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Kaleun1961
10-01-2005, 06:13 PM
I encountered some strange behaviour on the part of a convoy. This was my first convoy since installing the new U-boat War Ace mod. I can't say if it was due to the mod or not, just adding it for information background.

The weather was high wind, 15 mps, with the resultant big waves. This concerned me, because of the possibility of being discovered while trying to maintain periscope depth in rough water in daylight. Nevertheless, I approached submerged to the front of the convoy and began my setup on the Southampton light cruiser at the front of the convoy.

The convoy was in disarray, with poor station keeping. I thought it would make an attack very difficult, as many ships were not on a steady course. I chose the cruiser because it was a high value target and was keeping a steady course, which seemed to me to offer the greatest promise of a sinking.

Here is an overhead map view of the convoy. you can see how the ships were scattered about.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy001.jpg

I moved into position on the cruiser, launching 2 G7E electric torpedoes, to minimize the chance of their wake being spotted and the cruiser evading. I launched from about 400 metres away, so perhaps steam torpedoes would have been alright, with the target having very little time to evade them, but I decided to play it safe and opted for the electrics. Both hit and caused massive damage to the cruiser.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy003.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy004.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy005.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy006.jpg

Here are some photos of the convoy. Notice how many ships are on different headings.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy007.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy008.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy009.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy010.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy011.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy012.jpg

At the rear of the convoy was an escort in some form of distress. It was heeled over to one side, as if damaged and flooded.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy013.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy014.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy015.jpg

After the cruiser exploded, I was damaged somehow. Perhaps it was collateral damage from the cruiser, as I was within 300-400 metres of her when the torpedoes detonated. It may have been from her firing at my conning tower as it was exposed in the pitching sea, I can't say for certain. My bridge was completely destroyed, as were both of my periscopes. My flak gun and deck gun areas were heavily damaged, but repairable.

I stayed under at about 120 metres and evaded by the back of the convoy. When I eventually surfaced, four of my crewmen were instantly killed in the act of going up top. I don't know how that happened, but that distressed escort was nearby, but tilted right over. I don't see how it would have been possible for her to fire on me. After the four crewmen were killed, I wasn't bothered again. I tried to sink the escort, but I could not get the UZO to work for surface firing. Thinking that it might be radioing my position to the convoy, I immediately left the area at top speed. After a nervous run home, without a bridge watch, we made it to port and laid up for repairs. Here is a photo of the distressed escort as I found it when I surfaced.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a299/K-61/Convoys/Convoy016.jpg

Kaleun1961
10-01-2005, 07:12 PM
I'm beginning to think there is a problem with this new mod. I'm on my second patrol, outbound, and have just intercepted another convoy, which is behaving exactly the same as the previous one; ships out of line, same escorts, seems to be an exact copy.

I've just uninstalled the mod and am going to try again to see if there is any difference in game play without this mod installed.

Gunnersman
10-01-2005, 11:20 PM
Thanks for the report.
Does that "bearing indicator" (for lack of a better word) come with the mod?

Was each ship zig zagging or just kind of drunkenly wandering around? Or what?
Was the convoy moving on a base course?

deckard1982
10-02-2005, 12:17 AM
from my experience this can happen when the leader ship of the convoy is sunk, whitout a leader the convoy will get dissoriented,

in U-Boat War Ace mod- Axis patrols are increased wich could increase the chance that the convoy would have runned into a firefight before you encountered it.
since you also explain that one of the escorts seemed to be damaged this was most likely what had happend.

i wouldnt call it a bugg, more maybe a future of the mod http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Chrystine
10-02-2005, 12:22 AM
*

Indeed €" great presentation & a valuable report. Many thanks!
Some great shots, as well. The 3rd from the bottom in particular is superb!

From the look and sound of it, it does rather create impression that you€ve there run into a Convoy that€s already been harried by other U-boats €" or, in any event, by something that threw them a panic-attack.

It seems as well that someone (recent U-boat attack?) hit that Destroyer rather smartly. Look like she€s in a world of trouble out there.
Incidentally €" kudos for a good €˜clean€ kill of that Southampton.

There seems some strange €˜stuff€ afoot €¦
Although I€m not-using that Mod (U-Boat War Ace Mod) -

I mentioned to you earlier about my coasting off the north-west coast of England, trying to repair those tubes & etc€¦
While there (and about five minutes before being jumped by a couple very healthy Hurricanes) I noticed two columns of smoke ashore on the near-horizon.
Couldn€t resist a look €" so went over in Free Cam to see what was burning.
Rather strange €" I found two €˜dead€ Hurricanes just laying on the ground maybe some thousand meters or so apart.
Never seen anything like that before.

I did not engage either €" or any €" aircraft, so whatever killed them, it wasn€t me. I hadn€t fired at any aircraft for well over a week €" and no-where around €˜here.€

http://idealhorizons.intuity.net/P-5_Dead_HCcanes_1a.jpg
http://idealhorizons.intuity.net/P-5_Dead_HCcanes_2a.jpg
http://idealhorizons.intuity.net/P-5_Dead_HCcanes_3a.jpg

Might you or anyone else have any thoughts about this?
Wonder what€s up€¦ - ?

It makes me wonder €" yet-again €" whether there really isn€t a €œwar going on€ out here €" whether we€re present for all the action or not.
I mean €" what€s the point in €˜scripting€ that? It€s meaningless isn€t it?
Who in their (her http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif ) right mind would bring a U-boat to within shouting distance of the coast of England €˜here?€ There€s nothing here. It€s another 30-40 miles to reach Loch Ewe.
It couldn€t be expected anyone would €˜see€ those two smoldering piles of once-were Hurricanes.
Did they run out of fuel together and crash?
Were they shot down? ..If so, by whom, by what?
* shrugs * I have no clue€¦.

All I know for sure is €" they were there, and U-53 didn€t do it.

Best,
~ C.

*

WirMussen
10-02-2005, 08:40 AM
@Kaleun: as stated, the convoy may have stumbled across a pocket BB, but i have no experience of that happening in the game, id put it down to the mod (ship may have been damaged in a collision). but without trying it i really wouldnt know.

@Chrystine: something like that happened to me recently, at periscope depth i was checking out a convoy, when i saw what looked like 2 meteors coming down in the distance, didnt get a screenie in time, but i went over and checked it out. 2 hurricanes must of collided mid-air. which is what happen on my flak-gunning exam. planes are too dumb in this game.

ILikePortillos
10-02-2005, 08:50 AM
I was actually wondering about the likelyhood of air attacks. Would it be possible that the Luftwaffe (active in the North Atlantic) could have made a strike earlier? I came upon a convoy once, escorted by Corvettes, and one of them was LOW in the water. No bad weather either.

TheRealWulfmann
10-02-2005, 09:08 AM
Open the RND.mis file in the campaign folder. Scroll down to RND group 61, the first convoy. See what the spacing is. If it is 400 change it to 500.
At 400, the ships go crazy at waypoints. They will still have realignment problems at 500 or higher, but not ridiculous as with 400.

Another way to do this faster is when you open the RND, click edit, scroll to €œfind€. This will open a box, copy the RND Group 1 into that box, then change the 1 to 61 and click €œfind next€. After looking at 61, change to 62 and click €œfind next€. Do this through RND Group 118 which is all the convoys and change the distances to 500 or 600 (What I did). The farther the distance, the farther the escorts are away. At 800-900 they will not bother you at all even if you reload in the middle of a burning convoy. I want them to act more like, I don€t know, ESCORTS!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Wulfmann

Gunnersman
10-02-2005, 09:54 AM
Originally posted by ILikePortillos:
I was actually wondering about the likelyhood of air attacks. Would it be possible that the Luftwaffe (active in the North Atlantic) could have made a strike earlier? I came upon a convoy once, escorted by Corvettes, and one of them was LOW in the water. No bad weather either.

There was a post a few month back with screen shots. The Kaleun watched a Luftwaffe attack on a convoy from his periscope.

Chrystine
10-02-2005, 10:53 AM
*

€œ2 hurricanes must [have] collided mid-air.€

I thought about that possibility also €" but the only time I€ve ever seen aircraft collide is when €˜swarming€ in attack mode (and have only seen Sunderlands collide: my husband has also seen Hurricanes collide tho€).
One would think they could fly in formation on ASW Patrol without clipping each other with fatal effect €¦ http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif
It is very possible that€s what brought these two down tho€.
I suppose it€s probably even the most likely.

Best,
~ C.

*

Nick_Toznost
10-02-2005, 11:09 AM
I've just installed a fresh, unmodded version of SH3 (after a bad mod conflict I had before) and I'm at patrol no 6, march 1941. I came across a convoy in the Irish sea. Looking through the periscope I noticed that 1 of the ships, a C2, was on fire. When I looked at the torpedo computer room I noticed the ships were scattered, in pretty much the fashion on your screenshot.

Believe me, they are seriously hard to hit when like that, moving around in all different directions, I shot 4 torps at a T3 and missed every time, it was rotating in circles.

My presumption is that either this is some kind of (effective) defence manouvre or a bug in the original game.

As I said unmodded, it's happened to me, but only once.

Fekin_Von_dEtRi
10-02-2005, 11:11 AM
I have had Hurricanes and other planes crashing into eachother a couple of time too.

Chrystine
10-02-2005, 11:24 AM
*

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

At the same time, I do think all these little anomalies make SH III more interesting and a richer experience on the whole.
SH III is like a box of chocolates€¦ http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Best,
~ C.

*

W.Irving
10-02-2005, 12:13 PM
Ever been to Scapa Flow in the wake of a big storm?
The islands are usually littered with burning Swordfish. I'll show you a few screenies when I get home. There are little bonfires everywhere!
And this in vanilla SHIII.

Kaleun1961
10-02-2005, 12:48 PM
I've never seen anything like this before. What has me suspecting it is the mod is that I came across the exact same convoy on my next patrol, same configuration, same behaviour. I bailed on it, abandoned the career and uninstalled the mod.

r1fl3m4n1990
10-02-2005, 01:52 PM
SH3_EarlySurface2

r1fl3m4n1990
10-02-2005, 01:54 PM
www.elements.lx.ro

r1fl3m4n1990
10-02-2005, 02:05 PM
http://files.filefront.com/SH3_EarlySurface2jpg

r1fl3m4n1990
10-02-2005, 02:06 PM
http://files.filefront.com/SH3_EarlySurface2jpg
re

Kaleun1961
10-05-2005, 06:21 PM
Originally posted by TheRealWulfmann:
Open the RND.mis file in the campaign folder. Scroll down to RND group 61, the first convoy. See what the spacing is. If it is 400 change it to 500.
At 400, the ships go crazy at waypoints. They will still have realignment problems at 500 or higher, but not ridiculous as with 400.

Another way to do this faster is when you open the RND, click edit, scroll to €œfind€. This will open a box, copy the RND Group 1 into that box, then change the 1 to 61 and click €œfind next€. After looking at 61, change to 62 and click €œfind next€. Do this through RND Group 118 which is all the convoys and change the distances to 500 or 600 (What I did). The farther the distance, the farther the escorts are away. At 800-900 they will not bother you at all even if you reload in the middle of a burning convoy. I want them to act more like, I don€t know, ESCORTS!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Wulfmann

Last night I did what you suggested, manually changing any references that were at 400 to 600. I did this while I was in the process of attacking a convoy that was all messed up from trying to keep station at 400. As soon as I loaded the new file, set at 600, they all began to sort themselves out. This is definitely what was causing the problem.

While attacking this convoy, I penetrated into the middle of the columns and began to attack. Out front was a destroyer which seemed to be in some form of distress, perhaps from the storm. I was tempted to attack it, as it was doing only 2 knots and was heeled over to one side. I ignored it and proceeded with my attack on a T3 tanker. The destroyer sank on its own.

I proceeded to reload and sink several ships in the convoy. This convoy had 8 escorts, but at no time did they make contact with me. One of them dropped a few depth charges at some distance from me, but nowhere close to me to cause any worries. I even ran at high speed at periscope depth, occasionally my conning tower broaching, but still not one escort came into the convoy columns to hunt for me. I think this is not only unrealistic, but it also is unchallenging, so I am going to manually adjust all the convoys down to 500 and see what difference this makes.

cuthy2k
10-05-2005, 06:37 PM
I have seen the odd couple of planes crashed before, only once though have i seen them (2 hurricans) collide. Usually only sunderlands that are dumb enough to do that http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

Another thing i have noticed is that if there is a carrier docked in Scapa Flow then the amount of crashed Swordfish around the islands is immense! I know my Ack-Ack skills are good but they aint that good http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

It seems as if they just crash from lack of fuel and/or being unable to land... anyone else found this?