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Dalan88
11-03-2009, 12:13 AM
I loved the first AC on my ps3 BUT I missed one thing.. Sure all gamedevelopers talks about giving the player a realistic gameplay and so on but I don't understand why they don't put in some dismemberment countermoves in AC2 like I hoped they would...

This game IS M rated and are for 18+ as it sais on my AC1 box so that is not a problem.. It seems that dismemberment is as scary as naked skin in games? I think that a BIG part of the "realistic" gameplay is gone with the wind if there is no, like i have said.. Dismemberment...

I mean.. A part of this game IS about killing people, alot if you want to so i find it very annoying..

What do you guys think? Dismemberment in AC3 or not? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Irvinlr
11-03-2009, 12:47 AM
It would be cool to have dismemberment in future games but that probably wont happen. They will most likely follow the trend that AC1 and 2 and not put dismembermebt in AC3. But I could be wrong. If they put guns, we might see some.

Dalan88
11-03-2009, 01:16 AM
Well, not just dismemberment but more realistic stuff like when you take that big hammerliked weapon from a guard in AC2 and hit him in the head, shouldnt the helmet be scrapples afterwards? When I start to think about it there is much thats NOT realistic...

its a shame. Sure I love AC, its not that but ezio can climp in a realistic way, use the crowd in a realistic way, fight in a realistic way.. But where is the realistic wounds? cutwounds and such http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif Im little dissapointed. I mean, the technology in games the past years have exploded in better graphs, physics and stuff but is it forbidden to have dismemberment in a realistic game or what? Dead space has it (because of all monsters?) starwars has it (because its not realistic enough?) Dead rising has it(if im thinking of the right game) because theres just zombies? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

I mean, is it really that scary to put in dismemberments in form of cutting the weaponhand off and stuff like that? I say its not that realistic when you slash a guy a couple of times and the blood is spraying but no wounds/cuts? Sure you could brake legs in AC1 but no more.. Altough its m rated it feels very VERY censoured.

kakashi560
11-03-2009, 01:19 AM
got to remember its still a video game...

Dalan88
11-03-2009, 01:24 AM
Ofc but what would you say if you saw a 2009 gangstermovie (example) and there is much shooting in it and everytime somone get shot you don't see any marks on him that indicate that hes been shot? Or a warmovie. Would the experience be the same and would people just say "Well its just a movie http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif"?

Iskander_Estel
11-03-2009, 01:25 AM
it's not a gore game like God of War,
you're an Assassin you don't have to go a make all youre victims swim a blood pool...

the point of the game it's make the world look real, even tough Ezio is a more violent guy i think gore is out of context...

kakashi560
11-03-2009, 01:27 AM
the guards also wear armour

Dalan88
11-03-2009, 01:29 AM
armour yes, so why not put in some marks on them when you try to hit them with a sword?

kakashi560
11-03-2009, 01:32 AM
i just dont see it happening ever

the amolang
11-03-2009, 02:00 AM
I don't even want it to happen, I just don't see how it could be realistic in a game about assassins.

PlagueDoctor357
11-03-2009, 02:04 AM
Gotta say meh at your Ezio climbs realistic.

He's way to fast now, in half the videos he's leaping up over and over in some sort of super climb fashion.

The3rdDay
11-03-2009, 09:04 AM
The biggest problem with dismemberment is the technical restriction. When you want to have dismemberment in a game, you need to make models for each part of the body, so it make like 5 to 6 times more models in the same area.

Fallout 3 has it and if you look on a body, you can easly see the separation mark between the body parts. But in fallout, the dismemberment is perfectly match with the combat system.

In an AC game, dismemberment would just be a gorish unnecessary and kind of silly element.

X10J
11-03-2009, 09:10 PM
maybe they dont want to ruin it for australians http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

UchihaKarasu
11-03-2009, 09:33 PM
Dismemberment wasn't really common in a battle during the Renaissance, you don't read very often about people loping off another person's head.
There are several case of a mob getting a hold of a dead body and displaying the torn off parts around the city (a leg there and half a head on the wall, etc)
but it wasn't all to common in battle. And Ezio is an Assassin, though he's more brutal than Altair, its not that easy to just cut a limb off (especially with armor on) and I doubt Ezio is SOOO consumed by vengeance that he's going to stand around to hack a guy's arm off

An_Idea
11-03-2009, 09:35 PM
dismemberment isnt all that realistic anyway... not for ezio. maybe if you had some beastly two handed sword and swung it as hard as you could there would be. but the way ezio will fight (at least i think) is more about just killing efficiently and with a bit of flare. not to cause your enemy as much pain as possible

Phobos14
11-03-2009, 10:22 PM
Haha i was thinking about this post earlier tonight when i was just massacring people on Prototype.

Some how when i blow a guy to bits with a rocket launcher his rib cage and spin survive http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Azugo
11-03-2009, 10:31 PM
Originally posted by X10J:
maybe they dont want to ruin it for australians http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I'm Australian. What is that supposed to mean?

Xanatos2007
11-04-2009, 12:23 AM
He was reffering to Australia's tough rating system.

Azugo
11-05-2009, 12:34 AM
I don't get it lol.

AltairEagleEzio
11-06-2009, 01:32 AM
Our country does'nt let many games that have pretty mature content. Fallout 3 had to have the drugs removed from it for it to be allowed classifaction. Left 4 Dead 2 is'nt allowed in, neither was a Silent Hill game (think it was Homecoming, can't remember). Our classification board is pretty tough.

AetosEagle
11-06-2009, 12:47 PM
I don't see why people are opposed to it other than because he's an Assassin. Right... So when someone becomes an Assassin, is there a rule saying "no limb removal"? Yeah sure armour and stuff and it wouldn't suit the game, a Hammer wouldn't knock someones head off. Just the reasons your giving are the wrong ones for it not being in the game.

LaurenIsSoMosh
11-06-2009, 01:05 PM
Originally posted by AetosEagle:
I don't see why people are opposed to it other than because he's an Assassin. I'm opposed to it because it's in poor taste.

Naturally, gore and dismemberment will attract a few budding teenagers looking for some sick thrills, but it will also turn off those who are looking for actual depth in their games.

I find Assassin's Creed II to be a game that has good taste in style, maturity (as in maturity, not immaturity, if you catch my drift there), and art value. Tacking on dismemberment for some cheap laughs during combat would clash with and detract from my appreciation for any depth that Assassin's Creed would otherwise have.

AetosEagle
11-06-2009, 01:08 PM
Well atleast someone has an honest opinion http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I just don't think flying arms and heads suits Assassins creed.

LaurenIsSoMosh
11-06-2009, 01:11 PM
Originally posted by AetosEagle:
Well atleast someone has an honest opinion http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif That's me! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
I just don't think flying arms and heads suits Assassins creed. Haha, there's always someone who can in ten words sum up what I say in fifty words...

AetosEagle
11-06-2009, 01:19 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/partyhat.gif And today it was me!

GkrewZ
11-06-2009, 01:44 PM
I wouldent mind dismemberment if they did it in the right way so no over the top crazylimbs flying around all the time i mean like maybe as a way to disarm an aponent(no pun intended) you would end up hitting him at the wrist ant taking off his hand then he stumbles off then passes out and dies from blood loss or something like one thing i havent sean implamented to well is bleading out like if you cut someone along the chest or something enough to make him blead alot his movements would start getting sluggish or something and blood acualy falling on the cround and acumulating a bit would be a nice touch but back on point it would depend on how the dismemberment is used would deturmin if i would want it implamented or not

Jack_Vykios
11-06-2009, 02:46 PM
Originally posted by Iskander_Estel:
it's not a gore game like God of War,
you're an Assassin you don't have to go a make all youre victims swim a blood pool...

the point of the game it's make the world look real, even tough Ezio is a more violent guy i think gore is out of context... I disagree. Done the right way, anything can work in the context of the game. Ezio is more than violent; he is brutal. Realistic dismemberment with people literally screaming for their lives in a believable fashion: twitching, vomiting, coughing up blood as they lie on the floor...I can see that being pretty disturbing. In a good way.
But the nut-stab is stupid.
Of course, I think that's a little beyond the technology of current gen consoles. Also, people don't like to do risky stuff in games. I mean, games are an art and all, but art has limits!...right? That's the point of art, isn't it? That limits are imposed upon it by the censors?

AltairEagleEzio
11-06-2009, 02:53 PM
Yeah, "disturbing in a good way" if you like that sort of thing. I personally think that
people literally screaming for their lives in a believable fashion: twitching, vomiting, coughing up blood as they lie on the floor is not a very attractive addition to a game.

Jack_Vykios
11-06-2009, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by AltairEagleEzio:
Yeah, "disturbing in a good way" if you like that sort of thing. I personally think that <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> people literally screaming for their lives in a believable fashion: twitching, vomiting, coughing up blood as they lie on the floor is not a very attractive addition to a game. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>You're an assassin. You kill people for a living, and you do it in really horrible ways. I would actually like to feel what Ezio feels when he kills.

Of course, it wouldn't just be an orgy of corpses screaming, being sick and coughing upblood (that would be almost comical before turning annoying). Just one or two in every so many.
See, so many people die in games. We brutally murder legions upon legions of "baddies" throughout the course of entire games, but we don't seem to care, because they're not us, and they're certainly not human. So my argument is to make them as human as possible. Make you ACTUALLY feel sorry for your enemies, not like: "Oh, that looks like it hurt...LET'S DO IT AGAIN!" but more like: "Oh god...did I do that?"
Give the gamer something to think about.

LaurenIsSoMosh
11-06-2009, 03:05 PM
Originally posted by Jack_Vykios:
Give the gamer something to think about. While I totally, wholeheartedly, one-hundred-percentedly agree with you on this note, I think dismemberment is absolutely without question the worst way to go about doing that.

It'll only attract the people who enjoy such moments and scare off the people who don't like killing legions and legions, entirely defeating its own purpose in an ironic way.

Jack_Vykios
11-06-2009, 03:14 PM
Originally posted by LaurenIsSoMosh:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jack_Vykios:
Give the gamer something to think about. While I totally, wholeheartedly, one-hundred-percentedly agree with you on this note, I think dismemberment is absolutely without question the worst way to go about doing that.

It'll only attract the people who enjoy such moments and scare off the people who don't like killing legions and legions, entirely defeating its own purpose in an ironic way. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>My example was off the top of my head. Studying WW1 poetry and literature in college ATM. Pretty graphic pictures lingering at the back of my mind as a result.

I would never say never to something like that. I readily expect there to be a way to construct dismemberment or gore in a way that is both tasteful and appropriate. For one, I'm sick of seeing identically unscarred corpses littering my wake in games. It just looks so fake. That doesn't mean I wanna see giblets lying everywhere, but I want to see, without excess, body parts cut off where I cut them, lying where they fell, and I want to see the people actually reacting to what I've done to them. I genuinely want to pity these people, but I'm not, because they're all so faceless and identical. And Ezio stabs them in the balls, and as soon as that happens, it's just embarrassing.

And, at the end of the day, always include a "turn horrific violence OFF" option as a cop out. Some people genuinely hate blood, even fake blood, and there's no reason to force them to sit through something that'll make them faint through every minute of gametime.

bladencrowd
11-06-2009, 03:15 PM
Graphic dismemberment or just general dismemberment. An example of general dismemberment would be Ninja Gaiden 2. I had no guilty feelings after I beheaded thousands of ninjas at the end of the game. I never had emotions for the enemies; they were just things in my way. In Assassins Creed the guards seem more "human", so cutting a guard head off would make me feel a bit disgusted at my self. Maybe an arm or leg to get a "Wow that really looks painful" moment.

Xm3buX
11-06-2009, 03:46 PM
LOL was I the only one who thought of this when reading this topic:

http://static.guim.co.uk/Guardian/arts/gallery/2007/jul/22/comedy.films/holy_grail_ronaldgrant-2878.jpg

Azugo
11-06-2009, 06:22 PM
Originally posted by AltairEagleEzio:
Our country does'nt let many games that have pretty mature content. Fallout 3 had to have the drugs removed from it for it to be allowed classifaction. Left 4 Dead 2 is'nt allowed in, neither was a Silent Hill game (think it was Homecoming, can't remember). Our classification board is pretty tough.

Ah, I see. It's a wonder why they let Grand Theft Auto IV in then, don't you think? And are you sure they removed the drugs from Fallout 3? In the GotY edition that my Dad wants as a present, it says on the back ''Drug References''... o_O

ChaosOveride
11-07-2009, 02:44 PM
Originally posted by Jack_Vykios:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AltairEagleEzio:
Yeah, "disturbing in a good way" if you like that sort of thing. I personally think that <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> people literally screaming for their lives in a believable fashion: twitching, vomiting, coughing up blood as they lie on the floor is not a very attractive addition to a game. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>You're an assassin. You kill people for a living, and you do it in really horrible ways. I would actually like to feel what Ezio feels when he kills.

Of course, it wouldn't just be an orgy of corpses screaming, being sick and coughing upblood (that would be almost comical before turning annoying). Just one or two in every so many.
See, so many people die in games. We brutally murder legions upon legions of "baddies" throughout the course of entire games, but we don't seem to care, because they're not us, and they're certainly not human. So my argument is to make them as human as possible. Make you ACTUALLY feel sorry for your enemies, not like: "Oh, that looks like it hurt...LET'S DO IT AGAIN!" but more like: "Oh god...did I do that?"
Give the gamer something to think about. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

no your an assassin you kill quickly an efficiantly subject to the enviroment and the materials you have availible. A proffesional assassin would not feel anything but ezio would mearly feel hate and Altair would feel maby hate or he would just enjoy the challange, from what i know.
I agree that dismemberment does not suit assassins creed, you have to have a heavy weapon and a powerful precise swing to take off a body part. just my thoughts :P

RasmusChrstnsn
11-07-2009, 03:36 PM
Well, I can live without dismemberment in the game http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
However I must admit, that i giggles a little every time i see an ACII video, and I see Ezio stab a guard with a sword, and the sword just goes into the guards texture, and out on the other side. It looks hilarious up close.

Back on topic, I do agree with those who say, dismemberment doesn't quite fit into ACII. What I like about AC is the assassinating and parkour, not the blood and gore, even though I like when I watch an ACII video and see Ezio swing a hammer into the face of a guard, makes me say "Oh my..." http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

In conclusion, nobody will ever be able to make the perfect game. The perfect game is the real world, but unfortuneately your actions have consequences here! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
---

caswallawn_2k7
11-11-2009, 05:31 PM
just to bring this back to prove a point on why no dismemberment makes the game available to more, this is from the BBFC rating basically saying the game only got a 15 rating (instead of 18) due tot he lack of dismemberment.


At '15', the BBFC's Guidelines state that 'violence may be strong but should not dwell on the infliction of pain or injury.' The strong bloody violence is very similar to the first game in the series, and includes sight of gushing blood when characters are attacked by a variety of hand-held weapons including swords, daggers and throwing knives. However, this violence does not extend to body dismemberment or other similarly gory images. The player-character is also shown stabbing some enemies in cold blood or slitting their throats, although the sight of the latter is not accompanied by close-up detail. Furthermore the game encourages the player to act with stealth as opposed to battling enemies repeatedly.

the amolang
11-11-2009, 07:38 PM
why are people still discussing this? dismemberment in ac2 does not mix. assassin's want clean assassinations, not heads and legs flying around.

Mcmole2
11-11-2009, 11:14 PM
Maybe it's just me, but if they allowed dismemberment, then the game starts to become a hack and slash game, instead of a sandbox/action-adventure game. I love the violence and the creative way Ubisoft has gone with it with disarming opponents and using their weapons, but to include limbs falling off and the huge amount of gore to follow, what would make it different from any other hack and slash game out there?

rjs55_85
11-11-2009, 11:41 PM
I think dismemberment would make the game less realistic. It's hard to cut of an arm, leg, or head. I could see the removal of a hand though.

FROGGEman2
11-12-2009, 03:41 AM
We should focus on getting WEATHER for now, but dismemberment might be cool.

Almost as cool as WEATHER.

WEATHER WEATHER WEATHER