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MB_Avro_UK
06-13-2007, 05:40 PM
Hi all,

Just seen 'FlyBoys'. What a PoS!

CGI is a disgrace and the plot is worse.

The best WW1 Aviation movie IMO was 'The Blue Max'.

This link mixes FlyBoy clips with The Blue Max.The Blue Max was made in 1966 and sets the bar as far as I'm concerned.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aubR2xbDiHw&mode=related&search=

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

MB_Avro_UK
06-13-2007, 05:40 PM
Hi all,

Just seen 'FlyBoys'. What a PoS!

CGI is a disgrace and the plot is worse.

The best WW1 Aviation movie IMO was 'The Blue Max'.

This link mixes FlyBoy clips with The Blue Max.The Blue Max was made in 1966 and sets the bar as far as I'm concerned.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aubR2xbDiHw&mode=related&search=

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

DKoor
06-13-2007, 05:44 PM
In the lack of better, it's good.
Or at least I don't think it's a PoS.

But the emphasis is on the: who makes these kind of movies any more?

So.. considering that... we should be kinda happy to see more of those "PoSs" http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

BillyTheKid_22
06-13-2007, 05:51 PM
COOL!~! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/inlove.gif Great Video!!

MB_Avro_UK
06-13-2007, 05:57 PM
Hi all,

Maybe I was being too hard on FlyBoys. In it's own way it was a good film to introduce the average filmgoer to aviation combat.

But the best film as I have mentioned is 'The Blue Max'. Made in 1966 yet it's flying sequences are superb. Tells the story from the German side.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHJmae52J8c&mode=related&search=

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

Bearcat99
06-13-2007, 06:35 PM
I think PoS is a bit too strong... especially considering all the other WWI aerial combat movies that are out there... It definitely needed more... the plot was not too bad.. it was just predictable... It was still fgood to see all those birds though CGI or not.

Udidtoo
06-13-2007, 06:37 PM
Fly Boys was so bad it almost made me remember Pearl Harbor in a new light, almost.

Your right about The Blue Max.

Dear Roland. Get frikken bent.

Xiolablu3
06-13-2007, 06:49 PM
I thought it COULD have been so good if ONLY they had got a good writer in.

It was the story which absolutely killed it for me, real kindergarten stuff. The writer should be shot.

1: New 'outsider' pilots join squadron
2: Old Pilots hate New pilots (booo)
3: New pilots 'prove themselves' and are accepted (Hurrah!)
4. 'VERY BAD' German kills best friend. ( Big Booo!)
5: Pilot very sad and falls in love and drowns sorrows with girl. (Hurrah!)
6. Pilot Rescues girl. (He's so brave)
7: Hero gets revenge by killing 'VERY BAD' German. ( Hurrah times ten!)


The CGI and actors were OK, if ONLY they had got in a good writer and had a story which was so predictable as to think you have seen the film many times before, such as 'Aces High', or 'The Blue Max'.

Feathered_IV
06-13-2007, 08:19 PM
It is just another awful aviation movie. Every bit as terrible as PH, Top Gun and Memphis Belle.
I had a free ticket to see it, and still felt cheated.

As an aside, we should consider forming a lobby group to prevent George Lucas from making the movie about the Tuskeegee flyers. Can you imagine what he would do to that? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Korolov1986
06-13-2007, 08:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
...Every bit as terrible as PH, Top Gun and Memphis Belle... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

PH was junk, Top Gun was ok if you only watched the jet scenes, but Memphis Belle was a fun movie. What's your beef with it?

leitmotiv
06-13-2007, 08:49 PM
Because Memphis Belle was a travesty about a real airplane, which was not shot to pieces on its last mission, and was the subject of a brilliant color documentary shot by William Wyler, and released in 1944 about the real aircraft which far surpasses the bunk of that pathetic Hollywood teen film:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0036152/

Feathered_IV
06-13-2007, 09:14 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif

Plus the homo-erotism of Top Gun was just so monumental. Here is the condensed version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHklGtW3rwU

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

BillyTheKid_22
06-13-2007, 09:17 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
Because Memphis Belle was a travesty about a real airplane, which was not shot to pieces on its last mission, and was the subject of a brilliant color documentary shot by William Wyler, and released in 1944 about the real aircraft which far surpasses the bunk of that pathetic Hollywood teen film:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0036152/ </div></BLOCKQUOTE>



http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif and http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

polak5
06-13-2007, 09:23 PM
the only problem i had with Memphis bell was this guy
http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/6878/carrottopzm7.jpg

leitmotiv
06-13-2007, 09:43 PM
I'm on the floor---which Tarentino film is that from, FIV? I've always thought the screenplay of Top Goon had to have been written by some completely depraved Hollywood screenwriters who deliberately wanted to make a military film with a Tom of Finland gay porn subplot---and succeeded beyond their wildest dreams. I'd imagine the film is a gay classic just for all the near naked buff men. I've always thought it was a joke from beginning to end---saw it one time, laughed my head off, and that was enough.

M_Gunz
06-13-2007, 10:32 PM
Blue Max is good and excellent plot but.......

Hell's Angels (Howard Hughes, 1930) has original WWI fighters (some or all) flown by actual
WWI pilots with complete technical oversight at high attention to detail. The Zeppelin
however, was a model but done very well.

The plot is good and displays attitudes of the time as well for several different groups.
Monte is a bounding cad and Roy is honorable but still a tool. The German officer... is he
portrayed well I can't say. Very correct, reserved and controlled gentleman, that one.
If I caught somebody with my old lady, he wouldn't have to wait till tomorrow to fight!

Still, you want to see how those late-war fighters flew then it's that or actual war film.

Sturmtrooper
06-13-2007, 10:34 PM
I don't know if it's the worst but .......
it's really BAD!
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

I had heard of this movie way before it was released.I had great expectations.
It LOOKED cool in the previews and trailers.

UGH !!!

They really botched it!!!!
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

The dogfight CG scenes were a joke.

But the real-life mock-ups that they used were great.

Story-line=a joke
Acting=a joke

This movie probably was doomed from the begining.

Here's a thought:
Why doesn't some producer/director/production company make a movie based on the story of one of these NONFICTION books:

Samurai
To Fly And Fight
The First And The Last
No Parachute
Fly For Your Life
The Blond Knight Of Germany
etc....

Hell,make a movie on someone who hasn't been written about much.Like:
Richard Bong
Gabreski
Gentile&Godfrey
Tex Hill
_______
(fill in the blank)

You know with all the retro crud coming out,why not do a NEW "Baa Baa Black Sheep" movie.
YEAH!!!!
Pappy with a green screen!
Computer generated Corsairs,Zeros,Betty's,...
AND....
A GREAT STORY too!

Sorry,I was just dreaming. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sleepzzz.gif

M_Gunz
06-13-2007, 10:45 PM
Sturmtrooper could you RESIZE that Avatar pic where it is stored rather than make us dialups
have to load down a dam' near screen sized picture and then it gets choked down?

I swear, I thought that UBI set limits. I am wishing they would set them IN CODE so if the
Avatar pic is over the display size then it wouldn't load, period.

GreyFox5
06-13-2007, 10:48 PM
Sure it was predictable sure - but it was fun and entertaining.

I hated the almost comical tracers. Ok I get that its hard to get the shooting at the other guy but that was a bit over the top. Like there wasn't smokeless powder invented yet.

I also applaud the fact that James DeFanco got his pilots lic. for the shoot, that was cool.

So where are all the pilot movies for all those brave British pilots? I'm sure there are a lot of great stories there.

Stiletto-
06-13-2007, 10:50 PM
I rented this movie a couple months ago as I didn't see it in the theatre. I had to see it cause I am a huge WWI aviation fan,(I cut my teeth with Red Baron by Dynamix for Pete's sake). While it wasn't a very good movie, atleast some people were interested enough in making a WWI movie and some people were interested enough in actually seeing it, despite if it was good or bad. World War I era combat movies have always been neglected compared to WWII, but they have been taking a real back burner of late, not many people know alot about "The Great War", and I'm glad to see that people still think that this is a valid franchise. When was the last time there was a good WWI combat flight sim? Thank God for Knights of The Sky, I will eat that up.

Anyways, the script was too cliche, there were Fokker DR.I's in 1916 (Germans didnt get it until late 1917) and they were all red like the Red Barons... A little overboard on trying to relate the more popular things of history to the masses and being innacurate, but those Nieuports! They were awesome looking, and no I am not talking about the CG scenes, they had very realistic authentic replicas made somewhere in the Midwest I think ( I forget what the companies name is but they have a cool webpage and they aren't all that expensive). The real shots of the Nieuports taking off from grass runwayed airodromes was worth sitting through the other hour of filler IMO.

Jasko76
06-14-2007, 01:53 AM
Ummm... I'm quite undecided about this one. Wanted to comment it when I first saw it, but didn't want to say anything bad about it because, as someone said, we don't get too many WWI related movies these days. Apart from that, it's a disaster. Unrealistic CG-scenes. Evil, bloodthirsty Krauts. Cordite powered bullets. Black pilot in WWI (were there any in US Aircorps, or what was it called back then?!?). Cheezy lovestory. Nah, they had a chance to create something beautiful and now we have to wait another 10 years for the next WWI movie to be made. As far as WWI goeas, I really like the "Aces High".

On a side note, I love "Letters from Iwo Jima". This movie is so powerful, I almost wept. Now, THATS what I call a realistic war movie.

leitmotiv
06-14-2007, 01:59 AM
I thought Letters was magnificent.

whiteladder
06-14-2007, 02:12 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">surpasses the bunk of that pathetic Hollywood teen film: </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have to defend our American cousins on this one, because Mephis Belle is actually a British film. I was produced by David Putnam and was financed, produced and filmed in Britain.

In fact I remeber a TV interview at the time with Putnam where he came in for a bit of stick for making War film that didn`t have British subject(the film was partially financed with film council money). He quite rightly pointed out that as America was the largest market and there was no demand for a "British" war movie it would have been a flop and lost money.

Sergio_101
06-14-2007, 02:58 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by whiteladder:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">surpasses the bunk of that pathetic Hollywood teen film: </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have to defend our American cousins on this one, because Mephis Belle is actually a British film. I was produced by David Putnam and was financed, produced and filmed in Britain.

In fact I remeber a TV interview at the time with Putnam where he came in for a bit of stick for making War film that didn`t have British subject(the film was partially financed with film council money). He quite rightly pointed out that as America was the largest market and there was no demand for a "British" war movie it would have been a flop and lost money. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Original "Memphis Belle" was a documentary, and was pretty good for a war propaganda film.

The later "re-make" was lame, and a real B-17 was
lost during the filming.
That's way to high a price to pay for that lame POS.

I found Fly Boys to be a film in need of more isle seats.

I did not last 10 minutes.

Sergio

ploughman
06-14-2007, 03:02 AM
Love that Gay Top Gun. I mean, you know, I don't LOVE Gay Top Gun, I, er...

Never seen Flyboys or any of the Harry Potter films. Neat huh.

leitmotiv
06-14-2007, 03:11 AM
I'm American and I thought the fantasy boy's adventure movie Memphis Belle sucked mightily and just made me want to drink heavily to erase the memory so that I would only think of Wyler's magnificent documentary whenever I heard that name. I, too, abjured Potter and Fly Brats. Looking forward to Dambusters.

luftluuver
06-14-2007, 03:33 AM
Yes Jasko there was but he flew for the French. He was Eugene Jacques Bullard
http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/2071032974

Could it possibly be that all the Fokkers were <span class="ev_code_RED">red</span> since Joe Public is so clueless about WW1 airplanes and this made for easy recognition of who was 'friend and foe'?

Xiolablu3
06-14-2007, 03:56 AM
I really enjoyed Top Gun (I am not gay http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif)


Didnt like Memphis Belle, i just found it a bit ridiculous and unbelievable.

I also believe they used 2 Bf109s for the filming, so why didnt we SEE more of them instead of of just dots in the distance.

I know he was probably trying to be realistic in that you only see 'a dot with blinking lights' but what a missed opportunity!

Close up footage of Bf109's attacking would have been fantastic.

Someone asked for a good British WW1 movie. Get 'Aces High', it has a good story, good footage of planes. Along with 'The Blue Max', probably the best 2 WW1 air movies.

I have not seen Howard Hughes film however.

Badsight-
06-14-2007, 04:01 AM
the small , minority "air combat" crowd must be quite the unsual group to the game & movie makers

a small market , knows their history & is largely intolerant of anything inaccurate (bordering on the obsessive)

leitmotiv
06-14-2007, 04:20 AM
There are quite a few howlers in Blue Max, for example, but I think most of us do not care because, overall, a really big effort was made to capture the period flavor, the cast was brilliant, the acting was very good, and the direction was very good, i.e., it is so good overall that quibbling looks like foolishness. Same for Twelve O'Clock High and Dambusters. What distinguishes all of these is that they are great films which happen to be about flying done by directors who were determined to capture the atmosphere of the time. Another thing---a really good cameraman, and a really good director, and a really good actor can make you forget about whether the airplane was precisely the correct mark for the period.

Fox_3
06-14-2007, 05:25 AM
Gun Bus was the worst WW1 movie ever made.

http://www.gunbus.biz/film.main.html

Two US Doughboys tired of life in the trenches steal a couple of RFC officers uniforms, and report for duty at an airfield.

Throw in an ironclad Zeppelin, and the RFC's version of **** Dastardly's Vulture squadron, and you have the ingredients for the biggest pile of cack every seen on screen.

JG53Frankyboy
06-14-2007, 05:54 AM
this, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darling_Lili Darling Lili, could also be a candidate http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

leitmotiv
06-14-2007, 05:54 AM
One of the great scenes about the air war is in a film about the post-war. It is in The Best Years of Our Lives when the bombardier played by Dana Andrews, whom everybody thinks is OK, is really suffering from his experience (anger, resentment, depression), and he finally confronts his war nightmare in the nose of a derelict Fort in a scrap yard of hundreds of Forts. A very powerful scene. Has lost nothing in 60 years, as true today as then.

AlGroover
06-14-2007, 06:11 AM
What was so frustrating about 'Flyboys' was the number details they got right. Such as the references to 'Archie' (not AA or ack-ack), the leader's pennants which he removed to go solo hunting after a patrol (very authentic) and the airfield itself. It would have cost no more to get much more right.

mauld
06-14-2007, 06:12 AM
Yes it is a PoS, its a Mills and Boon romance, with some cartoon flying, Hollywood has lost the plot when it comes to historic aviation films pearl harbour is an example what every happened to historic technical advisors all dead i suppose. WW1 pilots would be outraged by that depiction of what it was (not)like.

Blutarski2004
06-14-2007, 06:38 AM
Funny that the topic of "Flyboys" should come up, as I just rented it this past weekend. Generally speaking, I found it as utterly lame as its title implied. Whoever was responsible (and I mean that in the felonious sense) for the plot and dialogue should be taken out behind the hangar and shot. Apparently, the real story of the LE was just not found sufficiently "exciting".

The fine French actor Jean Reno (the French Securite' agent in "Ronin") was completely wasted - a shame.

YET .....

Someone involved in that film displayed a deep affection for the period. You could see it creep out in little details at odd moments during the film -

- the ammunition sorting scene.

- the clip of the rotary engine being slowly spun in the mechanic's shed.

- the flight leader pennants being removed from Cassidy's plane before take-off.

- the outside rack for spare flares on Franco's Nieuport.

- the crash of "Captain Hook's" Nieuport in no man's land, which I thought was portrayed excellently.

- the scene of the Fokker Dr.I structurally collapsing as its tumbled to earth (by itself more dramatic than any of those flaming explosions we had to endure time after time).

- some of the combat gunsight views, which hinted at the difficulty in tracking an evading and weaving target.

- "Captain Hook" FINALLY figuring out how to lead his target at the climax of the film. (BTW, I do seem to recall that there was a WW1 fighter pilot who flew with such a hook in place of a hand, but I believe he was a German)

- - -

Someone mentioned Eugene Bullard, the black American who flew for France. The life of this man absolutely cries out for a film to be made. What a story!

Blutarski2004
06-14-2007, 06:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AlGroover:
What was so frustrating about 'Flyboys' was the number details they got right. Such as the references to 'Archie' (not AA or ack-ack), the leader's pennants which he removed to go solo hunting after a patrol (very authentic) and the airfield itself. It would have cost no more to get much more right. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


..... I agree.

The190Flyer
06-14-2007, 07:06 AM
Personally, I liked the movie, however it did have it's faults, for instance: how every german plane was a triplane?
I haven't seen Memphis Belle for a long time so I would have to watch it again to comment.
I want to see Letters from Iwo Jima and Flags of our Fathers, because they both look like great movies
One of my favorite war movies still has to be Enemy at the Gates!

Ernst_Rohr
06-14-2007, 07:08 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Blutarski2004:
Funny that the topic of "Flyboys" should come up, as I just rented it this past weekend. Generally speaking, I found it as utterly lame as its title implied. Whoever was responsible (and I mean that in the felonious sense) for the plot and dialogue should be taken out behind the hangar and shot. Apparently, the real story of the LE was just not found sufficiently "exciting".

The fine French actor Jean Reno (the French Securite' agent in "Ronin") was completely wasted - a shame.

YET .....

Someone involved in that film displayed a deep affection for the period. You could see it creep out in little details at odd moments during the film -

- the ammunition sorting scene.

- the clip of the rotary engine being slowly spun in the mechanic's shed.

- the flight leader pennants being removed from Cassidy's plane before take-off.

- the outside rack for spare flares on Franco's Nieuport.

- the crash of "Captain Hook's" Nieuport in no man's land, which I thought was portrayed excellently.

- the scene of the Fokker Dr.I structurally collapsing as its tumbled to earth (by itself more dramatic than any of those flaming explosions we had to endure time after time).

- some of the combat gunsight views, which hinted at the difficulty in tracking an evading and weaving target.

- "Captain Hook" FINALLY figuring out how to lead his target at the climax of the film. (BTW, I do seem to recall that there was a WW1 fighter pilot who flew with such a hook in place of a hand, but I believe he was a German)

- - -

Someone mentioned Eugene Bullard, the black American who flew for France. The life of this man absolutely cries out for a film to be made. What a story! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Agree 100%.

There were a lot of details they got "right" in the movie, but it seems that Hollywood CANNOT film anything without screwing around with the plot to make it sufficiently entertaining/understandable to the weak minded know nothings that populate our theaters.

The only folks in Hollywood that can come close to making something close to respectable are Spielberg/Hanks and Eastwood.

M_Gunz
06-14-2007, 07:31 AM
They couldn't afford to CG even TWO different German planes, not even more than one skin
for the one anachronism they did model and how many small, cheap details makes up for it?

The film should not have been made like that.

-HH-Dubbo
06-14-2007, 09:23 AM
I have high hopes for this one - http://www.redbaron-themovie.com/

I shall probably be disappointed http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

EDCF_Rama
06-14-2007, 09:35 AM
For each detail they got right, there are plenty they got wrong (tracers, rotary engines not rotating, no blip, wrong German helmet in 1916, etc, etc, etc....it's an endless list)
More important (to me).... the film context shows a major German offensive piercing the lines.... something totally wrong in 1916 and 1917... The Ludendorf offensives took place in 1918, when the Lafayette squad was history.

And lastly (and what really makes this movie a looser)... none of the actor is believable in his role... they all seems not to believe themthelves in the story.

It's probably the worse aviation movie I ever saw.

GreyFox5
06-14-2007, 09:50 AM
I bought the special edition DVD and the commentary especially the little stunt guy bit was totally hilarious its so funny that its a must have.

Look I already know Hollywood is going to screw up anything I look forward to being released. Ya I didn't mention the details but its entertaining I'll give it that.

Deep Blue World didn't need the love story there either but you have to look at it from the studio's perspective - TO MAKE MONEY on there investment. That was an amazing movie and any of my counterparts living in England want to send me a DVD - I'll pay of course http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif since I can't find it in the states. I would appreciate it.

Memphis Belle - was a bunch of B-17 war stories all rolled into one movie and ya that doesn't make for a good movie. But again it made some money so the movie makers were happy. - I believe the French owned B-17 was the one that crashed on takeoff. The burning B-17 is the footage that was used in the movie. All escaped unharmed.

Anyway just remember its entertainment not a documentary.

Cheers -

huggy87
06-14-2007, 09:52 AM
I have the feeling that if they actually made the movie that everyone here wanted to see, the only people who would actually go see it are here.

ploughman
06-14-2007, 09:57 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by GreyFox5:
I bought the special edition DVD and the commentary especially the little stunt guy bit was totally hilarious its so funny that its a must have.

Look I already know Hollywood is going to screw up anything I look forward to being released. Ya I didn't mention the details but its entertaining I'll give it that.

Deep Blue World didn't need the love story there either but you have to look at it from the studio's perspective - TO MAKE MONEY on there investment. That was an amazing movie and any of my counterparts living in England want to send me a DVD - I'll pay of course http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif since I can't find it in the states. I would appreciate it.

Memphis Belle - was a bunch of B-17 war stories all rolled into one movie and ya that doesn't make for a good movie. But again it made some money so the movie makers were happy. - I believe the French owned B-17 was the one that crashed on takeoff. The burning B-17 is the footage that was used in the movie. All escaped unharmed.

Anyway just remember its entertainment not a documentary.

Cheers - </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

PM me your address and I'll send it to you. You have an all regions DVD player right?

JG52Uther
06-14-2007, 10:03 AM
Dark blue World in the US:
http://www.amazon.com/Dark-Blue-World-Hans-J%C3%B6rg-Assmann/dp/B00006490T

EDCF_Rama
06-14-2007, 10:04 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by GreyFox5:
I believe the French owned B-17 was the one that crashed on takeoff. The burning B-17 is the footage that was used in the movie. All escaped unharmed. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

There were 2 French B-17 in this movie, both were at that time properties of French Geographical Institute.
One crashed on takeoff (the one you talk about), the other still fly, is now property of a dedicated association and is operated by AJBS.

LStarosta
06-14-2007, 10:15 AM
Yeah I thought Flyboys was pretty gay.

Blutarski2004
06-14-2007, 10:24 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by EDCF_Rama:
For each detail they got right, there are plenty they got wrong (tracers, rotary engines not rotating, no blip, wrong German helmet in 1916, etc, etc, etc....it's an endless list)
More important (to me).... the film context shows a major German offensive piercing the lines.... something totally wrong in 1916 and 1917... The Ludendorf offensives took place in 1918, when the Lafayette squad was history.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>


..... Absolutely agree re the "crossing the Meuse" bit - totally Harry Turtledove stuff AFAIC.

But I'm pretty sure that the steel coal-scuttle helmets were in use by 1916, at least with certain front-line troops. I know they were in use at Verdun in 1916.

jamesdietz
06-14-2007, 10:33 AM
Richthofen & Brown smelled!

M_Gunz
06-14-2007, 12:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by GreyFox5:
you have to look at it from the studio's perspective - TO MAKE MONEY on there investment. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So when people pay money to see a POS movie and/or buy the DVD/merchandise, guess what kind
of movie they'll make next time?

"Oh, don't bother with all those planes and accuracy stuff... Flyboys sold!"

Xiolablu3
06-14-2007, 12:18 PM
I dont buy the 'People wouldnt go and see a movie that we would like'' bit.

The Blue Max/Battle of Britain (For the time)/Aces High/Tora Tora Tora

Also

SAving Private Ryan/Apolcalypse Now/Full Metal Jacket

All great films. I BELIEVE all were succesful at the box office, and all will be far more successful than Flyboys, I am sure.

GreyFox5
06-14-2007, 12:22 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG52Uther:
Dark blue World in the US:
http://www.amazon.com/Dark-Blue-World-Hans-J%C3%B6rg-Assmann/dp/B00006490T </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

VHS format! Yikes

I see Amazon has it in DVD here http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000648X2/sr=1-1/qid=...45200&sr=1-1&seller= (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000648X2/sr=1-1/qid=1181845200/ref=olp_product_details/103-8614226-3931814?ie=UTF8&qid=1181845200&sr=1-1&seller=)

Man it's expensive!

Udidtoo
06-14-2007, 01:01 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by GreyFox5:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG52Uther:
Dark blue World in the US:
http://www.amazon.com/Dark-Blue-World-Hans-J%C3%B6rg-Assmann/dp/B00006490T </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

VHS format! Yikes

I see Amazon has it in DVD here http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000648X2/sr=1-1/qid=...45200&sr=1-1&seller= (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000648X2/sr=1-1/qid=1181845200/ref=olp_product_details/103-8614226-3931814?ie=UTF8&qid=1181845200&sr=1-1&seller=)

Man it's expensive! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't know what your location is but in Phoenix the Fry's Electronics always have copies, can't recall the price at the moment but it's less than $20.

boxmike
06-14-2007, 01:32 PM
Plz wait with those hammerings. I'm going to get 'Flyboys' to my small yet ever growing DVD library. Admitted, even trailer gives the understanding that no 1 pilot in this movie is L. Skywalker and Dreideckers are actually Tie-fighters and Zeppelin may be Deathstar.
Still, some people did some work to implement this movie which was definitely not all-CGI, no I'm not talking about girls http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
Nevertheless, any movie reflects the time it was made. A bit more training for hollywood with WWI-WWII CGI and in the end, we'll be happy with the outcome http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Mean time, regarding WWI I still have in my wishlist Wellman's 'Wings', Hughes' 'Hell's Angels' and from 60's 'Blue Max'. Maybe 'Aces High'?
For comics fans, I recommend warmly DC Comics', 'Enemy Ace: War Idyll', there seems to be a whole series for this teutonic hero but I read only 'War Idyll', really great.

Rgds,
- box

I_KG100_Prien
06-14-2007, 02:54 PM
I didn't think Flyboys was terrible. I was disappointed in the lame love story plot a la PH.. However I didn't watch it with high expectations to begin with. I knew it was going to be a film with more of an emphasis on "entertainment" rather than historical accuracy. So from that viewpoint I was actually able to enjoy it.

Memphis Belle is enjoyable if you can let go of the hard nosed history buff persona and look at it from a different angle. Mostly, a story depicting the type of hardships that bomber crews endured during missions over Fortress Europe.

Jasko76
06-14-2007, 02:57 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by boxmike:
Maybe 'Aces High'?
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Definitely Aces High! Malcolm McDowel is outstanding in his role of a war-weary squadron leader.

MB_Avro_UK
06-14-2007, 03:54 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jasko76:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by boxmike:
Maybe 'Aces High'?
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Definitely Aces High! Malcolm McDowel is outstanding in his role of a war-weary squadron leader. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree...based on the play 'Journey's End' by R C Sheriff about Trench warfare in WW1 and transposed to the Royal Flying Corps.

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

boxmike
06-14-2007, 04:03 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jasko76:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by boxmike:
Maybe 'Aces High'?
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Definitely Aces High! Malcolm McDowel is outstanding in his role of a war-weary squadron leader. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thx for the tip. Last time I saw Malcolm M. in my comp was 'Wing Commander IV' and 'Star Trek movie Next Generation'. He surely has that genuine theatrical expression (like Patrick Stewart).
There are 2 versions of a movie called 'Dawn Patrol', haven't seen original but in '38 version Basil Rathbone certainly makes an impression as a tired SqL, finally picking on the wild hero(Erroll Flynn) to answer of the lives of young apprentices. David Niven makes an excellent part, in laugh and in heroism.

Rgds,
- box

MB_Avro_UK
06-14-2007, 04:14 PM
Hi all,

The subject matter of this film had great potential but it was wasted http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif.

US pilot Eddie Rickenbacker scored 26 kills in WW1.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eddie_Rickenbacker

In my opinion this film debases him and other US pilots who flew in this conflict.

It also debases the German Imperial Pilots. There is no record or evidence of a WW1 German pilot straffing a British,French or American pilot on the ground.

But what does Hollywood care about history?

Here's another link to the 'Blue Max' film made in 1968...nearly 40 years ago!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inNXvSUZ2zk&mode=related&search=

I suspect that CGI has degraded cinematic entertainment http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

gkll
06-14-2007, 05:18 PM
I didn't expect much, and wasn't disappointed. However on the plus side am I the only one who feels the makers made an attempt to show tactics? I remember seeing well executed barrel rolls, hammerheads, immelmanns (sic?, high and low yo yos, use of roll to defeat turn, I recollect some real effort to show the lot, pretty dressed up but there...

Of course it was all pretty much nonsense regardless, just i thought I detected some effort?

MrMojok
06-14-2007, 06:39 PM
No one has yet mentioned the heroic wounded American flyer barrel-rolling around the Evil Hun in order to line up a shot with his good arm from his trusty revolver.

Like Badsight said up above, movies in this genre aren't made for you (the dedicated history buff/flightsimmer). They are made for teenyboppers who cram popcorn and amphetamines in their face at the theater, in between answering calls on their cellphones.

I disagree with what someone said above about Lucas. Lucas' Redtails movie might be the best hope for some kind of realistic WWII aviation movie, simply because he will bankroll it all himself and then lease it to a film studio, like his last movies. He is one of probably only two people who have full creative control... 'final cut' if, you will. No studio head is going to be able to pressure him to put anything in there that he doesn't want.

Bash Star Wars all you want, but I think there is an excellent chance he would make a good one.

Krt_Bong
06-14-2007, 07:02 PM
Coming Soon:
http://redbaron-themovie.com/

leitmotiv
06-14-2007, 08:22 PM
DER ROTE BARON

Oct 2007

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0365675/

Badsight-
06-14-2007, 09:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by huggy87:
I have the feeling that if they actually made the movie that everyone here wanted to see, the only people who would actually go see it are here. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>yes , the movie "the Battle of Britian" has long boring combat sequences that break up the human interest dialogue that movies depend on

.

here is the movie "Pearl Harbour" as we would want it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G9mEIA_UMTQ

Badsight-
06-14-2007, 09:44 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MrMojok:
Lucas' Redtails movie might be the best hope for some kind of realistic WWII aviation movie, simply because he will bankroll it all himself and then lease it to a film studio, like his last movies. He is one of probably only two people who have full creative control... 'final cut' if, you will. No studio head is going to be able to pressure him to put anything in there that he doesn't want. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>thing is that not only is Lucas a huge WW2 air combat fan , but also the redtails has large scope for a good storyline

DD_doubletap
06-15-2007, 05:38 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Bash Star Wars all you want, but I think there is an excellent chance he would make a good one. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Okay, I will. The last 3 movies were abortions, and if Lucas is involved in the script or, God Forbid, in the directing, it will be a grotesque abortion.

I was a Lucas fan-boy up until he decided to side with his critics who said his movies were fluff and all light and noise, and made 3 films to prove just that. ******-******-******.

When Peter Jackson is done with Dambusters, let HIM do the Redtail movie.

Bearcat99
06-15-2007, 06:07 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by whiteladder:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">surpasses the bunk of that pathetic Hollywood teen film: </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have to defend our American cousins on this one, because Mephis Belle is actually a British film. I was produced by David Putnam and was financed, produced and filmed in Britain.

In fact I remeber a TV interview at the time with Putnam where he came in for a bit of stick for making War film that didn`t have British subject(the film was partially financed with film council money). He quite rightly pointed out that as America was the largest market and there was no demand for a "British" war movie it would have been a flop and lost money. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


LOL I'll have to remember that if The Few ever gets going agin with all of it's .... drama. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Yes Jasko there was but he flew for the French. He was Eugene Jacques Bullard
http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/2071032974

Could it possibly be that all the Fokkers were <span class="ev_code_RED">red</span> since Joe Public is so clueless about WW1 airplanes and this made for easy recognition of who was 'friend and foe'? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The Balack Swallow of Death.... Now that's a story that needs to be told. Guy runs away from home at 15... joins the circus, stows away on board a ship... boxes.... joins the foreign legion.... learns to fly.... and becomes a pilot... with kills....



<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MrMojok:
I disagree with what someone said above about Lucas. Lucas' Redtails movie might be the best hope for some kind of realistic WWII aviation movie, simply because he will bankroll it all himself and then lease it to a film studio, like his last movies. He is one of probably only two people who have full creative control... 'final cut' if, you will. No studio head is going to be able to pressure him to put anything in there that he doesn't want.

Bash Star Wars all you want, but I think there is an excellent chance he would make a good one. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree.... He is a huge Warbird fan as well. in fact I believe he owns a P-51. I also thought that StarWars.. alll of tyhem... when taken as one humongous story.... was not bad at all. The series has ebbbs and flows.. just like all the individual films.

ploughman
06-15-2007, 06:13 AM
Well we'll see with the Dam Busters if there's a market for a war movie about British bombers.

Puttnam's such a schmuck.

Jasko76
06-15-2007, 08:11 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Badsight-:

here is the movie "Pearl Harbour" as we would want it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's about everything that's worth watching compressed in four and a half minutes. Good video!

MrMojok
06-15-2007, 11:58 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DD_doubletap:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Bash Star Wars all you want, but I think there is an excellent chance he would make a good one. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Okay, I will. The last 3 movies were abortions, and if Lucas is involved in the script or, God Forbid, in the directing, it will be a grotesque abortion.

I was a Lucas fan-boy up until he decided to side with his critics who said his movies were fluff and all light and noise, and made 3 films to prove just that. ******-******-******.

When Peter Jackson is done with Dambusters, let HIM do the Redtail movie. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, there's no historical accuracy to go for in a science fiction movie. I believe with his enthusiasm for warbirds, he would be likely to make a good 'Redtails' movie.

As for Peter Jackson, no one has ever seen him make a serious, reality-oriented pic either. Not saying he wouldn't do a good job of it, but he has not committed one image to film in such a movie either. The thing about the girls in New Zealand doesn't count as a serious pic... with its clay figures coming to life and surreal tone, it's no more real-life than "Dead Alive" is.

And what happened to the stillborn "Dambusters" project anyway? It's not even listed as being in preproduction. Not one actor has been signed. Instead, he's working on a movie about a videogame. Figures.

ploughman
06-15-2007, 12:03 PM
Mojok, Dambusters is listed as an ongoing project for WETA in New Zealand.
Click. (http://www.wetaworkshop.co.nz/projects/filmography/film/thedambusters)

MrMojok
06-15-2007, 12:14 PM
Well, good. It looks like something is getting done after all. I was worried that it went to script heaven.

Sergio_101
06-15-2007, 05:44 PM
There are a gaggle of bad war movies made in the 1950s
by Howard Hughes and others.

If you can suffer the bad plots and worse acting
there is some excellent footage of extinct aircraft
and mid 50's birds that are not available anywhere else.

Prime example is the HORRIBLE "Strategic Air Command"
with Jimmy Stewart.
Excellent B-36 and B-47 footage.
Miserable special effects!

Sergio

Sergio_101
06-15-2007, 05:56 PM
Ok, what the hey, here's my list of favorite
"war" films with an avaition theme.
in order, favorite first.

12 O Clock High
Dambusters
Failsafe
Blue Max

How about not so war like themes...
More like good fun....

The Great Waldo Pepper
Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb ...

The original Memphie Belle is a war propaganda film,
but still excellent.

"Well, I've been to one World Faire, a picnic and a rodeo and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones."

Quote Slim Pickens in Dr. Strangelove

Sergio

Xiolablu3
06-15-2007, 06:55 PM
LMAO I found this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbIqEfk4hY0

The thing that made Aces high and the Blue MAx such great films is that they had a twisting turning plot where you are not sure what will happen next. The CHaracters are REAL characters with flaws and such.

The part in Aces HIgh where Mcdowell drives to the front to take 'his' German back to the Mess for a party, walkign right past all the wounded soldiers suffering hell in the trenches, just showed how ridiculous the whole setup was.

Likewise at the end of the Blue Max where he is betrayed, great writing, and there are lots of these interesting bits in both films, keeping the watcher captivated even when there is no action on the screen.

Flyboys was just totally predictable all the way through. It needed a good writer.

avimimus
06-16-2007, 07:11 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MB_Avro_UK:
The best WW1 Aviation movie IMO was 'The Blue Max'.

Best Regards,
MB_Avro. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Pssh http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif I'm a dawn patrol man myself.

Realistic attrition and real pilots flying the original immelman right on the deck.

two40
06-16-2007, 10:55 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MrMojok:

Like Badsight said up above, movies in this genre aren't made for you (the dedicated history buff/flightsimmer). They are made for teenyboppers who cram popcorn and amphetamines in their face at the theater, in between answering calls on their cellphones.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

quoted for truth.

--

you guys here will rip this movie up to shreds because a helmet was not the correct colour. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif the movie isn't gay, it's your expectations. they've made their money and entertained their target audience. don't be bitter about it but rather realise that movies like this will at least bring more members to your community.

Sergio_101
06-17-2007, 07:55 AM
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/0a/Hell%27sAngelsPoster.gif/150px-Hell%27sAngelsPoster.gif

It's really quite good.
It was only the second major film shot with sound!

Howard Hughes "HELLS ANGELS" (not 81)

Sergio

Jasko76
06-17-2007, 05:29 PM
What surprises me is how many of you think "Memphis Belle" sucks. I have the original WWII documentary and the movie, but I never try to compare the two. I know Belle's history quite well and her final mission was nowhere as eventfull as the movie tells us. But the flick is quite enjoyable, once you get through the first hour it's all about flying. I think they should have named the bomber and the movie something else and people wouldn't be half as critical about it.

leitmotiv
06-17-2007, 06:18 PM
Indeed, if they had titled it St. LOUIS SALLY I possibly could have suffered the achingly adolescent script---for me it is primarily the theft of the history of the best known Fort of the war. The screenwriters wanted to make a teen-friendly film since they buy the majority of tickets, thus, they turned 20-something aircrew into 14-yr-olds, which I found unwatchable. The best handbooks on the minds of the WWII-era U.S. males, both written by men who were in the war, are CATCH-22 and Fussell's WARTIME. Both emphasize one thing: the Americans were mindbendingly ***** and obsessed with sex. Those guys in MEMPHIS BELLE were like choirboys---I was born 7 years after VE Day in the U.S. and I found them unbelievable. No 20-something U.S. male I've ever met acted like those guys.

Korolov1986
06-17-2007, 06:35 PM
Everyone is entitled to their opinion of course, but I'm starting to wonder if we're talking about the same movie titled "Memphis Belle" here.

But I gotta agree with two40 here. If somebody did a WW2 aircraft movie that was incredibly realistic, you guys would hate it because of the wrong markings on a infantryman's helmet!

mattinen
06-18-2007, 04:23 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif

Plus the homo-erotism of Top Gun was just so monumental. Here is the condensed version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHklGtW3rwU

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Great link! Those navel aviators really know how to straighten up and fly right!
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif

MadMacgunner
07-17-2007, 04:35 PM
I┬┤ve read all posts...
And i only have to say...
Pearl harbor and flyboys are simply a piece of s**t.
An complete˝y nonsense of planes trying to bite the tail to others and making anoying imposible maneuvers.
The ┬┤human story┬┤,as someone said here are simply an stupid teen question.

Simply a piece of ****.
Sorry for my bad languaje....
But i wasted money in the cinema for both.

Vista Suerte y al toro.

Sturmtrooper
07-17-2007, 07:16 PM
Yes,it is.

leitmotiv
07-17-2007, 08:29 PM
Today I received an email from a friend who is not a very critical film viewer. He and his wife saw F last night. He thought it was stupid, idiotic, and grossly inferior to THE BLUE MAX, and he isn't even a WWI flying buff. Thought it was something for the children, not for adults.

Xiolablu3
07-17-2007, 08:42 PM
Watch Aces High and Blue Max instead.

Both unmissable.

zardozid
07-17-2007, 08:49 PM
Not the worst...But it is one of the most disappointing.
I had high hopes for the movie after I saw the previews on the big screen.
I was hoping that if the movie had a big enough showing at the box office we might see a few more "airwar" orientated films...and maybe one of them would be exceptional...

But it sucked...

leitmotiv
07-17-2007, 09:22 PM
When I saw the trailer with the guy crashing his plane into the envelope of a zep and running along the envelope as it blew up behind him, I thought---this is on LSD. NO WAY. I left this kind of idiocy behind when I was eight years old.

Alloy007P
07-17-2007, 09:46 PM
It's most certainly not the worst movie ever

LStarosta
07-17-2007, 09:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
When I saw the trailer with the guy crashing his plane into the envelope of a zep and running along the envelope as it blew up behind him, I thought---this is on LSD. NO WAY. I left this kind of idiocy behind when I was eight years old. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You dropped acid when you were 8?

leitmotiv
07-17-2007, 10:10 PM
No, when I was six weeks old. I was a head starter. Timothy Leary was my Nanny. Let me be absolutely clear, I quit irresponsibly crashing airplanes into zeppelins when I was eight.

Grand_Armee
07-17-2007, 11:22 PM
The problem with almost all modern war-movies is that they are trying to make them interesting to women as well.

If I and my wife sit through a war movie and she says "I liked it" I know it's screwed.

My list of ways to screw up a war movie:

1. THE BIGGEE: Put romance in it that endures for more than one percent of the entire film.
2. Put women in it with lines longer than: "Hey GI, me love you long time."
3. Put women in it who are more than extras either watching the army march past, or fleeing as refugees.

Don't get me wrong...I love women...but the scenes they are in detract from the movie due to the fact that you don't often see women in combat scenes.

4. Make the bad-guys either really: evil, stupid, clumsy, or blundering.
5. Make the good guys SO good that you can't believe they don't have a huge S on their chests and wear their underwear on the outside.

My selection of best war movies because of a small "W" factor.

1. Das Boot: A stripper who unexpectedly takes part in a wet-dress contest, and a few chicks to welcome the sub home.

2. Gettysburg: They watch the barefoot Confederates march through their town...without a peep, comment, or tiny piece of feminine wisdom....then disappear for the rest of the movie.

3. Cross of Iron: OK...a bit more W-factor here. But the scenes were either short, or filled with aggro, gun-toting, Kommie chicks.

We're not going to see a decent air-combat movie until CGI is married up to somebody who wants to do something truly epic about air combat. Until then, we'll be stuck with schlock that's created to get whatever money it can from a broad spectrum of people.

leitmotiv
07-17-2007, 11:43 PM
Well put, GA. I was forced to bail out on GETTYSBURG because my new goilfriend's ears got blown out by a minor artillery skirmish which just got me warmed up. I was practically weeping inside. "Do I mind---On nooooooo, of course not" (AGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH) (What you will do for hoggins, you weaseling, spineless %%#!!@@%%&&##!!!!!!). On top of that it was the London premiere of G at the NFT and I had paid big money for the tickets. Oh the agony.

What I love about CGI is that someday somebody will do the Battle of Jutland and it will blow the whole world's mind. Until CGI it was impossible.

Doolittle81
07-17-2007, 11:53 PM
Since this thread is way off track anyway, I suggest that you download or stream the movie
"Faith, Hope, and Charity" (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/65710358/m/2261004765/p/1)

I'd like to see how you think it compares to the Hollywood movies......

Please post your comments and reviews in the same UBI Movie-Makers Forum/Thread

Thanks.

UnknownTarget
07-18-2007, 01:54 AM
I saw Flyboys, I thought it was pretty bad. The CGI was awful - it mostly consisted of the aircraft flying in straight lines - watch the movie closely, you'll see most of the animation is the aircraft moving in a straight line from A to B, while doing a roll in between or something. The combat was slipshod - there was no defining, well, anything in it. Each encounter was ten second snap shots of twenty characters that we didn't really care about - the main character got so little screen time during the fight scenes that he became a secondary character.

As for the rest of the movie, well, the acting was poor. The plot was predictable and cliche', and the whole love story amounted to exactly nothing.

People think that no one makes aviation movies anymore because no one wants to see them - that's not true. The unfortunate truth is that most aviation movies just suck.

zardozid
07-18-2007, 02:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Posted Wed July 18 2007 00:54 Hide Post
I saw Flyboys, I thought it was pretty bad. The CGI was awful - it mostly consisted of the aircraft flying in straight lines - watch the movie closely, you'll see most of the animation is the aircraft moving in a straight line from A to B, while doing a roll in between or something. The combat was slipshod - there was no defining, well, anything in it. Each encounter was ten second snap shots of twenty characters that we didn't really care about - the main character got so little screen time during the fight scenes that he became a secondary character.

As for the rest of the movie, well, the acting was poor. The plot was predictable and cliche', and the whole love story amounted to exactly nothing.

People think that no one makes aviation movies anymore because no one wants to see them - that's not true. The unfortunate truth is that most aviation movies just suck. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't know the true story here...BUT:

After watching the movie it seems like they may have started out with the intentions of making a decent "air combat WW1 movie", but by the time the "Hollywood suits" got done with it, it was so watered down and predictable that it fell limp...I can just hear their voices, "whats happening their? Make it simpler... No one is going to understand THAT! Where are the explosions? We need a love story...Where is the love interest? We need something for the lady's..."

HuninMunin
07-18-2007, 07:41 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MrMojok:
No one has yet mentioned the heroic wounded American flyer barrel-rolling around the Evil Hun in order to line up a shot with his good arm from his trusty revolver.

Like Badsight said up above, movies in this genre aren't made for you (the dedicated history buff/flightsimmer). They are made for teenyboppers who cram popcorn and amphetamines in their face at the theater, in between answering calls on their cellphones.

I disagree with what someone said above about Lucas. Lucas' Redtails movie might be the best hope for some kind of realistic WWII aviation movie, simply because he will bankroll it all himself and then lease it to a film studio, like his last movies. He is one of probably only two people who have full creative control... 'final cut' if, you will. No studio head is going to be able to pressure him to put anything in there that he doesn't want.

Bash Star Wars all you want, but I think there is an excellent chance he would make a good one. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

100

p-11.cAce
07-18-2007, 08:04 AM
A truly great film today is only going to come from someone who, as Mrmojok pointed, can bankroll it entirely and avoid the idiots who water it down for the lowest common denominator. Munich, for example, was not a simple film. It had complex characters and a fairly sophisticated storyline - but imho it was a great film. Had it been made in the normal hollywood style it would have starred brad pitt and looked like commando.

LStarosta
07-18-2007, 09:13 AM
Star Wars rawks.

F*ck you, trekkies.

Sillius_Sodus
07-18-2007, 01:10 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HuninMunin:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MrMojok:
No one has yet mentioned the heroic wounded American flyer barrel-rolling around the Evil Hun in order to line up a shot with his good arm from his trusty revolver.

Like Badsight said up above, movies in this genre aren't made for you (the dedicated history buff/flightsimmer). They are made for teenyboppers who cram popcorn and amphetamines in their face at the theater, in between answering calls on their cellphones.

I disagree with what someone said above about Lucas. Lucas' Redtails movie might be the best hope for some kind of realistic WWII aviation movie, simply because he will bankroll it all himself and then lease it to a film studio, like his last movies. He is one of probably only two people who have full creative control... 'final cut' if, you will. No studio head is going to be able to pressure him to put anything in there that he doesn't want.

Bash Star Wars all you want, but I think there is an excellent chance he would make a good one. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

100 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I can see it now, Yoda in a leather flying helmet: "Yessss, Boom and Zoomers you shall be, avoid turning with a Zero you shall, yesss. I feel a disturbance in the Force, from three o'clock high the bandits are attacking, yessss"

Our Hero Luke at a mission briefing: "Escort to Berlin? But I was going into London with my friends to get some power converters!"

Sand people in Afrika Korps uniforms...

Then of course Darth in his 262 on the tail of the hero's P-51: "Luke, I am your wingman" Noooooooo! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Good hunting,
Sillius_Sodus

RocketDog
07-18-2007, 01:40 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by whiteladder:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">surpasses the bunk of that pathetic Hollywood teen film: </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have to defend our American cousins on this one, because Mephis Belle is actually a British film. I was produced by David Putnam and was financed, produced and filmed in Britain.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I remember reading an interview at the time in which Putnam said he had originally wanted to make a film of Len Deighton's book "Bomber", about a Lancaster crew and their German opposition. However, the need to make a film that would appeal to the US market meant he had to go for the Memphis Belle instead. I'm not sure what a film of Bomber would have been like. The book is unrelentingly bleak and the part of the story that takes place on the ground in Germany is pretty horrific. If he'd followed the book it would have been a very different film without much of a positive message.

Cheers,

RocketDog.

BOA_Allmenroder
07-18-2007, 01:42 PM
Von Richtofen and Brown was probably the worst WW1 film ever made.

The Blue Max is a great movie, but differs significantly from the book: Stachel is much, much darker/more evil in the book; and Willie Von Klugelmann doesn't die flying under a bridge.

Twelve O'Clock high, although it has limited flying scenes, is one of my favorites. It shows the challenges faced by the 1942/early 43 US Air Corps leadership.

As for one posters comment that there is no evidence of German pilots strafing allied aircrew: that's just plain factually incorrect.

Both Von Richtofen and Voss were noted strafers: they did this in order to prevent the downed aircrews from destroying/setting their aircraft on fire after being forced down.

There is plenty of periodic/eyewitness testimony to this regard.

Jynski
07-18-2007, 07:57 PM
No one mentioned FIREBIRDS. Great AH-64 footage but one of the worst Nicholas Cage and Tommy Lee Jones films ever. The plot and dialoge sucked.

Jynski
07-18-2007, 07:59 PM
A good film is "A Gathering of Eagles" with Rock Hudson. A good SAC film. I cut my teeth in SAC in the later years but could relate to everything in the film.