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Deedsundone
03-15-2008, 08:48 AM
Taken from a book about Johannes Steinhoff wich I´m reading for the moment.

"The Bf 109 had relative weak armament compared to other fighters during this time (1943).It consisted with two 13mm MG 131 machineguns on top of the engine with 300 rounds each and a 20mm cannon (150-200 rounds)wich shot through the propellor hub.In each wing there was another 13mm machinegun wich shot outside the arc of the proppelor.To improve the firepower a 30mm cannon could replace the 20mm cannon.Problem with reloads,corditesmoke in the cabin and instability in the longitudinal axis durin shootin made the installition impopular"

Wich version of G6,as I asume it is, had 13mm guns in the wings?

DKoor
03-15-2008, 08:50 AM
I thought that they all had nose 13mms from 109G6 onwards.
Never ever heard for wing 13mm installations tho.

Kettenhunde
03-15-2008, 09:08 AM
Wich version of G6,as I asume it is, had 13mm guns in the wings?



The Bf-109G6 flying around the authors head...

VW-IceFire
03-15-2008, 09:11 AM
Originally posted by Deedsundone:
Taken from a book about Johannes Steinhoff wich I´m reading for the moment.

"The Bf 109 had relative weak armament compared to other fighters during this time (1943).It consisted with two 13mm MG 131 machineguns on top of the engine with 300 rounds each and a 20mm cannon (150-200 rounds)wich shot through the propellor hub.In each wing there was another 13mm machinegun wich shot outside the arc of the proppelor.To improve the firepower a 30mm cannon could replace the 20mm cannon.Problem with reloads,corditesmoke in the cabin and instability in the longitudinal axis durin shootin made the installition impopular"

Wich version of G6,as I asume it is, had 13mm guns in the wings?
Made up one. I've never read about 13mm MG131s in gondola pods on the wings. As far as I know it never happened. Lots of misinformation about the Bf109s armament types are floating around for whatever reason. Kind of like the confusion about Spitfire engines, wings, and the official and unofficial designations. Only a few people get these things truly right.

I also have to disagree that the 109s firepower was weak for the time period. A single MG151/20 is a potent weapon...arguably the best balance of fire rate, destructive potential, and ammo capacity (smaller shells than the Hispano). MG131s are going to be more efficient than the Spitfires four .303s that was typical at the time. Neither compare to the Typhoon or FW190 which is maybe the point they were trying to make.

JtD
03-15-2008, 09:47 AM
Some pilots refer to their planes armament as "big guns" and "small guns", some authors understand "guns" and the reader ends up un- or worse misinformed. There were no 13mm gondolas.

JSG72
03-15-2008, 02:39 PM
And this is one of the reasons I fail to read pilots accounts of their, Aircraft flown.

Half the time they didn't know which type THEY http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif were flying.

From an early age. I remember reading an account from a JG 3 pilot who spoke about his 109 with 6x20mm 151s and 2x 13mm. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/1072.gif

BSS_Sniper
03-15-2008, 02:45 PM
I agree. You shouldn't read pilot accounts and instead should come to these forums and get your good information from everyone that has never set foot in a cockpit. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

JSG72
03-15-2008, 03:32 PM
Originally posted by BSS_Sniper:
I agree. You shouldn't read pilot accounts and instead should come to these forums and get your good information from everyone that has never set foot in a cockpit. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Having never actually set foot in a cockpit.(Having only ever flown as a passenger in a Dragon Rapide. Plus a helicopter) Has nothing to do with Guns/gunnery.

WW2 pilots Didn't have "Good information"

BSS_Sniper
03-15-2008, 06:17 PM
Originally posted by JSG72:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by BSS_Sniper:
I agree. You shouldn't read pilot accounts and instead should come to these forums and get your good information from everyone that has never set foot in a cockpit. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Having never actually set foot in a cockpit.(Having only ever flown as a passenger in a Dragon Rapide. Plus a helicopter) Has nothing to do with Guns/gunnery.

WW2 pilots Didn't have "Good information" </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

hard to believe someone said that. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

ElAurens
03-15-2008, 07:44 PM
Amazing isn't it?

Phas3e
03-15-2008, 09:48 PM
Memory is a strange thing isnt it

Ratsack
03-16-2008, 05:17 AM
Depends if you're dealing with memory or not. It may well be a misunderstanding by the author, who may not be an expert. It could be a problem of translation. It could be a simple typo in a draft, that resulted in a systematic mistake in the final text.

Or it could be that the pilot's memory is not perfect.

There's no need to go disparaging the recollections of those who were there simply because a work of popular history has mistakes in it.

cheers,
Ratsack

micksaf
03-16-2008, 06:31 AM
.. I agree with Ratsack, you can't imagine how many times I heard about 50 MILLIMETER machineguns instead of .50 ...that's 12,7 mm ....in documentaries on TV ...

Deedsundone
03-16-2008, 06:57 AM
I do not think Johannes Steinhoff got it wrong (it´s a sort of a diary when he was stationed at Sicily), more the picture resercher/translator knowledge about spoken aircraft armament.I´m not an expert either but got a bit surprised about 13mm guns inwings.Maybe it was a variant I never heard of. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

JSG72
03-16-2008, 01:08 PM
Originally posted by Deedsundone:
I do not think Johannes Steinhoff got it wrong (it´s a sort of a diary when he was stationed at Sicily), more the picture resercher/translator knowledge about spoken aircraft armament.I´m not an expert either but got a bit surprised about 13mm guns inwings.Maybe it was a variant I never heard of. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Yeh! Like the one in your Sig? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Xiolablu3
03-16-2008, 03:02 PM
Maybe he said 30mm?

TX-Gunslinger
03-16-2008, 04:46 PM
Originally posted by Deedsundone:
Taken from a book about Johannes Steinhoff wich I´m reading for the moment.

"The Bf 109 had relative weak armament compared to other fighters during this time (1943).It consisted with two 13mm MG 131 machineguns on top of the engine with 300 rounds each and a 20mm cannon (150-200 rounds)wich shot through the propellor hub.In each wing there was another 13mm machinegun wich shot outside the arc of the proppelor.To improve the firepower a 30mm cannon could replace the 20mm cannon.Problem with reloads,corditesmoke in the cabin and instability in the longitudinal axis durin shootin made the installition impopular"

Wich version of G6,as I asume it is, had 13mm guns in the wings?

Could you please tell me which page of "Messerschmitts Over Sicily" this paragraph is on?


Thanks

Gunny

Kurfurst__
03-17-2008, 12:42 AM
The original poster seems to have read a book about Steinhoff, not by Steinhoff (ie. that would be Messerschmitts over Sicily).

Deedsundone
03-17-2008, 08:38 AM
Originally posted by TX-Gunslinger:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Deedsundone:
Taken from a book about Johannes Steinhoff wich I´m reading for the moment.

"The Bf 109 had relative weak armament compared to other fighters during this time (1943).It consisted with two 13mm MG 131 machineguns on top of the engine with 300 rounds each and a 20mm cannon (150-200 rounds)wich shot through the propellor hub.In each wing there was another 13mm machinegun wich shot outside the arc of the proppelor.To improve the firepower a 30mm cannon could replace the 20mm cannon.Problem with reloads,corditesmoke in the cabin and instability in the longitudinal axis durin shootin made the installition impopular"

Wich version of G6,as I asume it is, had 13mm guns in the wings?

Could you please tell me which page of "Messerschmitts Over Sicily" this paragraph is on?


Thanks

Gunny </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well,it is actually by Steinhoff (I guess it´s Messerschmitts over sicily but mine says Luftwaffe over sicily ,don´t know why they changed that?) but it´s translated one and don´t know if you got the picture on the same page or even the same text but mine is at page 44,where a man loading the 13 mm cowl guns.

JG53Frankyboy
03-17-2008, 09:47 AM
you mean you have a picture in your book, and "around" this picture this 13mm wingarmament is mentioned ?

because i have checked the german written "Die Strasse von Messina" (by Steinhoff,thinking its the same book ............) - and in my version there are no pistures at all, and in the text (fast overlook +/-20 pages around page 44)mentioned.

just a 6 gun (in the nose http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif ) armed P-38 is mentioned by Steinhoff, that outturns their 109s but is slightly slower http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif - dont ask about what version THAT was http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

No41Sqn_Banks
03-17-2008, 09:51 AM
Originally posted by JG53Frankyboy:
dont ask about what version THAT was http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Propably the one with 13mm gunpods under the wing http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

Deedsundone
03-17-2008, 12:06 PM
Originally posted by JG53Frankyboy:
you mean you have a picture in your book, and "around" this picture this 13mm wingarmament is mentioned ?

because i have checked the german written "Die Strasse von Messina" (by Steinhoff,thinking its the same book ............) - and in my version there are no pistures at all, and in the text (fast overlook +/-20 pages around page 44)mentioned.

just a 6 gun (in the nose http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif ) armed P-38 is mentioned by Steinhoff, that outturns their 109s but is slightly slower http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif - dont ask about what version THAT was http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Well,it´s text under the picture.I guess I got an added picture version of the book. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Xiolablu3
03-18-2008, 06:56 AM
I think its probably a misunderstanding while gathering data for the book.

Say '13mm' in English with a German accent and it sounds very much like '30mm'

Did they have 30mm gunpods on the 1944 model G6's? I would have guessed so, the G6 was the most numerous 109 after all.

Bremspropeller
03-18-2008, 07:04 AM
I've never seen any 109s with 30mm gunpods.
Only those with 20mm gunpods...

Any pics on the 30mm pods?

JG53Frankyboy
03-18-2008, 07:34 AM
AFAIK MK 108-gunpods were only in some prototypes, no series-production was done

Vike
03-18-2008, 07:05 PM
Originally posted by Bremspropeller:
I've never seen any 109s with 30mm gunpods.
Only those with 20mm gunpods...

Any pics on the 30mm pods?

Just here mate

Me109 with MK108 gunpods:

http://www.adlertag.de/waffen/kanone.gif (-there (http://www.adlertag.de/waffen/weapons.htm)-)

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e133/Kurfurst/Bf109G6_R5.jpg

(-From there (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/8771067164?r=7801065464#7801065464)-)

@+ http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

BGs_Ricky
03-19-2008, 03:17 AM
Given the period described in Steinhoff's book (which I have read), i.e summer'43, my bet is that he speaks about G-6s with 20mm gondolas. Somewhere and somehow in the final text this has turned into 13mm guns in the wings...

Ratsack
03-19-2008, 08:23 AM
I haven't found the quoted text in Messerschmitts Over Sicily. Which chapter was it in?

cheers,
Ratsack

mortoma
03-19-2008, 10:20 AM
Originally posted by BGs_Ricky:
Given the period described in Steinhoff's book (which I have read), i.e summer'43, my bet is that he speaks about G-6s with 20mm gondolas. Somewhere and somehow in the final text this has turned into 13mm guns in the wings... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif
I would have to agree with you, there was probably some misunderstanding or typo and what started as 20mm cannon became 13mm MG.

Bremspropeller
03-19-2008, 12:34 PM
Thanks Vike! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Obviously, those a/c are testbeds.

KG26_Oranje
03-19-2008, 12:59 PM
I hope this helps u out , its from Jane`s Fighting aircraft of World war 2.

S! I/KG26_Oranje.

The Messerschmitt Me109G.

Destined to become numerically the most important of all models of the Me109 fighter, the Me109G was evolved to use the more powerful and heavier DB 605 engine and to make provision for cockpit pressurisation.
A pre serie batch of Me109G-0 fighters was begun in the late summer of 1941, the firts exemple being completed in October and the series Me109G-1 appearing during the following spring.
The Me109G-1 and G-2 (the latter lacking cabin pressurisation) were produced in parallel, were powered by the 1.475 hp DB 605A-1 engine with GM 1 Boost and carried an armament of one 20 mm MG 151 cannon and two 7.9 mm machine guns.
The Me109G-3 and G-4 differed in having wider mainwheel tyres and later radio, the G-4 being a photo recce variant.
The Me109G-1/Trop had 13 mm guns in place of the 7.9 mm weapons, all subsequent variants standardising on the larger calibre guns.
These commenced with the Me109G-5 delivered with both the DB 605A and GM 1 combination, and with the DB 605AS which featured a larger super-charger.
The Me109G-5/U2 differed in heaving a wooden tailplane.
From the late autumn of 1942, the Me109G-6 reached the assembly lines, this being the first "standard" model capable of accepting various Rststze (Field Conversion Sets) and usually powered by the DB 605AM with MW 50 (Methanol-Water) boost, the engine mounted cannon being either a 20 mm MG 151 or a 30 mm MK 108.
Fitted with a Rststz for a 551 lb (250 kg) bomb, the fighter was designated Me109G-6/R1; with two 21 cm mortars it became the G-6/R2; with two additional 30 mm MK108 cannon underwing it was the G-6/R4 and with these replaced by 20 mm MG 151s it was the G-6/R6.
The Me109G6/N was a specially equipped version for nocturnal operations and the Me109G8 was a recce version of the G-6, the G-8/U2 and G8/U3 having GM 1 and MW 50 boost respectively.
By 1944, two new models were being developed, the Me109G-10 and Me109G-14, the latter preceding the former into service.
The G-10 was powered by the new DB 605D engine, while the G-14 represented an attempt to standardise all the progressive refinements that had been appleid to DB 605A and AM engined models.
The DB 605D engine of the Me109G-10 provided 1.850 hp, the basic armament of this sub-type of the fighter being twin 13 mm guns and a single 20 mm or 30 mm cannon, and in clean condition, max speed was 426 mp/h (685 km/h) at 24,280 ft (7.400 m).
In excess of 30,000 G-series Me109 fighters were produced, including licence manufacture in Hungary and Romania.
Me109Gs were used by most of the air arms flying along side the Luftwaffe.
In addition, 160 were supplied to Finland and 12 to Switzerland.

Specification : Me109G-6.
Year : 1942.
Type : Fighter.
Crew : One.
Power plant : One Daimler Benz DB605A-1 12-cylinder, inverted Vee, liquid-cooled engine developing 1475 hp.
Dimensions : Span, 32 ft 6.5 in (9.92m) ; length, 29 ft 7.5 in (9.03m) ; height, 8 ft 2.5 in (2.50m) ; wing area , 173.30 sq ft (16.10 sq/m).
Weights : loaded weight, 7.496 lb (3.400 kg).
Performance : Max speed; 386 mp/h (621 km/h) at 22,640 ft (6.900 m); Initial clim , 3.346 ft/min (17.00m/sec); Range (with auxiliary tank), 620 miles (998 km).
Armament : One 20 mm MG 151 cannon firing through propeller hub, two 13 mm MG 131 machine guns in upper cowling.

Specification : Me109G-10.
Year : 1944.
Type : Fighter, Fighter bomber, reconnaissance, ground atack and the upper component of the Me109/Ju88 composite aircraft.
Crew : One.
Wings : Low-wing cantilever monoplane.
All metal-spar structure, covered with flush-riveted stressed-skin metal covering.
Outer wings are attached to the fuselage at three points, two on the flanges of the single spar at right angels to each ohter and a third at the leading-edge to transmit torsional loads.
Entire trailing-edge hinged, the outer portions acting as slotted ailerons and the inner portions as camber-changing flaps.
Engine coolant radiators, one on each side of fuselage, partly buried within under surface of wings.
Boundary layer beneath wing is picked up in front of each radiator, led over the top and discharged through a double-surfaced flap forming a continuation of the upper wing surface.
The section of the main wing flap immediately behind radiator is independent of the rest of the landing flap and is interconnected with the upper flap, which normally moves up when the lower section is depressed, thereby controlling air flow through the radiator and preventing any change in lift.
This flap movement is controlled thermostatically but has only two positions.
When the main flaps are lowered for landing the upper radiator-flap drops, with the lower one moving progressively ahead of its at a greater angle, thereby maintaining the cooling airflow.
Ailerons have external mass-balances.
Handley page auto-slots on outer position of leading edges.
Attachment points for underslung guns or 21 cm. rocket projectile tubes outboard of wheel wells.
Fuselage : Oval section light metal monocoque.
Made in two halves with longitudinal joints top and bottum.
Each half is made up of a number of longitudinal stringers and a series of vertical panels.
Every other panels has both its edges flanged to form "Z"-frames and these frames are holed to let the stringers pass through.
The flanged panels have their edges "joggled"so that the alternate plain panels may be flush-riveted to give a completely smooth outer surface.
The longitudinals have a singel row or rivets to the outer skin only.
Each half of the fuselage is butt-jointed top and bottom to a double-width longitudinal.
Tail unit : Cantilever monoplane type.
Balanced rudder and elevators.
Normal structure had metal framework with metal covered fixed surfaces and fabric-covered movable surfaces but various sub-types, notably the G-6 and G-14, were fitted towards the end of the war with wooden tail-untits to conserve light metal.
Landing Gear : Retractable type with narrow track.
Wheels raised upwards and outwards by hydraulic jacks.
Auxiliary manual raising gear.
Hydraulic wheel brakes.
Semi-retractable tail wheel often locked in down position.
Power plant : One Daimler Benz DB605A , AS, ASB, AM, ASM or D 12-cylinder, inverted Vee, liquid-cooled engine on two cantilever magnesium-alloy bearers attached to the fuselage at four points.
MW 50 or GM 1 power boosting equipment, depending on sub-type engine.
VDM electrically-operated constant-speed airscrew 9 ft, 10 in, in diameter.
Ducted coolant radiators under wings (see "Wings") Fuel (88 Imp. gallons= 400 litres) in a rubber cell in a playwood box behind and under the pilot seat.
Special long-range variant may have a 66 gallon drop tank under each wing.
Oil tank and cooler beneath engine cowling.
Water-header tank under reduction-gear housing.
Large ramming air-intake scoop on port side of cowling may be fitted with filter for tropical use.
Accommodation : Enclosed cockpit over wing.
Cockpit hood hinges to starboard and has sliding panels in sides and roof.
Some sub-types have pressurised cockpit in which the fireproof bulkhead, floor and slide walls have been made air-tight.
A sloping plate of armour completes the enclosure.
Pilot has bullet resisting windscreen and back protection.
Dimensions : Span, 32 ft 6.5 in (9.92m) ; length, 29 ft 4 in (8.9m) ; height (one airscrew blade vertical - tail down.), 12 ft (3.4m) ; wing area , 173.sq ft (16.2 sq/m).
Weights : Normal loaded weight varies from 7.000 lb (3.178 kg) to 7.700 lb (3.496 kg) , maximum permissable flying weight also varies up to 8.100 lbs. (3.678 kg).
Performance : (the following figures are for the fastest sub-type (G-10) without wing armament and with DB 605D engine and MW 50 power boost equipment) Max speed at sea level ; 344 mp/h (550 km/h) Max speed at 24,250 ft (7.600 m) 428 mp/h (685 km/h) ; Clim to 20.000 ft (6.100 m) 6 min, Range 350 miles (569 km), Endurance 55 min.
Armament : Typical armament consists of two 13 mm MG 131 machine guns (300 rounds each) in the top cowling and synchronised to fire through the airscrew, One 20 mm MG 151 cannon firing through airscrew boss, and two 20 mm MG 151/20 cannon (optional), each with 120 rounds, mounted under the outer wings.
Revi C12C reflector gub-sight.
One 250 kg , four 50 or 70 kg, or ninety six 2 kg bombs may be carried under the fuselage.
Two 21 cm rocket mortar tubes, adapted from the land service type, are alternatives to the wing guns.


Summary of variants.

Me109G-0 : DB 601E engine. Armament : Two 7.9 mm MG 17 machine guns and one or three 20 mm MG 151/20 cannons.
Pre-produktion series , only 10 bild.
Me109G-1 : DB 605A engine. GM 1 (nitreous-oxide) emergency power boost equipment optional. Pressure cabin.
Armament as G-0.
Me109G-1/Trop : Tropicalized model of G-1.
Me109G-2 : Similar to G-1 but without pressure cabin and GM 1 equipment.
Me109G-2/R2 : Reconnaissance plane with Reihenbildgert Rb 50/30.
Me109G-2/R3 : Long range sub-type wiht 300 liter drop tank under fuselage.
Me109G-2/R6 : Bomber-destroyer - with one MG 151/20 in underwing gondolas below each wing.
Me109G-2/Trop : Tropicalized model of G-2.
Me109G-3 : Similar to G-1 except for radio equipment (FuG 16Z instead of FuG 7A).
Me109G-3/R6 : As G-3 but with one MG 151/20 in underwing gondolas below each wing.
Me109G-4 : Similar to G-2 except for radio change as in G-3.
Me109G-4/R2 : Reconnaissance plane with Reihenbildgert Rb 50/30 and a 300 liter drop tank under fuselage.
Me109G-4/R3 : With Rb 50/30 and two 300 liter drop tanks, Armament in wings removed.
Me109G-4/U3 : Tactical reconnaissance plane wiht two Rb 12,5/7.9. All armament removed.
Me109G-4/Trop : Tropicalized model of G-4.
Me109G-4/R3Trop : Tropicalized model of G-4/R3.
Me109G-5 : DB 605A or D engine. Similar to G-1 except for cabin blower and the substitution of two 13 mm MG 131 for the 7.9 mm MG 17 cowling guns.
Me109G-5/R2 : Fighter bomber mdel with ECT50/VIIId bomb rack , carrying 4 SC50`s (50kg).some models chanced ECT50 bomb rack for two 21 cm mortars (Wgr 21) under wings.
Me109G-5/U2 : As G-5 but differed in heaving a wooden tailplane
Me109G-6 : DB 605A, AS, AM or D engine. As G-5 but no pressure cabin.
Me109G-6/Trop : Tropicalized model of G-6.
Me109G-6/R1 : Fighter bomber model of the G-6, ECT500/IXb mounted under fuselage for carrying one 500 kg or 250 kg bomb.
Me109G-6/R2 : As G6/R1 but differed in heaving the two 21 cm mortars (Wgr 21) under wings.
Me109G-6/R1Trop : Tropicalized model of G6/R1.
Me109G-6/R3 : Long range sub-type wiht 300 liter drop tank under fuselage.
Me109G-6/R4 : Heaving the two 30 mm MK 108 cannon in underwing gondolas.
Me109G-6/R6 : Heaving the two 20 mm MG 151 cannon in underwing gondolas.
Me109G-6/U4 : Armament of one or three 30 mm MK 108 cannon and two 13 mm MG 131 machine guns.
Me109G-6/N : Specialized versian in having the FuG 305 "Naxos Z" radar for tracking the H 25 navigation radars of the RAF bombers.
Me109G-8 : DB 605A or D engine. Photographic reconnaissance model fitted with two Rb 12.5/7 or two Rb 32/7 cameras. The MK 108 engine cannon was optional.
Me109G-10 : DB 605D engine. MK 108 engine cannon optional.
Me109G-12 : Two seat trainer. DB 605A engine and reduced tankage.
Me109G-14 : DB 605A, AM, AS, ASB, ASM or D engine. MK 108 engine cannon was optional. later produktion G-14 fitted with wooden tail-unit.
Me109G-16 : DB 605D , fitted with armored oil coolers and radiator, also center-line bomb rack, probebly to late for combat service.

TX-Gunslinger
03-19-2008, 05:27 PM
Unable to check forum last few days.

My page 44 in Messerschmitts over Sicily is text only too. Previous page has a picture of a 109 E9/Trop in flight.

I thumbed through all the illustrations and there is not a one with aircaft weapons being loaded.

So, these are different books OR different editions of the same book. Common for illustrations to be mislabeled, as they can be products from publishers and not authors.

Thanks

Gunny