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XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:15 PM
I know how we can test our different opinions. You fly your BF-109 F4 and I'll fly my P-39 N1. We'll go best of 5. After that we'll swap planes, you in the P-39 N1 and me in the BF-109 F4, then we'll go another best of 5. We'll get a good idea of which plane was easier to get kills in and which plane is the more n00bish one and you may actually realize that all your biased statistics have left out one very important factor, the pilot.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


<center>http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars/bp_geminiCombined.gif

<center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Warning: My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">If you treasure your lack of humor please refrain from reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Heaven Forbid.</table style></center>
<table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
<font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my P-39</font></font> </table style>
/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
<table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)"> www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:15 PM
I know how we can test our different opinions. You fly your BF-109 F4 and I'll fly my P-39 N1. We'll go best of 5. After that we'll swap planes, you in the P-39 N1 and me in the BF-109 F4, then we'll go another best of 5. We'll get a good idea of which plane was easier to get kills in and which plane is the more n00bish one and you may actually realize that all your biased statistics have left out one very important factor, the pilot.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


<center>http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars/bp_geminiCombined.gif

<center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Warning: My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">If you treasure your lack of humor please refrain from reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Heaven Forbid.</table style></center>
<table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
<font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my P-39</font></font> </table style>
/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
<table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)"> www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:18 PM
Leave externals on, so I can watch.

Da Buzz
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
<center>
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto1/anderson3.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:21 PM
Last I heard, he still did not have FB./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif He did say he was going get it sometime.

http://www.stenbergaa.com/stenberg/crandall-stormclouds2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:23 PM
He has it now.

Da Buzz
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
<center>
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto1/anderson3.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:24 PM
And I'll join with my I-16 and blow ya both out of the sky

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:25 PM
BuzzU wrote:
- Leave externals on, so I can watch.



Full Real. (Internal PL and Speed bar if he wants)
I'll record a track.





<center>http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars/bp_geminiCombined.gif

<center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Warning: My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">If you treasure your lack of humor please refrain from reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Heaven Forbid.</table style></center>
<table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
<font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my P-39</font></font> </table style>
/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
<table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)"> www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:27 PM
BpGemini wrote:
- I know how we can test our different opinions. You
- fly your BF-109 F4 and I'll fly my P-39 N1. We'll go
- best of 5. After that we'll swap planes, you in the
- P-39 N1 and me in the BF-109 F4, then we'll go
- another best of 5. We'll get a good idea of which
- plane was easier to get kills in and which plane is
- the more n00bish one and you may actually realize
- that all your biased statistics have left out one
- very important factor, the pilot.


Though completely outside the scope of my complaints I'll accept this. But results of this engagement will not reflect the problems of FM, just merely the experience of the pilots. I have the game for only 2 weeks, and almost no experience online. But I gladly fly against you on a default small map with padlock and map icons on.


I said before combat flight is not test flight. I can show tracks in which P-39 can easily outturn F4 which should never happen.

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:27 PM
Intruder_GP wrote:
- And I'll join with my I-16 and blow ya both out of the sky



Hey you're more than welcome to come to my Saturday server.
I-16s are located at the red base. Have a ball.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif



<center>http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars/bp_geminiCombined.gif

<center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Warning: My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">If you treasure your lack of humor please refrain from reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Heaven Forbid.</table style></center>
<table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
<font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my P-39</font></font> </table style>
/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
<table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)"> www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:30 PM
Problem is I have the patch 08 installed. Do you?

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:35 PM
You didn't back up your game?

Da Buzz
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
<center>
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto1/anderson3.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:37 PM
BuzzU wrote:
- You didn't back up your game?


I backed up only the overwritten files, but in big hurry. I don't know if I can restore it correctly in a short time, but I can try if necessary.

Anyway I got only 45 minutes to one hour left. Let's take advantage of it.

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:37 PM
Huckebein_FW wrote:
- Though completely outside the scope of my complaints
- I'll accept this. But results of this engagement
- will not reflect the problems of FM, just merely the
- experience of the pilots. I have the game for only 2
- weeks, and almost no experience online. But I gladly
- fly against you on a default small map with padlock
- and map icons on.
-
-
- I said before combat flight is not test flight. I
- can show tracks in which P-39 can easily outturn F4
- which should never happen.


Great! I fly at Hyperlobby and I have a broadband connection. I will make a quick map that includes only the P-39 N1 version and the BF-109 F4. No base AAA or anything. Once someone is killed the other will bail out and we will take off at the same time. Sound good? I can host tonight (in about 4 hours) after I put my son to bed.

Internal Pad Locking sounds good to me, but map icons on? You mean icons that show where each other are located at all times. Isn't that kind of cheap? How about we just agree to meet over a city or something? If one of us loses track of the other after we meet then it's their problem. How's this sound?




<center>http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars/bp_geminiCombined.gif

<center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Warning: My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">If you treasure your lack of humor please refrain from reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Heaven Forbid.</table style></center>
<table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
<font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my P-39</font></font> </table style>
/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
<table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)"> www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:39 PM
Huckebein_FW wrote:
- Problem is I have the patch 08 installed. Do you?


No I don't. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif
We'll have to postpone until the 31st I guess.




<center>http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars/bp_geminiCombined.gif

<center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Warning: My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">If you treasure your lack of humor please refrain from reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Heaven Forbid.</table style></center>
<table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
<font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my P-39</font></font> </table style>
/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
<table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)"> www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:40 PM
BpGemini wrote:
- Huckebein_FW wrote:
-- Though completely outside the scope of my complaints
-- I'll accept this. But results of this engagement
-- will not reflect the problems of FM, just merely the
-- experience of the pilots. I have the game for only 2
-- weeks, and almost no experience online. But I gladly
-- fly against you on a default small map with padlock
-- and map icons on.
--
--
-- I said before combat flight is not test flight. I
-- can show tracks in which P-39 can easily outturn F4
-- which should never happen.
-
-
- Great! I fly at Hyperlobby and I have a broadband
- connection. I will make a quick map that includes
- only the P-39 N1 version and the BF-109 F4. No base
- AAA or anything. Once someone is killed the other
- will bail out and we will take off at the same time.
- Sound good? I can host tonight (in about 4 hours)
- after I put my son to bed.
-
- Internal Pad Locking sounds good to me, but map
- icons on? You mean icons that show where each other
- are located at all times. Isn't that kind of cheap?
- How about we just agree to meet over a city or
- something? If one of us loses track of the other
- after we meet then it's their problem. How's this
- sound?


Gem why not right now on a default map? I can host, I'm on broadband too. Tonight I need a good sleep.

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:41 PM
Huckebein_FW wrote:
- BuzzU wrote:
-- You didn't back up your game?
-
-
- I backed up only the overwritten files, but in big
- hurry. I don't know if I can restore it correctly in
- a short time, but I can try if necessary.
-
- Anyway I got only 45 minutes to one hour left. Let's
- take advantage of it.



So can you fly or not?
No leaked patch.



<center>http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars/bp_geminiCombined.gif

<center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Warning: My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">If you treasure your lack of humor please refrain from reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Heaven Forbid.</table style></center>
<table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
<font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my P-39</font></font> </table style>
/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
<table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)"> www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:43 PM
BpGemini wrote:
- Huckebein_FW wrote:
-- Though completely outside the scope of my complaints
-- I'll accept this. But results of this engagement
-- will not reflect the problems of FM, just merely the
-- experience of the pilots. I have the game for only 2
-- weeks, and almost no experience online. But I gladly
-- fly against you on a default small map with padlock
-- and map icons on.
--
--
-- I said before combat flight is not test flight. I
-- can show tracks in which P-39 can easily outturn F4
-- which should never happen.
-
-
- Great! I fly at Hyperlobby and I have a broadband
- connection. I will make a quick map that includes
- only the P-39 N1 version and the BF-109 F4. No base
- AAA or anything. Once someone is killed the other
- will bail out and we will take off at the same time.
- Sound good? I can host tonight (in about 4 hours)
- after I put my son to bed.
-
- Internal Pad Locking sounds good to me, but map
- icons on? You mean icons that show where each other
- are located at all times. Isn't that kind of cheap?
- How about we just agree to meet over a city or
- something? If one of us loses track of the other
- after we meet then it's their problem. How's this
- sound?
-
Hey Gemini.... can I join today and what do you mean by Hyperlobby never flown on that server...how do I get there? do I need to subscribe?
-
-
-
-
- <center><img
- src="http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars
- /bp_geminiCombined.gif">
-
- <center><table
- style="filter:glow(color=red,strength=1)">Warning:
- My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick
- crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center>
- <center><table
- style="filter:glow(color=red,strength=1)">If you
- treasure your lack of humor please refrain from
- reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table
- style></center> <center><table
- style="filter:glow(color=red,strength=1)">Heaven
- Forbid.</table style></center>
- <table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
- <font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my
- P-39</font></font> </table style>
- /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
- <table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)">
- www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>
-

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:43 PM
Huckebein_FW wrote:
- Gem why not right now on a default map? I can host,
- I'm on broadband too. Tonight I need a good sleep.



I'm at work.
I wont be home for 2 hours.
When I get home I need to watch my 2-year old son til he goes to bed at 8-8:30.
It's the only time I can fly tonight.




<center>http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars/bp_geminiCombined.gif

<center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Warning: My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">If you treasure your lack of humor please refrain from reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Heaven Forbid.</table style></center>
<table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
<font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my P-39</font></font> </table style>
/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
<table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)"> www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:43 PM
BpGemini wrote:
-
- Huckebein_FW wrote:
-- BuzzU wrote:
--- You didn't back up your game?
--
--
-- I backed up only the overwritten files, but in big
-- hurry. I don't know if I can restore it correctly in
-- a short time, but I can try if necessary.
--
-- Anyway I got only 45 minutes to one hour left. Let's
-- take advantage of it.
-
-
-
- So can you fly or not?
- No leaked patch.



I think I can. I'll tell in 5 minutes if I can run the game without patch.

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:45 PM
This is a gudge match. Nobody else should be there. A track will show the results.

Da Buzz
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
<center>
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto1/anderson3.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:47 PM
BpGemini wrote:
-
- Huckebein_FW wrote:
-- Gem why not right now on a default map? I can host,
-- I'm on broadband too. Tonight I need a good sleep.
-
-
-
- I'm at work.
- I wont be home for 2 hours.
- When I get home I need to watch my 2-year old son
- til he goes to bed at 8-8:30.
- It's the only time I can fly tonight.


Eh, ok. I usually enter online only in the morning, and rarely in the night. Maybe we'll meet sometime.

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:47 PM
Intruder_GP wrote:
- Hey Gemini.... can I join today and what do you mean
- by Hyperlobby never flown on that server...how do I
- get there? do I need to subscribe?



Nope it's free.
http://hyperfighter.jinak.cz/

I may still host a server tonight.
I'll run my 3-team map if I do.
I'll be listed as BlitzPig_Gemini.





<center>http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars/bp_geminiCombined.gif

<center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Warning: My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">If you treasure your lack of humor please refrain from reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Heaven Forbid.</table style></center>
<table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
<font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my P-39</font></font> </table style>
/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
<table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)"> www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:48 PM
Huck,

I'm sure you can't put the final patch over your beta patched game. You might as well do another install.

Da Buzz
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
<center>
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto1/anderson3.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:49 PM
BpGemini wrote:
- Intruder_GP wrote:
-- Hey Gemini.... can I join today and what do you mean
-- by Hyperlobby never flown on that server...how do I
-- get there? do I need to subscribe?
-
-
-
- Nope it's free.
- http://hyperfighter.jinak.cz/
-
-
-
- I may still host a server tonight.
- I'll run my 3-team map if I do.
- I'll be listed as BlitzPig_Gemini.


I don't think I can make it tonight, but we'll meet for sure/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:50 PM
Huckebein_FW wrote:
- I think I can. I'll tell in 5 minutes if I can run
- the game without patch.



Sorry, my work connection is sloooooooww. It takes a while to update these pages so my answer are obviously a little behind.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

I wont be hosting until 8-8:30 which is in 4-5 hours.






<center>http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars/bp_geminiCombined.gif

<center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Warning: My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">If you treasure your lack of humor please refrain from reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Heaven Forbid.</table style></center>
<table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
<font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my P-39</font></font> </table style>
/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
<table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)"> www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:53 PM
Huckebein_FW wrote:
- I don't think I can make it tonight, but we'll meet
- for sure /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


Roger.
I host a server every Saturday, maybe then?
We'll meet up sooner or later.


<center>http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars/bp_geminiCombined.gif

<center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Warning: My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">If you treasure your lack of humor please refrain from reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table style></center> <center><table style="filter:glow[color=red,strength=1)">Heaven Forbid.</table style></center>
<table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
<font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my P-39</font></font> </table style>
/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
<table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)"> www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:55 PM
BpGemini wrote:
-
- Huckebein_FW wrote:
-- I think I can. I'll tell in 5 minutes if I can run
-- the game without patch.
-
-
-
- Sorry, my work connection is sloooooooww. It takes a
- while to update these pages so my answer are
- obviously a little behind.
-
- /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif
-
- I wont be hosting until 8-8:30 which is in 4-5
- hours.


Cool I'll see you there since I will be home only by your time.... Look forward for a good fight

Just out of curiosity..why do you not host at UBI and I have never come across you there?
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
- <center><img
- src="http://www.blitzpigs.com/forum/images/avatars
- /bp_geminiCombined.gif">
-
- <center><table
- style="filter:glow(color=red,strength=1)">Warning:
- My intense sense of humor may tug at the stick
- crammed in your shaded spot.</table style></center>
- <center><table
- style="filter:glow(color=red,strength=1)">If you
- treasure your lack of humor please refrain from
- reading my posts as they may cause laughter.</table
- style></center> <center><table
- style="filter:glow(color=red,strength=1)">Heaven
- Forbid.</table style></center>
- <table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
- <font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my
- P-39</font></font> </table style>
- /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif
- <table style="filter:glow[color=green,strength=4)">
- www.blitzpigs.com</center> (http://www.blitzpigs.com</center>) </table style>
-

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 09:56 PM
http://www.briandiskin.com/Assets/Pissing-Contest-B-W_lg.jpg

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

<table width="100%" border="0" align="center">
<tr>
<td colspan="2"><hr></td>
<td rowspan="2"><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="1">http://members.chello.se/ven/duck.jpg</font></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td width="43%"><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="1">Rubber Ducky, joy of joys,
When I squeeze you, you make noise!
Rubber Ducky, you're my very best friend,
it's true!

Rubber Ducky, you're the one,
You make bathtime lots of fun,
Rubber Ducky, I'm awfully fond of you.</font>
</td>
<td width="36%"><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="1">Every day when I
make my way to the tubby
I find a little fella who's
Cute and yellow and chubby

Rubber Ducky, you're so fine
And I'm lucky that you're mine
Rubber ducky, I'm awfully fond of you.</font></td>
</tr>
</table>

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 10:02 PM
Intruder_GP wrote:
- Cool I'll see you there since I will be home only by
- your time.... Look forward for a good fight
-
- Just out of curiosity..why do you not host at UBI
- and I have never come across you there?


Sounds good.
The last time I tried Ubi was well over a year ago.
It never really warmed up to me.
HL just seems to have the best people to play with and more choices.
I don't even have the Ubi program installed anymore.



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<table style="filter:glow[color=black,strength=1)">
<font size=+2><font color="black">Still loving my P-39</font></font> </table style>
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XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 10:07 PM
No p!$$ing contests here Ven.
This is purely for scientific research.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif


hehe.... That guy peeed on the judges.



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XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 10:11 PM
LOL if I did this against gemini the result would be:

Me in 109 Gem in P39 Gemini wins 5-0
Me in P39 Gem in 109 Gemini wins 5-0

Conclusion? Nic sucks...

Hardly conclusive as to plane performance IMO /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Nic

http://nicolas10.freeservers.com/images/et.jpg


OK I -->[]

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 10:19 PM
*Cherry*



nicolas10 wrote:
- LOL if I did this against gemini the result would be:
-
- Me in 109 Gem in P39 Gemini wins 5-0
- Me in P39 Gem in 109 Gemini wins 5-0
-
- Conclusion? Nic sucks...
-
- Hardly conclusive as to plane performance IMO /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif



Shhhhhhhh it's highly conclusive. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif
Btw, I thought you were pretty good in that Dora.






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XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 11:07 PM
Huckebein_FW wrote:

- I said before combat flight is not test flight. I
- can show tracks in which P-39 can easily outturn F4
- which should never happen.



The very fact that the P-39 could out-turn the Bf-109 send shudders up your spine, doesn't it? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://pages.prodigy.net/4parks/_uimages/SkyChimp.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 11:12 PM
SkyChimp wrote:
-
- Huckebein_FW wrote:
-
-- I said before combat flight is not test flight. I
-- can show tracks in which P-39 can easily outturn F4
-- which should never happen.
-
-
-
- The very fact that the P-39 could out-turn the
- Bf-109 send shudders up your spine, doesn't it?
- http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif


Yes, but caused by disgust.

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 11:21 PM
Huckebein_FW wrote:

- Yes, but caused by disgust.
-
-

Damn those Americans, how dare thay make something that could compete with a German plane in ONE area.

Don't let it bother you, Huck.

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://pages.prodigy.net/4parks/_uimages/SkyChimp.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 11:22 PM
SkyChimp wrote:
-
- Huckebein_FW wrote:
-
-- Yes, but caused by disgust.
--
--
-
- Damn those Americans, how dare thay make something
- that could compete with a German plane in ONE area.
-
-
-
- Don't let it bother you, Huck.


Why would I?

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 11:30 PM
Huckebein_FW wrote:

- Why would I?

You seem to get upset anytime an American plane outperforms a German plane in ANY envelope. Just figured this time would be no exception.



Regards,

SkyChimp

http://pages.prodigy.net/4parks/_uimages/SkyChimp.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-22-2003, 11:47 PM
SkyChimp wrote:
-
- Huckebein_FW wrote:
-
-- Why would I?
-
- You seem to get upset anytime an American plane
- outperforms a German plane in ANY envelope. Just
- figured this time would be no exception.


No, I'm upset only when some fighters outperform others by flying outside the envelope.

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 12:19 AM
Intruder_GP wrote:
- Hey Gemini.... can I join today........


As it turns out there will be no server tonight. My wife canceled her Mary Kay class due to having a migraine. I'll be taking care of her tonight, but every Saturday I host a Dog Fight server, so maybe I'll see you there.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


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XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 12:38 AM
Huckebein_FW wrote:

- No, I'm upset only when some fighters outperform
- others by flying outside the envelope.


Ah, I see. Which plane does that?



Regards,

SkyChimp

http://pages.prodigy.net/4parks/_uimages/SkyChimp.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 12:44 AM
SkyChimp wrote:
-
- Huckebein_FW wrote:
-
-- No, I'm upset only when some fighters outperform
-- others by flying outside the envelope.
-
-
- Ah, I see. Which plane does that?


P-39 in turn, in climb, in acceleration and in general handling. For example P-39 has the CG way aft the leading edge of the wing. All stable ww2 fighters have CG in front of the wing, P-39 was not one of them.

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 12:50 AM
Huckebein_FW wrote:

- P-39 in turn, in climb, in acceleration and in
- general handling. For example P-39 has the CG way
- aft the leading edge of the wing. All stable ww2
- fighters have CG in front of the wing, P-39 was not
- one of them.

Hmmmm.

The current P-39 is too slow at all altitudes. Roll rate is pretty accurate, though. It spins easily, just like in real life. It turns very tightly, just like in real life. Acceleration seems fine.

Do you suspect it's off because it's not the easy kill you thought it was?


Regards,

SkyChimp

http://pages.prodigy.net/4parks/_uimages/SkyChimp.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 12:55 AM
I see black and white charts on the horizon. It's only a matter of time now.

Lixma,

Blitzpig.

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 12:57 AM
SkyChimp wrote:
-
- Huckebein_FW wrote:
-
-- P-39 in turn, in climb, in acceleration and in
-- general handling. For example P-39 has the CG way
-- aft the leading edge of the wing. All stable ww2
-- fighters have CG in front of the wing, P-39 was not
-- one of them.
-
- Hmmmm.
-
- The current P-39 is too slow at all altitudes. Roll
- rate is pretty accurate, though. It spins easily,
- just like in real life. It turns very tightly, just
- like in real life. Acceleration seems fine.


Check your facts before posting. Stall speed for P-39N&Q at loaded weight was 105mph (it is the manual Skychimp, read it), when Bf109G2&6 155kmh. All early Bf-109 should turn inside P-39N&Q.

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 01:02 AM
Huckebein_FW wrote:

- Check your facts before posting. Stall speed for
- P-39N&Q at loaded weight was 105mph (it is the
- manual Skychimp, read it), when Bf109G2&6 155kmh.
- All early Bf-109 should turn inside P-39N&Q.


Check my facts? Um, Huck, did I even mention stall speed?

I am asking you what is wrong with the P-39 in the game, specifically, and what documents do you have that you can post that will support your contentions?

You've made the assertions, now back them up.



Regards,

SkyChimp

http://pages.prodigy.net/4parks/_uimages/SkyChimp.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 01:05 AM
You said:
- It turns very tightly, just
- like in real life.

Which means that turn radius was small. All this thread is about comparisons between P-39 and early Bf-109 so I assumed that from what you said you implied that P-39 has a smaller turn radius than Bf-109. That would be true if P-39 had a smaller stall speed than Bf-109 but it didn't, so the opposite is true: Bf-109 turns tighter than P-39.

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 01:18 AM
Huckebein_FW wrote:
- You said:
-- It turns very tightly, just
-- like in real life.
-
- Which means that turn radius was small. All this
- thread is about comparisons between P-39 and early
- Bf-109 so I assumed that from what you said you
- implied that P-39 has a smaller turn radius than
- Bf-109. That would be true if P-39 had a smaller
- stall speed than Bf-109 but it didn't, so the
- opposite is true: Bf-109 turns tighter than P-39.


You mentioned specific tests that you had that support your position. Are you going to post them or not?

Also, you use the term "loaded weight" in all you posts. What's a loaded weight, Huck?

Loaded weight is very imprecise. Please give us a specific weight for the P-39. And what configuration is the configuration of the plane at that weight?

What weight are you using for the Bf-109? Which Bf-109?

Just curious.


Regards,

SkyChimp

http://pages.prodigy.net/4parks/_uimages/SkyChimp.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 01:38 AM
Huck, in another thread you posted about the P-39:

"In beta 08 it climbs at 4300 fpm instead of 2700fpm (on the first try, maybe the climb rate is even higher)"

Where do you come up with 2,700 fpm?

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://pages.prodigy.net/4parks/_uimages/SkyChimp.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 02:36 AM
Huckbein_FW Wrote

"For example P-39 has the CG way aft the leading edge of the wing. All stable ww2 fighters have CG in front of the wing, P-39 was not one of them."

Your grasp of aircraft design is faulty. For any aircraft to fly, the CG must be pretty darn close to the center of lift (CL). For a straight wing monoplane, the CL is somewhere around 1/3 of the way back from the leading edge of the wing. If the CG is in front of the wing, the aircraft will not fly at all (except down).

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 08:20 AM
klower wrote:
- Huckbein_FW Wrote
-
- "For example P-39 has the CG way aft the leading
- edge of the wing. All stable ww2 fighters have CG in
- front of the wing, P-39 was not one of them."
-
- Your grasp of aircraft design is faulty. For any
- aircraft to fly, the CG must be pretty darn close to
- the center of lift (CL). For a straight wing
- monoplane, the CL is somewhere around 1/3 of the way
- back from the leading edge of the wing. If the CG
- is in front of the wing, the aircraft will not fly
- at all (except down).


The aerodynamic center (AC) is at aprox 25% aft of the leading edge of the wing for most of the ww2 planes. The pitching moment is caused by the couple of the two forces, lift and weight. If CG is in front of AC a nose down moment develops as AoA increases which counters the increase in pitch, returning the wing to the original AoA. If CG is aft of AC then when lift increases the couple of the two forces pull the wing at an even higher AoA making it very unstable (in pitch). You can get a clear picture of this if you draw the coupled forces. The ideea that center of gravity should be on the same spot with aerodynamic center or center of pressure is incorrect.

A much too stable configuration is not suitable for fighters, but one too unstable is unflyable.

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 09:45 AM
Huckebein_FW wrote:
- klower wrote:
-- Huckbein_FW Wrote
--
-- "For example P-39 has the CG way aft the leading
-- edge of the wing. All stable ww2 fighters have CG in
-- front of the wing, P-39 was not one of them."
--
-- Your grasp of aircraft design is faulty. For any
-- aircraft to fly, the CG must be pretty darn close to
-- the center of lift (CL). For a straight wing
-- monoplane, the CL is somewhere around 1/3 of the way
-- back from the leading edge of the wing. If the CG
-- is in front of the wing, the aircraft will not fly
-- at all (except down).
-
-
- The aerodynamic center (AC) is at aprox 25% aft of
- the leading edge of the wing for most of the ww2
- planes. The pitching moment is caused by the couple
- of the two forces, lift and weight. If CG is in
- front of AC a nose down moment develops as AoA
- increases which counters the increase in pitch,
- returning the wing to the original AoA. If CG is aft
- of AC then when lift increases the couple of the two
- forces pull the wing at an even higher AoA making it
- very unstable (in pitch). You can get a clear
- picture of this if you draw the coupled forces. The
- ideea that center of gravity should be on the same
- spot with aerodynamic center or center of pressure
- is incorrect.
-
- A much too stable configuration is not suitable for
- fighters, but one too unstable is unflyable.
-
-


Hmmm...

I'm not sure you've got it right here Huck.

The centre of lift and centre of mass (gravity) definitely don't have to be in the same place (in fact, the C o L will move around with airspeed), but I'm very surprised to hear you say that the C of G was actually in front of the wing on all stable WWII fighters. Just looking at most a/c with rearward tricycle undercarriages it's clear that it couldn't be because they would fall onto their noses on the ground because the C of G would be in front of the main wheels.

Equally, of course, it's hard to see how the P-39 could have a C of G behind the wing trailing edge and not end up sitting on its tail on the ground with the nose up in the air.

It just doesn't sound right to me - but I'm willing to be corrected.

Regards,

RocketDog.





Message Edited on 07/23/0308:47AM by RocketDog

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 02:48 PM
Can anyone explain what this "datum point" is? And, where it is located.

for some Spifires

- the centre of gravity 5.0" aft of the datum (undercarriage down)(Mk XI)

- the centre of gravity was at 7.8 inches aft of the datum(Mk V)

- the centre of gravity 7.4" aft of the datum point(Mk V)

http://www.stenbergaa.com/stenberg/crandall-stormclouds2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 12:13 AM
Huckebein_FW wrote:
- klower wrote:
-- Huckbein_FW Wrote
--
-- "For example P-39 has the CG way aft the leading
-- edge of the wing. All stable ww2 fighters have CG in
-- front of the wing, P-39 was not one of them."
--
-- Your grasp of aircraft design is faulty. For any
-- aircraft to fly, the CG must be pretty darn close to
-- the center of lift (CL). For a straight wing
-- monoplane, the CL is somewhere around 1/3 of the way
-- back from the leading edge of the wing. If the CG
-- is in front of the wing, the aircraft will not fly
-- at all (except down).
-
-
- The aerodynamic center (AC) is at aprox 25% aft of
- the leading edge of the wing for most of the ww2
- planes. The pitching moment is caused by the couple
- of the two forces, lift and weight. If CG is in
- front of AC a nose down moment develops as AoA
- increases which counters the increase in pitch,
- returning the wing to the original AoA. If CG is aft
- of AC then when lift increases the couple of the two
- forces pull the wing at an even higher AoA making it
- very unstable (in pitch). You can get a clear
- picture of this if you draw the coupled forces. The
- ideea that center of gravity should be on the same
- spot with aerodynamic center or center of pressure
- is incorrect.
-
- A much too stable configuration is not suitable for
- fighters, but one too unstable is unflyable.
-
-
If the CG was actually in "in front of the wing" (as you said), the pitching moment would be so great that the pilot would never be able to lift the nose off the ground. Even if the aircraft did become airborne, the downward force required from the elevators/stabilizers would be so great that the performance penalty would be huge.

Perhaps what you meant was that the CG was in front of the CL (or AC as you call it). If that was your meaning, then I agree with your original statement.

Are you saying that the P-39 was unusual in that it had the CG aft of the CL (AC)? If this is the case, I'd like to know what your source was.

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 12:33 AM
Huckebein,

I am also confused as to why stall speed is a relavent issue? Wouldn't turn rate at combat speeds be more relavent?

I have to warn you, if you are even thinking about turn fighting against a P-39 in any 109, you are already screwed.

Gemini,

it's not even going to be funny. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 12:42 AM
I also found this. Even the heavy USAAF P-39s could outturn a 109 at low altitude. This is from "P-39 Airacobra Aces of World War 2" P.47. This was the last USAAF kill by a P-39 in Italy April 1944.

"Since scoring his first kill in February 1943, Dow had been able to test fly a captured Messerschmitt fighter, and he new his chances of out-turning the enemy aircraft were good at low altitude. He was betting with his life, but Dow was right, as his P-39 gained about 90 degrees of deflection on the Bf 109 in just a single turn."

(I know this was probably a G6 not an F4 but, the P-39 clearly was not at a turn disadvantage against the 109.)