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zerocooll21
11-16-2011, 11:20 AM
Couple things Tinia said that have me thinking.

Why did he call Desmond a Cypher?

Ezio's last two words before Tinia spoke sounded like "Now, Listen". Did Ezio see that message somehow? Did I hear it wrong? Anyone else notice the audio was often trumped by the background music?

Tinia talks about "6 methods for salvation". Anyone care to take a stab at what those methods could be? If the 6 best ideas TWCB had didn't work, how is man kind suppose to figure it out?

Sync Nexus - Is this something that the Animus creates? How/Why does Tinia Show up there?

snazzyjabber123
11-16-2011, 11:55 AM
Well, a ' Sync Nexus' is a memory in which both ancestors are present.
So this happens when he Is collecting the five masyaf keys.
This needs to happen, so that the animus can differentiate between Desmond, Ezio, and Altair.

zerocooll21
11-16-2011, 12:52 PM
Sorry, might have been to vague. I was referring more to why/how Tinia was there. Thanks for the reply though http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

BK-110
11-16-2011, 02:04 PM
I would guess that the presence of all three major characters, the Sync Nexus, was the trigger for the Apple to activate the "hologram" of Jupiter/Tinia.

zerocooll21
11-16-2011, 02:27 PM
Originally posted by BK-110:
I would guess that the presence of all three major characters, the Sync Nexus, was the trigger for the Apple to activate the "hologram" of Jupiter/Tinia.

Ah, I'll buy that. Thanks.

zerocooll21
11-17-2011, 08:16 AM
Bump,

Anyone got any ideas on my other questions?

BlackRose1809
11-17-2011, 09:55 AM
I loved the ending. It was good. But the thing I hated is that for one thing we learned a new one came up. Kinda reminded me of Kingdom Hearts series, but you know.

Anyways, I hated how we don't learn much about what the Ezio said to Desmond, what did desmond learn and what the hell happened at the end with the TWCB. ( I didn't quite understand what they were saying.) But yeah...

The one thing I was looking forward to be answered but never was: WHY DID JUNO MAKE DESMOND STAB LUCY!?

One thing that also confused me: Why and how Desmond got back on Animus Island at the very end? I know it was just for us to complete the game but... usually they give a reason for them to put him back in.

But yeah. xD

Oh and Altair.... I was sad for him.

zerocooll21
11-17-2011, 10:26 AM
Basically Tinia told Desmond to go to the grand temple (coordinates from Davinci Disappearance and where he wakes up in the van) and seek the knowledge TWCB left behind. There were 6 ways they determined would be ideal for saving the planet from the CME but ran out of time to find a solution.

What I'm guessing happens in AC3 is Desmond walks out of the van and into the grand temple. Inside there will be puzzles to navigate through the temple and at some points he'll have to jump back into the animus to find what ever clues/answers he needs.

I think it would be cool if he went back to Adams time and maybe after that and lived when TWCB walked the earth. I think this fits b/c its got a modern feel to it but still so far back in time its believable they didn't have the tech we have today. In that vid of the world ending I didn't see one car or anything to lead me to believe they had reached today's worldly inventions.

Lucy is dead so Desmond can Find Eve and together their DNA will activate some machine to "save" the world. There isn't enough time to have a baby so it doesn't make sense why they killed Lucy. If Desmond and Eve could get done with what they need to do without a baby,then why bother taking Lucy out of the equation?

I noticed there was a message that said reloading Aniumus program after the game was done. Once back on the island you'll notice the two last pillars (where you access the Desmond sections) are now fixed but still no doorway. I have only got 40 data fragments, wondering if I get 100 they will be available. Or could be set up for a DLC. I don't think there was any good way to end it like they did in ACII. Just not feasible to say after he just awoke from a coma he needs to go back into the animus to tie up loose ends.

Very sad seeing Altiar and Ezio go. Its funny, these past couple days I have felt like I just mutually ended a relationship. You know its for the best but sad to see them go xD

LxLAS3RzZz
11-17-2011, 10:54 AM
I recently finished it, Desmond says "I know what I have to do." about to hopefully get some Desmond playing time, so I'm going. "Come on, come on." and the credits pop up for me only to shout "NO!" this next Game cannot come any slower.

De Filosoof
11-17-2011, 12:34 PM
I was also very disappointed with the Lucy part.
Was this the revelation? Bill, Shaun and Rebecca telling lucy is buried?
Why were the Desmond missions so meaningless...
Why not access stuff we didn't know. For example the funeral of Lucy. So first we create a bond with her in AC:2 and AC:B and then just kill her and that's it?! big letdown.

Tygerhetoric
11-17-2011, 12:52 PM
I just finished AC:R, and as much as I wished to have a little bit of Desmond playing time, I am pretty satisfied with how it ended. It just seemed to end so suddenly.

I didn't expect to be so bummed out when Ezio found Yusuf Tazim dead seeing as he was such a new character. I really liked him for some reason.
So much sympathy for Altaďr's condition near the end, and partially to Desmond.
I've never received so much from a series of games. And I can not wait for the next.

I'm guessing it will be mostly about Desmond, well I am hoping anyway.

Berneri
11-17-2011, 12:59 PM
Originally posted by zerocooll21:
Very sad seeing Altiar and Ezio go. Its funny, these past couple days I have felt like I just mutually ended a relationship. You know its for the best but sad to see them go xD
Haha! You summarized my feeling perfectly. XD Thank you!

zerocooll21
11-17-2011, 01:02 PM
Originally posted by Berneri:
Haha! You summarized my feeling perfectly. XD Thank you!

haha, glad I'm not the only one. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Gil_217
11-17-2011, 01:44 PM
I am very pleased with the Assassin's Creed series. The character development of Ezio in the 3 games that he was featured is absolutely amazing really, it's beautiful, one of my all time favorite characters. The only thing that I didn't like was Ezio dying when his children were so young. Of course that he had to die, but he deserved to finally live with peace, and for that reason he deserved to watch his children grow up.

zerocooll21
11-18-2011, 05:33 AM
True that

samward
11-18-2011, 07:00 AM
going to dive in head first with my questions and then my thoughts on the game, some of which have already been mentioned here already...

1.Lucy:
-So other then knowing that she really is dead, we don’t know much about her death. Shawn alludes to Daniel Cross and asks Will M. if Desmond could have been used by the Templars in the same way… but other then Will saying he does not think so, we don’t get any answer.

-So that leaves me wondering, was it some programming by the Templars, who knew Lucy was a mole, to kill her?

-Or was it the Apple or Juno who was the force that made Desmond kill her? And if so why? Does that confirm she was a traitor?

-Also somewhere William mentions that he trained both Lucy and Desmond when they were younger, does that mean that Desmond knew her when he lived on the Farm? And if so, why did he not remember her?


2.Those Who Came Before:
-So we know a bit more now and with new knowledge comes a lot more questions. This is to be expected, as they have to keep our attention. However, I fail to see how they will make the logical leap to answer the questions they have posed.

-In the ending Jupiter says to Desmond that they tried to find a solution to save the earth, and while each time they came closer, the world ended before an answer could be found.

-So my questions is, if 3 of TWCB, who had all the artifacts at their disposal and had 100% advanced DNA pumping through them, were unable to figure out how to save the world… how is Desmond, who only has part TWCB DNA and just one apple suppose to figure out a way to save the earth?

3.he Apples:
-So the apple that Altair hid in his Library, is that the same apple that exploded in the Denver Airport accident?

-Also before Altair seals himself into his Library he tells his son to send people on a false trail and say the apple is hidden Cyprus. Yet that is where Rodrigo finds the Apple that ends up in Ezio’s, and later, in Desmond’s possession. So who put it there, if it was suppose to be a false trail?

4.Denver
-In ACB William writes Shawn and tells him that the Denver team has gone black… what happened to them? I hope they answer that in AC3.


So those are my big questions. Over all though the game was great. Really amazing improvements to game play mechanics. It really is effortless now. But with that said, could do without the den’s defense system, can get laborious after a awhile. The citys look fantastic; and the underground Templar city was breathtaking! I loved the romance that grew between Ezio and Sophia, and though the way that Altair and Ezio’s life ended ( in the game) was sublime. I have to say I got a bit choked up in that least bit with Altair. Cant wait till then next game!

zerocooll21
11-18-2011, 08:20 AM
Originally posted by samward:
1.Lucy:
-So other then knowing that she really is dead, we don’t know much about her death. Shawn alludes to Daniel Cross and asks Will M. if Desmond could have been used by the Templars in the same way… but other then Will saying he does not think so, we don’t get any answer.

-So that leaves me wondering, was it some programming by the Templars, who knew Lucy was a mole, to kill her?

-Or was it the Apple or Juno who was the force that made Desmond kill her? And if so why? Does that confirm she was a traitor?

-Also somewhere William mentions that he trained both Lucy and Desmond when they were younger, does that mean that Desmond knew her when he lived on the Farm? And if so, why did he not remember her?

I agree if you blinked you’d miss her death, very poor job with a major character. I do however believe she is dead, Juno speaks of him needing to find Eve to pass through a gate. If Desmond needs to find Eve then it makes sense for Juno to remove Lucy (love interest) from the equation. Juno forced him to kill her, that much was clear from the ending of ACB. What doesn’t fit is the true assassins were able to resist the power or the apple (in the mind control department) so that shouldn’t have been able to happen.
Good point on the Lucy/Desmond training, I wonder if she showed up just after he ran away. Was there ever any mention of a timeline for that?



Originally posted by samward:
2.Those Who Came Before:
-So we know a bit more now and with new knowledge comes a lot more questions. This is to be expected, as they have to keep our attention. However, I fail to see how they will make the logical leap to answer the questions they have posed.

-In the ending Jupiter says to Desmond that they tried to find a solution to save the earth, and while each time they came closer, the world ended before an answer could be found.

-So my questions is, if 3 of TWCB, who had all the artifacts at their disposal and had 100% advanced DNA pumping through them, were unable to figure out how to save the world… how is Desmond, who only has part TWCB DNA and just one apple supposed to figure out a way to save the earth?


The bloodlines of TWCB were diluted over time. Desmond however is a culmination of that bloodline re-emerging through the centuries. Think of a family tree growing to a peak then going in the opposite direction. I forget where I read it but it was stated Desmonds blood has a very high concentration of TWCB blood which is why he is special.
I also think this ties into “the awaking” Juno speaks of. I’m starting to think Desmond will turn into a TWCB and have to sacrifice himself to save the world. If you remember there was an easter egg in one of the trailers that said “three lives toiled, three lives lost”. That seems to me desmond will die in AC3. Plus his arm now has symbols all over it.
How he does it, no idea. I thought the same thing when Jupe said they were unsuccessful haha.


Originally posted by samward:
3.he Apples:
-So the apple that Altair hid in his Library, is that the same apple that exploded in the Denver Airport accident?

-Also before Altair seals himself into his Library he tells his son to send people on a false trail and say the apple is hidden Cyprus. Yet that is where Rodrigo finds the Apple that ends up in Ezio’s, and later, in Desmond’s possession. So who put it there, if it was supposed to be a false trail?
It sure looks that way. What I don’t get is S16 said what E/A/D all had in common was that specific apple. If it was blown up then how did Desmond get his hands on it?
I have no clue on the Cyprus, might be a coincidence. I agree though really strange how he would say that. Also strange how the man at the end of embers comes speaking of women and Rome, Like he knew who Ezio was.


Originally posted by samward:
4.Denver
-In ACB William writes Shawn and tells him that the Denver team has gone black… what happened to them? I hope they answer that in AC3.


No idea.

samward
11-18-2011, 09:08 AM
Originally posted by samward:
2.Those Who Came Before:
-So we know a bit more now and with new knowledge comes a lot more questions. This is to be expected, as they have to keep our attention. However, I fail to see how they will make the logical leap to answer the questions they have posed.

-In the ending Jupiter says to Desmond that they tried to find a solution to save the earth, and while each time they came closer, the world ended before an answer could be found.

-So my questions is, if 3 of TWCB, who had all the artifacts at their disposal and had 100% advanced DNA pumping through them, were unable to figure out how to save the world… how is Desmond, who only has part TWCB DNA and just one apple supposed to figure out a way to save the earth?


The bloodlines of TWCB were diluted over time. Desmond however is a culmination of that bloodline re-emerging through the centuries. Think of a family tree growing to a peak then going in the opposite direction. I forget where I read it but it was stated Desmonds blood has a very high concentration of TWCB blood which is why he is special.
I also think this ties into “the awaking” Juno speaks of. I’m starting to think Desmond will turn into a TWCB and have to sacrifice himself to save the world. If you remember there was an easter egg in one of the trailers that said “three lives toiled, three lives lost”. That seems to me desmond will die in AC3. Plus his arm now has symbols all over it.
How he does it, no idea. I thought the same thing when Jupe said they were unsuccessful haha.

yeah it mentions about Desmond’s high concentration of TWCB DNA in the Encyclopedia. While I agree with you that the bloodline was weakened over time; and now by a fluke, or natural section, Desmond has a freak amount of “pure” DNA in him making him the person to save the world…. This aside, I think my point was missed.

What I was saying is that Juno, Minerva and Jupiter were the originals, you can not get any higher concentration of TWCB. Because there were, TWCB. This being said, they also had the staff, the shroud, sword and apples to help them in their task, and still could not complete it. Desmond only has one apple and only some of TWCB DNA, so while he may have a better chance then anyone else on earth of saving us all from being burnt to a crisp… the odds are not in his favor. I just cant figure out how the writers can say that these evolved beings could not figure it out, with their extra knowledge and POE’s and still make a plausible expiation on how Desmond is going to figure it out….

As far as the easter egg goes, I know what one you are talking about. But I don’t think it was referring to Desmond, rather I think it was referring Juno, Minerva and Jupiter, all three who were toiled to find the solution to save earth, and all three who lost their lives cause they could not do so.

At any rate will be interesting to see what they do with it. I am just praying that it ends well … I am so scared of it ending like LOST. The story has been so believable hope they don’t loose that in this last game.

I also agree that they did not provide really any closure for Lucy. I think it would have been nice to end the game with Desmond paying homage to her in some way. But maybe in a DLC or in the next game.

They have a lot of old questions to answer still, as well as plenty of new ones… like the red foot prints what was the deal with those? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

zerocooll21
11-18-2011, 09:21 AM
Originally posted by samward:
This aside, I think my point was missed.
Nah I totally agree with you, I just think this is one of those “it’s a video game” arguments. I agree no sense but it also wouldn’t make much sense to have the world end in the AC universe.


Originally posted by samward:
As far as the easter egg goes, I know what one you are talking about. But I don’t think it was referring to Desmond, rather I think it was referring Juno, Minerva and Jupiter, all three who were toiled to find the solution to save earth, and all three who lost their lives cause they could not do so.
Oh Very nice! Didn’t think of that ?


Originally posted by samward:
At any rate will be interesting to see what they do with it. I am just praying that it ends well … I am so scared of it ending like LOST. The story has been so believable hope they don’t loose that in this last game.
I never got into Lost, what happen that you’re comparing too?

Originally posted by samward:
I also agree that they did not provide really any closure for Lucy. I think it would have been nice to end the game with Desmond paying homage to her in some way. But maybe in a DLC or in the next game.
True that

Originally posted by samward:
They have a lot of old questions to answer still, as well as plenty of new ones… like the red foot prints what was the deal with those? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif
LOL The Dev’s already commeted that the trail was there to let the game testers know how to get back to the villa. The artist who did it just picked red. No mystery, nothing special. Yah kinda of a let down haha.

billy-regal
11-18-2011, 09:48 AM
Originally posted by samward:
3.he Apples:
-So the apple that Altair hid in his Library, is that the same apple that exploded in the Denver Airport accident?

-Also before Altair seals himself into his Library he tells his son to send people on a false trail and say the apple is hidden Cyprus. Yet that is where Rodrigo finds the Apple that ends up in Ezio’s, and later, in Desmond’s possession. So who put it there, if it was suppose to be a false trail?


I was also wondering about that. I always thought that the apple that Altair possessed in AC1 was the exact same apple that Rodrigo and Ezio try to obtain in AC2. They say that it was found in Cyprus. Ezio then hides it under the Colosseum.
But when Ezio, as an old man, arrives in Masyaf, he finds the apple hidden in the vault where Altair left it before he died. How is that possible? Ezio already HAD the apple! And he left the apple there in Masyaf! That can only mean that there are two apples! But then: How does Altair possess TWO apples? The one that he got in AC1 and the one Ezio got later was hidden in Cyprus - but then why does he tell his son he should spread lies about Cyprus? It all doesn't make sense to me.

And I'm also disappointed that we don't get to know why Lucy was killed.

Another thing: What exactly does Desmond now know? We saw a huge map of the world in the end, and if I am not mistaken then the place where the big temple stands is in or around New York City? Can someone confirm that? And when Desmond wakes up, we can see a glimpse of the farm, right? So that means, the "Monterriggioni" of AC3 will be the Assassin's Farm, and we will need to find the temple in NYC? Sounds... strange.

samward
11-18-2011, 09:51 AM
Originally posted by zerocooll21:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by samward:
This aside, I think my point was missed.
Nah I totally agree with you, I just think this is one of those “it’s a video game” arguments. I agree no sense but it also wouldn’t make much sense to have the world end in the AC universe.


Originally posted by samward:
As far as the easter egg goes, I know what one you are talking about. But I don’t think it was referring to Desmond, rather I think it was referring Juno, Minerva and Jupiter, all three who were toiled to find the solution to save earth, and all three who lost their lives cause they could not do so.
Oh Very nice! Didn’t think of that ?


Originally posted by samward:
At any rate will be interesting to see what they do with it. I am just praying that it ends well … I am so scared of it ending like LOST. The story has been so believable hope they don’t loose that in this last game.
I never got into Lost, what happen that you’re comparing too?

Originally posted by samward:
I also agree that they did not provide really any closure for Lucy. I think it would have been nice to end the game with Desmond paying homage to her in some way. But maybe in a DLC or in the next game.
True that

Originally posted by samward:
They have a lot of old questions to answer still, as well as plenty of new ones… like the red foot prints what was the deal with those? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif
LOL The Dev’s already commeted that the trail was there to let the game testers know how to get back to the villa. The artist who did it just picked red. No mystery, nothing special. Yah kinda of a let down haha. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

well that is a let down on the red trail thing! :P As far as LOST, it was just a cryptic story that had a lot of conspiracy and mystery in it, and in the end they chose a " everyone was already dead" cop out ending that made no sense at all. while i doubt Ubi would use that particular cop out, there are many more to choose from. I just want the story to end well. To understand what happened and to feel like everything has come full circle. Questions answered, a thought provoking or moving ending and satisfaction.

zerocooll21
11-18-2011, 10:45 AM
Originally posted by billy-regal:
I was also wondering about that. I always thought that the apple that Altair possessed in AC1 was the exact same apple that Rodrigo and Ezio try to obtain in AC2. They say that it was found in Cyprus. Ezio then hides it under the Colosseum.
But when Ezio, as an old man, arrives in Masyaf, he finds the apple hidden in the vault where Altair left it before he died. How is that possible? Ezio already HAD the apple! And he left the apple there in Masyaf! That can only mean that there are two apples! But then: How does Altair possess TWO apples? The one that he got in AC1 and the one Ezio got later was hidden in Cyprus - but then why does he tell his son he should spread lies about Cyprus? It all doesn't make sense to me.

And I'm also disappointed that we don't get to know why Lucy was killed.

Another thing: What exactly does Desmond now know? We saw a huge map of the world in the end, and if I am not mistaken then the place where the big temple stands is in or around New York City? Can someone confirm that? And when Desmond wakes up, we can see a glimpse of the farm, right? So that means, the "Monterriggioni" of AC3 will be the Assassin's Farm, and we will need to find the temple in NYC? Sounds... strange.

There are 5-6 different apples. See AC Wiki for explanations.
From the Davinci Dissapearance we know the location of the grand temple which is in NY.
I didn’t see any “farms” just that they are a rocks through away from a remote place in NY.


Originally posted by samward:
well that is a let down on the red trail thing! :P As far as LOST, it was just a cryptic story that had a lot of conspiracy and mystery in it, and in the end they chose a " everyone was already dead" cop out ending that made no sense at all. while i doubt Ubi would use that particular cop out, there are many more to choose from. I just want the story to end well. To understand what happened and to feel like everything has come full circle. Questions answered, a thought provoking or moving ending and satisfaction.
Ahh, gotcha. Yah lets hope they don’t cop out like that.

So do you have any idea why Tinia called Des a Cypher?

LordWolv
11-18-2011, 12:05 PM
Sigh.. It's strange I guess. The whole memory in the library made me so emotional..
The last key was what particularly hit me. Altair embracing his end, and it was pulled off by Ubisoft so brilliantly. Truly amazing. His last sight of another human, putting out the torches, laying down the apple. And then the chair... When the camera panned around the chair firstly seeing Altair dying, then 600 years later and his corpse next to Ezio. That sent shivers down my spine. That exact moment was also when I shed a tear.. Believe it or not.

The strange thing is, it's felt like I've ended a long and amazing relationship... You don't want it to end, but you know it's for the better. And that's exactly how I've felt with Altair and Ezio.

Ubisoft, well done, and thank you. Thank you so much.
Thank you for Altair and Ezio.
Thank you for everything.
Requiescat in pace, Altair and Ezio.
Requiescat in pace.

zerocooll21
11-18-2011, 12:13 PM
Originally posted by Isaac500:
Sigh.. It's strange I guess. The whole memory in the library made me so emotional..
The last key was what particularly hit me. Altair embracing his end, and it was pulled off by Ubisoft so brilliantly. Truly amazing. His last sight of another human, putting out the torches, laying down the apple. And then the chair... When the camera panned around the chair firstly seeing Altair dying, then 600 years later and his corpse next to Ezio. That sent shivers down my spine. That exact moment was also when I shed a tear.. Believe it or not.

The strange thing is, it's felt like I've ended a long and amazing relationship... You don't want it to end, but you know it's for the better. And that's exactly how I've felt with Altair and Ezio.

Ubisoft, well done, and thank you. Thank you so much.
Thank you for Altair and Ezio.
Thank you for everything.
Requiescat in pace, Altair and Ezio.
Requiescat in pace.

Well said, Same here http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

The_Sphinx
11-18-2011, 05:42 PM
For every question answered, three new ones arise.

I wonder if we ever get to figure out just what the hell is going on.

dylanfrim
11-18-2011, 06:13 PM
so the revelations were?

1.under masayaf is altairs apple
2.the old civilization was killed by the sun
3.lucy is dead
4.subject 16 is dead
5.desmond must use the temples to save the world
6.ezio finally figures out his purpose: he is just a messenger


im still confused though,
-why did lucy have to die?
-who is eve?
-what did subject 16 mean about desmond having a son?
-why do the templars want to get to the temples?
-how did subject 16 die?
-how are the TWCB able to predict the destruction of the earth? but unable to predict their own demise
-do the templars know about possible ending of the world?

DSchneiderIII
11-18-2011, 11:19 PM
Did Subject 16 truly die? I have been a huge fan since the first Assassin's Creed, and it's the simple things that keep you curious.

Subject 16 states that he has been waiting, "a lot of waiting." Then he asks Desmond if he can join him upon waking. In my heart I want to believe that we haven't seen the last of Subject 16. It just keeps reminding me of Chekhov's Gun theory. Subject 16's eagerness to get out cannot go unnoticed, he had his reasons for saving Desmond, but I hope that our beloved mystery man still lingers in the back of Desmond's mind.

Also, Lucy's death is unresolved. I'm sure we will see some details on that. My thoughts revert back to AC1 where, in the beginning, Altair was "killed" in the same way by Al Mualim.

And lastly, "the cross darkens the horizon," Juno said in ACB. Which of our beloved (Modern Day) Assassins is the mole?

TRhardcorezzGC
11-19-2011, 01:55 AM
does anyone know how to get onto the 5 desmond sequences

zerocooll21
11-19-2011, 02:02 AM
Originally posted by TRhardcorezzGC:
does anyone know how to get onto the 5 desmond sequences

You need 30 data fragments. There are 100 around the whole game.

xX ryche Xx
11-19-2011, 02:42 AM
Originally posted by dylanfrim:

-what did subject 16 mean about desmond having a son?

Maybe in the end clip showing the world falling apart wasn't the world of TWCB. Perhaps it was showing Desmond a glimpse of the future. The woman holding the baby could be Eve and that could be his son which once hit by the "wave" (whatever it was) then proc's and causes that glowing that was seen before it went to another segment.

I'll be honest though I just finished the game and thought when I saw the scene of people dying that it was the future even though the statue was there. Perhaps the only way to save humanity is sending everyone back in time. That would explain how TWCB knew Desmond would be watching Ezio's memories and all that prophet stuff. They're trying to set him on the path so their future comes true.

That or I'm just tired.

MrGerbz
11-19-2011, 06:26 AM
Originally posted by BlackRose1809:
I loved the ending. It was good. But the thing I hated is that for one thing we learned a new one came up. Kinda reminded me of Kingdom Hearts series, but you know.

Anyways, I hated how we don't learn much about what the Ezio said to Desmond, what did desmond learn and what the hell happened at the end with the TWCB. ( I didn't quite understand what they were saying.) But yeah...

The one thing I was looking forward to be answered but never was: WHY DID JUNO MAKE DESMOND STAB LUCY!?

One thing that also confused me: Why and how Desmond got back on Animus Island at the very end? I know it was just for us to complete the game but... usually they give a reason for them to put him back in.

But yeah. xD

Oh and Altair.... I was sad for him.

These are basically my exact thoughts.

The big question all AC fans were hoping to be answered was why and how Desmond stabbed Lucy.
The only thing we heard about it? That she was just buried... Sweet jeebus, talk about crushing any hope http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

It was also awesome to see Ezio finally referring to Desmond directly, even got my hopes up for an actual conversation between the two, even though it's impossible as you only experience what has already happened.

And damn, Ubisoft handled it pretty good, but Altaďr made me very sad too. I never get emotional from movies / games / books / whatever, but this got me very close. I mean, we've experienced a lot with Altaďr, and while not at the same level of for example Super Mario, he was an iconic hero. To see such a man become old and weak, and actually see him die (and even worse, see what's left of him...), wow.

I was also really disappointed how Subject 16 was handled. We have been wondering for years who he was, what he looked like, etc. He got way too little screen-time in my opinion.

Something else that severely disappointed me was how Desmond and his friends were handled. Sure his levels were artful and pretty decent in their own right, but I would've much preferred his history to be experienced like we experience Altaďr and Ezio.
And I wanted to interact with Rebecca and Shaun dammit. I mean, there is hardly any series as immersive as Assassin's Creed, you really get attached to the characters.

KuldarYldrad
11-19-2011, 09:06 AM
Originally posted by zerocooll21:
I noticed there was a message that said reloading Aniumus program after the game was done. Once back on the island you'll notice the two last pillars (where you access the Desmond sections) are now fixed but still no doorway. I have only got 40 data fragments, wondering if I get 100 they will be available. Or could be set up for a DLC. I don't think there was any good way to end it like they did in ACII. Just not feasible to say after he just awoke from a coma he needs to go back into the animus to tie up loose ends. I finished the game wiht 100% synch and 100/100 fragment. There is nothing to do with thoses pillars. So it's for a DLC. Maye the one in january.

zerocooll21
11-19-2011, 12:21 PM
Originally posted by KuldarYldrad:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by zerocooll21:
I noticed there was a message that said reloading Aniumus program after the game was done. Once back on the island you'll notice the two last pillars (where you access the Desmond sections) are now fixed but still no doorway. I have only got 40 data fragments, wondering if I get 100 they will be available. Or could be set up for a DLC. I don't think there was any good way to end it like they did in ACII. Just not feasible to say after he just awoke from a coma he needs to go back into the animus to tie up loose ends. I finished the game wiht 100% synch and 100/100 fragment. There is nothing to do with thoses pillars. So it's for a DLC. Maye the one in january. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>]

oh cool, thanks man http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Andy_Pandy86
11-19-2011, 05:52 PM
Originally posted by samward:

yeah it mentions about Desmond’s high concentration of TWCB DNA in the Encyclopedia. While I agree with you that the bloodline was weakened over time; and now by a fluke, or natural section, Desmond has a freak amount of “pure” DNA in him making him the person to save the world…. This aside, I think my point was missed.

What I was saying is that Juno, Minerva and Jupiter were the originals, you can not get any higher concentration of TWCB. Because there were, TWCB. This being said, they also had the staff, the shroud, sword and apples to help them in their task, and still could not complete it. Desmond only has one apple and only some of TWCB DNA, so while he may have a better chance then anyone else on earth of saving us all from being burnt to a crisp… the odds are not in his favor. I just cant figure out how the writers can say that these evolved beings could not figure it out, with their extra knowledge and POE’s and still make a plausible expiation on how Desmond is going to figure it out….


From my understanding, it's not that Desmond is somehow better than TWCB. Nor does he have to figure out the problem. It's that there was so much in-fighting and conflict at the time that they didn't begin looking for a solution early enough and so ran out of time. After the disaster, not everyone perished and so the ones that survived continued to search for a solution knowing that future generations would need the technology as it would happen again. They did eventually come up with a method of saving the earth when it happens again and that is what's contained in the underground temples.

But seeing as it's powerful 'alien' tech. Beyond the understanding and wisdom of us mere mortals, they didn't want just anyone being able to wield this technology. (It could be manipulated and used for evil. EVILLLLL!) See; Templars.

So when they repopulated the earth they made a special bloodline that would contain their genetic memory and would be able to activate the tech (Like the Ancient Gene in 'Stargate Atlantis') and this bloodline would be guided and taught to use it the way it's meant to be. (Through the Peaces of Eden and through the Holograms). They set the whole thing up to play-out in their absence. (Unless they can also do some time-travel voodoo.)

That's the way I understand it.

R3d_Ace-
11-19-2011, 06:47 PM
what if the artefacts weren't around back when the earth was first going to die and was made towards the end of the twbc's lives and they imprinted themselves into the artefacts the same way altair did his memorys?

Andy_Pandy86
11-19-2011, 08:11 PM
Originally posted by R3d_Ace-:
what if the artefacts weren't around back when the earth was first going to die and was made towards the end of the twbc's lives and they imprinted themselves into the artefacts the same way altair did his memorys?

Always a possibility.

dylanfrim
11-19-2011, 09:00 PM
Originally posted by Andy_Pandy86:


From my understanding, it's not that Desmond is somehow better than TWCB. Nor does he have to figure out the problem. It's that there was so much in-fighting and conflict at the time that they didn't begin looking for a solution early enough and so ran out of time. After the disaster, not everyone perished and so the ones that survived continued to search for a solution knowing that future generations would need the technology as it would happen again. They did eventually come up with a method of saving the earth when it happens again and that is what's contained in the underground temples.

But seeing as it's powerful 'alien' tech. Beyond the understanding and wisdom of us mere mortals, they didn't want just anyone being able to wield this technology. (It could be manipulated and used for evil. EVILLLLL!) See; Templars.

So when they repopulated the earth they made a special bloodline that would contain their genetic memory and would be able to activate the tech (Like the Ancient Gene in 'Stargate Atlantis') and this bloodline would be guided and taught to use it the way it's meant to be. (Through the Peaces of Eden and through the Holograms). They set the whole thing up to play-out in their absence. (Unless they can also do some time-travel voodoo.)

That's the way I understand it.

by far the best explanation of wtf is going on

sandman06
11-19-2011, 10:57 PM
The 2 separate apples is actually fairly explainable. It's clear that as Altair is about to go into the library, he knows a lot about the future. He knows generally what needs to happen, but not what will or who it's for. Like when he gave the keys to Polo and said he knows it's for someone to find, but he doesn't know who. I think him saying to spread lies about Cyrpus was similar to this. He knows there's an apple there and someone is supposed to find it and that no one will be able to except for the one who is supposed to. So instead of trying to explain this, he just says it's a lie, knowing that that person will get word that there is an apple there and find it. Which obviously Ezio does and eventually Desmond.

Yammka01
11-20-2011, 04:27 AM
^ Oooh, I like that interpretation, Sandman. I really like that explanation. Sounds like an excellent way to hide a specific Apple, by directing enemies to a completely different Apple . . .

zerocooll21
11-20-2011, 04:37 AM
Good stuff guys, keep it coming!

rob.davies2014
11-20-2011, 10:47 AM
I finished the game his morning and consequently had to have a lie down. There was a lot to think about and I'm afraid one or two things still puzzle me and I'm hoping you may be able to answer them.
1. I've seen it asked before but have yet to see an answer, how did Ezio's Apple get to Cyprus if Altaďr kept his in Masyaf. Was it a coincidence that Altaďr suggested Cyprus as one of the locations when he told Darim to lie about the Apple?

2. In AC2 we saw (presumably) Eden just after Adam and Eve had stolen an Apple. They looked rather naked and we caught a glimpse of humans being used as slaves by TWCB. However, in AC:R we saw humans living in a similar looking environment and wearing clothes walking around quite freely.
These two views seem conflicting to me, can anyone explain this?
Grazie.

Will_Lucky
11-20-2011, 11:14 AM
I'm surprised Ezio didn't take Altairs apple and seal it elsewhere. It seemed the Templars knew all about the library, even the common foot soldier knew about the keys so surely they knew about the Library in general within Templar circles.

We also know that eventually the Templars would acquire that Apple, according to the Wiki Elizabeth I owned it in the 1500s so presumably the Templars took it very soon after Ezio left, by leaving it with it such common knowledge among Templars he practically gave them a Piece of Eden.

Gil_217
11-20-2011, 11:33 AM
Originally posted by RussellSparrow:
I finished the game his morning and consequently had to have a lie down. There was a lot to think about and I'm afraid one or two things still puzzle me and I'm hoping you may be able to answer them.
1. I've seen it asked before but have yet to see an answer, how did Ezio's Apple get to Cyprus if Altaďr kept his in Masyaf. Was it a coincidence that Altaďr suggested Cyprus as one of the locations when he told Darim to lie about the Apple?

2. In AC2 we saw (presumably) Eden just after Adam and Eve had stolen an Apple. They looked rather naked and we caught a glimpse of humans being used as slaves by TWCB. However, in AC:R we saw humans living in a similar looking environment and wearing clothes walking around quite freely.
These two views seem conflicting to me, can anyone explain this?
Grazie.

To answer your first question, there was an Apple in Cyprus just like there was an Apple in Solomon's Temple in AC1. They were just hidden in different places by TWCB.

At first, I thought that Altair told his son to say that there was an Apple in Cyprus just to fool the Templars, without Altair knowing there was actually an Apple in Cyprus.

Now, I think that he knew about the Apple in Cyprus, telling his son to say to everyone who asked about Altair's Apple that he hid it in Cyprus with the objective of keeping them (Templars) away from his Apple, because Altair knew that someone in the future (Ezio) had to find his Apple.

samward
11-20-2011, 12:20 PM
Originally posted by sandman06:
The 2 separate apples is actually fairly explainable. It's clear that as Altair is about to go into the library, he knows a lot about the future. He knows generally what needs to happen, but not what will or who it's for. Like when he gave the keys to Polo and said he knows it's for someone to find, but he doesn't know who. I think him saying to spread lies about Cyrpus was similar to this. He knows there's an apple there and someone is supposed to find it and that no one will be able to except for the one who is supposed to. So instead of trying to explain this, he just says it's a lie, knowing that that person will get word that there is an apple there and find it. Which obviously Ezio does and eventually Desmond.

Really well thought out. I also like the way u think sir http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

samward
11-20-2011, 12:23 PM
Originally posted by dylanfrim:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Andy_Pandy86:


From my understanding, it's not that Desmond is somehow better than TWCB. Nor does he have to figure out the problem. It's that there was so much in-fighting and conflict at the time that they didn't begin looking for a solution early enough and so ran out of time. After the disaster, not everyone perished and so the ones that survived continued to search for a solution knowing that future generations would need the technology as it would happen again. They did eventually come up with a method of saving the earth when it happens again and that is what's contained in the underground temples.

But seeing as it's powerful 'alien' tech. Beyond the understanding and wisdom of us mere mortals, they didn't want just anyone being able to wield this technology. (It could be manipulated and used for evil. EVILLLLL!) See; Templars.

So when they repopulated the earth they made a special bloodline that would contain their genetic memory and would be able to activate the tech (Like the Ancient Gene in 'Stargate Atlantis') and this bloodline would be guided and taught to use it the way it's meant to be. (Through the Peaces of Eden and through the Holograms). They set the whole thing up to play-out in their absence. (Unless they can also do some time-travel voodoo.)

That's the way I understand it.

by far the best explanation of wtf is going on </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

hahahha Well said on both of your parts http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

samward
11-20-2011, 12:52 PM
Originally posted by Isaac500:
Sigh.. It's strange I guess. The whole memory in the library made me so emotional..
The last key was what particularly hit me. Altair embracing his end, and it was pulled off by Ubisoft so brilliantly. Truly amazing. His last sight of another human, putting out the torches, laying down the apple. And then the chair... When the camera panned around the chair firstly seeing Altair dying, then 600 years later and his corpse next to Ezio. That sent shivers down my spine. That exact moment was also when I shed a tear.. Believe it or not.

The strange thing is, it's felt like I've ended a long and amazing relationship... You don't want it to end, but you know it's for the better. And that's exactly how I've felt with Altair and Ezio.

Ubisoft, well done, and thank you. Thank you so much.
Thank you for Altair and Ezio.
Thank you for everything.
Requiescat in pace, Altair and Ezio.
Requiescat in pace.

could not have said it better. loved the ending so much, very moving.

Indian0Lore
11-20-2011, 02:34 PM
Defiantly the last bit where the end of the world for TWCB and then the time shifts and we watch as everything decays and then the plants regrow. That is the location in Turin, NY where we get the coordinates in the DLC of AC:B. I know it is the same location because I got obsessed with that location and studied the maps. (currently in our time there are no windmills marked on the maps)

So the entire time of Revelations is them moving Desmond to the main temple where all of the other research (labs) temples backed up their data.

Also, it looked like to me that the entrance to the temple had been rebuilt. Is it possible that Abstergo or another company has discovered this area already but they didn't have Desmond to open a door?

Desmond's arms are glowing because he is taking what he learned from TWCB and putting it in his hands.

AsydRaiyne
11-20-2011, 03:33 PM
Hey everyone, I've been thinking, how will 'Eve' come into play in the next game. I've noticed the recent involvement of a lot of the female characters, particularly the death of Lucy (absolute bull**** IMO, but I read that the Developers said her death was simply a means to send Desmond into a coma, nothing else), the introduction of Shao Jun, and the woman in the end video. Considering these events, here are my predictions: Shao Jun will be the next major assassin...for some reason. Or. We will play as the woman with the child somehow. Considering, that civilization was more advanced that its successors, since the solar flare was kind of like the reset button on civilization. It's really bugging me, I'm itching to know who and what 'Eve' is. Also, did you all catch the golden gate at the end, with the female gender symbol in the center? God damn it Ubisoft...
On a side note: I think that glow in Desmond's arm may have had something to do with 16. Of course, it's got to do with his TWCB blood, and putting Jupiter's words into his hands, yes yes all of that philosophical stuff. But, I think 16 is in Desmond. Somehow. Maybe I'm blurring expectation and hope. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

dchil279
11-20-2011, 08:34 PM
What I want to know is why in the hell Desmond didn't say at some point to subject 16, "Hey 16, while I have your attention, what the **** have you been trying to tell me all this time?"

twenty_glyphs
11-20-2011, 08:46 PM
Originally posted by dchil279:
What I want to know is why in the hell Desmond didn't say at some point to subject 16, "Hey 16, while I have your attention, what the **** have you been trying to tell me all this time?"

Also, why didn't Subject 16 say, "While you're here, let me tell you this big important thing I've been trying to tell you since I hacked into the Animus core and then killed myself and wrote clues in my own blood!" We finally get to meet Subject 16 and it was so meaningless. He didn't reveal anything new, and his personality seemed so different from what we've already seen of him. Even his voice was different. Just feels like a wasted opportunity. It was probably still too early in the story to reveal what he was really going on about, but to just ignore it in this game makes his appearance feel pointless.

EDIT: As an aside, I wonder what the point of 16 "hugging" Desmond when the Island was being deleted was. Why did he do that before he pushed Desmond into the portal? Was it just for dramatic effect in the story, or was he transferring something of himself into Desmond? Or does it have something to do with playing the game after the credits, since we never saw Desmond go back into the Animus? Could we actually be playing as Subject 16 after Animus Island gets rebuilt during the credits? Subject 16 with Desmond's avatar? Or is it just an imprint of Desmond's consciousness left behind like Subject 16's was?

dylanfrim
11-20-2011, 08:48 PM
Originally posted by AsydRaiyne:
Hey everyone, I've been thinking, how will 'Eve' come into play in the next game. I've noticed the recent involvement of a lot of the female characters, particularly the death of Lucy (absolute bull**** IMO, but I read that the Developers said her death was simply a means to send Desmond into a coma, nothing else), the introduction of Shao Jun, and the woman in the end video. Considering these events, here are my predictions: Shao Jun will be the next major assassin...for some reason. Or. We will play as the woman with the child somehow. Considering, that civilization was more advanced that its successors, since the solar flare was kind of like the reset button on civilization. It's really bugging me, I'm itching to know who and what 'Eve' is. Also, did you all catch the golden gate at the end, with the female gender symbol in the center? God damn it Ubisoft...
On a side note: I think that glow in Desmond's arm may have had something to do with 16. Of course, it's got to do with his TWCB blood, and putting Jupiter's words into his hands, yes yes all of that philosophical stuff. But, I think 16 is in Desmond. Somehow. Maybe I'm blurring expectation and hope. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

i don't think we'll play as a girl. i think i heard somewhere that desmond couldnt relive female memories, but who knows if that is true.

also idt desmond is realated to shao jun. so it would have to be someone else. i dont think desmond has oriental ancestors, but who knows.

AsydRaiyne
11-20-2011, 09:09 PM
That leads me to my next far fetched option. I also considered, what if in AC3 we weren't Desmond. My understanding is that Desmond is a direct ancestor of Adam (THE Adam). What if we play as the 'Eve' that he is supposed to be looking for. Then we could relive female memories. So many possibilities, although far fetched.

Razrback16
11-20-2011, 09:30 PM
Originally posted by Gil_217:The only thing that I didn't like was Ezio dying when his children were so young. Of course that he had to die, but he deserved to finally live with peace, and for that reason he deserved to watch his children grow up.

Yep I said the same in another thread. Sad.

Razrback16
11-20-2011, 09:46 PM
Question for you guys -- what's the deal with totally different armor / Ezio appearance in Revelations? Why no Brutus armor since Brotherhood ends with him wearing it. Ubisoft did a good job with storyline continuity from AC2 to ACB with regard to the Altair Master Assassin armor. It may seem trivial, but I follow this series pretty closely and have always loved the in-depth storyline continuity and detail, and this seems lacking somehow that they didn't explain it. Seems far fetched that Ezio would have two sets (his standard armor and Brutus armor) of good armor at the end of Brotherhood and then in Revelations on his trek to the castle he's wearing really weak armor and a different appearance.

Thanks.

Il_Divo
11-20-2011, 10:01 PM
Originally posted by Razrback16:
Question for you guys -- what's the deal with totally different armor / Ezio appearance in Revelations? Why no Brutus armor since Brotherhood ends with him wearing it. Ubisoft did a good job with storyline continuity from AC2 to ACB with regard to the Altair Master Assassin armor. It may seem trivial, but I follow this series pretty closely and have always loved the in-depth storyline continuity and detail, and this seems lacking somehow that they didn't explain it. Seems far fetched that Ezio would have two sets (his standard armor and Brutus armor) of good armor at the end of Brotherhood and then in Revelations on his trek to the castle he's wearing really weak armor and a different appearance.

Thanks.

Well, it all depends on what Ubisoft considers canon. In Brotherhood's case, they decided that Ezio always collected Altair's armor, sword, and upgraded the villa, regardless of whether the player did or did not. With Brotherhood to Revelations, without some other explanation, it seems like they're following a different canon.

If you think back to that very first cut-scene we see of Ezio in Spain (before Desmond is forced out of the memory), he's not actually wearing the Brutus armor, but the Seusenhoffer armor, so it does raise the question if Ezio ever obtained it canon-wise.

Razrback16
11-20-2011, 10:05 PM
Originally posted by Il_Divo:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Razrback16:
Question for you guys -- what's the deal with totally different armor / Ezio appearance in Revelations? Why no Brutus armor since Brotherhood ends with him wearing it. Ubisoft did a good job with storyline continuity from AC2 to ACB with regard to the Altair Master Assassin armor. It may seem trivial, but I follow this series pretty closely and have always loved the in-depth storyline continuity and detail, and this seems lacking somehow that they didn't explain it. Seems far fetched that Ezio would have two sets (his standard armor and Brutus armor) of good armor at the end of Brotherhood and then in Revelations on his trek to the castle he's wearing really weak armor and a different appearance.

Thanks.

Well, it all depends on what Ubisoft considers canon. In Brotherhood's case, they decided that Ezio always collected Altair's armor, sword, and upgraded the villa, regardless of whether the player did or did not. With Brotherhood to Revelations, without some other explanation, it seems like they're following a different canon.

If you think back to that very first cut-scene we see of Ezio in Spain (before Desmond is forced out of the memory), he's not actually wearing the Brutus armor, but the Seusenhoffer armor, so it does raise the question if Ezio ever obtained it canon-wise. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I noticed that as well in the cut-scene -- due to that cutscene I always unlock the Brutus Armor at the end of the game for cut-scene continuity. Still wish Ubi would keep it consistent. I'm not saying I'm a fan of the Brutus Armor (I actually think it's somewhat ugly) -- just wish they would keep things uniform. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

zerocooll21
11-21-2011, 05:52 AM
The only way I can accept S16 as taking over Desmond's body is if upon revealing him self he proceeds to bounce off the walls like Dafey Duck. I kid I kid. I don't think he got out of the Animus but I also don't see why they had to kill him off. Could have kept him as the Animus AI helper for future games.

I'll buy Altiar knowing there was another apple in cyprus, perfectly plausible since his apple did know the locations of the remaining artifacts (AC1). Knowing the Templars wouldn't stop till the apple was found he sent them searching for a different apple rather than the one Desmond needs Ezio to find in 1511AD.

Why did Ezio leave the apple? He already LIVED what happen's when you touch one of those things so rather than be troubled with what Altiars apple had to just let it be.

Someone asked about the relation to the Truth Vid and Ending, I think what the truth video shows was the start of the war (Adam/Eve steal apple). Locations are different as well, Truth vid presumably Mt Kilimanjaro and The ending which was in NY. The Ending in AC:R was some amount of time after the war started. How much time, we have no idea although the girl they keep showing does look a lot like Eve. And why would she be carrying a baby? Hmmmmm

AsydRaiyne
11-21-2011, 10:54 AM
Originally posted by zerocooll21:


So do you have any idea why Tinia called Des a Cypher?


It was Cipher. A 'cipher' is a message in code.

twenty_glyphs
11-21-2011, 04:02 PM
Originally posted by AsydRaiyne:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by zerocooll21:


So do you have any idea why Tinia called Des a Cypher?


It was Cipher. A 'cipher' is a message in code. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The only thing I can think of is that they're calling Desmond this because he's the tool by which they are relaying this secret message to the future, in code -- encoded in his DNA. Notice that they're not just leaving their message around for anyone to find -- only Ezio saw Minerva for Desmond's sake, only Desmond saw Juno, and then Altaďr leaves his Apple for Ezio to find so Tinia can contact Desmond directly in a "nexus of time". It's like they know not to let the Templars get these messages, so they are leaving them in code for only Desmond to find.

zerocooll21
11-21-2011, 05:22 PM
Yah I just thought they could have done a better job conveying that. You go from that epic scene with Altiar to Tinia showing you home movies.

Agentbarto
11-21-2011, 06:49 PM
I've recently begun wondering about the six predecessors to Desmond. Is it possible perhaps that TWCB are time travelers who have some how tried to save the world many times over and failed? With Desmond being the 7th and most promising method of salvation for both species it seems to me this is at least somewhat plausible. Anyone care to comment?

Andy_Pandy86
11-21-2011, 06:53 PM
I was wondering if William is really Desmond's father. I say this because near the beginning William says he does not have the right genes to wield the apple. But that Desmond does. If he is Des's father should they not share the same genes? Unless his mother's genes are also important.

Agentbarto
11-21-2011, 06:58 PM
Both are. Keep in mind mixing of genes is how one generation is different from another. It's completely possible for Desmond to have the correct combination of genes when neither of his parents had the correct combination; so long as the genes are not sex-linked. Besides he said he thought. (He's probably right but who knows at this point)

Andy_Pandy86
11-21-2011, 07:07 PM
Originally posted by Agentbarto:
Both are. Keep in mind mixing of genes is how one generation is different from another. It's completely possible for Desmond to have the correct combination of genes when neither of his parents had the correct combination; so long as the genes are not sex-linked. Besides he said he thought. (He's probably right but who knows at this point)

Yeah, fair enough. Though it can't be based on complete chance. The possible genetic combinations would be endless.

Agentbarto
11-21-2011, 07:14 PM
True, this is why we had to have the Ezio's line as separate from Altair; in order to concentrate the presence of First Civilization genes, so that the likelihood of inheriting the required recombination (Desmond's supposed genome) increases. How the First Civilization could have foreseen this, beats me. This leads me back to my time travel theory.

Will_Lucky
11-21-2011, 07:18 PM
I wonder if its to do with the Altair-Ezio connection again.

Lets say theoretically Desmonds mother had Ezio's genes and Desmonds Father has Altairs Genes.

Desmond can use the apple because he has Ezios genes but his father can't because he doesn't have that link.


Its hard to say though, given we have seen numerous people wield that Apple such as Savonarola, Cesare, Rodrigo ect. Unless the Apple itself refuses to work for William it doesn't make any sense. But we have seen some sort of choice from the Shroud perhaps all the pieces of eden have some sort of awareness and choice.

Agentbarto
11-21-2011, 07:20 PM
That could be the reason Desmond was so severely affected by the Apple. It might heave been genetically programmed to respond to Desmond's "touch" this would explain why Bill could hold it without the concern of experiencing what Desmond experienced when he touched the Apple.

Andy_Pandy86
11-21-2011, 07:40 PM
That could be it. Desmond is like the 'Nexus' of the two parallel bloodlines. Occurring side by side down the centuries but never meeting, until Desmond. TWCB waited till it was almost time before allowing the two bloodlines to be mixed, producing the one who will control the tech to save humanity.

LightRey
11-21-2011, 11:41 PM
Originally posted by Agentbarto:
I've recently begun wondering about the six predecessors to Desmond. Is it possible perhaps that TWCB are time travelers who have some how tried to save the world many times over and failed? With Desmond being the 7th and most promising method of salvation for both species it seems to me this is at least somewhat plausible. Anyone care to comment?
Though that is a technical possibility considering there is an artifact that has the ability to bend spacetime, there is a problem with that theory. The problem is that if that were the case, TWCB would, could and probably should have saved the world the first time this happened, which evidently isn't the case.

I think the situation is a little more down to earth. Jupiter specifically referred to the other temples to be places where information was gathered and then sent to this "Grand Temple", which appears to be in New York at the coordinates given at the end of the Da Vinci Disappearance, where Desmond, William, Shaun and Rebecca now appear to be. I think the temples are more like supercomputers that gather data and that the Grand Temple is a supercomputer that can run simulations of the disaster, trying to find a way to avoid this. I think this makes sense since TWCB obviously had the means to, to a certain degree, predict, and apparently manipulate, what was going to happen to the accuracy of the precise details of a specific conversation.

H3ll_on_Earth-
11-22-2011, 12:02 AM
Excerpt from The Codex way back from AC2.

"Of all the things I've seen, none troubles me more than the image of the flames... Pillars so tall they seemed to pierce the heavens. The ground rumbled and shuddered. Mountains split and crack. Great metal towers splintered, their innards strewn about the ground... And everywhere there was screaming. A chorus so terrible that even now I feel its echoes still.
What is this madness I have seen? Is it them, I wonder? Those who came before... Is this where they went? Into the fire? Into the dust? Perhaps this destructive power is what the Templars seek. That they might hold it over us a command devotion. What hope would we have, then, if they held such darkness in their hands – that they could murder the world... "

I think the vision that Jupiter had shown Desmond was what Altair was referring to in the Codex, not the Truth video where we see Adam and Eve. Someone ought to edit that part in the AC wiki because the description of what Altair saw fits just right with the vision Jupiter had shown Desmond. Thoughts?

samward
11-22-2011, 01:00 AM
Originally posted by AsydRaiyne:
Hey everyone, I've been thinking, how will 'Eve' come into play in the next game. I've noticed the recent involvement of a lot of the female characters, particularly the death of Lucy (absolute bull**** IMO, but I read that the Developers said her death was simply a means to send Desmond into a coma, nothing else), the introduction of Shao Jun, and the woman in the end video. Considering these events, here are my predictions: Shao Jun will be the next major assassin...for some reason. Or. We will play as the woman with the child somehow. Considering, that civilization was more advanced that its successors, since the solar flare was kind of like the reset button on civilization. It's really bugging me, I'm itching to know who and what 'Eve' is. Also, did you all catch the golden gate at the end, with the female gender symbol in the center? God damn it Ubisoft...
On a side note: I think that glow in Desmond's arm may have had something to do with 16. Of course, it's got to do with his TWCB blood, and putting Jupiter's words into his hands, yes yes all of that philosophical stuff. But, I think 16 is in Desmond. Somehow. Maybe I'm blurring expectation and hope. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

If you are right and the whole point of Lucy’s death was just to put Desmond into a coma, well then Ubi, I say that is the biggest load of bullocks I have every heard! Lets hope they come up with a better explanation then that.

As for the female ancestor thing, I think you may be on to something. Eve is often referred to as the mother of women or used as a replacement for the word woman, so a female ancestor could indeed be in our future. Not to get into the age long debate, but I kind of hope not, or if we are, I hope it is limited. I have been waiting for a Desmond dominated game for so long.

As far as Shao Jun is concerned, she is unlikely the next ancestor. She is alive while Ezio and Ezio’s child, to whom Desmond is related too is alive… so Desmond can not be related to her, at least on one side of his family tree… but I suppose she could be from the side of the tree Altair is from. Though I think this is a bit of a logical leap.

The stuff on his arm was just to show you that he has a high concentration of TWCB DNA in his system. You know that bit where Jupiter says, “ let my words go from you head to your hands…” or something to that effect. I think that the end there was just a physical representation of Desmond understanding who he was and what he was capable of.

samward
11-22-2011, 01:15 AM
Originally posted by twenty_glyphs:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by dchil279:
What I want to know is why in the hell Desmond didn't say at some point to subject 16, "Hey 16, while I have your attention, what the **** have you been trying to tell me all this time?"

Also, why didn't Subject 16 say, "While you're here, let me tell you this big important thing I've been trying to tell you since I hacked into the Animus core and then killed myself and wrote clues in my own blood!" We finally get to meet Subject 16 and it was so meaningless. He didn't reveal anything new, and his personality seemed so different from what we've already seen of him. Even his voice was different. Just feels like a wasted opportunity. It was probably still too early in the story to reveal what he was really going on about, but to just ignore it in this game makes his appearance feel pointless.

EDIT: As an aside, I wonder what the point of 16 "hugging" Desmond when the Island was being deleted was. Why did he do that before he pushed Desmond into the portal? Was it just for dramatic effect in the story, or was he transferring something of himself into Desmond? Or does it have something to do with playing the game after the credits, since we never saw Desmond go back into the Animus? Could we actually be playing as Subject 16 after Animus Island gets rebuilt during the credits? Subject 16 with Desmond's avatar? Or is it just an imprint of Desmond's consciousness left behind like Subject 16's was? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think the point of 16 hugging Desmond was to put himself so close to Desmond that the Animus would think he was Desmond and delete him (16) instead. Of course there is always the chance that 16 left some part of him self behind in Desmond. Ubi left that one open for speculation.

I agree with you though. I found 16 very disappointing. Other then finding out he truly he was dead, body wise, he told us nothing. I also agree that his voice and personality were most disturbing. He was always so kind and caring to Desmond before. In ACR he seemed like he was always about to stab you in the back.

I really wish Ubi had though him threw better, given him more game time and let him tell us what he was trying too all along. As for the animus island being reconstructed, I think that was just poor planning on Ubi’s part. They needed away to let you go back and re play whatever you wanted, so just stuck Desmond back on the island, even though it made no sense with the storyline.

Andy_Pandy86
11-22-2011, 01:23 AM
Originally posted by samward:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by twenty_glyphs:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by dchil279:
What I want to know is why in the hell Desmond didn't say at some point to subject 16, "Hey 16, while I have your attention, what the **** have you been trying to tell me all this time?"

Also, why didn't Subject 16 say, "While you're here, let me tell you this big important thing I've been trying to tell you since I hacked into the Animus core and then killed myself and wrote clues in my own blood!" We finally get to meet Subject 16 and it was so meaningless. He didn't reveal anything new, and his personality seemed so different from what we've already seen of him. Even his voice was different. Just feels like a wasted opportunity. It was probably still too early in the story to reveal what he was really going on about, but to just ignore it in this game makes his appearance feel pointless.

EDIT: As an aside, I wonder what the point of 16 "hugging" Desmond when the Island was being deleted was. Why did he do that before he pushed Desmond into the portal? Was it just for dramatic effect in the story, or was he transferring something of himself into Desmond? Or does it have something to do with playing the game after the credits, since we never saw Desmond go back into the Animus? Could we actually be playing as Subject 16 after Animus Island gets rebuilt during the credits? Subject 16 with Desmond's avatar? Or is it just an imprint of Desmond's consciousness left behind like Subject 16's was? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think the point of 16 hugging Desmond was to put himself so close to Desmond that the Animus would think he was Desmond and delete him (16) instead. Of course there is always the chance that 16 left some part of him self behind in Desmond. Ubi left that one open for speculation.

I agree with you though. I found 16 very disappointing. Other then finding out he truly he was dead, body wise, he told us nothing. I also agree that his voice and personality were most disturbing. He was always so kind and caring to Desmond before. In ACR he seemed like he was always about to stab you in the back.

I really wish Ubi had though him threw better, given him more game time and let him tell us what he was trying too all along. As for the animus island being reconstructed, I think that was just poor planning on Ubi’s part. They needed away to let you go back and re play whatever you wanted, so just stuck Desmond back on the island, even though it made no sense with the storyline. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Agree with everything said.

Surely there are other ways to put Desmond into a coma that don't involve someones death. Why not just have him touch the apple and collapse? BAM! coma, the end. I don't buy it. Just offing a long running character for such an arbitrary reason? If its true, Ubisoft have clearly lost the plot, in which case what hope do we have?

sandman06
11-22-2011, 07:51 AM
Originally posted by samward:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AsydRaiyne:
Hey everyone, I've been thinking, how will 'Eve' come into play in the next game. I've noticed the recent involvement of a lot of the female characters, particularly the death of Lucy (absolute bull**** IMO, but I read that the Developers said her death was simply a means to send Desmond into a coma, nothing else), the introduction of Shao Jun, and the woman in the end video. Considering these events, here are my predictions: Shao Jun will be the next major assassin...for some reason. Or. We will play as the woman with the child somehow. Considering, that civilization was more advanced that its successors, since the solar flare was kind of like the reset button on civilization. It's really bugging me, I'm itching to know who and what 'Eve' is. Also, did you all catch the golden gate at the end, with the female gender symbol in the center? God damn it Ubisoft...
On a side note: I think that glow in Desmond's arm may have had something to do with 16. Of course, it's got to do with his TWCB blood, and putting Jupiter's words into his hands, yes yes all of that philosophical stuff. But, I think 16 is in Desmond. Somehow. Maybe I'm blurring expectation and hope. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

If you are right and the whole point of Lucy’s death was just to put Desmond into a coma, well then Ubi, I say that is the biggest load of bullocks I have every heard! Lets hope they come up with a better explanation then that.

As for the female ancestor thing, I think you may be on to something. Eve is often referred to as the mother of women or used as a replacement for the word woman, so a female ancestor could indeed be in our future. Not to get into the age long debate, but I kind of hope not, or if we are, I hope it is limited. I have been waiting for a Desmond dominated game for so long.

As far as Shao Jun is concerned, she is unlikely the next ancestor. She is alive while Ezio and Ezio’s child, to whom Desmond is related too is alive… so Desmond can not be related to her, at least on one side of his family tree… but I suppose she could be from the side of the tree Altair is from. Though I think this is a bit of a logical leap.

The stuff on his arm was just to show you that he has a high concentration of TWCB DNA in his system. You know that bit where Jupiter says, “ let my words go from you head to your hands…” or something to that effect. I think that the end there was just a physical representation of Desmond understanding who he was and what he was capable of. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Just because she's alive when Ezio is doesn't mean Desmond isn't related to her. Family trees branch so far out it's incredible. It's not a direct line from Ezio to Desmond. For each generation theres another tree being connected to that one due to the fact that it takes 2 to make a baby. And considering the fact that there are a large number of generations before Desmond is born, it's entirely possible for her to be linked one way or another to Desmond. That said I doubt she's the ancestor in ACIII. But I do believe we'll see her again.

assassinato_862
11-22-2011, 11:51 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Razrback16:
Question for you guys -- what's the deal with totally different armor / Ezio appearance in Revelations? Why no Brutus armor since Brotherhood ends with him wearing it. Ubisoft did a good job with storyline continuity from AC2 to ACB with regard to the Altair Master Assassin armor. It may seem trivial, but I follow this series pretty closely and have always loved the in-depth storyline continuity and detail, and this seems lacking somehow that they didn't explain it. Seems far fetched that Ezio would have two sets (his standard armor and Brutus armor) of good armor at the end of Brotherhood and then in Revelations on his trek to the castle he's wearing really weak armor and a different appearance.

Thanks.



Well, it all depends on what Ubisoft considers canon. In Brotherhood's case, they decided that Ezio always collected Altair's armor, sword, and upgraded the villa, regardless of whether the player did or did not. With Brotherhood to Revelations, without some other explanation, it seems like they're following a different canon.

If you think back to that very first cut-scene we see of Ezio in Spain (before Desmond is forced out of the memory), he's not actually wearing the Brutus armor, but the Seusenhoffer armor, so it does raise the question if Ezio ever obtained it canon-wise.


I noticed that as well in the cut-scene -- due to that cutscene I always unlock the Brutus Armor at the end of the game for cut-scene continuity. Still wish Ubi would keep it consistent. I'm not saying I'm a fan of the Brutus Armor (I actually think it's somewhat ugly) -- just wish they would keep things uniform.



I was gonna say that it was too heavy for Ezio to travel with. But, he wears plenty of heavy armor in ACR so nevermind that...

Hmmm...


Let's see, he was in Acre for a week being fed and sheltered by kind passerby. Maybe he gave his armor as a thank-you? I know it sounds kinda lame, but it's the only thing I could think of.

samward
11-23-2011, 04:13 AM
Originally posted by sandman06:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by samward:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AsydRaiyne:
Hey everyone, I've been thinking, how will 'Eve' come into play in the next game. I've noticed the recent involvement of a lot of the female characters, particularly the death of Lucy (absolute bull**** IMO, but I read that the Developers said her death was simply a means to send Desmond into a coma, nothing else), the introduction of Shao Jun, and the woman in the end video. Considering these events, here are my predictions: Shao Jun will be the next major assassin...for some reason. Or. We will play as the woman with the child somehow. Considering, that civilization was more advanced that its successors, since the solar flare was kind of like the reset button on civilization. It's really bugging me, I'm itching to know who and what 'Eve' is. Also, did you all catch the golden gate at the end, with the female gender symbol in the center? God damn it Ubisoft...
On a side note: I think that glow in Desmond's arm may have had something to do with 16. Of course, it's got to do with his TWCB blood, and putting Jupiter's words into his hands, yes yes all of that philosophical stuff. But, I think 16 is in Desmond. Somehow. Maybe I'm blurring expectation and hope. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

If you are right and the whole point of Lucy’s death was just to put Desmond into a coma, well then Ubi, I say that is the biggest load of bullocks I have every heard! Lets hope they come up with a better explanation then that.

As for the female ancestor thing, I think you may be on to something. Eve is often referred to as the mother of women or used as a replacement for the word woman, so a female ancestor could indeed be in our future. Not to get into the age long debate, but I kind of hope not, or if we are, I hope it is limited. I have been waiting for a Desmond dominated game for so long.

As far as Shao Jun is concerned, she is unlikely the next ancestor. She is alive while Ezio and Ezio’s child, to whom Desmond is related too is alive… so Desmond can not be related to her, at least on one side of his family tree… but I suppose she could be from the side of the tree Altair is from. Though I think this is a bit of a logical leap.

The stuff on his arm was just to show you that he has a high concentration of TWCB DNA in his system. You know that bit where Jupiter says, “ let my words go from you head to your hands…” or something to that effect. I think that the end there was just a physical representation of Desmond understanding who he was and what he was capable of. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Just because she's alive when Ezio is doesn't mean Desmond isn't related to her. Family trees branch so far out it's incredible. It's not a direct line from Ezio to Desmond. For each generation theres another tree being connected to that one due to the fact that it takes 2 to make a baby. And considering the fact that there are a large number of generations before Desmond is born, it's entirely possible for her to be linked one way or another to Desmond. That said I doubt she's the ancestor in ACIII. But I do believe we'll see her again. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree that we will see her again. Though I think it will be in a new series of games after this one is over, or maybe in a comic or something to that effect.

What I meant about them not being related is that she could not be related to the Ezio side of Desmond’s heritage. As I said before, it is entirely possible that she is related to the Altair line. The reason I say this is that of course Ezio was Desmond’s direct ancestor, and so it was up to him to pass on his direct line that will lead to Desmond. Therefore one of Ezio’s children has to be Desmond’s direct next ancestor; as Shao Jun is not Ezio’s child, she cannot be related to Desmond on Ezio’s side. However, we do not know where Altair’s line goes. So it is very possible that she is related to Desmond from that line. At any rate that was what I was trying to say before. I hope I made a bit more sense this time around :P

samward
11-23-2011, 04:15 AM
Originally posted by Andy_Pandy86:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by samward:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by twenty_glyphs:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by dchil279:
What I want to know is why in the hell Desmond didn't say at some point to subject 16, "Hey 16, while I have your attention, what the **** have you been trying to tell me all this time?"

Also, why didn't Subject 16 say, "While you're here, let me tell you this big important thing I've been trying to tell you since I hacked into the Animus core and then killed myself and wrote clues in my own blood!" We finally get to meet Subject 16 and it was so meaningless. He didn't reveal anything new, and his personality seemed so different from what we've already seen of him. Even his voice was different. Just feels like a wasted opportunity. It was probably still too early in the story to reveal what he was really going on about, but to just ignore it in this game makes his appearance feel pointless.

EDIT: As an aside, I wonder what the point of 16 "hugging" Desmond when the Island was being deleted was. Why did he do that before he pushed Desmond into the portal? Was it just for dramatic effect in the story, or was he transferring something of himself into Desmond? Or does it have something to do with playing the game after the credits, since we never saw Desmond go back into the Animus? Could we actually be playing as Subject 16 after Animus Island gets rebuilt during the credits? Subject 16 with Desmond's avatar? Or is it just an imprint of Desmond's consciousness left behind like Subject 16's was? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think the point of 16 hugging Desmond was to put himself so close to Desmond that the Animus would think he was Desmond and delete him (16) instead. Of course there is always the chance that 16 left some part of him self behind in Desmond. Ubi left that one open for speculation.

I agree with you though. I found 16 very disappointing. Other then finding out he truly he was dead, body wise, he told us nothing. I also agree that his voice and personality were most disturbing. He was always so kind and caring to Desmond before. In ACR he seemed like he was always about to stab you in the back.

I really wish Ubi had though him threw better, given him more game time and let him tell us what he was trying too all along. As for the animus island being reconstructed, I think that was just poor planning on Ubi’s part. They needed away to let you go back and re play whatever you wanted, so just stuck Desmond back on the island, even though it made no sense with the storyline. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Agree with everything said.

Surely there are other ways to put Desmond into a coma that don't involve someones death. Why not just have him touch the apple and collapse? BAM! coma, the end. I don't buy it. Just offing a long running character for such an arbitrary reason? If its true, Ubisoft have clearly lost the plot, in which case what hope do we have? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

hahahha the way you said, "just have him touch the apple and collapse? BAM! coma, the end." made me laugh http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif well said http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

erudit0
11-23-2011, 05:22 AM
Originally posted by Agentbarto:
I've recently begun wondering about the six predecessors to Desmond. Is it possible perhaps that TWCB are time travelers who have some how tried to save the world many times over and failed? With Desmond being the 7th and most promising method of salvation for both species it seems to me this is at least somewhat plausible. Anyone care to comment?

You made me remember of the Matrix here. The sixth version of the matrix, Neo being the one who "saved" zion. Now, there is something interesting about tinia that I'll share just for controversy... Taken from wikipedia: "In the Etruscan language, tin or tinš means "day" and its plural is tinia showing that he is a god governing the passage of time "

eagleforlife1
11-23-2011, 05:23 AM
I hope Shao Jun is the character we play as in the PS Vita game. I think we will definitely see more of her as she is only 19 when we meet her so plenty of things could happen in her life.

erudit0
11-23-2011, 05:47 AM
Well. I think I have digested Lucy's death by now. I hate to learn she is dead but I just hope they come up with a good excuse for that. I loved Ezio's character development and that we got to play as Altair being 80+ years old. Badass! Now... As many of you I didn't feel my questions were answered. First Lucy, then subject 16. And also, because of the Borgia and having played as Ezio in the Vatican I was just hoping they would exploit the prophecy of the popes of St. Malachy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes

I don't know what will happen, because we haven't learned much from the templars. Vidic and friends... And I was hoping for confrontation too, but maybe that will happen in AC3. Also, note: "Aquila is a stellar constellation. Its name is Latin for 'eagle' and it is commonly represented as such. In mythology, Aquila was owned by the Roman god Jupiter and performed many tasks for him." Altair (name of a star) is the brightest star in this constellation. It sparked my interest a while ago.

There is a lot of information about those who came before with respect to their names and their roles in mythology. Why would Juno make Desmond stab Lucy? If she is the goddess of fertility... Was she pointing at something here? The stab was near the stomach but it was also near the zone were women are fertile. Also, there has been some discussion about the effect of the apple/illusion that Al-Mualim used in the first episode to "kill" Altair.

Anyway... Enough for now.

EDIT: found this on an older post in the forums here:

Found this about Hera (Juno's version in Greek Mythology) in wikipedia:

"Hera was known for her jealous and vengeful nature, most notably against Zeus's lovers and offspring, but also against mortals who crossed her, such as Pelias. Paris offended her by choosing Aphrodite as the most beautiful goddess, earning Hera's hatred."

sandman06
11-23-2011, 07:22 AM
Originally posted by samward:
What I meant about them not being related is that she could not be related to the Ezio side of Desmond’s heritage. As I said before, it is entirely possible that she is related to the Altair line. The reason I say this is that of course Ezio was Desmond’s direct ancestor, and so it was up to him to pass on his direct line that will lead to Desmond. Therefore one of Ezio’s children has to be Desmond’s direct next ancestor; as Shao Jun is not Ezio’s child, she cannot be related to Desmond on Ezio’s side. However, we do not know where Altair’s line goes. So it is very possible that she is related to Desmond from that line. At any rate that was what I was trying to say before. I hope I made a bit more sense this time around :P Yes that makes more sense, but at the same time, it could easily be either side. There's a good 500 years before Desmond is born. It's entirely possible that Shao's line made it into Ezio's hundreds of years down the line. No one said it had to be immediate. Ex: her great-great-grandchild may have had a kid with Ezio's great-great grandchild and then suddenly she falls into Ezio's line. Regardless I don't think she's actually an ancestor of Desmond. But I do think she'll show up somehow. Probably a comic is my guess.

CShock_
11-23-2011, 08:00 AM
Just a quick thought. If nothing is true and everything is permitted, does this apply when saving the world? for example, what if humans were saved/stored within the animus as desmond and 16 were? it would be a false reality (everything is true) and it would be unethical (as its false - but everything is permitted). Also i believe Ezio's story is complete if you watch Embers.

twenty_glyphs
11-23-2011, 09:53 AM
Originally posted by erudit0:
Also, note: "Aquila is a stellar constellation. Its name is Latin for 'eagle' and it is commonly represented as such. In mythology, Aquila was owned by the Roman god Jupiter and performed many tasks for him." Altair (name of a star) is the brightest star in this constellation. It sparked my interest a while ago.

*** SPOILERS ***

Did you notice that on the door to Altaďr's library are constellations? You can see the actual constellation line and dot pattern in Eagle Vision. The one that you place the 5 seals on to solve the puzzle is Aquila.

zerocooll21
11-23-2011, 10:02 AM
Originally posted by twenty_glyphs:
The one that you place the 5 seals on to solve the puzzle is Aquila.

I did, love how they do that stuff to tie it all together.

erudit0
11-23-2011, 04:11 PM
Originally posted by twenty_glyphs:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by erudit0:
Also, note: "Aquila is a stellar constellation. Its name is Latin for 'eagle' and it is commonly represented as such. In mythology, Aquila was owned by the Roman god Jupiter and performed many tasks for him." Altair (name of a star) is the brightest star in this constellation. It sparked my interest a while ago.



*** SPOILERS ***

Did you notice that on the door to Altaďr's library are constellations? You can see the actual constellation line and dot pattern in Eagle Vision. The one that you place the 5 seals on to solve the puzzle is Aquila. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yep! I saw that. What are your views on the future of the storyline? You have had some pretty good guesses overall.

Agentbarto
11-23-2011, 07:09 PM
Originally posted by LightRey:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Agentbarto:
I've recently begun wondering about the six predecessors to Desmond. Is it possible perhaps that TWCB are time travelers who have some how tried to save the world many times over and failed? With Desmond being the 7th and most promising method of salvation for both species it seems to me this is at least somewhat plausible. Anyone care to comment?
Though that is a technical possibility considering there is an artifact that has the ability to bend spacetime, there is a problem with that theory. The problem is that if that were the case, TWCB would, could and probably should have saved the world the first time this happened, which evidently isn't the case.

I think the situation is a little more down to earth. Jupiter specifically referred to the other temples to be places where information was gathered and then sent to this "Grand Temple", which appears to be in New York at the coordinates given at the end of the Da Vinci Disappearance, where Desmond, William, Shaun and Rebecca now appear to be. I think the temples are more like supercomputers that gather data and that the Grand Temple is a supercomputer that can run simulations of the disaster, trying to find a way to avoid this. I think this makes sense since TWCB obviously had the means to, to a certain degree, predict, and apparently manipulate, what was going to happen to the accuracy of the precise details of a specific conversation. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

See here's what gets me. There seems to be gaps in the knowledge of all 3 "gods". Juno, Minerva, and Jupiter all lack knowledge of future events such as what will happen once Desmond enters the Grand Temple, but knew and implemented certain factors which will lead Desmond to the Grand Temple. This lack of complete knowledge can be explained in two ways.

One; they only predicted so much before their civilization fell and the technology was locked away.

Two; Minerva may not have explicitly stated a lack of knowledge and my interpretation of her cryptic warning of "guarding against the cross" may therefore be incorrect. This would coincide with Jupiter's excuse for his awkwardness in the "Time-Field", by confirming that out of the three of them only Minerva could perceive time more clearly than they could.

I suppose given their advanced technology it would be possibly to fully conceptualize "time" in every instance, thus allowing them to predict what we feel is unpredictable. I dunno food for thought.

Agentbarto
11-23-2011, 07:12 PM
Originally posted by erudit0:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Agentbarto:
I've recently begun wondering about the six predecessors to Desmond. Is it possible perhaps that TWCB are time travelers who have some how tried to save the world many times over and failed? With Desmond being the 7th and most promising method of salvation for both species it seems to me this is at least somewhat plausible. Anyone care to comment?

You made me remember of the Matrix here. The sixth version of the matrix, Neo being the one who "saved" zion. Now, there is something interesting about tinia that I'll share just for controversy... Taken from wikipedia: "In the Etruscan language, tin or tinš means "day" and its plural is tinia showing that he is a god governing the passage of time " </div></BLOCKQUOTE> The Matrix is exactly what I thought when I heard Jupiter.

syndbg
11-24-2011, 07:00 AM
Guys, I'll present you my theory about the events so far and future events. This post was already written before 3days and may feature some things that are already said by now, can't help it :/
I'll start with:
TWCB - actually they aren't the good guys. They are the templars of their time. From the Truth videos in AC2 we've seen them using the Apple to enslave the humanity so that they can expand their civilization. That's why Adam and Eve (the first assasins) escaped. TWCB's way of doing things led the world to many apocalypses as we understand in AC:R's ending. BUT!.... now they're so desperate in saving the world that they need to rely on the assasins. So far, so good I think that's enough on this part of the post, anything else should be known.
Next: Juno's role
I feel that she's so important, that I'll give her a part of my post. First, who is she? Juno is the roman equivalent of the greek goddess Hera, which is known to be jealous (could be jealous of the not-so-hidden love between Desmond and Lucy?) and vengeful. Especially vengeful towards the people that cross her. Well, from the AC2 Truth we see some goddess using the Apple to force humans to work, which I think is Juno. Adam and Eve "crossed" her by escaping from TWCB's slavery. From the dialogues in AC:B we can clearly see that Juno is very, very hateful towards humanity, probably the most hateful from TWCB ( now there are only three from TWCB so there's no big choice anyway... ). But let's skip this not-so-serious talk and focus on Subject16's the Truth message - "She is not who you think she is. Everything you hope to become. Everything you hold dear. It's already gone." = Juno is not who Desmond thinks she is, her

intentions aren't to help the assassins, she is not to be trusted? Everything Desmond hopes to become ( no idea about this but I'd guess something with awakening the 6th ) and everything he holds dear - Lucy, Lucy and again Lucy. It's already gone... or not?
If I got the right idea with Subject 16's message then Juno's words - "There is one who would accompany you through the gate. She lies not within our sight. The cross darkens the horizon.The Path must be opened. You cannot escape your part in this. The scales shall be balanced. *after stabbing Lucy* It is done. The way lies all before you. Only she remains to be found. Awaken the sixth. Go. ALONE!" - now, before someone tells me "but this is exactly the opposite of what you've been plotting so far" - no! Just no! Let's look at the ending of AC:R, the death of a previous civilization. This was after Adam and Eve had a child, although both of them had the 6th awakened the world still ended. Does this sound like Desmond will save the world by finding some other Eve ( probably they fail cause brunettes suck ) and having a child with her? Again, no. The world will still end. So Juno wants Desmond to go down the same road Adam went which lead to world's end.

(TO BE CONTINUED) Next: Desmond(name meaning "the world") and Lucy (name meaning "light")- the world's light? a.k.a saviors and only hope?
I need more research on this topic so it may take a day or two to finish it

P.S I try to present this information in a different way by including some jokes. I think it's a little better than reading "dull" text.

goclo822
11-24-2011, 02:57 PM
Originally posted by syndbg:
Guys, I'll present you my theory about the events so far and future events. This post was already written before 3days and may feature some things that are already said by now, can't help it :/
I'll start with:
TWCB - actually they aren't the good guys. They are the templars of their time. From the Truth videos in AC2 we've seen them using the Apple to enslave the humanity so that they can expand their civilization. That's why Adam and Eve (the first assasins) escaped. TWCB's way of doing things led the world to many apocalypses as we understand in AC:R's ending. BUT!.... now they're so desperate in saving the world that they need to rely on the assasins. So far, so good I think that's enough on this part of the post, anything else should be known.
Next: Juno's role
I feel that she's so important, that I'll give her a part of my post. First, who is she? Juno is the roman equivalent of the greek goddess Hera, which is known to be jealous (could be jealous of the not-so-hidden love between Desmond and Lucy?) and vengeful. Especially vengeful towards the people that cross her. Well, from the AC2 Truth we see some goddess using the Apple to force humans to work, which I think is Juno. Adam and Eve "crossed" her by escaping from TWCB's slavery. From the dialogues in AC:B we can clearly see that Juno is very, very hateful towards humanity, probably the most hateful from TWCB ( now there are only three from TWCB so there's no big choice anyway... ). But let's skip this not-so-serious talk and focus on Subject16's the Truth message - "She is not who you think she is. Everything you hope to become. Everything you hold dear. It's already gone." = Juno is not who Desmond thinks she is, her intentions aren't to help the assassins, she is not to be trusted? Everything Desmond hopes to become ( no idea about this but I'd guess something with awakening the 6th ) and everything he holds dear - Lucy, Lucy and again Lucy. It's already gone... or not?
If I got the right idea with Subject 16's message then Juno's words - "There is one who would accompany you through the gate. She lies not within our sight. The cross darkens the horizon.The Path must be opened. You cannot escape your part in this. The scales shall be balanced. *after stabbing Lucy* It is done. The way lies all before you. Only she remains to be found. Awaken the sixth. Go. ALONE!" - now, before someone tells me "but this is exactly the opposite of what you've been plotting so far" - no! Just no! Let's look at the ending of AC:R, the death of a previous civilization. This was after Adam and Eve had a child, although both of them had the 6th awakened the world still ended. Does this sound like Desmond will save the world by finding some other Eve ( probably they fail cause brunettes suck ) and having a child with her? Again, no. The world will still end. So Juno wants Desmond to go down the same road Adam went which lead to world's end.

(TO BE CONTINUED) Next: Desmond(name meaning "the world") and Lucy (name meaning "light")- the world's light? a.k.a saviors and only hope?
I need more research on this topic so it may take a day or two to finish it

P.S I try to present this information in a different way by including some jokes. I think it's a little better than reading "dull" text.

That was my exact thoughts after ACR. I really don't think Lucy was killed because she was in the way or a templar or anything of the sort. I think that is was a mistake on TWCB side. Lucy wasn't in the way of Desmond or in the way of him saving the world, but rather she was in the way of TWCB and whatever plan they may have for civilization. I still don't believe she is dead for that reason. I think TWCB are the ones that cannot be trusted and they have a plan that eventually Desmond will have to stop but the key to doing so will be to find Eve (probably Lucy).

Andy_Pandy86
11-24-2011, 05:23 PM
Originally posted by syndbg:
Guys, I'll present you my theory about the events so far and future events. This post was already written before 3days and may feature some things that are already said by now, can't help it :/
I'll start with:
TWCB - actually they aren't the good guys. They are the templars of their time. From the Truth videos in AC2 we've seen them using the Apple to enslave the humanity so that they can expand their civilization. That's why Adam and Eve (the first assasins) escaped. TWCB's way of doing things led the world to many apocalypses as we understand in AC:R's ending. BUT!.... now they're so desperate in saving the world that they need to rely on the assasins. So far, so good I think that's enough on this part of the post, anything else should be known.
Next: Juno's role
I feel that she's so important, that I'll give her a part of my post. First, who is she? Juno is the roman equivalent of the greek goddess Hera, which is known to be jealous (could be jealous of the not-so-hidden love between Desmond and Lucy?) and vengeful. Especially vengeful towards the people that cross her. Well, from the AC2 Truth we see some goddess using the Apple to force humans to work, which I think is Juno. Adam and Eve "crossed" her by escaping from TWCB's slavery. From the dialogues in AC:B we can clearly see that Juno is very, very hateful towards humanity, probably the most hateful from TWCB ( now there are only three from TWCB so there's no big choice anyway... ). But let's skip this not-so-serious talk and focus on Subject16's the Truth message - "She is not who you think she is. Everything you hope to become. Everything you hold dear. It's already gone." = Juno is not who Desmond thinks she is, her

intentions aren't to help the assassins, she is not to be trusted? Everything Desmond hopes to become ( no idea about this but I'd guess something with awakening the 6th ) and everything he holds dear - Lucy, Lucy and again Lucy. It's already gone... or not?
If I got the right idea with Subject 16's message then Juno's words - "There is one who would accompany you through the gate. She lies not within our sight. The cross darkens the horizon.The Path must be opened. You cannot escape your part in this. The scales shall be balanced. *after stabbing Lucy* It is done. The way lies all before you. Only she remains to be found. Awaken the sixth. Go. ALONE!" - now, before someone tells me "but this is exactly the opposite of what you've been plotting so far" - no! Just no! Let's look at the ending of AC:R, the death of a previous civilization. This was after Adam and Eve had a child, although both of them had the 6th awakened the world still ended. Does this sound like Desmond will save the world by finding some other Eve ( probably they fail cause brunettes suck ) and having a child with her? Again, no. The world will still end. So Juno wants Desmond to go down the same road Adam went which lead to world's end.

(TO BE CONTINUED) Next: Desmond(name meaning "the world") and Lucy (name meaning "light")- the world's light? a.k.a saviors and only hope?
I need more research on this topic so it may take a day or two to finish it

P.S I try to present this information in a different way by including some jokes. I think it's a little better than reading "dull" text.

TWCB being evil is an interesting thought. Though I thought in AC2 whatshername said that some of them wanted to make things better with humanity. That they realized their mistake.

Definitely got the vibe that Juno hates our guts, that we took what wasn't ours. (knowledge/apple)

I remember discussions about 16's message being a warning about Lucy or in fact Juno. Which would play into the whole, evil thing. Which was also discussed. Maybe it is all a ploy to save the world then enslave it once again. Or maybe it's only Juno who wants that and she'll try and take over from the other 'gods'

Really it could go either way at this point.

As for Eve I would assume that Desmond needs her ancestors memories to find one of the other Grand Temples. As for a baby, they couldn't turn one around so quickly, so close to the event, could they? If they did, what's a month old or younger baby gonna do?

erudit0
11-24-2011, 08:42 PM
Originally posted by syndbg:

Well, from the AC2 Truth we see some goddess using the Apple to force humans to work, which I think is Juno. Adam and Eve "crossed" her by escaping from TWCB's slavery. From the dialogues in AC:B we can clearly see that Juno is very, very hateful towards humanity, probably the most hateful from TWCB ( now there are only three from TWCB so there's no big choice anyway... ). But let's skip this not-so-serious talk and focus on Subject16's the Truth message - "She is not who you think she is. Everything you hope to become. Everything you hold dear. It's already gone.""There is one who would accompany you through the gate. She lies not within our sight. The cross darkens the horizon.The Path must be opened. You cannot escape your part in this. The scales shall be balanced. *after stabbing Lucy* It is done. The way lies all before you. Only she remains to be found. Awaken the sixth. Go. ALONE!"


Great theory! Althought there are certain parts I have different views on. Your name meanings are almost spot on, I think Desmond means 2 things, but the most relevant here is "man of the world (or society)." I found Lucy's meaning to be interesting. He should look for the light. (I don't remember any references to light in the series, or the sequence titles, etc)

When I read "the cross darkens the horizon" I think there's one possibility for this.

**SPOILERS** (BIG ONES)

Do you guys remember Daniel Cross? He killed the menthor and then reunited with Abstergo. People think he is in the higher chain of abstergo. I think the cross darkening the horizon is Daniel Cross (apart from the templars in general), and he seems to be the perfect antagonist to Desmond (same position inside the templars as of Desmond within the assassins - think of Cain vs. Abel). Probably the one he will have to fight against in the very end. Who knows if this Daniel Cross has some artifact in possession but if he does, it must be something very valuable to the story.

And about TWCB... I agree, their intentions are bleak at best. But I just can't think in which way Jupiter (who owns the Aquila constelation - Altair being the name of its brightest star) or Minerva can mean harm...

There's the message "three lives toiled. Three lives lost. Three messages delivered: the greeting, the warning, the revelation" in the encyclopedia. It may well be Altair, Ezio and Desmond. But I think it refers to Minerva (the greeting), Juno (the warning) and Jupiter (the revelation).

I know I might be moving away from the discussion, but isn't it interesting that according to the wiki, Jupiter shares the same voice actor as Al-Mualim and they look similar?

Andy_Pandy86
11-24-2011, 09:02 PM
Originally posted by erudit0:

There's the message "three lives toiled. Three lives lost. Three messages delivered: the greeting, the warning, the revelation" in the encyclopedia. It may well be Altair, Ezio and Desmond. But I think it refers to Minerva (the greeting), Juno (the warning) and Jupiter (the revelation).


Sounds good to me. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Agentbarto
11-24-2011, 11:32 PM
Originally posted by Andy_Pandy86:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by erudit0:

There's the message "three lives toiled. Three lives lost. Three messages delivered: the greeting, the warning, the revelation" in the encyclopedia. It may well be Altair, Ezio and Desmond. But I think it refers to Minerva (the greeting), Juno (the warning) and Jupiter (the revelation).


Sounds good to me. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Possible, but the way its worded you could read it through the eyes of Desmond looking back in time; the greeting being Altair's memories which introduced Desmond into the "lost" history. The meanings of the remaining messages seem to coincide with TFC hypothesis, however.

As for the lives toiled, they could refer to the ancestors (This, in addition to adding different meanings to different parts of the quote, also is more likely). Lives lost could refer to the destructive nature of the war and quest for knowledge which ultimately led to the loss of prospective paths in the lives of the ancestors.

Just throwing that in there.

Btw; I've long hypothesized that the Assassins and Templars took their ideological perspectives on how to harmonize society from the factions in the first civilization. Again this is due to the fact that Minerva seems to feel that knowledge belongs to all, while Juno feels it belongs to those who are intuitively able to understand it; thereby excluding humans.
In fact I'm betting that the reason they programmed their technology to respond only to their genetic markers is that they wanted to keep their knowledge from falling into the wrong hands. The wrong hands being humans with diluted TWCB genetic information; because they knew reference the cross, they obviously predicted the humans would be divided after TFC fell; this is why we can't excuse the wording as referring to "Templars". Assuming this is true, it's possible they want to use Desmond to recreate their genome in a new generation by mixing Desmond's genes with those of Eve. Thus ushering in a new generation of their supposed "preeminent species." Again this ideology would be espoused by those in agreement with Juno. (Anyone see parallels to templar ideology?)

erudit0
11-25-2011, 03:42 PM
Originally posted by Agentbarto:


Btw; I've long hypothesized that the Assassins and Templars took their ideological perspectives on how to harmonize society from the factions in the first civilization. (Anyone see parallels to templar ideology?)

I have had the exact same thought. And my gut feeling is that Juno's stance is templar and Minerva's stand seems to be more assassin inclined (this when discussing ideologies).

On a side note, how does Desmond relate to the whole "eagle" ordeal? Altair (brightest star in the aquila -or eagle- constellation), and Ezio said to mean something like eagle... Desmond means man of the world, and Miles in latin is soldier...

Agentbarto
11-25-2011, 05:55 PM
Originally posted by erudit0:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Agentbarto:


Btw; I've long hypothesized that the Assassins and Templars took their ideological perspectives on how to harmonize society from the factions in the first civilization. (Anyone see parallels to templar ideology?)

I have had the exact same thought. And my gut feeling is that Juno's stance is templar and Minerva's stand seems to be more assassin inclined (this when discussing ideologies).

On a side note, how does Desmond relate to the whole "eagle" ordeal? Altair (brightest star in the aquila -or eagle- constellation), and Ezio said to mean something like eagle... Desmond means man of the world, and Miles in latin is soldier... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Probably means something like soldier for mankind. What is man, if not free to live and learn? This would explain how Desmond is a soldier for man, while the templars are against it. (But who knows, I'm not even fully sure of that idea myself)

Joiceatron
11-26-2011, 07:25 AM
So Desmond Miles is the 'Soldier of Man', who's on a quest that started with Altair (the brightest star in Aquila, Jupiter's constellation), who was basically on a mission from Jupiter to contain his knowledge to ensure the right person see's it (Ezio). Ezio (The Eagle), has toiled his entire life to finally come to the point where he realises he's nothing more than what is essentially voice-mail. You have to feel a little sorry for Ezio here right?!
I think the end game here is some sort of joining of Desmond's and Eve's DNA, which will lead to a way of TWCB coming back, and it will be them who save the world using their tech. Just an idea, I also think Lucy is the 'light' that will lead Desmond in the right direction, maybe even turn out to be Eve?

Steww-
11-26-2011, 09:20 AM
This post contains multiplayer and Project Legacy spoilers as well.

Firstly, I wish subject 16 had been explored more. I do feel the little he says has a more important meaning than a lot of us realize, but I'm not sure what.


Secondly, away from the topic of the SP ending, in the final Abstergo dossier (FC_Entities) they mention that Animus and Project Legacy research has provided conclusive evidence that entities called Minerva, Juno, Tinia, and Consus were members of TWCB.

Tinia: It was our duty... mine, Minerva's, and Juno's- to sort and sample all that was collected.

Consus plays a different role. He appears in Project Legacy, and here are a few excerpts for those of you who didn't play it. They're from the perspective of Giovanni Borgia - http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Giovanni_Borgia

"Consus is standing next to me. He is watching. He does not speak much. Papŕ tells me he is not real, but I see him."

Fiora Cavazza (The Courtesan) makes an attempt to steal the apple from Cesare's house:
"I ask Consus if Fiora is here to kill Papŕ. He says no. She is here for the Apple."
"Consus tells me to give her the Apple. I laugh and tell Fiora she will have to catch me first!"

I feel he holds some keys to understanding things better. How can Giovanni interact with someone, who apparently is there at the time, if TWCB are completely gone from the world? There is more about him, but that's for another time.
Edit: I was just looking more at this again, and I'm pretty sure it's the effect of The Shroud that causes Giovanni to interact with Consus. That doesn't entirely answer the question though.


Back to the SP ending, I think the woman (who imo is Eve) and the child survived. Perhaps just the child. The key to everything seems to be the DNA of TWCB, including saving the world. I believe that child is Desmond's ancestor, so that's why his importance is highlighted.

Anyway, I'll stop here before I ramble even more. There's some more stuff I'd like to cover another time.

zerocooll21
11-26-2011, 09:30 AM
Good stuff man, thanks for that. Interesting.

Did you get to end of the MP? I read some interesting stuff in there. I wont spoiler it here unless you know.

Steww-
11-26-2011, 09:33 AM
Yeh, I got to the end of the MP today.

zerocooll21
11-26-2011, 09:39 AM
Is there a vid anywhere showing the ending? Was Danial the one being held down?

Steww-
11-26-2011, 09:47 AM
I don't think the final MP vid is up anywhere.
If you want me to tell you what happens in the final vid, just say.

As for your question -
<span class="ev_code_WHITE">Daniel Cross is the guy restraining you. He's part of the Templar's inner sanctum.</span>

erudit0
11-26-2011, 07:16 PM
Originally posted by Joiceatron:
Just an idea, I also think Lucy is the 'light' that will lead Desmond in the right direction, maybe even turn out to be Eve?

^This! I have thought about this idea too... Moreso, because Eve's name meaning is life... What if what happened to Lucy is something to consider "dark" but her being the "light" had herself a chance to be alive (life-Eve) again?

erudit0
11-26-2011, 07:39 PM
Originally posted by Steww-:
in the final Abstergo dossier (FC_Entities) they mention that Animus and Project Legacy research has provided conclusive evidence that entities called Minerva, Juno, Tinia, and Consus were members of TWCB.

Tinia: It was our duty... mine, Minerva's, and Juno's- to sort and sample all that was collected.

Consus plays a different role. He appears in Project Legacy, and here are a few excerpts for those of you who didn't play it. They're from the perspective of Giovanni Borgia

I feel he holds some keys to understanding things better. How can Giovanni interact with someone, who apparently is there at the time, if TWCB are completely gone from the world? There is more about him, but that's for another time.

Edit: I was just looking more at this again, and I'm pretty sure it's the effect of The Shroud that causes Giovanni to interact with Consus. That doesn't entirely answer the question though.


Back to the SP ending, I think the woman (who imo is Eve) and the child survived. Perhaps just the child. The key to everything seems to be the DNA of TWCB, including saving the world. I believe that child is Desmond's ancestor, so that's why his importance is highlighted.

Anyway, I'll stop here before I ramble even more. There's some more stuff I'd like to cover another time.

Please continue! Your post gave great insight. When Giovanni enters the temple of pythagoras isn't he greeted by "Consus, the erudite god?" I'm hoping they release more chapters of PL, although it seems they won't for the time being...

I also think the shroud has much to do with Giovanni's hallucinations. But as you mentioned, there's still a possibility they will expand this Consus thing. By the way, I couldn't find Consus as a god in mythology but rather in ancient Roman religion. I guess the equivalent to Consus (who is the protector of pretty much agriculture by the way) is Ceres.

And I don't know if the others agree but I want to know what happens by the end of multiplayer...

Steww-
11-27-2011, 04:30 AM
I'm gonna go back and have a look at the Project Legacy files again, especially chapter 4, but I'll tell you about the mp ending now.

Here is the transcript, obviously this is a MP spoiler -
<span class="ev_code_WHITE">Vidic:You have all been brought here because our intelligence gathering has progressed rapidly in the last week.
Daniel: What have they found?
Vidic: Be patient, Daniel. I have an announcement to make. We now know where the Assassin Leader, William M., is located.
Laeticia England: Brilliant work. We need to send a retrieval team.
Vidic: Well? What are you waiting for? Go get him.</span>

zerocooll21
11-27-2011, 05:36 AM
Wow good stuff. I wonder if they are going to bring Danial in on AC3 or just keep him part of the MP side story.

erudit0
11-27-2011, 03:02 PM
*SPOILER*

I wonder if anyone inside the assassin team has to do anything with this "intelligence gathering"

Steww-
11-27-2011, 03:14 PM
Would it help you if I got the transcript for each video, and maybe typed up the dossiers? It wouldn't bother me. I'm just not sure if they are available already.

erudit0
11-27-2011, 05:58 PM
Originally posted by Steww-:
Would it help you if I got the transcript for each video, and maybe typed up the dossiers? It wouldn't bother me. I'm just not sure if they are available already.

That would be awesome! But I think it may be very time consuming. If anyone else wants to have this information then please inform us, otherwise I think I will be spending the next days playing the MP instead of playing PES 2012 online

Steww-
11-28-2011, 10:20 AM
You'd be surprised. I'll type it up later tonight.

Edit: Just remembered this forum has no spoiler tags, I'll type the stuff up if anyone wants it, but I'm not sure how to go about posting it. I could post the video transcripts since they are relatively short, but they're mostly available. The dossiers are much longer though.

souNdwAve89
11-28-2011, 12:14 PM
Originally posted by zerocooll21:
Wow good stuff. I wonder if they are going to bring Danial in on AC3 or just keep him part of the MP side story.

I really hope they do include Daniel in AC3 because his story is getting bigger. In the official Assassin's Creed Encyclopedia, there is a picture that is a video game character render of Daniel. It would be a waste to not include him in AC3 since the modern day period will play a bigger role this time. Besides, who doesn't want a Daniel vs Desmond battle, Subject 4 vs Subject 17?

samward
11-28-2011, 07:51 PM
Originally posted by erudit0:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by syndbg:

Well, from the AC2 Truth we see some goddess using the Apple to force humans to work, which I think is Juno. Adam and Eve "crossed" her by escaping from TWCB's slavery. From the dialogues in AC:B we can clearly see that Juno is very, very hateful towards humanity, probably the most hateful from TWCB ( now there are only three from TWCB so there's no big choice anyway... ). But let's skip this not-so-serious talk and focus on Subject16's the Truth message - "She is not who you think she is. Everything you hope to become. Everything you hold dear. It's already gone.""There is one who would accompany you through the gate. She lies not within our sight. The cross darkens the horizon.The Path must be opened. You cannot escape your part in this. The scales shall be balanced. *after stabbing Lucy* It is done. The way lies all before you. Only she remains to be found. Awaken the sixth. Go. ALONE!"


Great theory! Althought there are certain parts I have different views on. Your name meanings are almost spot on, I think Desmond means 2 things, but the most relevant here is "man of the world (or society)." I found Lucy's meaning to be interesting. He should look for the light. (I don't remember any references to light in the series, or the sequence titles, etc)

When I read "the cross darkens the horizon" I think there's one possibility for this.

**SPOILERS** (BIG ONES)

Do you guys remember Daniel Cross? He killed the menthor and then reunited with Abstergo. People think he is in the higher chain of abstergo. I think the cross darkening the horizon is Daniel Cross (apart from the templars in general), and he seems to be the perfect antagonist to Desmond (same position inside the templars as of Desmond within the assassins - think of Cain vs. Abel). Probably the one he will have to fight against in the very end. Who knows if this Daniel Cross has some artifact in possession but if he does, it must be something very valuable to the story.

And about TWCB... I agree, their intentions are bleak at best. But I just can't think in which way Jupiter (who owns the Aquila constelation - Altair being the name of its brightest star) or Minerva can mean harm...

There's the message "three lives toiled. Three lives lost. Three messages delivered: the greeting, the warning, the revelation" in the encyclopedia. It may well be Altair, Ezio and Desmond. But I think it refers to Minerva (the greeting), Juno (the warning) and Jupiter (the revelation).

I know I might be moving away from the discussion, but isn't it interesting that according to the wiki, Jupiter shares the same voice actor as Al-Mualim and they look similar? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


ooooooooooo!!! love your theory on Cross http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

jeremytwoface
11-29-2011, 11:26 AM
This has probably been brought up before, but what if Lucy was a sleeper agent like Daniel Cross? It's possible right? And maybe that's why she had to be killed... Remember Juno saying something like "she's not who you think she is"... or something.



EDIT --- It was 16 that said that, not Juno. My mistake!

Jacobaab
12-10-2011, 01:05 PM
I wondered why nobody hasen't mentioned the coordinates from leodanos disappering in brotherhood.
We find out in brotherhood that the pythograians wanted desmond to see this coordinates 43 39 19 N 75 27 42 W
However ezio cant oviously figure out what is, because it's modern coordinates. But it you reacerch them on google maps you get the following location which shows a crater

http://www.google.dk/imgres?q=...,r:3,s:0&tx=46&ty=78

this is the location we see in the end movie at revelations, (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2mdxGQb2OI , 8;30)

However what we can learn from this, is that, this is the location Desmond, rebaccas and his father is at , and also that AC 3 wil probably take place in USA.
Some says that we will play a person from the american revolution , because a big fight from the revoultion took place close to there , and also George washington was templar and had a piece of eden.(wikiassainscreed.com)

erudit0
12-10-2011, 06:03 PM
Originally posted by Jacobaab:
I wondered why nobody hasen't mentioned the coordinates...

This has been discussed about 3,381 times in this forum.

zerocooll21
12-11-2011, 05:17 AM
Originally posted by erudit0:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jacobaab:
I wondered why nobody hasen't mentioned the coordinates...

This has been discussed about 3,381 times in this forum. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

3,381 times sounds about right http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif