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View Full Version : Just a reminder of how tough these manuevers are on the body



knightflyte
06-04-2006, 10:38 PM
I saw a documentary a few years ago where the narrator was taken up in a prop plane. The pilot was describing a VERY basic evasive manuever, and the resultant effect of the body. He then performed it while describing seeing an enemy plane come in fast: Bandit at 2:00 break left on 3...... 1...2...3 Then the plane banked quikly.

The narrator upon landing then described his sensations during the BASIC evasion.


WELL here's a video clip of some bloke in a jet doing one of the most basiv manuevers.....the immelmann.

It's not the documentary I described above......but it gives you a good idea the abuse fighter pilots had to go through WITHOUT body suits to control bloodflow to the brain.


http://www.break.com/index/f1goodnight.html

han freak solo
06-05-2006, 03:34 PM
3 strikes and yer out! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Treetop64
06-05-2006, 03:47 PM
Well, at least the guy recovers quite well after each episode! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Looks painful, though...

Whoever wrote the caption needs to be reprimanded, though. That's an F-18, NOT an F-1! Fernando Alonso is NOT in the cockpit! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

leitmotiv
06-05-2006, 04:03 PM
Fighter pilots are now very special breeds---were in WWII, too. The time when ordinary people could fly in combat, with all their varieties of disabilities, ended in 1918. Tough luck for me.

Treetop64
06-05-2006, 04:13 PM
Originally posted by leitmotiv:
Fighter pilots are now very special breeds---were in WWII, too. The time when ordinary people could fly in combat, with all their varieties of disabilities, ended in 1918. Tough luck for me.

Yeah, no kidding. But, someone forgot to tell Bader, though!

knightflyte
06-05-2006, 04:13 PM
I guess that's why I posted this,leitmotiv. They ARE a special breed.

We have fun 'playing' WW2 ace, but really the physical exersion to fight adequately, never mind proficeintly, is staggering.

Hang me by my ankles for 30 seconds and I'll get a headache.....LOL! Nevermind looping and spinning and negative G's.


I wonder how many folks manage to get u in a jet like that thinking it's like riding in a car?

leitmotiv
06-05-2006, 04:23 PM
Definitely, knightflyte. Bader was a holy terror fighter pilot with guts of steel, Treetop64, and losing his legs probably made him even more athletic and tough. He was superman, no doubt about it. However, but for an extreme national emergency he would never have flown a fighter again---the RAF doctors rejected him over and over.

LEBillfish
06-05-2006, 04:46 PM
Originally posted by leitmotiv:
......and losing his legs probably made him even more athletic and tough. He was superman, no doubt about it. ..........

L.......M......."F".......A.......O.....

Now no disrespect intended for whomever it is you speak of, as quite frankly I don't know them.........Yet if they had no "legs" for the blood to rush to, I'd suspect it would still fill as much as it could the lowest point...

Now, I really can't speak from any experience at all on that, yet I'd suspect he'd have an even bigger (or more agitating) problem.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

SeaFireLIV
06-05-2006, 05:10 PM
Actually it`s pretty much agreed that Douglas Bader was able to fly as well as he could because he had no legs. He never suffered as badly from blood to the feet or head problem. Something to do with the fact that blood has less distance to move.

There`s an article on it somewhere...

leitmotiv
06-05-2006, 05:17 PM
Remember Bader was an aerobatic champion before he smashed himself. I'd venture his arduous physical fitness routine after he got his "tin legs" and temperence made him fitter, despite his age, than his young proteges. No legs might have helped with Gs but I'd wager his being a great athlete counted more.

ploughman
06-06-2006, 02:37 AM
Originally posted by LEBillfish:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by leitmotiv:
......and losing his legs probably made him even more athletic and tough. He was superman, no doubt about it. ..........

L.......M......."F".......A.......O.....

Now no disrespect intended for whomever it is you speak of, as quite frankly I don't know them.........Yet if they had no "legs" for the blood to rush to, I'd suspect it would still fill as much as it could the lowest point...

Now, I really can't speak from any experience at all on that, yet I'd suspect he'd have an even bigger (or more agitating) problem.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think the guy was referring to Bader's ice-like personality etc. The trauma of losing his legs, the rehabilitation and getting booted out of flying made Bader stronger both physically and mentally.

Bader was famously strong in the cockpit and could turn harder and faster than most other pilots and there was alot of speculation by other pilots as to whether or not this was due to his disability, the blood could only go so far south. I don't know if anyone actually attempted a 'scientific' investigation into it. As to whether or not he got wood in a turn? Who doesn't, well Kurfy I guess. That boy doesn't like to turn.
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WOLFMondo
06-06-2006, 03:33 AM
Originally posted by Ploughman:
I don't know if anyone actually attempted a 'scientific' investigation into it. As to whether or not he got wood in a turn? Who doesn't, well Kurfy I guess. That boy doesn't like to turn.
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

That made my day. Thanks!

F19_tintin
06-06-2006, 05:12 AM
leitmotiv wrote Fighter pilots are now very special breeds---were in WWII, too. The time when ordinary people could fly in combat, with all their varieties of disabilities

how much G did they reach in ww1 plane ??

leitmotiv
06-06-2006, 06:04 AM
Good point, F19_tintin---I don't know. What amazes me, in retrospect, is the variety of types who were top pilots in all the air forces of WWI---Zeumer was dying of tuberculosis, Guynemer was sickly and slight---he was rejected for service in the Army and only his father's influence got him into the air service---as a mechanic, von Richthofen kept flying with a severe head injury and probably suffering from injury-related psychological infirmities, etc. All of these unique characters would not have flown in later years.

Vacillator
06-06-2006, 06:12 AM
Last year I did a Redletter aerobatics day. We only did around 20 minutes in the air, with a few loops, stall turn, barrel roll etc.
My grinning pilot (who let me have a quick go at flying http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif) told me we'd pulled maybe 5 g's coming out of a vertical dive. Boy was I sick as a dog during the flight and for the next couple of hours.
To try and do in real life anything like I do in this sim would have me so incapacitated I wouldn't need an enemy to down me, I'd either be no use to anyone or dead. Hats off indeed to fighter pilots from any era...

joeap
06-06-2006, 06:44 AM
I'd have been in a Sunderland flying endless patrols over the Atlantic be sure. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

ImpStarDuece
06-06-2006, 07:31 AM
I've backseated in a L-39 Albatross light trainer/attack jet for 15 minutes of a practice acrobatic display routine. The pilot was an ex-RAAF Roulettes Captain, with about 30 years of stick time, includig F/A-18, Mirage III and F-111 time.

We did up to positive 4 - 4.5 g and down to around negative 1.5 and the stress on your body is not to be underestimated. Lifting my arms in a 3g sustained downward spiral was like doing weights. I experianced grey out, tunnel vision and red out and they are the weirdest physical sensations.

The biggest problem I had though, was trying to keep my lunch down. Watching the horizon disappear while doing spins, loops, rolls and turns does all sorts of nasty things to your inner ear.

In my opinion, the ultimate fighter pilot is about 5'4", weights 90kg, is built like a brick outhouse, has neck muscles like a bull and could survive an hour inside a spin dryer without puking. Good eyesight and fast reaction times are great, but the spatial awarness necessary to carry out complex aerobatic manouvers is just mindblowing.