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View Full Version : Attention all, about threads that i moved out...



crazyivan1970
12-16-2004, 11:33 PM
Untill we know for sure what is happening from official sources, i would like to ask everyone to stop making false statements and speculate about what went down between 1C, UBI and American plane makers... and what kind of addon Russian version gets and who does what when and how. This mass histeria got to stop. It doesn`t do any good, trust me.

Thanks.

crazyivan1970
12-16-2004, 11:33 PM
Untill we know for sure what is happening from official sources, i would like to ask everyone to stop making false statements and speculate about what went down between 1C, UBI and American plane makers... and what kind of addon Russian version gets and who does what when and how. This mass histeria got to stop. It doesn`t do any good, trust me.

Thanks.

VMF223_Smitty
12-17-2004, 12:09 AM
Thank You Ivan http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

F19_Orheim
12-17-2004, 03:24 AM
I think it just got confirmed

http://www.simhq.com/simhq3/sims/boards/bbs/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=114;t=002258

Oleg opens up as well... some anyway

EDIT: This is strange.. Oleg's input has been erased from the threads http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

(1VB)YAKMAN
12-17-2004, 03:44 AM
Didn't see a post there from Oleg????????

F19_Orheim
12-17-2004, 04:00 AM
sorry, wrong thread...it was here:

http://www.simhq.com/simhq3/sims/boards/bbs/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=114;t=002241;p=5

FI.Snaphoo
12-17-2004, 04:14 AM
Though it doesn't seem too promising, I'm going to wait for official word on this site before I go panicking.

s.bush
12-17-2004, 04:58 AM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v76/aminx/11.jpg

grab one before it's too late......

s.bush
12-17-2004, 05:10 AM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v76/aminx/d1_trainstation_020034.jpg

any objections.....

Bearcat99
12-17-2004, 06:00 AM
Yeah Ivan but you must admit...... why are we always the last to know? I mean if all this is on Sim HQ then it would be just assinine to think that it wouldnt make it over here.

VF-29_Sandman
12-17-2004, 06:00 AM
they can have my game when they pry my cold dead fingers from it http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

crazyivan1970
12-17-2004, 06:26 AM
That is not true BC, Olny us got official reply, not really clear one, for probably business reasons. SimHQ got bunch of speculations. That`s all

"Oleg Maddox said: We will not make new P-47s not because we don't wont it, but because of very serious reason that I can't tell you currently. Maybe later it will be possible to tell and you will understand us completely. And we will not make several other types of planes for PF (or PF+FB+AEP) due to this reason as well."

Thats official.

Bearcat99
12-17-2004, 06:42 AM
rgr....

crazyivan1970
12-17-2004, 06:43 AM
There is not a single official statement in SimHQ yet either. Guesses and specualtions. Some good guesses too http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

JG51Beolke
12-17-2004, 07:04 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
That is not true BC, Olny us got official reply, not really clear one, for probably business reasons. SimHQ got bunch of speculations. That`s all

"Oleg Maddox said: We will not make new P-47s not because we don't wont it, but because of very serious reason that I can't tell you currently. Maybe later it will be possible to tell and you will understand us completely. And we will not make several other types of planes for PF (or PF+FB+AEP) due to this reason as well."

Thats official. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is absolutely terrible. I'm going to pray that everything works out in the long run for Oleg. And If I have to, I'll learn to speak Russian and buy the Russian version.

And, If there's any Lawyers in the house who are Flight Sim enthusiasts, perhaps they can offer legal advice. Just guessing though. Why discriminate againt Oleg and not M$. Maybe because Oleg put all other Flight Sim companies out of business. They're all probablly really ticked, so they may have approached the Aircraft Manufacturers with a deal.

By best wishes and prayers for Oleg and 1C.

crazyivan1970
12-17-2004, 07:26 AM
Bottom line:

Some types of US produced WW2 Aircraft will not be modeled. This does not include all US aircraft and has nothing to do with aircraft that is already in the game. <span class="ev_code_RED">Nobody is suing anyone and nobody will take existing planes away it just a matter of future developments.</span> <span class="ev_code_RED">The reason why new types of aircraft are not being developed and which types they are WILL NOT be discussed in public</span>. It`s that simple. So take it as it is. Can something be done about it...I do not know, neither does Oleg.

And that is Official.

VMF223_Smitty
12-17-2004, 07:46 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Bottom line:

Some types of US produced WW2 Aircraft will not be modeled. This does not include all US aircraft and has nothing to do with aircraft that is already in the game. <span class="ev_code_RED">Nobody is suing anyone and nobody will take existing planes away it just a matter of future developments.</span> <span class="ev_code_RED">The reason why new types of aircraft are not being developed and which types they are WILL NOT be discussed in public</span>. It`s that simple. So take it as it is. Can something be done about it...I do not know, neither does Oleg.

And that is Official. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thanks Ivan - I think that is pretty clear.

Lewicide
12-17-2004, 07:48 AM
Cut , em loose Ivan
Nobody knows for sure whats going on, they(we) can go to all kinds of different places to complain, but this is a biggie,
and this is home

Cheers

Willey
12-17-2004, 08:20 AM
Looks to me like Ubi wants to get rid of PF and hurry up the BoB. They don't shell out money for Maddox doing PF stuff anymore. Maddox already had to correct lots of 3rd party work for PF which means they had to concentrate on PF 103% and they were not able to develop the BoB at the same time.

Ruy Horta
12-17-2004, 08:34 AM
As I wrote before, this is all a storm in a glass of water...

The only real issue at hand is using the name of said company without the permision of the new owner.

So you cannot name the object in your game "Grumman F6F-5N Hellcat", since Grumman is still a proprietary name.

HOWEVER...F6F-5N Hellcat would be no problem, since both the designation and the nome the guerre are US government property at worst.

The design of the object can be used freely, since its too common in historical terms to lay claim on. You do not need permission to draw a Hellcat.

So its ONLY about using official names and in part caution on Ubisoft - so not to risk their main market.

If they abstain from using the company names they can model whatever they like, and IMHO they know this.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Ruy says: Just stick to official designations!

I agree with the likelihood of this issue being used as a good excuse to stop unwanted further development of a dead product (in development terms).

"Its not that we don't want to..."

BTW, where are those planes that didn't fit on the CD, but were "ready"?

Another "grey area".

Platypus_1.JaVA
12-17-2004, 08:54 AM
all the stuff about legal issues is more or less confirmed (more or less, not directly) by Ian Boys on SimHQ.

This is not an official statement from Oleg or UBI and he is not part of any of those companies.

ImpStarDuece
12-17-2004, 09:01 AM
I dont know, to me this seems pretty important. As far as I can see it, if it actually is an aerospace firm enforcing copyright.trademerk on their designs/name it puts up some serious issues.

First of all, it restricts my ability to simulate, recreate and learn history. Why? Well if all the companies that i buy WW@ videos, books, posters, models and computer games have to start shelling out royalties that is going to eat into my pocket and give extra profits to the buggers who are causing the price rise in the first place. If I have to play a game with a "Gumman Hellbat" or a "Meesyschmid 901" I am going to be more than a little annoyed.

Secondly, this impacts on my ability to enjoy the game, learn history and respect the men and women who built, designed, tested and flew these airplanes. Opportunistic application of copyright, particularly as this issue has lain dormant for decades, seems a little steep. The current mania that the online music fracas has generated is now spreading. This is the result. I think a move towards licencing arrangements like Creative Commons Copyright can only benefit the industries involved, not to mention making the laws less monolithic, more applicable and less draconian.

One other possibility that springs to mind is that there is another sim in development that HAS licenced various aircraft from the concerned parties. I know flight sims aren't exactly common on the ground, but it is a possibility. Said developer could be trying to to generate interest by creating exclusivity and the "official" seal of approval style of thing. Only in their sim can you fly the X, Y or Z.

This is not the sky falling in. Yes, if the US aircraft are really cancelled then its a crying shame. Yes, I feel more than a little mystified by the whole situation. Why now? Why this game? Why only certain American aircraft? Who is responsible? What do they gain by doing it (money aside obviously)? If it is an aerospace company why are they alienating fans of their products? Has this been through the courts? Or is it there now or maybe in the future? Are other companies having similar problems? Is this why there have been issues with patches and US aircraft in PF? Why the secrecy?

I dont think many, id any at all, of these questions will get answered. Certainly I would like to know whats going on though, even in only the broadest terms. Information and an explaination are all we ask for at the moment. When we have some knowledge we can then act accordingly. There are probably several avenues we have to help resolve this or initiate our own solutions.

I dont even have PF yet, but this sets a worrying trend in my mind. It clamps down on our freedom to enjoy historical aircraft in historical settings. YEs a profit is being made here, UbiSoft and MAddox Games are companies after all What i dont think should happen is that they be made to suffer for creating a simulation of our history and heritage.

Nuff said

crazyivan1970
12-17-2004, 09:02 AM
Just FIY Platypus, it was stated by Oleg in ORR. I just had to confirm some things with him and made this post with his permission. Take it the way you like it.. official or not. But that`s how it stands.

Cheers!

KarayaEine
12-17-2004, 09:09 AM
It seems very strange that 'all of a sudden' the issue of certain US planes in a flight sim becomes a big deal. Il-2 has been around for quite some time with US planes in it and no one seemed very concerned.

I do know that certain US aerospace companies have become very protective over use of their past products (either of their own design or acquired through mergers and buyouts). I don't like this anymore than anyone else and even ashamed to admit that I work for one of these aerospace companies myself. To me it's just a shamefull way to make a dollar off something that is part of history. (not to mention the huge profit these companies made in the past from actually building the aircraft)

I used to proudly tell everyone that I flew IL-2 and urged them to go out an buy it to experience the same thrill i felt every time I booted the sim up. However, it's very unlikely I'll ever refer anyone to this sim again. Especially when things like this occur. It leaves quite a sour taste in my mouth.

Johann

superjohnny
12-17-2004, 10:55 AM
Hmm all this talk about US versions not having new US planes, but Russian ones being OK. Err does the UK version come under the OK to have everything umbrella.
I'm very confused and quite quite sad. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/cry.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/cry.gif

AFJ_Locust
12-17-2004, 11:05 AM
Ill have my mass histeria medium rare please.

With a side dish of Psychotic nerosis

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

BSS_Goat
12-17-2004, 11:06 AM
I heard Billy Gates threatened to whoop Olegs @ss because CFS3 flopped and to appease him Oleg will not include any US planes......be sure.

Ruy Horta
12-17-2004, 12:10 PM
Well if they see a way of making that new Russian add on available to us with the International version of FB+AEP+PF than all is well again.

Sure it is a shame that some PF a/c didn't make it, but the stuff mentioned by Oleg would make make up for a lot of it!

Would be surprised if Ubi didn't want to release one last add-on before BoB. Makes sense to cover the gap.

Although I still think there is more to it than what's being writte, Oleg's gained credits for finally coming out in the open with some clear information.

Now stop the BS and get that Russian Add On westernized, PRONTO!!!

Airmail109
12-17-2004, 12:12 PM
Ruy as i mentioned in another post..........we can translate it.........how many times do i have to shout that out lol...its not impossible.

Ruy Horta
12-17-2004, 01:53 PM
Don't care about what we CAN do, but what will BE DONE!

Other than that I am currently pretty pleased besides the legal cat flap. Any new add on is good news in my book.

So when?

hehe...

VMF-214_HaVoK
12-17-2004, 02:05 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
That is not true BC, Olny us got official reply, not really clear one, for probably business reasons. SimHQ got bunch of speculations. That`s all

"Oleg Maddox said: We will not make new P-47s not because we don't wont it, but because of very serious reason that I can't tell you currently. Maybe later it will be possible to tell and you will understand us completely. And we will not make several other types of planes for PF (or PF+FB+AEP) due to this reason as well."

Thats official. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Everyone call/email Northrop and tell them what a crooked money grubbing lawyer they got working for them. Northrop owns Grumman and Republic, this is the reason we will see no future US planes...be sure. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

Tvrdi
12-17-2004, 04:03 PM
well, they killed the king (PF)..live long the king! (BoB) http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

that we could expect....one f legend is dead, like all others before.....now wait for the new baby with new things...

ElAurens
12-17-2004, 04:24 PM
HaVoK, spamming Northrop/Grumman is a bad idea. Things are bad enough.

I'd say that unless your degree is in corporate law, and you got it from an Ivy league school, it would be best to leave it be.

VMF-214_HaVoK
12-17-2004, 06:27 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ElAurens:
HaVoK, spamming Northrop/Grumman is a bad idea. Things are bad enough.

I'd say that unless your degree is in corporate law, and you got it from an Ivy league school, it would be best to leave it be. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Good point...but make no mistake this is the reason.

TAGERT.
12-17-2004, 10:10 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Bearcat99:
Yeah Ivan but you must admit...... why are we always the last to know? I mean if all this is on Sim HQ then it would be just assinine to think that it wouldnt make it over here. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>We?

VOL_Hans
12-17-2004, 10:16 PM
Just a little something to add here.

If you want to avoid speculation, put posts in with the official releases of information. Tell these guys what they want to know in one big shot and make a dedicated debate thread on that subject.

Give the people the information and a place to fight about it and there most likely to form one neat little brawl rather than several small riots!

crazyivan1970
12-17-2004, 10:34 PM
Note to everyone... if you see VOL_Hans in the forums, it means Hyperlobby is down http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Hans, read my reply in the middle of that page2 : http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?q=Y&a=tpc&s=400102&f=26310365&m=5771085352&p=2 That will clear it up for you.

Cheers!