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tehz0mgbie
08-02-2010, 12:47 AM
The more videos i see and the more descriptions i read the more IMPATIENT I GET!!!

Is anybody else out there getting so excited and freaked that your hands get sweaty thinking about ACB? Seriously, I wanted so hard for an AC Multiplayer experience that it drives me nuts.

I realize how nerdy this makes me sound but by god, gaming has come so far. We need this game soon. I don't think I can wait for November.

EzioAssassin51
08-02-2010, 12:58 AM
Don't worry! No doubt either later this month or after the BETA is out, UBI will release the Dev Diaries and stuff to dow with SP to calm you down http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

primerib69
08-02-2010, 01:04 AM
Originally posted by EzioAssassin51:
Don't worry! No doubt either later this month or after the BETA is out, UBI will release the Dev Diaries and stuff to dow with SP to calm you down http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Yeah if you can wait 1 month and 13 days (if you're in the U.S.) then you will be rewarded. Hope for the best! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Xanatos2007
08-02-2010, 02:16 AM
I'm not that excited. I might not even get it, depending on where Ubi goes with it. The series is going downhill in my opinion.

primerib69
08-02-2010, 02:20 AM
COOL dude. We get it. Thank you for sharing your opinion.

edzilla_551
08-02-2010, 03:28 AM
Originally posted by Xanatos2007:
I'm not that excited. I might not even get it, depending on where Ubi goes with it. The series is going downhill in my opinion.

than why are you even on these forums if you dont like the series, seriously i hate guys like you that put down a game before its even out, god i hope the game is really good so it can shut people like you up! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/compsmash.gif

Xanatos2007
08-02-2010, 03:32 AM
You're obviously not paying very good attention to the series as a whole then, are you? Besides, it's far safer to be a cynic.

primerib69
08-02-2010, 03:41 AM
Originally posted by Xanatos2007:
You're obviously not paying very good attention to the series as a whole then, are you? Besides, it's far safer to be a cynic.

Again, your opinion. If you want to rant about how you hate this, and hate that, then please do it somewhere else because no one here wants to hear it despite what you think, and this forum is for people who actually like the series. I'm sorry that you don't like the AC universe anymore, and you certainly do have the right to say you don't like it as much as you wish. But please don't do it here.

edzilla_551
08-02-2010, 03:47 AM
Originally posted by primerib69:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xanatos2007:
You're obviously not paying very good attention to the series as a whole then, are you? Besides, it's far safer to be a cynic.

Again, your opinion. If you want to rant about how you hate this, and hate that, then please do it somewhere else because no one here wants to hear it despite what you think, and this forum is for people who actually like the series. I'm sorry that you don't like the AC universe anymore, and you certainly do have the right to say you don't like it as much as you wish. But please don't do it here. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

agreed, so please listen to him and dont come back until you like the series alright bro! cheers http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
ps- i do pay attention to the series thats why im on here! DUH! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

Xanatos2007
08-02-2010, 03:52 AM
How was that a rant? All I was saying was that I'm not that hyped about AC:B and giving a brief reason why. It's not my fault you two overreacted.

And I didn't say I hate the series: AC1 is still one of the best games ever made and AC2 was above average (but still far from perfect). And if the multiplayer for AC:B works out okay and Ubisoft stops treating PC players like H&K treats the civilian market, then I might look more positively to the future of the AC series. But, seriously, what are the odds of that ever happening?

edzilla_551
08-02-2010, 03:58 AM
Originally posted by Xanatos2007:
How was that a rant? All I was saying was that I'm not that hyped about AC:B and giving a brief reason why. It's not my fault you two overreacted.

And I didn't say I hate the series: AC1 is still one of the best games ever made and AC2 was above average (but still far from perfect). And if the multiplayer for AC:B works out okay and Ubisoft stops treating PC players like H&K treats the civilian market, then I might look more positively to the future of the AC series. But, seriously, what are the odds of that ever happening?


oh dude what did we just say we dont wanna hear it, man your really making me sick please just <span class="ev_code_RED">[Edit: swearing removed]</span>

Xanatos2007
08-02-2010, 04:01 AM
Now now, that language wasn't called for.

Murcuseo
08-02-2010, 04:07 AM
Give it a break ladies lol

Xanatos has every right to express his opinion on AC whether it be here or anywhere else. Just because his opinion doesn't fall in line with yours doesn't give you the right to tell him to beat it.

I don't agree with his opinions either but thankfully that's part of being human... you don't have to agree with someone to respect them.

Grow the hell up http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Plus it was 2 againgst one so I thought I'd step in and even the odds... now, get over yourselves and get back on topic lol

edzilla_551
08-02-2010, 04:10 AM
alright then im sorry i went a little overboard, do you really think ac1 is better than ac2? seriously man i know the first one had mad graphics and atmosphere but ac2 is just a way better and more deep game,i mean i still love ac1 but ac2 is better, but i love both because assassins creed is my favourite series because it is unique and has different settings apart from other games thats why i think ac is so great, thumbs up if u agree!

Xanatos2007
08-02-2010, 04:14 AM
Thanks Rob, good to see another Balanced individual here. And Scottish, too.

There wasn't much of a topic to begin with in the first place anyway, just another impatient fan showering Ubisoft with arbitrary praise. Developers need honest opinions from players to expose their game's flaws so they know what to improve on in future installments - they already know what they did good, they don't need 1,500 reminders of it.

^These little snipits of opinions don't deserve a whole entire thread. If you guys really want me to rant though I can always make another topic, but I doubt that you do.

Murcuseo
08-02-2010, 04:21 AM
Originally posted by Xanatos2007:

Developers need honest opinions from players to expose their game's flaws so they know what to improve on in future installments - they already know what they did good, they don't need 1,500 reminders of it.

That's why I expect the MP Beta testing to be a farce, to many people treating it like a demo. Seems to be the way things are going now though... but again, that's off topic lol

To be fair I think this thread could do with being closed so I'll stick in a report http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

edzilla_551
08-02-2010, 04:23 AM
Originally posted by Robson19822009:
Give it a break ladies lol

Xanatos has every right to express his opinion on AC whether it be here or anywhere else. Just because his opinion doesn't fall in line with yours doesn't give you the right to tell him to beat it.

I don't agree with his opinions either but thankfully that's part of being human... you don't have to agree with someone to respect them.

Grow the hell up http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Plus it was 2 againgst one so I thought I'd step in and even the odds... now, get over yourselves and get back on topic lol


shut up, youre a lady http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif plus i cant believe you dont get ****ed off from this guy comments, the topic is on being excited for the game and this guy comes and brings it down, if he wanted to bring it down he should make a thread saying that ac series is going down hill.

Murcuseo
08-02-2010, 04:32 AM
Originally posted by edzilla_551:

shut up, youre a lady http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif plus i cant believe you dont get ****ed off from this guy comments, the topic is on being excited for the game and this guy comes and brings it down, if he wanted to bring it down he should make a thread saying that ac series is going down hill.

lol if I spent my time getting annoyed with people I don't agree with I'd be in a really bad mood all day. You'll learn to let it wash over you and rationalise your points instead of hurling abuse at people http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Regardless of what the thread was for he still has a right to express his opinion. Seeing as he did so in a reasonable manner there's no excuse for losing the rag with him...

EzioAssassin51
08-02-2010, 04:48 AM
And if he made a thread, you guys would come in it and say the exact same things to him and that one would be closed by the pointless spam just like this one!

Xanatos2007
08-02-2010, 04:49 AM
A Balanced Scott with common sense and courtesy. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

There doesn't seem to be room in this world for honesty anymore. People aren't interested the truth anymore, only what they want to hear. Whenever I give an honest opinion on something - even though more often than not I'm exactly right - I always get attacked by aggressive fans who keep trying to defend developers regardless of their flaws. And when asked about their opinions of a game they always sugar-coat their answers to avoid offending people and hopefully gain favour with those higher up than them. Look, nothing I say is going to reduce anyone at Ubisoft to tears and they care even less about you, the sycophants.

@edzilla: If you don't like what I say then ignore my posts. I've got to tolerate a lot of hogwash as well, especially since I've been here longer than you, but at least I'm civil about it.

EDIT: Dang, I take too long to type.

Mr_Shade
08-02-2010, 05:05 AM
Originally posted by edzilla_551:

shut up, youre a lady http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif plus i cant believe you dont get ****ed off from this guy comments, the topic is on being excited for the game and this guy comes and brings it down, if he wanted to bring it down he should make a thread saying that ac series is going down hill.

I think this ends now...

Your new.. so I will give you a nice warning...


Please do not swear at other users - not only is it rude, but even though the forum has a filter to remove it, it's not needed, nor wanted..


ANYONE has the right to post anything about the game or gameplay - as long as it's done in a civil and constructive way - which until you started with the abuse, it was being done as such..


I suggest you cool down a little and think before you type.. and consider reading the forum rules...


If you need further guidance, the members here will advise you or you can contact myself or a member of the moderation team.


Now.. back on topic with out the swearing or the insults to other members.. and see if this thread can be recovered...

Crucify Lucifer
08-02-2010, 08:54 AM
Originally posted by tehz0mgbie:
The more videos i see and the more descriptions i read the more IMPATIENT I GET!!!

Is anybody else out there getting so excited and freaked that your hands get sweaty thinking about ACB? Seriously, I wanted so hard for an AC Multiplayer experience that it drives me nuts.

I realize how nerdy this makes me sound but by god, gaming has come so far. We need this game soon. I don't think I can wait for November.

That's what I got to feel about Splinter Cell Conviction..for 3 years. I wasn't too excited about ACB until I saw the single player trailer / gameplay. Now I'm a little on edge myself. At least there won't be any delays..hopefully http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif.

Murcuseo
08-02-2010, 09:07 AM
Originally posted by Ulqui4rra:

At least there won't be any delays..hopefully http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif.

Not for the console release anyway http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

Mr_Shade
08-02-2010, 09:13 AM
Originally posted by Robson19822009:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ulqui4rra:

At least there won't be any delays..hopefully http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif.

Not for the console release anyway http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>lets not jinx it.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Ru1986
08-02-2010, 10:16 AM
Am excited yea but have been more excited about other games. November seems to far away at the mo and i dont want to wish the end of the summer away.

masterfenix2009
08-02-2010, 10:57 AM
im even more impatient cause my audio doesnt work and i cant hear the videos.

SWJS
08-02-2010, 11:23 AM
I definately know the feeling. I did the same thing with many games, including the most recent Destroy All Humans!

Currently I'm doing it for Halo Reach and Brotherhood.

I'll admit I try to be civil and such, but I've been in many a heated debate. So hot, it vaporized a continent. So yeah. It's easy for me to step out of line, but I do try and control it. As long as someone doesn't insult me or my taste in gaming, I'm fine.

We are all human after all.

SBRedFlag
08-02-2010, 11:49 AM
I actually felt much more hyped before the release of AC2 than I am right now. For some reason, ACB doesn't excite me as much. Sure the multiplayer looks great, and I'm definitely going to buy the game, but I feel as if the singleplayer mode is straying from the original stealth aspect of the game.

It's now much too easy to just rush into any situation and kill anyone in your way, rather than plan out what you're going to do, and stay in the shadows. AC1 stressed the stealth, and AC2, started taking away that focus, and now, with ACB's one-hit kill chains that allow you to take out whole groups of guards in seconds, it's become more of a sword-fighting action game than a stealth action game, like it once was.

I have to agree with Xanatos, the series is taking a turn for the worse in terms of single player gameplay.

X10J
08-02-2010, 01:02 PM
Originally posted by tehz0mgbie:
The more videos i see and the more descriptions i read the more IMPATIENT I GET!!!

Is anybody else out there getting so excited and freaked that your hands get sweaty thinking about ACB? Seriously, I wanted so hard for an AC Multiplayer experience that it drives me nuts.

I realize how nerdy this makes me sound but by god, gaming has come so far. We need this game soon. I don't think I can wait for November.

i know its tough but try and have patience (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMmX9G8JP38&feature=related) dear child

ArtofParkour
08-02-2010, 01:24 PM
Why do people think that Assassins have to be stealthy? Assassins kill people on instruction. There is no set "you must be stealthy" rule. As long as you succeed and escape, that's it. Some would argue that you don't even have to escape. Furthermore, almost 60% why the first game was so popular was because of the insane fight scenes and sequences; I know because people complained a lot when the second game went to more a stealth route. So I personally don't get what you mean by "original stealth" aspect. Because, originally (meaning AC1), stealth wasn't really required.


Originally posted by Xanatos2007:
You're obviously not paying very good attention to the series as a whole then, are you? Besides, it's far safer to be a cynic.

Sure, but you're chosing something ridiculous to be a cynic about. Assassin's Creed has continued to get better in my opinion. Perhaps some people like limited gameplay, repetitive missions, and a very uncinematic expirience save the last two scenes, but not me.

It's obvious that AC has gradually gotten better. I haven't played the new game so I can't speak for it, but I'm assuming from what I've seen it's just another few steps in the right direction.

It's probably multiplayer that is making you be so upset about the series, which is really irritating. People who dislike multiplayer games are suspicious because of their motives. It seems that people dislike a game sometimes when they're not very good at it. I'm not saying this is the case. But, I'm sure this is why some AC fans are upset about multiplayer...simply because they're not good at multiplayer games.

El_Sjietah
08-02-2010, 01:32 PM
Originally posted by ArtofParkour:
Why do people think that Assassins have to be stealthy? Assassins kill people on instruction. There is no set "you must be stealthy" rule. As long as you succeed and escape, that's it.

Not according to the Creed.


And for the rest of your post. Just because you think it's gotten better, doesn't make it fact. AC2 was a step forward in a lot of ways, but it was also a step back in a few.

ArtofParkour
08-02-2010, 01:33 PM
I'm talking about reality (in some aspects) not necessarily game canon refering to the Hashashins (although I do not think that really breaks the "Creed" either). I also would suggest that doesn't even matter after AC1. It would appear Altair changed many aspects of the supposed "Creed" after killing Al Mualim and taking control of the Brotherhood.

El_Sjietah
08-02-2010, 01:36 PM
Well, the discussion is about the AC universe, so why drag in reality? In the AC universe, an assassin has to abide to the creed.

ArtofParkour
08-02-2010, 02:37 PM
All the creed states is that you're not to show yourself before you strike. If a fight happens, then so be it. Otherwise, the game would desync you whenever a fight broke out anyway, right? You can chose to fight if that's the way you want to strike. No where in the creed does it say you have to be Solid Snake.

I really wanted to avoid this debate because it's really pointless. It's an interpretation of something that doesn't even hold water. If you want to sneak and do your crazy Tom Clancy stuff that's fine, I enjoy stealth play as well, but it is not needed and not required by the creed.


The Creed

1) Do not harm the innocent.
2) Hide in plain sight.
3) Do not compromise the Brotherhood.

Which one of those three tenants suggest you have to stealth kill your target? Tenant two suggests you have to hide in plain sight until you strike. How you chose to strike is up to you.

hewkii9
08-02-2010, 04:47 PM
Tenant 2 suggests you have to hide in plain sight - how does that not sound like stealth? My ideal assassination is always very quietly in, very loudly out. That was possible for every assassination in AC1. In AC2, either there is no loud out [Emilio, Silvio/Dante] or your quiet in is blown by the computer deciding you're there [Vieri, Ludovico Orsi]. It's made worse by AC2 giving you even more tools for stealth [namely, the assassinations from cover] then absolutely no chances to use them.

I stab someone from a bench exactly once per playthrough - there's a side mission in San Gimignano. Considering that was the first kill from the first video of AC2, you'd think you'd see it more often.

Sbredflag, I was more pumped for AC2 than this, too. Makes sense, since we're still with Ezio.

SBRedFlag
08-02-2010, 06:38 PM
I think all the fanboys that will defend something to death really need to simmer down here. I'm just stating my opinion, and if it doesn't match yours, I'm sorry, but that's life.

AC1 really allowed you to stealth assassinate any of the targets. You weren't required to, of course, but it was definitely a very viable option. In AC2, the assassinations are way more scripting, i.e. the developers only wanted them to be done in one way, and you have to find exploits or glitches to do them stealthily, if possible. Take for example the assassination of Uberto. No matter how you approach him, there's no way to take him out stealthily, he'll always say "you..." Similarly, you have to engage in a fight with Vieri, and Silvio Barbarigo and Dante in order to kill them.

I think the addition of features that would help stealth kills were great. I think, though, that the stealth kills themselves just weren't encouraged. And thats a shame, because I felt that one of the biggest features of AC1 gameplay was going through as stealthily as possible. The stealthy way was usually easier, if less obvious, but in AC2, stealth was pushed to the sidelines.

P.S. "Tenets" does not equal "tenants"

edzilla_551
08-02-2010, 11:53 PM
Originally posted by Mr_Shade:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by edzilla_551:

shut up, youre a lady http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif plus i cant believe you dont get ****ed off from this guy comments, the topic is on being excited for the game and this guy comes and brings it down, if he wanted to bring it down he should make a thread saying that ac series is going down hill.

I think this ends now...

Your new.. so I will give you a nice warning...


Please do not swear at other users - not only is it rude, but even though the forum has a filter to remove it, it's not needed, nor wanted..


ANYONE has the right to post anything about the game or gameplay - as long as it's done in a civil and constructive way - which until you started with the abuse, it was being done as such..


I suggest you cool down a little and think before you type.. and consider reading the forum rules...


If you need further guidance, the members here will advise you or you can contact myself or a member of the moderation team.


Now.. back on topic with out the swearing or the insults to other members.. and see if this thread can be recovered... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

alright sir im sorry for my swearing, i guess i didnt think before typing, so please forgive me it will not come up again http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

primerib69
08-02-2010, 11:56 PM
Damn straight bro no one messes with Shade http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

It's all good though. We're all bros http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Xanatos2007
08-03-2010, 12:51 AM
This happens a lot with games; the developers tend to forget the original "raw" concept that drew players in in the first place and dumb down the final product. Particularly with stealth games, developers tend to lean more towards the action side of things (well, Ubisoft does anyway). Even though Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory was probably one of the best stealth games I've played they even went a bit backwards in that aspect by giving the player a shotgun and a 20mm sniper attachment (although I never felt the need to use them and the game didn't encourage it). And must I point out all the flaws in SC: Conviction, a 3rd-person shooter with vague stealth elements? The only stealth series I've played that's remained consistent the whole way through was Thief and Hitman. <span class="ev_code_WHITE">Both made by Eidos.</span>

Assassin's Creed is drifting further & further from the original concept that drew us all in in the first place. I remember seeing the first gameplay demo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbYiV4IiWeI) (notice how combat is a last resort) and the cinematic trailer, (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJ-Do4hfzOs) how 'fresh' and 'realistic' it seemed. The combat was a lot harder, meaning you'd have to rely more on stealth to get anything done (how a stealth game should be). The visuals were a lot more immersive as well; there was no coloured filter (Acre/Venice were blueish, Damascus/Florence were orangey, Jerusalem/Tuscany were more yellow) and the Animus didn't make everything glow electronically and didn't have stupid HUD interfaces popping up diverting the player's attention (the villa chest & "Hold Mouse0 for a strong attack" being the most annoying).

The crowd was a lot more reactive to the player's actions, such as when climbing the building. But stealth wasn't that important in the final product; when I first got it I was shocked when I saw that I could climb buildings right in front of guards and the only people who seemed to really care were the beggars (they were probably just jealous). The combat was way too easy as well, given the amount of regenerating health the player was given. It was odd how I could get into a massive fight during a mission and it would have no impact whatsoever on my overall performance.

The level design was also dumbed down a lot. When I heard that you have to do investigations on your target before you struck it didn't bother me one bit, since that's how assassinations are usually carried out (95% investigation, 5% assassination). But I was more into the mindset of Thief when I thought about the investigations, that the game would maybe point out the general area of your objective and force the player to actually look for information themselves. Stormpen probably knows what I'm on about, as is any Thief player; conversations and important documents weren't marked out on the map but required diligent exploration to find and conversations happened randomly. In AC it was completely different; instead of stalking around looking for intelligence I was forced to run errands for lazy novices and press maybe 1 or 2 buttons near a pair of people wearing big neon signs on their backs saying "INFORMATION, HERE!" with no sense of achieving anything. All of which was marked conveniently on my map as though the game thought I wasn't paying attention to the Rafik's directions and forgot which way North is.

AC2 and AC:B have drifted a lot further from the original concept that they're practically on the opposite hemisphere.

@ArtofParkour: I actually think the multiplayer is the best bit of Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood so far, as I've said before. (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/5251069024/m/4691014078/p/1)

edzilla_551
08-03-2010, 04:30 AM
i think acb multiplayer might become really popular if it stays the way its going and more game types are added.

assassins creed FTW!

edzilla_551
08-03-2010, 04:53 AM
Originally posted by Xanatos2007:
This happens a lot with games; the developers tend to forget the original "raw" concept that drew players in in the first place and dumb down the final product. Particularly with stealth games, developers tend to lean more towards the action side of things (well, Ubisoft does anyway). Even though Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory was probably one of the best stealth games I've played they even went a bit backwards in that aspect by giving the player a shotgun and a 20mm sniper attachment (although I never felt the need to use them and the game didn't encourage it). And must I point out all the flaws in SC: Conviction, a 3rd-person shooter with vague stealth elements? The only stealth series I've played that's remained consistent the whole way through was Thief and Hitman. <span class="ev_code_WHITE">Both made by Eidos.</span>

Assassin's Creed is drifting further & further from the original concept that drew us all in in the first place. I remember seeing the first gameplay demo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbYiV4IiWeI) (notice how combat is a last resort) and the cinematic trailer, (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJ-Do4hfzOs) how 'fresh' and 'realistic' it seemed. The combat was a lot harder, meaning you'd have to rely more on stealth to get anything done (how a stealth game should be). The visuals were a lot more immersive as well; there was no coloured filter (Acre/Venice were blueish, Damascus/Florence were orangey, Jerusalem/Tuscany were more yellow) and the Animus didn't make everything glow electronically and didn't have stupid HUD interfaces popping up diverting the player's attention (the villa chest & "Hold Mouse0 for a strong attack" being the most annoying).

The crowd was a lot more reactive to the player's actions, such as when climbing the building. But stealth wasn't that important in the final product; when I first got it I was shocked when I saw that I could climb buildings right in front of guards and the only people who seemed to really care were the beggars (they were probably just jealous). The combat was way too easy as well, given the amount of regenerating health the player was given. It was odd how I could get into a massive fight during a mission and it would have no impact whatsoever on my overall performance.

The level design was also dumbed down a lot. When I heard that you have to do investigations on your target before you struck it didn't bother me one bit, since that's how assassinations are usually carried out (95% investigation, 5% assassination). But I was more into the mindset of Thief when I thought about the investigations, that the game would maybe point out the general area of your objective and force the player to actually look for information themselves. Stormpen probably knows what I'm on about, as is any Thief player; conversations and important documents weren't marked out on the map but required diligent exploration to find and conversations happened randomly. In AC it was completely different; instead of stalking around looking for intelligence I was forced to run errands for lazy novices and press maybe 1 or 2 buttons near a pair of people wearing big neon signs on their backs saying "INFORMATION, HERE!" with no sense of achieving anything. All of which was marked conveniently on my map as though the game thought I wasn't paying attention to the Rafik's directions and forgot which way North is.

AC2 and AC:B have drifted a lot further from the original concept that they're practically on the opposite hemisphere.

@ArtofParkour: I actually think the multiplayer is the best bit of Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood so far, as I've said before. (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/5251069024/m/4691014078/p/1)

to be honest mate you lost me on what ac youre talking about...

Xanatos2007
08-03-2010, 05:08 AM
I was talking about how far AC1 was drifting from the original 'stealth' concept and that the other two games are drifting even further.

edzilla_551
08-03-2010, 05:40 AM
oh ok, well i guess you have to forget about the original stealth concept because the devs obviously have, and you have to look at ac in a new way according to the direction there going with ac2 and brotherhood, which is more of a game with variety in missions and more freedom for the assassin in the open world which in my opinion is a good direction. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Xanatos2007
08-03-2010, 05:52 AM
Then they could at least change the title to something more suitable, like "Hooded Thugs" or something.

edzilla_551
08-03-2010, 05:57 AM
Originally posted by Xanatos2007:
Then they could at least change the title to something more suitable, like "Hooded Thugs" or something.

why would you say that assassins creed is an awesome name, lol hats off to the one who came up with it! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Xanatos2007
08-03-2010, 06:01 AM
You mean aside from the fact that it has little to do anymore with 'Assassins' (not just a group by the same name) and a 'Creed'?

And would you please use punctuation? Your posts are getting hard to read properly.

wukalok
08-03-2010, 06:05 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/inlove.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

Xanatos2007
08-03-2010, 06:08 AM
Originally posted by wukalok:
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/inlove.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

edzilla_551
08-03-2010, 06:12 AM
seriously i !dont care for@ punctuation RR so sorry _ but you have to deal ?with it#

Xanatos2007
08-03-2010, 06:29 AM
Originally posted by edzilla_551:
seriously i !dont care for@ punctuation RR so sorry _ but you have to deal ?with it#
And I hate the direction AC is going and the way fanboys like you keep defending the series. So sorry, but you have to deal with it. http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/sauer/angry-smiley-047.gif

SBRedFlag
08-03-2010, 07:44 AM
Originally posted by Xanatos2007:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by edzilla_551:
seriously i !dont care for@ punctuation RR so sorry _ but you have to deal ?with it#
And I hate the direction AC is going and the way fanboys like you keep defending the series. So sorry, but you have to deal with it. http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/sauer/angry-smiley-047.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

WIN

Edzilla, I understand you're excited about the game, but simply ignoring people that disagree with you is usually not the way to go. It's like the 4 year olds you plug there ears and say "I can't year you!". You're doing pretty much the same thing. So before I stop posting in this thread which has transformed from a discussion of a game's good and bad points into a good reasons vs. "no you're wrong" thread, I'm going to say one thing: Assassin's Creed Brotherhood is still going to be a decent, maybe even good game. The multiplayer looks amazing, for one, and the story will be interesting. However, as someone who has been with the series since the first game, the trend I've been seeing is going downwards, not upwards.

Oatkeeper
08-03-2010, 09:13 AM
I agree with xanatos to a degree, ive said several times in recent threads that one thing that bugged me about AC2 is the lack of a need for stealth. The game doesn't really encourage it. Players need to feel like getting into fights with more than 3-4 guards at a time is a threatening situation to be in, and guards need to be able harder to lose than just climb a building.

Its also a growing concern that the creed is becoming less relevant as it was one of my favorite parts of the story in AC1(the whole honorable warrior thing may be cliche, but its still a good for a plot) as well as it being the games namesake.

xChupa
08-03-2010, 11:43 AM
@Xanatos

I haven't read all your posts in this thread, but im just going to bring in my opinion anyways.

First of all, the series is not necessarily moving away from stealth. Sure, the cinematic trailers are making every game look more action based, but anything stealth-related that you could do in the first game you can do in AC2 or AC:B.

In fact, imo AC2 improved on AC1's stealth by allowing specific stealth takedowns and moving bodies (which wasnt needed often but did help occasionally). Being able to discretely assassinate someone while hanging on a ledge, in a bale of hay, on a bench, or a rooftop garden thing made the game feel much more like a stealth game to me. Sure, this series focuses on social stealth so often those assassinations may not be needed, but theres no denying that they are very helpful and helped improved the series.

There were also weapons such as the poison blade which was even more unnoticeable than the hidden blade. Additionally, new gameplay mechanics were added such as having thieves steal from/distract gaurds so you could slip past unnoticed.

Just because the gameplay and combat was much easier doesnt mean you couldnt be stealthy. Sure, if you wanted to you could barge into w/e fortress you're target is in and fight your way to him. But did you have to? No. You dont have to treat the game like that. Just because thats an option with little consequence compared to the first game, doesnt mean its the only option. You could still plan your attack and stealthily remove guards just the same way you could in AC1.

Im not saying AC2 trumps AC1 in every aspect however. I much preferred how AC1 handled the whole "assassin" thing, with being part of a large 'clan' of assassins. In AC2 you just felt like an angry man who craved revenge killing anyone he saw fit, instead of taking orders and following a strict set of rules such as in AC1.

Also:

And I hate the direction AC is going and the way fanboys like you keep defending the series.
Thats a bit unneeded.
Not everyone who defends the series is a fanboy. You are attacking the series, so do you hate it? Are you just trolling? No, you're a fan of the series (at least AC1 and partially AC2), and you're just stating your opinion. As are these 'fanboys'. In their opinion, the series is still great and heading in the right direction.

Again, this is just my opinion. Im not saying the games are beyond perfect or that their even going in the right direction (i much prefer AC's stealth over combat if that matters, and i hope the series isnt taking a huge leap towards the action crowd like Splinter Cell), im just pointing out some facts.

primerib69
08-03-2010, 02:12 PM
SHADE WHY HAVEN'T YOU CLOSED THIS YET???? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sadeyes.gif

SBRedFlag
08-03-2010, 02:17 PM
Just because the gameplay and combat was much easier doesnt mean you couldnt be stealthy. Sure, if you wanted to you could barge into w/e fortress you're target is in and fight your way to him. But did you have to? No

Really? Think of all the main targets. How many of them are possible to kill with stealth?

Let's list:

Uberto Alberti- No way to stealth assassinate. All you can do is walk up to Uberto (while Uberto says "you..."), then stab him very indiscretely multiple times. Granted, this is when Ezio is still a novice, so we can ignore this one.

Vierri de Pazzi- Again, no way to stealth assassinate. The only way to kill him is through engaging in a fight with your army of mercenaries against his army of guards.

Francesco de Pazzi- Once again, Francesco starts running no matter your approach, so you can't stealth assassinate him.

Antonio Maffei- Finally, a target you can kill with stealth. If you kill his archers, he comes down to investigate the corpses, and you can sneak up behind him and kill him.

Stefano da Bagnone- I'm not sure if you can kill this target stealthily. At the very least, it's very hard to do so, but probably not impossible.

Bernardo Baroncelli- Again, you can't kill him stealthily, he begins running once you get in range, and keeps a cohort of body guards.

Francesco Salvati- As soon as you get in range, even if he doesn't see you, he screams "I warned you to stay away, assassin" and starts a battle with you.

Jacopo de Pazzi- this isn't even an assassination, you just watch Borgia stab him in the throat, then have to fight a hoarde of guards to escape.

And so on, and so forth. Out of the 8 targets I mentioned, you can kill 2 stealthily. In AC1, out of the 8 targets that were not Robert de Sable or Al Mualim, you can kill 7 of them stealthily (you can't kill the Tamir stealthily, the slave trader, because he tries to run away).


Being able to discretely assassinate someone while hanging on a ledge, in a bale of hay, on a bench, or a rooftop garden thing made the game feel much more like a stealth game to me. Sure, this series focuses on social stealth so often those assassinations may not be needed, but theres no denying that they are very helpful and helped improved the series.

There were also weapons such as the poison blade which was even more unnoticeable than the hidden blade. Additionally, new gameplay mechanics were added such as having thieves steal from/distract gaurds so you could slip past unnoticed.

Of course, you're given many tools which would aid stealth assassination, and that's whats frustrating. You have the tools, but you're never given opportunity to use them.



Originally posted by primerib69:
SHADE WHY HAVEN'T YOU CLOSED THIS YET???? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sadeyes.gif
Why would he? There's nothing bad going on here?

P.S. xChupa, I love your sig http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

primerib69
08-03-2010, 02:21 PM
P.S. xChupa, I love your sig http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Yeah bro my boi Zeejay made his sig! Actually most of the sigs you see around here were made by him.

Xanatos2007
08-03-2010, 02:22 PM
Originally posted by sbredflag:
(you can't kill the Talal stealthily, the slave trader, because he tries to run away)
To add to your list, you can also hide in crowds but this just seemed like another hiding spot. Not that you really need hiding spots anyway; guards give up the chase a lot quicker than in the 3rd crusade so it's quicker to just outrun your pursuers.

@xChupa: You should probably read the whole thread first before you judge my response to edzilla's comment.

SBRedFlag
08-03-2010, 02:27 PM
Ah yes, I forgot to mention that. Fanboy is actually the perfect description for certain people, just read the thread.


Originally posted by primerib69:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">P.S. xChupa, I love your sig http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Yeah bro my boi Zeejay made his sig! Actually most of the sigs you see around here were made by him. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not mine.

primerib69
08-03-2010, 02:29 PM
Hey xanatos, I've been looking at this thread or a while and there's something that really bothers me. Your avatar creeps the hell out of me. Like, it scares me.

Xanatos2007
08-03-2010, 02:31 PM
Good. http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/waffen/violent-smiley-036.gif

SBRedFlag
08-03-2010, 02:31 PM
Originally posted by primerib69:
Hey xanatos, I've been looking at this thread or a while and there's something that really bothers me. Your avatar creeps the hell out of me. Like, it scares me.

This sort of spam is what really closes threads, not debates.

primerib69
08-03-2010, 02:33 PM
Originally posted by sbredflag:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by primerib69:
Hey xanatos, I've been looking at this thread or a while and there's something that really bothers me. Your avatar creeps the hell out of me. Like, it scares me.

This sort of spam is what really closes threads, not debates. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

My bad bro I just had to say it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

ArtofParkour
08-03-2010, 02:34 PM
Originally posted by hewkii9:
Tenant 2 suggests you have to hide in plain sight - how does that not sound like stealth?

Well, if you would've read my post you would've known. Hiding in plain sight is a means to and end. You do this to get to your Assassination target. After that, it's really up to the Assassin to chose the method.

I think it's funny how people still prefer a dull character like Altair who would be destroyed by a creative writing professor over Ezio who is a good character that actually fits the time in which he lives.

To each their own I suppose in the world of Sarah Palins.

primerib69
08-03-2010, 02:42 PM
Originally posted by ArtofParkour:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by hewkii9:
Tenant 2 suggests you have to hide in plain sight - how does that not sound like stealth?

Well, if you would've read my post you would've known. Hiding in plain sight is a means to and end. You do this to get to your Assassination target. After that, it's really up to the Assassin to chose the method.

I think it's funny how people still prefer a dull character like Altair who would be destroyed by a creative writing professor over Ezio who is a good character that actually fits the time in which he lives.

To each their own I suppose in the world of Sarah Palins. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sarah Palin is a babe.

hewkii9
08-03-2010, 02:47 PM
Originally posted by ArtofParkour:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by hewkii9:
Tenant 2 suggests you have to hide in plain sight - how does that not sound like stealth?

Well, if you would've read my post you would've known. Hiding in plain sight is a means to and end. You do this to get to your Assassination target. After that, it's really up to the Assassin to chose the method.

I think it's funny how people still prefer a dull character like Altair who would be destroyed by a creative writing professor over Ezio who is a good character that actually fits the time in which he lives.

To each their own I suppose in the world of Sarah Palins. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
And if you read my post you would know that I don't consider stealth as the be-all and end-all of how to play Assassin's Creed. quiet in, and LOUD OUT! You said that quiet in is how an assassin should do it. "Hiding in plain sight is a means to and end. You do this to get to your Assassination target." My problem with AC2 is that there is so rarely a chance to properly quiet in.

God, we get it. You don't like Altair and you're probably Ernest Hemingway. Please do not use "Altair would be destroyed by a creative writing professor" as a debating point. It doesn't even make any sense. Are you a creative writing professor? If so, please tell me why.


Also, primerib69. Have you ever contributed anything to a discussion? Here's what I see when I read your posts.


Sarah Palin is a babe.

Meh

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Subject 16 please

Yep.

mmmhmmmmm....

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Yep.
The rest of your posts are either sucking up to Shade or saying "Welcome to the forums". Do you ever say anything meaningful?

ArtofParkour
08-03-2010, 02:52 PM
I don't want a conflict, but I do agree with you about primeri. Sorry dude, but "Sarah Palin is a babe." is simple spam. Hilarious spam, but spam nontheless.http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

I was being silly and using Sarah Palin as an example of how anyone can have an opinion. I'm certainly not Ernest Hemmingway, lol. I just think there is more character depth to Ezio than Altair and from my experience with past writing teachers, they absolutely despise when you use a character like Altair with no real depth of character to him.

Now, with that said. I personally like Altair. I understand that he was supposed to be this staunch and cold killer and I don't think it was a horrible job at that. He served his purpose and I quite enjoyed AC1 (obviously, or I wouldn't of played two.) You're trying to have some sort of argument and that is far from what I desire. I was just making my point and apparently you took issue with it (I don't know why).

After all, this is just a game and we're going completely off topic now. You have your view (and I respect it), I have mine. We somewhat disagree, though I think we agree on most points aside from the Altair-Ezio debate. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

That's the end of it.

hewkii9
08-03-2010, 02:58 PM
Since you decided to bring up how Altair fails as a proper literary character in a topic completely unrelated to that [we weren't even discussing AC1's story, instead its gameplay] I felt the need to rebut. That's all.

primerib69
08-03-2010, 02:59 PM
Dude. Hewkii. Bro. Yeah. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

ArtofParkour
08-03-2010, 03:02 PM
There is your answer, hewkii.


Originally posted by hewkii9:
Since you decided to bring up how Altair fails as a proper literary character in a topic completely unrelated to that [we weren't even discussing AC1's story, instead its gameplay] I felt the need to rebut. That's all.

Fair enough.

Now to get things back on-topic: Apparently there will be singe player gameplay at GamesCom and I'm very curious to see what they show off. I know at E3 some insiders were shown the "BAM" system where the Assassins helped Ezio in a mission. I'm hoping that we'll get a demonstration of that at least.

hewkii9
08-03-2010, 03:09 PM
Originally posted by ArtofParkour:
Now to get things back on-topic: Apparently there will be singe player gameplay at GamesCom and I'm very curious to see what they show off. I know at E3 some insiders were shown the "BAM" system where the Assassins helped Ezio in a mission. I'm hoping that we'll get a demonstration of that at least.

I'm a little bothered that the developers haven't shown a single second of single-player Rome gameplay, considering that's what we'll be doing for fifteen hours. Partially I just want to know if you can reconstruct Ezio's rampage from Castel Sant Angelo to the Sistine Chapel.

ArtofParkour
08-03-2010, 03:22 PM
I agree 100%. I don't know what to think really. From the people that have seen it, they say it's great, but it is very curious as to why they haven't shown any gameplay to the public.

masterfenix2009
08-03-2010, 03:35 PM
Originally posted by sbredflag:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
Just because the gameplay and combat was much easier doesnt mean you couldnt be stealthy. Sure, if you wanted to you could barge into w/e fortress you're target is in and fight your way to him. But did you have to? No

Really? Think of all the main targets. How many of them are possible to kill with stealth?

Let's list:

Uberto Alberti- No way to stealth assassinate. All you can do is walk up to Uberto (while Uberto says "you..."), then stab him very indiscretely multiple times. Granted, this is when Ezio is still a novice, so we can ignore this one.

Vierri de Pazzi- Again, no way to stealth assassinate. The only way to kill him is through engaging in a fight with your army of mercenaries against his army of guards.

Francesco de Pazzi- Once again, Francesco starts running no matter your approach, so you can't stealth assassinate him.

Antonio Maffei- Finally, a target you can kill with stealth. If you kill his archers, he comes down to investigate the corpses, and you can sneak up behind him and kill him.

Stefano da Bagnone- I'm not sure if you can kill this target stealthily. At the very least, it's very hard to do so, but probably not impossible.

Bernardo Baroncelli- Again, you can't kill him stealthily, he begins running once you get in range, and keeps a cohort of body guards.

Francesco Salvati- As soon as you get in range, even if he doesn't see you, he screams "I warned you to stay away, assassin" and starts a battle with you.

Jacopo de Pazzi- this isn't even an assassination, you just watch Borgia stab him in the throat, then have to fight a hoarde of guards to escape.

And so on, and so forth. Out of the 8 targets I mentioned, you can kill 2 stealthily. In AC1, out of the 8 targets that were not Robert de Sable or Al Mualim, you can kill 7 of them stealthily (you can't kill the Tamir stealthily, the slave trader, because he tries to run away).


Being able to discretely assassinate someone while hanging on a ledge, in a bale of hay, on a bench, or a rooftop garden thing made the game feel much more like a stealth game to me. Sure, this series focuses on social stealth so often those assassinations may not be needed, but theres no denying that they are very helpful and helped improved the series.

There were also weapons such as the poison blade which was even more unnoticeable than the hidden blade. Additionally, new gameplay mechanics were added such as having thieves steal from/distract gaurds so you could slip past unnoticed.

Of course, you're given many tools which would aid stealth assassination, and that's whats frustrating. You have the tools, but you're never given opportunity to use them.



Originally posted by primerib69:
SHADE WHY HAVEN'T YOU CLOSED THIS YET???? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sadeyes.gif
Why would he? There's nothing bad going on here?

P.S. xChupa, I love your sig http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

actually you can kill him without him noticing usually i go behind his guards assassinate them than i kill bernardo.or i hide in a well and kill him when he needs a place to sleep http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

SBRedFlag
08-03-2010, 05:21 PM
All right, I'll give you that one. But it's more more difficult than simply storming up to him, killing his bodyguards, and then killing him.

And yeah, I was going to say the same thing about primerib. He does that in every single topic...

xChupa
08-03-2010, 08:27 PM
Originally posted by sbredflag:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
Just because the gameplay and combat was much easier doesnt mean you couldnt be stealthy. Sure, if you wanted to you could barge into w/e fortress you're target is in and fight your way to him. But did you have to? No

Really? Think of all the main targets. How many of them are possible to kill with stealth?

Let's list:

Uberto Alberti- No way to stealth assassinate. All you can do is walk up to Uberto (while Uberto says "you..."), then stab him very indiscretely multiple times. Granted, this is when Ezio is still a novice, so we can ignore this one.

Vierri de Pazzi- Again, no way to stealth assassinate. The only way to kill him is through engaging in a fight with your army of mercenaries against his army of guards.

Francesco de Pazzi- Once again, Francesco starts running no matter your approach, so you can't stealth assassinate him.

Antonio Maffei- Finally, a target you can kill with stealth. If you kill his archers, he comes down to investigate the corpses, and you can sneak up behind him and kill him.

Stefano da Bagnone- I'm not sure if you can kill this target stealthily. At the very least, it's very hard to do so, but probably not impossible.

Bernardo Baroncelli- Again, you can't kill him stealthily, he begins running once you get in range, and keeps a cohort of body guards.

Francesco Salvati- As soon as you get in range, even if he doesn't see you, he screams "I warned you to stay away, assassin" and starts a battle with you.

Jacopo de Pazzi- this isn't even an assassination, you just watch Borgia stab him in the throat, then have to fight a hoarde of guards to escape.

And so on, and so forth. Out of the 8 targets I mentioned, you can kill 2 stealthily. In AC1, out of the 8 targets that were not Robert de Sable or Al Mualim, you can kill 7 of them stealthily (you can't kill the Tamir stealthily, the slave trader, because he tries to run away). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
To be honest, idk the targets names so idk who you were describing with each description. However i can say that during my 2 playthroughs it seemed like i could stealth kill my targets, or at least stealth my way to them by quietly killing guards. I could of course not be remembering right though i played it a while ago...

Heres just one example of one of the guys i killed:
During the carnival when you had to kill the guy on the boat, the game said something like, "you'll be seen if you swim to the boat, kill him with your hidden gun!" But that wasnt even true. I swam to the boat unnoticed and climbed up the side of it opposite of where my target was delivering a speech. I then pulled a brute over the edge of it into the water and climbed up the ropes to the top of the boat on the watch tower. I then air assassinated my target from above where the top of the sails are, and made my getaway by diving into the water and staying under until i was in a safe location.

Originally posted by Xanatos2007:
@xChupa: You should probably read the whole thread first before you judge my response to edzilla's comment.
Thats true, but my post was mostly just to everyone in general, not specific to you (even though i said '@Xanatos') except where i quoted you of course, and you're right i shouldve more but hey, im lazy http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Originally posted by sbredflag:
P.S. xChupa, I love your sig http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
Thanks http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
It was made by zeejay21 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

edzilla_551
08-03-2010, 09:30 PM
e al
Originally posted by xChupa:
@Xanatos

I haven't read all your posts in this thread, but im just going to bring in my opinion anyways.

First of all, the series is not necessarily moving away from stealth. Sure, the cinematic trailers are making every game look more action based, but anything stealth-related that you could do in the first game you can do in AC2 or AC:B.

In fact, imo AC2 improved on AC1's stealth by allowing specific stealth takedowns and moving bodies (which wasnt needed often but did help occasionally). Being able to discretely assassinate someone while hanging on a ledge, in a bale of hay, on a bench, or a rooftop garden thing made the game feel much more like a stealth game to me. Sure, this series focuses on social stealth so often those assassinations may not be needed, but theres no denying that they are very helpful and helped improved the series.

There were also weapons such as the poison blade which was even more unnoticeable than the hidden blade. Additionally, new gameplay mechanics were added such as having thieves steal from/distract gaurds so you could slip past unnoticed.

Just because the gameplay and combat was much easier doesnt mean you couldnt be stealthy. Sure, if you wanted to you could barge into w/e fortress you're target is in and fight your way to him. But did you have to? No. You dont have to treat the game like that. Just because thats an option with little consequence compared to the first game, doesnt mean its the only option. You could still plan your attack and stealthily remove guards just the same way you could in AC1.

Im not saying AC2 trumps AC1 in every aspect however. I much preferred how AC1 handled the whole "assassin" thing, with being part of a large 'clan' of assassins. In AC2 you just felt like an angry man who craved revenge killing anyone he saw fit, instead of taking orders and following a strict set of rules such as in AC1.

Also:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">And I hate the direction AC is going and the way fanboys like you keep defending the series.
Thats a bit unneeded.
Not everyone who defends the series is a fanboy. You are attacking the series, so do you hate it? Are you just trolling? No, you're a fan of the series (at least AC1 and partially AC2), and you're just stating your opinion. As are these 'fanboys'. In their opinion, the series is still great and heading in the right direction.

Again, this is just my opinion. Im not saying the games are beyond perfect or that their even going in the right direction (i much prefer AC's stealth over combat if that matters, and i hope the series isnt taking a huge leap towards the action crowd like Splinter Cell), im just pointing out some facts. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

i agree,what he said. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

SBRedFlag
08-04-2010, 08:13 AM
Uberto Alberti- The fat guy that sentences the Auditores to death.

Vierri de Pazzi- The spoiled brat who Ezio fights in the beginning.

Francesco de Pazzi- The guy who tries to kill the Medicis, and is hanged off the building.

Antonio Maffei- The crazy monk that's on top of a tower.

Stefano da Bagnone- The monk hiding in the monastery that is actually aetheist.

Bernardo Baroncelli- The guy that says "he'll get bored, lost, confused, dead" and wears a pink getup.

Francesco Salvati- The guy who roams around his walled complex in what look like pajamas, and carries a giant axe.

Jacopo de Pazzi- The old guy that Borgia kills.

But yeah, the guy you mentioned, the Templar Doge of Venice (Barbarigo, I think), is also one of the few that you can stealth assassinate. However, the developers intended for you to use the hidden gun from land, and it was only a happy mistake that allows you to kill him from the boat.

My point is that unlike AC1, where Malik says "Yes, I know about [target]'s death. In fact, THE WHOLE CITY KNOWS!!", your "advisors" in AC2 encourage just facing your targets head on.

Stormpen
08-04-2010, 08:50 AM
What happened with ACII was, they added loads of new gameplay mechanics, systems etc, etc, and made it appeal to 'a wider audience'. They also made the missions a bi less repetitive, which was good. But they lost the whole concept of the 'Assassin's Creed'. I notice they tried to explain it away with one of the codex pages, but the fact is the Assassin's Creed series is going all gung-ho, and for those of us who liked the first game for it's basic clandestine concept, it's a bit disappointing.

And,


Originally posted by primerib69:
Hey xanatos, I've been looking at this thread or a while and there's something that really bothers me. Your avatar creeps the hell out of me. Like, it scares me.

http://blogs.warwick.ac.uk/images/animesoc/2006/02/28/alucard.jpg?maxWidth=500

<sub>Couldn't resist.</sub>

SBRedFlag
08-04-2010, 09:18 AM
What happened with ACII was, they added loads of new gameplay mechanics, systems etc, etc, and made it appeal to 'a wider audience'. They also made the missions a bi less repetitive, which was good. But they lost the whole concept of the 'Assassin's Creed'. I notice they tried to explain it away with one of the codex pages, but the fact is the Assassin's Creed series is going all gung-ho, and for those of us who liked the first game for it's basic clandestine concept, it's a bit disappointing.


Thank you! That's exactly what I've been trying to get across this whole time.


i agree,what he said. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif
...this is why there should be an age restriction on these boards... ARGH, CHILDREN

xChupa
08-04-2010, 02:31 PM
Originally posted by sbredflag:
My point is that unlike AC1, where Malik says "Yes, I know about [target]'s death. In fact, THE WHOLE CITY KNOWS!!", your "advisors" in AC2 encourage just facing your targets head on.
Thats a good point, and its true.

I see where you're coming from, all i was trying to say is that even though stealth is not enforced like in AC1, its still (usually) possible. But i can see how thats not a very strong argument.

I actually agree a lot with what you said now that i actually get what you mean, and i hope AC:B and AC3 go back to the whole 'Creed' part of "Assassin's Creed", with a bigger emphases on stealth.

However, you must realize that even though the main targets are not focused dramitically on stealth doesnt mean its not a stealth game. The little details where you sneak past guards and whatnot are still 100% stealthable. One example: when you had to steal the boxes of Archer costumes for your team to dress up as archers, you could get all the 3 boxes w/o being noticed (i think, maybe im thinking of 2 different missions though).

Also just real quick: Are you disappointed that AC2 didn't have a consequence for not using stealth, or because you thought AC2 didnt allow stealth?

SBRedFlag
08-04-2010, 02:39 PM
Both, really. I wish that the consequence for not using stealth was that it would be harder and the chances of dying would be greater, instead of being easier. I also wish that it was possible to stealth kill more of the main targets, since it felt much more rewarding. I still loved AC2, but not for the same reasons.



i hope AC:B and AC3 go back to the whole 'Creed' part of "Assassin's Creed", with a bigger emphases on stealth.

Yeah, me too. Hopefully since the multiplayer has been focusing so much on stealth so far, and it's clear that you have to be stealthy to be great at it, the devs were in the stealth mindset for the next game http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif



However, you must realize that even though the main targets are not focused dramitically on stealth doesnt mean its not a stealth game. The litter details where you sneak past guards and whatnot are still 100% stealthable. One example: when you had to steal the boxes of Archer costumes for your team to dress up as archers, you could get all the 3 boxes w/o being noticed (i think, maybe im thinking of 2 different missions though).
I completely agree, and that's part of what made AC2 so fun. (and no, you're thinking of one mission http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif )

KCizzll
08-05-2010, 04:21 AM
@OP I'm also VERY impatient for MP ever since seeing the E3 footage http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

So that mitigates my fear that the campaign will be a sword sim stuck on easy mode.

I like stealth games so I agree with much of what Xanatos was saying. In AC1 it was already too easy to take out multitudes of guys and AC2 was a slap in the face to all the heavy gamers who enjoy a challenge.
I have no problem with casual gamers getting a good experience but give us a difficulty slider!
And really ALL the main assassinations should be stealth possible except maybe a final boss or if it's absolutely needed for plot development.
For side assassinations give a 50% cash bonus for doing it without a trace, give us some *incentive*.


PS- Question: Is there an ability to reload from last checkpoint w/o just dying? For some of the main assassinations I'd like to do this so I can do 'em stealthy but letting NPCs slowly chop me is frustrating, as is quitting and reloading http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

Xanatos2007
08-05-2010, 04:27 AM
Originally posted by Cronstintein:
For side assassinations give a 50% cash bonus for doing it without a trace, give us some *incentive*.
Actually that won't help either, since with the villa & everything players already have plenty of cash spilling out of their ears.

PS- Question: Is there an ability to reload from last checkpoint w/o just dying? For some of the main assassinations I'd like to do this so I can do 'em stealthy but letting NPCs slowly chop me is frustrating, as is quitting and reloading http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif
I couldn't agree more. Dying seems to take a lot longer when you're actually trying to get killed. Give us a checkpoint reloading feature damn it!

Murcuseo
08-05-2010, 04:36 AM
Originally posted by Cronstintein:

[QUOTE]PS- Question: Is there an ability to reload from last checkpoint w/o just dying? For some of the main assassinations I'd like to do this so I can do 'em stealthy but letting NPCs slowly chop me is frustrating, as is quitting and reloading http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

I had problems with this aswell, but thankfully there are many tall structures to launch yourself off if the need calls for it.

tehz0mgbie
08-13-2010, 03:06 PM
woops, i left this go for so long and forgot to check back i let the entire thing get by me! 5 pages! wow!

I saw the first diary come out, but now i want the reset :P

KCizzll
08-13-2010, 06:15 PM
How about if you successfully do an assassination mission stealthy like, whatever follower you brought with you gets a small xp bonus. Since you just showed him how it's done. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

EzioAssassin51
08-13-2010, 08:05 PM
Originally posted by Cronstintein:
How about if you successfully do an assassination mission stealthy like, whatever follower you brought with you gets a small xp bonus. Since you just showed him how it's done. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

That would be pretty good. I think if you manage to kill you target stealthily, you get BroHood XP bonus and the end-mission reward, but if you don't then you only get the reward!

thekyle0
08-13-2010, 09:32 PM
I think it's kind of difficult to say whether the stealth has regressed or progressed between AC1 and 2. While AC2 certainly had more tools for stealth, it lacked a proportional amount of instances in which those tools could be used. With the exception of missions which arbitrarily desync you when exposed, every mission could be done by the sword; several even force you to. The majority of the rest could be done with the air assassination. So in description it would sound like stealth was expanded, but in experience it felt just as limited. I don't really have high hopes for the single player stealth aspect in ACB, but the combat has me excited. While it's certainly not quite like the original demo of the AC1 combat system, it looks like a strong improvement. Then again, I suppose in experience it could work out like AC2's stealth system.

@xChupa, two of your examples are wrong to a degree, unless by "kill with stealth" you accept the "quiet in, LOUD OUT" mentality."

xChupa:
Stefano da Bagnone- I'm not sure if you can kill this target stealthily. At the very least, it's very hard to do so, but probably not impossible.

Bernardo Baroncelli- Again, you can't kill him stealthily, he begins running once you get in range, and keeps a cohort of body guards.
Stefano - climb up the outerside tower of the monastery to get on the roof of the abbey. then jump into a cart filled with leaves and use eagle vision to locate Stefano. As he walks past the cart and has his back turned to it jump out, run over to him, and stab him. It's advisable to use a smoke bomb, to incapacitate the guards that will rush over to you.

Bernardo, take a wide detour to get on the city walls (preferably from the side that goes up hill since a group of guards patrols in the other direction) and position Ezio on top of the caved in structure that overlooks the area Bernardo is walking in. You can just air-assassinate him when he walks near the wall. This is once again a "loud out" situation but a band of theives and a band of mercenaries are close at hand to bail you out. I prefer to leave the mercenaries waiting, but already payed for, nearby so that they start fighting right when Bernardo's guards respond.

itsamea-mario
08-14-2010, 06:56 AM
Yeah, the thing that brought me in to the first AC was the whole stealthy assassin, and the setting.
this post is not at all me rtying to cover the fact i made a large reply to someones post without noticing that there where 4 more pages to this thread.