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EAGLE_34_WO
02-08-2005, 12:23 PM
So I've had this game about 3 weeks now and have learned a lot. I do pretty well verses AI fighters set to veteran. When I go on HL I feel like I've never played this game before. I always get outturned, manuevered, and outran. I only manage to get kills when I jump in a DF and get on someones 6 while they are attacking someone else. 1 on 1 I'm a dead man everytime. I guess, I'm asking how long it took for you all to go from noob pilot to a decent fighter that contributes to the team(other than acting like bait for others lol).

EAGLE_34_WO
02-08-2005, 12:23 PM
So I've had this game about 3 weeks now and have learned a lot. I do pretty well verses AI fighters set to veteran. When I go on HL I feel like I've never played this game before. I always get outturned, manuevered, and outran. I only manage to get kills when I jump in a DF and get on someones 6 while they are attacking someone else. 1 on 1 I'm a dead man everytime. I guess, I'm asking how long it took for you all to go from noob pilot to a decent fighter that contributes to the team(other than acting like bait for others lol).

nickdanger3
02-08-2005, 12:26 PM
This summer will be two years of playing a lot more than I'd like to admit.

Only in the last few months have I stopped COMPLETELY embarrassing myself online.

I played for 6 months before I went online and had that cold clear water splashed on my face.

I takes a LOOOOOOOONNNNGGGGGG time. Or you have to already be a fighter pilot IRL.

StellarRat
02-08-2005, 01:14 PM
Took me about a month of playing every night and weekends to actually start being decent online.

My biggest mistakes:

Not keeping my speed up (too much manuevering.)

Not flying high enough (stay above 3000m when not engaged.) If you at 3000 or higher you can escape by diving or trade altitude for speed when needed. When you're low the options are quite limited.

And not looking behind me enough.

If you can avoid these three mistake you'll probably be better off than 90% of the Noobs out there.

You're probably lousy at shooting anyone that you aren't directly behind, right? Your deflection shooting skills will develop over time. As a Noob just remember to lead the target by a lot more than you think is needed and get really close before you shoot. Make sure the target fills your sight ring even if you're right behind them. That's 100m away for fighter targets.

EAGLE_34_WO
02-08-2005, 01:28 PM
Those all sound like mistakes I make. I start at 3000M but then tend to lose alt very quickly when engaging an enemy. I have the most trouble with the deflection shooting. I start to turn into an enemy but quickly lose sight of him in my cockpit. I then straighten back out abit to bring him back in my sights and then I don't have the shot lol. I see myself getting shot down a lot more before I due any real damage lol.

carguy_
02-08-2005, 01:43 PM
Took me two months to get hold of controls,then maybe a year to handle the FM.Needless to say I mean Me109 and partly FW190 FM.In those machines I`m good,all other make me average though many fighters behave similary to those I fly.

Back when I was a n00b I entered online wars which was a shock.I did get nice kills but my lifespan wouldn`t exceed 3 missions.

I`ve been flying since Feb 2002 and think I got Me109 pretty much covered though my gun nery still stinks(9% accuracy).

I recommend thinking while flying.Many times I think "WTF am I doing?!".You`ll be surviving more sorties that way.

madsarmy
02-08-2005, 02:48 PM
If you were anything like me you thought you were a bit of an Ace when you€ve been playing offline only. I remember the first time I went online. I thought right then come get it suckers! off I went looking for trouble. Man did I get my ego & pride bashed.http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/cry.gif

It takes a long time to hold your own online but stick with it. The more time you fly the more you will get to enjoy it. Try not to feel intimidated or despondent which is not easy to do when you first start. If you find a good server with a good crowd on it you will get all the help & tips you need. Most will ask you to tag along with them.

Don€t be frightened to ask for help or tips &
most of all enjoy yourself because that€s what it€s all about.

Airmail109
02-08-2005, 02:51 PM
http://www.fatwillie.net/cpg/albums/userpics/10006/get_the_newbie.jpg

Only kidding http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

nickdanger3
02-08-2005, 03:01 PM
The thing is, there is just so much to learn. The different strengths and weaknesses of all the planes, the flying styles of the pilots online, deflection shooting, teamwork, energy management, defensive moves. It takes time.

I'd suggest at least completing one of the offline campaigns, just to get a firm grounding. No turning off spins, or unlimited ammo either http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif - keep it mostly legit.

EAGLE_34_WO
02-08-2005, 03:25 PM
Thanks for the replies fellas. I have picked the BF-109 and P-51 to dedicate my time to. I have heard many times on here, it's best to pick a couple planes and learn them in and out. Then pick a couple more down the road. It's nice to know others have been shot down as many times as I have when first getting the game!

LuckyBoy1
02-08-2005, 03:44 PM
See this link for all your needs...

http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/

-HH-Quazi
02-08-2005, 03:52 PM
I am going on a year and a half of playing/flying this sim. I am just now getting to where I can consider myself decent at best. Some learn more quickly than others. I have been lucky enough to have a squadmate with a lot of knowledge and experience that has mentoring me. I'd be glad to share his name, but I don't think he would want me to. Most everyone knows him around here anyway and he is not one to toot his own horn when it comes to his DF'ing abilities.

TgD Thunderbolt56
02-08-2005, 03:53 PM
Do you have a mic and speakers/headset? If so, then make sure to grab the TeamSpeak client software ( http://www.goteamspeak.com/news.php ). Once configured, you can find a number of servers that have "public" channels for the pilots on their servers (i.e. greatergreen, Warclouds, flygflottilj16, etc,...) Even if you don't talk much, you can listen to what's going on and possibly understand better how things develope.


TB

FI_Willie
02-08-2005, 05:33 PM
Try looking around here as well. Lot's of good info from basic to advanced ACM.
http://www.il2flying.com/component/option,com_frontpage/Itemid,1/

JG7_Rall
02-08-2005, 05:40 PM
Just stick with it bud, and don't give up when you get frustrated. It's a hard game, and it sounds like you're doing really well considering you've had the game for 3 weeks. I've been flying for a bit more than a year and a half and am still learning stuff everyday, and a lot of times have to re-learn things as I either fly a new plane or lose focus of how I'm fighting when I get greedy for kills. Don't give up, offline practice is great too for shooting but people fly a lot smarter, so I'd use it just for shooting. Good luck!

VF-29_Sandman
02-08-2005, 07:53 PM
this is nothing like cfs2/3 where u can get away with stayin low to the deck and be able to do a quick landing for a new plane/points. here, u have to stay high. a minumum of 3000 meters. its just that, some planes wont 'wake up' until their at this height, other planes dont care much for high alt unless u adjust the fuel mix/supercharger.

1000 meters is only 3,280 feet. in fb, that's basically 'mowin the grass'. ur suicidal if u insist on being this low in a fighter; especially in corsair's, hell/wildcats, jugs, 38's, or 190's. these are heavy planes, and u cant expect to get much speed out of them in a dive at only this height.

if u can afford it, get track ir. its 1 thing that's as essential as having a good joystick. lose sight, and u lose the fight. next page.

tactics....what tactics are u using for say....corsair?
if ur tryin to do the 'cfs2 way', ur gonna get murdered. this plane should be no lower than 10,000' (3,048 meters), and ur still in stage1 supercharger. stage2 is usually kicked in at roughly 4000 meters (13,123'). if u try to yank-n-bank like those did in cfs2, soon u'll be a skydiver minus 1 plane. its a zoom and boomer period. same for p-38. u try to turn a p-38 against 95% of other planes, u die. lone-wolf, u die. insist on chasing a bogey to their home base...u die from aaa fire if fighters dont get u first.

if u want to really get better, hang out where the big guns live. warclouds, greatergreen, etc. here wingmanship and proper tactics will keep u alive. a heavy price will be paid if u lone-wolf it there. stay out of the 'quake' df servers; aka, no-cockpit view. the most fun servers have locked cockpit/externals off. here's where u can get the most out of ur ride. u wont be able to do that in the 'air quake' rooms.

everything is in metric unless u map a key to toggle speedbar to imperial. .03 is 300 meters...ur still not close enough to get a quick kill unless ur good enough in gunnery. the rule of 'get close, then get closer' applies here. if their wings dont cover the .50 cal gunsite, ur still out of range. wait till it is, and u'll always get hits. protect ur wingman and they will protect u. cut in front of a teammate goin after their target is beggin to get shot down by friendly fire.

Atomic_Marten
02-08-2005, 08:08 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by EAGLE_34_WO:
So I've had this game about 3 weeks now and have learned a lot. I do pretty well verses AI fighters set to veteran. When I go on HL I feel like I've never played this game before. I always get outturned, manuevered, and outran. I only manage to get kills when I jump in a DF and get on someones 6 while they are attacking someone else. 1 on 1 I'm a dead man everytime. I guess, I'm asking how long it took for you all to go from noob pilot to a decent fighter that contributes to the team(other than acting like bait for others lol). <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think that is the main reason why this sim is still so great after all this time. You can not be 'instant ace'. You have to spen some time adjusting to all aspects of the game. Also sticking with one fighter plane type should help.

About your frustration; do not be frustrated; imagine situation: how angry can man be if he plays game for few years and here comes a newcomer who plays it for three weeks and regularly shots him down? I would call *that* a frustration.http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Consider buying decent joystick, it would help you a lot.

You say 'one on one you are dead'. That may be true but not neccesarily if you put some effort in your understanding physics model of the aircraft in the game. Some a/c's can't turn with opponents agile fighter, and naturally because you are new, you can't resist your instinct to turn with him in order to get clear shot from 6 o clock. Maybe there lies your mistake maybe not.

In any case I can reccomend you that you stick to one fighter plane type (for example Spit Bf109 or F4U) and learn how to properly fly it (for beggining take off and landing -- you must be able to do this automatically otherwise all your kills online would not count because you have to land safely) http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif. Also with specific plane comes specific tactics, some of the tactics are universal can be applied to all fighter planes but some of the planes requires special tactics (most famous of these IMO are the FW190s&P47s BnZ). You can find many suggestions around here about specific plane tactics and how to exploit opponents mistakes etc etc. And yes. Practice a lot. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Atomic_Marten
02-08-2005, 08:15 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by carguy_:
I recommend thinking while flying.Many times I think "WTF am I doing?!".You`ll be surviving more sorties that way. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is the one of the best suggestions lately. I have play this game since demo days, and I still sometimes have to ask myself: D@mn!?! What are you doing? (I have used citation from my IL2 rear gunner http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif)

Zatorski
02-08-2005, 08:20 PM
I'll give you and a lot of other experienced people one piece of advice.
If you have a twist joystick, get used to relaxing your grip, even if you are fighting for your life. All too often I find myself frantically trying to shake someone or shoot someone and I am flying with my joystick twisted in one direction. That is full rudder and it doesn't help your flying.

EAGLE_34_WO
02-08-2005, 09:05 PM
Thanks for the replies again guys. I just got 3 kills and was shot down about 12 times lol. It's funny how a game can get your heart racing so much. As soon as I get in range my heart races lol. I have one more question. I have been messing with the convergences* and can't seem to find the number that's right for me. What kind of conv. numbers are you guys punching in? Is it just a preference thing, or is their a good number to stick to?

WTE_Galway
02-08-2005, 09:45 PM
convergence is a personal preference thing

it depends a lot on how close you lke to shoot, how much deflection shooting you do and partly what sort of target you are shooting at

with convergence always rememeber it is vertical as well as horizontal so if you set the convergence to lets say 200 metres and you shoot from 300 you will need to aim high or your shot will drop under the target

a good way of practicing deflection shooting offline is to use QMB and set the sppped to half or slower until you get it right then bring the speed up again to normal or even double

if you can dogfight ace AI offline at double speed you are getting pretty good http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

dazza9806482
02-09-2005, 03:31 AM
Dont be disheartened , ive had a love/hate relationship with FB for a year now. I love it, it hates me!

sometimes u will fly like ur the greatest ace, everything will go well, u will score a few kills and have a few lucky escapes.

mostly u will make mistakes and never even see a bandit until u see your plane in a cloud of debris. even worse, for me is having a clear firing solution and repeatedly, doggedly, missing.

i set up a direct IP connect game for my mate last night, he is a TOTAL novice, so i let him practice shooting me as a target drone, before a few very light dogfights.

he was hooked, i think i have a convert, but the one thing he noticed is that the game is VERY unforgiving. If you think u are taking a chance, u are and u will die. it doesnt reward risks, like real life, and unlike many other games. that is its beauty...

VF-29_Sandman
02-09-2005, 09:38 AM
convergance range is also in metric. convergance is a point in space where both streams of fire from the wing guns come together to a point, and anything that is caught in that fire at convergance point is turned into coleslaw.

alot of the usaf/marine corps used anywhere from 300-1000 feet. converted from imperial, 300 feet ='s 91.44 meters. unfortunatly, the minumum range it will allow is 100 meters...but that is just 329 feet. at this range in the p-38/47/40/51, the bandit's wings will overlap the gunsite circle. he's a dead man if ur convergance is at 100 meters. but if he's a bit farther than this, ur shells will start to spread out like a shotgun, and be rather ineffective at longer range deflections and u wont get anywhere tryin to kill that whirlblewind tank either.

at 1000 feet, ur convergance would need to be at 304.8 meters. and ur fighter will close a gap at 1000' on a bomber in a zoom-n-boom in a very big hurry.

in the days of v 1.22, i used a conv of 190 meters, and back then, the 50 cals would make mincemeat out of everything in the sky.
some prefer a 'mid-range' conv. still capable of pingin at slightly long range, but in a snapshot, their devastating. 225 meters is a bit shy of 739 feet.

wing guns will fire alot differently than nose guns. in p-38's, ur capable of puttin rounds on target from 750 meters...if u lead em properly. at that range, ur lookin at almost 2,460 feet. u might tag a fighter at this range that's near the top of a loop, but unless ur a good shot, u might miss 1 on a deflection. u wont be able to hit anything at that range with wing guns hard enough to flame em tho.

JG52MadAdler
02-10-2005, 01:24 AM
Join a squad and have buds to cover your 6.
You can learn allot about tactics when your on coms and are able to talk to M8s in real time.
When it comes to learning solo, plan on being cannon fodder for some time.

Good Luck!

jurinko
02-10-2005, 03:11 AM
depend on the fighting style you prefer, choose the planes. Zero or Spitfire for turnfights, or heavy and fast planes like Fw 190, P-47 or P-38 for hit-and-run, or something between - Bf 109, P-40..
I fly IL-2 3 years and only now I am self-confident enough. The biggest experience is - enter the fight only in advantage, be good in shooting, decide when it is time to leave the fight. Usually my planes are faster and worse maneuvring than the opposite site, so I can at least run away if in troubles. To get the kills it takes some time, but I like it that way.

Crouchy Eagle
02-10-2005, 08:10 AM
Hi,

Is there an option that I can join a dogfight session as an observer? I believe that Lock-On offers this option. I have played Combat FS offline for long time (FS2000, Flanker 1.5 thru 2.5, LockOn and CFS2 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/1072.gif ). I did a lot of home works with this game (IL-2's FB&PF): practice, practice and then practice again. Reading Essestials, browsing Forums, watching tutorial movies and still fly like a baby begins to walk. It is very encouraging to know from you guys that it will take long time to get a License To Kill Without Being Killed. I'm planning to go Online and learn how Run Away and Survive firts. BTW, can you recommend a good (?) joystick? I have a Thrustmaster TopGun Afterburner.

Bearcat99
02-10-2005, 08:19 AM
Hmmmmm frustrated Noob... is there any other kind when it comes to this sim and online action..... LOL.. I still have my moments.... thats a part of the sims charm.. it is very challenging... Plus the run of the mill DF server unless you pop into Ivans or WC is just too.... solitaire..although from what I am hearing things are changing.... I perefer coops myself....

EAGLE_34_WO
02-10-2005, 09:05 AM
Things have gotten much better concerning my accuracy. I have switched my conv settings to 200 for machine guns and 150 for cannons. While I Don't shoot as far away now, my accuracy up close has changed dramatically! I find myself trying to avoid those headon first passes now. It's so tempting, but I usually get ripped apart by a KI-84 or something else with high firepower.