Shaman and I see a totally different unit in looks than the Mauler, although they're both Orcs. The 'Jaguar Guy' although I think it's actually the Slayer, might also be an Orc but still he's so much different than the other units and so what if he's an Orc? Well, at least, they didn't take an Orc, double its size, leave it green and call it an Ogre. But hey, whatever Heroes III did, was cool and original, right?

Although the 'Couatl' would have been a good idea, just that calling it by that name means that you're ripping it off D&D again! This is something that D&D came up with, as the Couatl is not a creature that existed in the Meso-American mythology but D&D's watered down version of Quatzelcoatl, a deity worshipped by Aztecs and Mayans. They could just call it Feathered Serpent. I'm tired of the Cyclops though, he's quite underwhelming as a Champion unit. The Feathered Serpent could have been a nice new Champion that fits too. With that said though, Cyclopses in Greek Mythology were really strong, that even fought against the Gods in Titanomachy. It's just that in the HoMM series, they don't inspire such greatness, not even enough to compete against Angels, Dragons and Devils. Though, yeah, I know, these units aren't in any faction's line-up.

Wow! Lighten up. I didn't even MENTION an Ogre, and if I would have, I'd talk about Heroes 2 or 1 ogres, those were cool (though Heroes 1 is more of a Giant really). I was just talking about how, save the Castle and its equivalents, Heroes 1-4 factions had a line-up of different monsters to give it a large and, above all, INTERESTING line-up. Dungeon had 7 different monsters, Rampart had 7 different monsters (even though one was mounted by an elf), Warlocks had 6 different monsters and so on. Since they were hinting at going back to it with the Haven (who now actually have a little variety) I was hoping for such.

Also, I only say Coautl because Quatzelcoatl is too long and awkward in the tongue and in the fingers. It's a nice shorter nickname. Don't need to get all high and mighty over it.

Just think about it, wouldn't it be nice if the Jaguar guy was the upgrade to the Orc Warrior and the Goblin shaman (or whatever) an upgrade to the goblin and having a Quatzecoutl filling the gap somewhere and some other creature that represents brutality? I'd love to see the Thunderbird or Behemoth or Troll or Ogre back, yes, but maybe a true Giant (of the kind that eats people) or the Basilisk or, I don't know, the Heka- (http://www.drault.com.ar/classical_mythology/hecatoncheires_classical_myth_monster.jpg)tonkheir es (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hekatonkheires).

SandroTheMaster
12-18-2010, 02:06 PM
Originally posted by SwampLord450:
Wait a second...
Video Games Live-Might and Magic 2010 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LToIV81D23g)

There's snow terrain featured in this video! At 3:50! What's up with that? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Aww... no opera. Boomer.

But it was an incredible composition on any case. You wouldn't believe the bliss it was to listen to the piece.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
12-18-2010, 04:50 PM
Originally posted by SwampLord450:
Wait a second...
Video Games Live-Might and Magic 2010 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LToIV81D23g)

There's snow terrain featured in this video! At 3:50! What's up with that? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Oh. I didn't know they were going to reveal that quite yet. Surprise! :O)

Ygds11
12-18-2010, 07:13 PM
Great video. I've always loved this music, very well written.

SwampLord450
12-18-2010, 07:59 PM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SwampLord450:
Wait a second...
Video Games Live-Might and Magic 2010 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LToIV81D23g)

There's snow terrain featured in this video! At 3:50! What's up with that? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Oh. I didn't know they were going to reveal that quite yet. Surprise! :O) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ahaha, they tricked us? Does that mean there's a sixth faction?

C'mon, spill! :P

kodial79
12-18-2010, 11:48 PM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
Wow! Lighten up. I didn't even MENTION an Ogre, and if I would have, I'd talk about Heroes 2 or 1 ogres, those were cool (though Heroes 1 is more of a Giant really). I was just talking about how, save the Castle and its equivalents, Heroes 1-4 factions had a line-up of different monsters to give it a large and, above all, INTERESTING line-up. Dungeon had 7 different monsters, Rampart had 7 different monsters (even though one was mounted by an elf), Warlocks had 6 different monsters and so on. Since they were hinting at going back to it with the Haven (who now actually have a little variety) I was hoping for such.

Also, I only say Coautl because Quatzelcoatl is too long and awkward in the tongue and in the fingers. It's a nice shorter nickname. Don't need to get all high and mighty over it.

Just think about it, wouldn't it be nice if the Jaguar guy was the upgrade to the Orc Warrior and the Goblin shaman (or whatever) an upgrade to the goblin and having a Quatzecoutl filling the gap somewhere and some other creature that represents brutality? I'd love to see the Thunderbird or Behemoth or Troll or Ogre back, yes, but maybe a true Giant (of the kind that eats people) or the Basilisk or, I don't know, the Heka- (http://www.drault.com.ar/classical_mythology/hecatoncheires_classical_myth_monster.jpg)tonkheir es (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hekatonkheires).

Don't worry, I'm not bashing you, I'm just making an argument! Although after many and long arguments regarding the concept and especially line-up's of various Heroes games, I do tend to heat up to make a point before the Empire of H3 Fanboys outnumber me by 100 to 1. It seems like that it's me against the world on that, cause I like H5's race based factions better than any other.

You know, that thing about the Hecatoncheires... I think it would be too much for the devs to handle, being that they have 100 arms and all (any less than that, and they couldn't be called that)... And if done right, these guys were so strong that any other champion unit would pale before them. If nerfed so they're on the same level with other champion units, wouldn't that be a shame? Heheh... A Hecatoncheire, would make a fine Boss though. One of them should be enough to hold en entire army of a high level character and provide for a thrilling fight and a near death experience for your hero.

Well, that's how I imagine them at least, basing on that even the Greek Gods and Titans were afraid of them.

dchalfont
12-19-2010, 10:05 PM
Wow I watched the clip that was posted, I reeeeeeeally hope there is 6 factions in the vanilla game, me thinks we will see Sylvan and Academy still.

The game looks gorgeous and the in engine cut scenes look mind blowingly good. This game is going to be the schnitzel.

KingImp
12-20-2010, 12:06 AM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SwampLord450:
Wait a second...
Video Games Live-Might and Magic 2010 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LToIV81D23g)

There's snow terrain featured in this video! At 3:50! What's up with that? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Oh. I didn't know they were going to reveal that quite yet. Surprise! :O) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

And let the speculation begin.

Does the snow mean Academy as they were in Heroes 3 or is this a confirmation of the Heroes 5 Fortress?

SandroTheMaster
12-20-2010, 12:42 AM
Originally posted by kodial79
You know, that thing about the Hecatoncheires... I think it would be too much for the devs to handle, being that they have 100 arms and all (any less than that, and they couldn't be called that)... And if done right, these guys were so strong that any other champion unit would pale before them. If nerfed so they're on the same level with other champion units, wouldn't that be a shame? Heheh... A Hecatoncheire, would make a fine Boss though. One of them should be enough to hold en entire army of a high level character and provide for a thrilling fight and a near death experience for your hero.

Well, that's how I imagine them at least, basing on that even the Greek Gods and Titans were afraid of them.

Basing on the Greek myths? Basing on the Greek myths Harpies are invulnerable creatures with iron skin and Cerberus should have 100 heads or so and cyclopses should forge lightning bolts and not shoot laser through their eyes and we'd have only one of... well, 90% of the Heroes creature rooster.

We don't need to get literal, make a giant with a whole lot of arms and a whole lot of heads. As long as it's an interesting monster, it'll be welcome.

SwampLord450
12-20-2010, 01:07 AM
Originally posted by KingImp:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SwampLord450:
Wait a second...
Video Games Live-Might and Magic 2010 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LToIV81D23g)

There's snow terrain featured in this video! At 3:50! What's up with that? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Oh. I didn't know they were going to reveal that quite yet. Surprise! :O) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

And let the speculation begin.

Does the snow mean Academy as they were in Heroes 3 or is this a confirmation of the Heroes 5 Fortress? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

According to one of the HC insiders it was something they were able to add in that they had not initially anticipated; he said nothing about a town coming with it, however.

KingImp
12-20-2010, 01:30 AM
Originally posted by SwampLord450:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by KingImp:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SwampLord450:
Wait a second...
Video Games Live-Might and Magic 2010 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LToIV81D23g)

There's snow terrain featured in this video! At 3:50! What's up with that? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Oh. I didn't know they were going to reveal that quite yet. Surprise! :O) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

And let the speculation begin.

Does the snow mean Academy as they were in Heroes 3 or is this a confirmation of the Heroes 5 Fortress? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

According to one of the HC insiders it was something they were able to add in that they had not initially anticipated; he said nothing about a town coming with it, however. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh well, so much for that speculation. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_redface.gif

At least they aren't pulling a Nival and only giving us snow with the addition of the snow-based faction like they did in H5.

On a side note, after all these years I can't believe I never joined HC. That place is hopping compared to here and CH combined.

SwampLord450
12-20-2010, 01:59 AM
Yup; I encourage all users here to frequent HC as well! It really is a great forum, with a fantastic sense of community. It's hit a bit of a slump at the moment, as it's been so long since any Heroes game, but Heroes VI's imminent release has it chugging a bit more again.

Oh, and if you do join, steer clear of the OSM. :P

kodial79
12-20-2010, 07:56 AM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
Basing on the Greek myths? Basing on the Greek myths Harpies are invulnerable creatures with iron skin and Cerberus should have 100 heads or so and cyclopses should forge lightning bolts and not shoot laser through their eyes and we'd have only one of... well, 90% of the Heroes creature rooster.

We don't need to get literal, make a giant with a whole lot of arms and a whole lot of heads. As long as it's an interesting monster, it'll be welcome.


No, no, no. You got it all wrong. Harpies weren't invulnerable, their lives were spared by the Argonauts at the request of Iris. Cerberus didn't have an iron skin, and he had only three heads and a snake for a tail, that's the only difference. Cyclopses didn't forge lightning bolts either, that was Haephaistus who did that. But Hecatoncheires had 100 arms as the name implies too (Hecaton = One Hundred, Cheires = Arms), and they were top tier creatures in Greek mythology, able to slay Gods if left to their own devices.

It's bad enough that one of the most important creatures of the Mesopotamian mythology, the Lamassu got degraded to just being an Undead. Where as to the people of those regions, they were equivalent to the Dragons and Angels. I wouldn't like to see other favorite mythological creatures of mine, being cut down to size to fit in.

Xenofex_086
12-20-2010, 11:00 AM
Cerberus is said to have multiple heads - most often 3 - no need to make them exactly 100.
As for the mythology discussion itself - yes, they are raping mythologies quite hard, but according to the conventional wisdom the vast majority of the would-be buyers know quite little about these things and thus have no solid ground to complain. As long as it looks "OMG", it can be totally misshapen caricature of the original. What worries me is that some people think that these caricatures are actually the original and are even willing to argue about it. Multiplication of the misinformation.

SandroTheMaster
12-20-2010, 04:38 PM
Originally posted by kodial79:
No, no, no. You got it all wrong. Harpies weren't invulnerable, their lives were spared by the Argonauts at the request of Iris. Cerberus didn't have an iron skin, and he had only three heads and a snake for a tail, that's the only difference. Cyclopses didn't forge lightning bolts either, that was Haephaistus who did that. But Hecatoncheires had 100 arms as the name implies too (Hecaton = One Hundred, Cheires = Arms), and they were top tier creatures in Greek mythology, able to slay Gods if left to their own devices.

It's bad enough that one of the most important creatures of the Mesopotamian mythology, the Lamassu got degraded to just being an Undead. Where as to the people of those regions, they were equivalent to the Dragons and Angels. I wouldn't like to see other favorite mythological creatures of mine, being cut down to size to fit in.

Conclusion, those Myths aren't that accurate or consistent to begin with (and harpies are supposed to have Iron Skin, or that's what said when mortal swords aren't capable of hurting them, at least, that's one of the versions...)

So who cares if they're that transfigured? It's not the specifics that matters, but rather the imagery.

Ygds11
12-23-2010, 10:26 AM
yes, they are raping mythologies quite hard, but according to the conventional wisdom the vast majority of the would-be buyers know quite little about these things and thus have no solid ground to complain. As long as it looks "OMG", it can be totally misshapen caricature of the original. What worries me is that some people think that these caricatures are actually the original and are even willing to argue about it. Multiplication of the misinformation.

My thoughts exactly. Really most people I talk to have little to no knowledge of mythology. What little they do know usually comes from games or movies. Sad, but true.

There is little to justify (from a demographic perspective) the use of accurate representations.
But it is disturbing how people formulate their ideas around these representations. But I am happy with Black Hole and their direction right now.

The orcs have a look all their own, a departure from other representations found elsewhere since Tolkein made them up. But I really hope I don't hear people saying orcs are Island dwelling spirit worshipers, just because that's what they are in this game.

wdcryer
12-29-2010, 08:01 AM
It looks like the un-upgraded and upgraded shamans in Stronghold are called Dreamwalker (http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=485702404587&set=a.482079994587.260460.161184829587&pid=5650327&id=161184829587) and Dreamreaver (http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=485702389587&set=a.482079994587.260460.161184829587&pid=5650326&id=161184829587), respectively.

kodial79
12-29-2010, 11:25 AM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kodial79:
No, no, no. You got it all wrong. Harpies weren't invulnerable, their lives were spared by the Argonauts at the request of Iris. Cerberus didn't have an iron skin, and he had only three heads and a snake for a tail, that's the only difference. Cyclopses didn't forge lightning bolts either, that was Haephaistus who did that. But Hecatoncheires had 100 arms as the name implies too (Hecaton = One Hundred, Cheires = Arms), and they were top tier creatures in Greek mythology, able to slay Gods if left to their own devices.

It's bad enough that one of the most important creatures of the Mesopotamian mythology, the Lamassu got degraded to just being an Undead. Where as to the people of those regions, they were equivalent to the Dragons and Angels. I wouldn't like to see other favorite mythological creatures of mine, being cut down to size to fit in.

Conclusion, those Myths aren't that accurate or consistent to begin with (and harpies are supposed to have Iron Skin, or that's what said when mortal swords aren't capable of hurting them, at least, that's one of the versions...)

So who cares if they're that transfigured? It's not the specifics that matters, but rather the imagery. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ah.. That's the Stymphalids that you're talking about, not the Harpies. They were birds whose feathers were either iron or steel, I don't remember. True, legends do vary greatly too, but they're not getting too far off from each version. Hecatoncheires would still be too much to fit in a faction. That's if they're done right. But I'm afraid you're right though. Cause now that I think about it, the Titans should be just as strong and overpowered as the Hecatoncheires, and well, they're not. If done right, a single Titan should be enough to counter the strength of the Dragon Gods or whatever were the supreme beings before Ashan. Well, they were Gods themselves, in a sense, equal to power with any Olympian. So if the Titan's strength were cut down to size in order to fit in with a faction, I guess, why shouldn't they be doing that with the Hecatoncheires too?

Meh, I just don't like seeing my favorite mythological creatures being degraded.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
01-03-2011, 12:41 PM
Originally posted by SwampLord450:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SwampLord450:
Wait a second...
Video Games Live-Might and Magic 2010 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LToIV81D23g)

There's snow terrain featured in this video! At 3:50! What's up with that? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Oh. I didn't know they were going to reveal that quite yet. Surprise! :O) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ahaha, they tricked us? Does that mean there's a sixth faction?

C'mon, spill! :P </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No. Sorry. We had actually requested a snow terrain for the purposes of map-making. That they actually did one was a surprise to us as well. They just DID it...no comments about it being a good idea or 'we'll think about it' or such...they just DID it. Nice.

As for it linking to a faction...I wouldn't be surprised if it was...just not in the basic game. I fully expect to see more factions in the expansions. Remember, H6 is a prequel to H5, so at some point they have to work up to the H5 lineups.

SandroTheMaster
01-03-2011, 03:31 PM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:

No. Sorry. We had actually requested a snow terrain for the purposes of map-making. That they actually did one was a surprise to us as well. They just DID it...no comments about it being a good idea or 'we'll think about it' or such...they just DID it. Nice.

As for it linking to a faction...I wouldn't be surprised if it was...just not in the basic game. I fully expect to see more factions in the expansions. Remember, H6 is a prequel to H5, so at some point they have to work up to the H5 lineups.

That's a refreshing change from Nival.

Now... if only they hear our protests about Mr. Sauron there (Vampire) and Mr. Human Pincushion (Grave Ghoul or whatever they decide to call them).

kodial79
01-04-2011, 07:36 AM
Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:

No. Sorry. We had actually requested a snow terrain for the purposes of map-making. That they actually did one was a surprise to us as well. They just DID it...no comments about it being a good idea or 'we'll think about it' or such...they just DID it. Nice.

As for it linking to a faction...I wouldn't be surprised if it was...just not in the basic game. I fully expect to see more factions in the expansions. Remember, H6 is a prequel to H5, so at some point they have to work up to the H5 lineups.

That's a refreshing change from Nival.

Now... if only they hear our protests about Mr. Sauron there (Vampire) and Mr. Human Pincushion (Grave Ghoul or whatever they decide to call them). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Protests? What protests? Speak for yourself! I like them just fine. I would protest if any were to be done to them.

wdcryer
01-06-2011, 01:08 PM
They have added info about the abilities of a number of creatures on the main site. If you go to game->creatures then click on creature portraits, it will take you to a page describing the creature and its abilities.

Creature Descriptions (http://might-and-magic.ubi.com/heroes-6/en-GB/game/creatures/haven/index.aspx)

There are more indications of Naga as the next faction in the Ghoul description:

"This meat is as tough as ghoul's skin." A famous line from a Naga comic play..."

KingImp
01-06-2011, 01:26 PM
Originally posted by wdcryer:
They have added info about the abilities of a number of creatures on the main site. If you go to game->creatures then click on creature portraits, it will take you to a page describing the creature and its abilities.

Creature Descriptions (http://might-and-magic.ubi.com/heroes-6/en-GB/game/creatures/haven/index.aspx)

Very cool! I didn't even think to click on the game section for some reason.

So, I guess we know now what that big water creature is.

Water Dragon aka Dragon Eel (http://might-and-magic.ubi.com/heroes-6/en-GB/game/creatures/neutral/index.aspx#tcm2111289-Maintab-1)

wdcryer
01-06-2011, 01:33 PM
Someone on HeroesCommunity also pointed out that one of the newly named islands on the map has a Japanese name, Hashima, possibly indicating samurai naga.

kodial79
01-07-2011, 05:21 AM
Originally posted by wdcryer:
Someone on HeroesCommunity also pointed out that one of the newly named islands on the map has a Japanese name, Hashima, possibly indicating samurai naga.

I doubt it. Umm.. If you remember the controversial leaked images on that Christmas Tree. You see, Japanese and Chinese cultures have very distinctive make-up's and head gear or jewelry. On those faces there were none of it.

lvlyLeah
01-09-2011, 09:11 AM
Originally posted by Pitsu:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SandroTheMaster:
My objections are that the necromancers have reimaginated humans as several forms of undead. The dragon was the only exception but it had its symbolic status. Technically, it was just the skeleton again, but a dragon.
A lamasu is just the zombie again.

I agree. A good way to explain it is the H5 necromancy system. Animals are raised as ghosts, magic units as liches, human like creatures as skeletons or zombies. High level monsters are rised as beast skeletons (bone dragons) or powerful spirits (wrights).
But from which creatures a undead lamassu can be raised? Only from a living lamassu. Obviously the necromancy system in H6 must be different. Raising limited only to undeads with less specific origin or there is a undead version for each unit (and ubihole can proudly announce that H6 has more units than any previous homm). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Good point. It seems to me, that The Lamasu are the new zombies. They were once animals, created, who have been raised into the undead. "The Lamasu function as plague vector,[just like HOMM V zombies] coupled with the creature’s physical might, and its mobility make them perfect front-line troops in the Undead armies."
Zombies were front line troops in the previous game, but since we havn't seen them, could the Lamasu take their place?

If so, thank god, they'll be faster.

wdcryer
01-10-2011, 07:40 AM
Originally posted by kodial79:
I doubt it. Umm.. If you remember the controversial leaked images on that Christmas Tree. You see, Japanese and Chinese cultures have very distinctive make-up's and head gear or jewelry. On those faces there were none of it.

I missed that leak, but yeah... I doubt it would be okay for me to say much more about this on the official forums.