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rijnton1944
12-02-2004, 07:27 AM
As I already wrote in another thread I just recently began with gaming and because I liked the idea of virtually flying with some action added, I bought FB and have already added AEP and PF. In the meantime I already got some tips here for setting the game up and have tried some flying for practicing. I already tried a few single missions and was even able to shoot an enemy plane down.
However all the options in the game itself are rather overwhelming, especially because I am new with gaming. I see Single Missions, Full Mission Builder and Quick Mission Builder with a lot of options in each of these.
Although in general I understand what the meaning of these options are, I don't know where to start and how to proceed.
So maybe you can give me some tips and/or advice ?

rijnton1944
12-02-2004, 07:27 AM
As I already wrote in another thread I just recently began with gaming and because I liked the idea of virtually flying with some action added, I bought FB and have already added AEP and PF. In the meantime I already got some tips here for setting the game up and have tried some flying for practicing. I already tried a few single missions and was even able to shoot an enemy plane down.
However all the options in the game itself are rather overwhelming, especially because I am new with gaming. I see Single Missions, Full Mission Builder and Quick Mission Builder with a lot of options in each of these.
Although in general I understand what the meaning of these options are, I don't know where to start and how to proceed.
So maybe you can give me some tips and/or advice ?

Extreme_One
12-02-2004, 07:36 AM
For me plenty of practice in the Quick mission builder was what helped me learn. My biggest problem at first was landing though so I didn't enable enemy planes for a while until I could land properly.

I didn't hink it right that I could stay alive in the air but kill myself when coming in to land.

As for practicing aiming and shooting I used to have realistic gunnery off so that I could see when I was making hits.

Some other swill chip in later with some far more useful tips I'm sure...

Rab03
12-02-2004, 07:51 AM
The best way to practice take offs and landings is to click Multiplayer, Create server (you're the host), Dogfight. Dogfight allows you to to just press Esc, click Refly, and within second you're back in the cockpit, preparing to take off. In the difficulty settings, try using easy take offs and landings at first. When you feel you're ready for more, change it to realistic.
Landing is the most stressfull part of flight for real pilots, as it is for Il-2 flyers.

Advance gradually through QMB. For practicing gunnery, you can set friendly flights, and then shoot them down (pay attention to distance, point of aim, and where bullets hit). Second stage is to set enemy flight or flights set to rookie experience, after that average, veteran and finally ace.

All can be summed up as: practice, practice, practice.

Bearcat99
12-02-2004, 12:01 PM
I used the QMB almost exclusively for the first 6 or 7 months. Look at the practice tips thread stickied at top and hit the Essentials thread in my sig.

xTHRUDx
12-02-2004, 01:04 PM
i (an online only player) started as a bomber pilot and moved into fighters. with the b-25 out now, it seems i'm back into bombers. if you go online, expect to be shot down alot, but that's ok. it's part of the learning process. record your tracks. watch'em to see what you did right or wrong.

Monty_Thrud
12-02-2004, 01:26 PM
Some like to throw themselves in at the deep end straight away and play FS/FR (full switch/full real)...i didnt, you want to have fun and some success whilst learning, i always played at first with CP (cockpit) on and realistic guns, CEM (complex engine management) off...concentrate on T/O (take off) and landing and aiming also engine overheat/ stalls and spins and vunrability OFF...just to concentrate on aiming, deflection shooting is a must. Then introduce the above slowly back in, one by one...lots of practice...go online on UBI...not Hyperlobby just yet...they're animals to Rookie pilots and vets also http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif..Pick one or two planes your comfy with, that suit your flying style, stick with them, till you feel your part of them...then annihilate thine enemy with extreme prejudice....OH!...and enjoy http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Korbelz
12-02-2004, 02:07 PM
no worries mate...it took me about a year and a half of playing before i was able to dive into "full real" and even have a chance of killing anyone on-line.
also joining a squad with a good training program..like vultures row did wonders for me, being able to get on teamspeak and ask what is the effect prop pitch? and have someone explain it to me in depth was very helpful.

dieg777
12-02-2004, 02:09 PM
Hi and welcolm

here are two threads from people new to the game with some good advice.

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?q=Y&a=tpc&s=400102&f=23110283&m=9181071422&p=1

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&s=400102&f=23110283&m=4901007622&r=9131017622#9131017622

here is some personnel advise -it is a bit long but is covered in PF manual so you should be able to pick it up
start with qmb QMB will give you an easy option situation where the mission will start with you flying
pick your favourite plane and learn to fly with this.
Add bandit - a bomber will be larger target and in his advanced button set his loadout to empty then he cant shoot back and set your ammo to unlimited in realism settings and learn to shoot

learn from your flying by watching tracks. You can save your last flight as a track when you exit - call it something you will remember and go to play tracks option on main page- select all options for time and views by using the switches on RHS then play your track.
Use different views e.g F2 for outside F8 for follow and ctrl+F2 for bandit and use your mouse to pan around.

single missions are an expansion for QMB in that you usually have to take off - find your target and land

Campaign is a set of single missions that follow each other. be careful what realism setings you choose at start of campaign as you cannot change them during the campaign.

http://www.airwarfare.com/
is a good site for help and tips

hope this will be of help

gates123
12-02-2004, 02:19 PM
quick mission builder and unlimited ammo. Once you get your aim down I went online and never looked back.

rijnton1944
12-02-2004, 04:31 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by dieg777:
by using the switches on RHS then play your track.



What do you mean with RHS ? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

By the way thanks for your advice you all.
One more question:
What's the best way to approach an enemy to shoot him down ? Fly straight to him and try to aim and shoot or turn 180 degrees and follow him and shoot him from behind ?

rijnton1944
12-02-2004, 04:32 PM
Sorry for messing around above.
I don't know exactly how to use the quote function

rijnton1944
12-02-2004, 05:18 PM
Think I figured it out already :
R(ight) H(and) S(creen)
Am I right ?

Chuck_Older
12-02-2004, 05:26 PM
rijnton-

There's a lot of stuff in the sim, and it can be overwhelming

Do you know anything at all about the aircraft in the sim? Do you have a favorite? Or just like the looks of one of the aircraft you can fly? A suggestion:

Don't jump around from plane to plane all the time. Try some out, and pick one you like. Learn some things about it, how it flies, if you like the cockpit, etc, and decide on one or two aircraft you really prefer to fly. Fly them around. Try not to pick more than one before you sorta-kinda "get the feel" of what you can and can't do, in general.

Some of the aircraft behave so differently from others that what you learn in one may be a bad mistake in another

I like to tell new folks to check out this link:
http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/index.htm

JR_Greenhorn
12-02-2004, 05:35 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by rijnton1944:
What's the best way to approach an enemy to shoot him down ? Fly straight to him and try to aim and shoot or turn 180 degrees and follow him and shoot him from behind ? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>It depends what you're facing. If you are straight behind a fighter, his only defences are to outmanouver you or bait you into his wingmen. If you are behind a plane with a rear gunner, you are just asking for trouble.

For planes with gunners, try to see where the gunners have the worst shot. On an Il-2, the gunner can't touch you if you are below his level, so often the best way to take down Il-2s is to shoot them from below.

Many bombers have belly gunners, so it isn't safe below them. On these planes, try to attack from different angles, both in the horizontal and vertical planes. Usually it's pretty effective to aim for the engines.

You asked about flying straight toward your opponet and shoot. This is usually called a head-on pass. These are obviously a dangerous manouver, because if your opponent banks the same way as you do you may collide. However, if you can perfect the technique, they can be very effective.

dieg777
12-03-2004, 10:20 AM
sorry mate should try to avoid abbreviations

right hand side ( of screen )

for shooting see these threads

http://mywebpages.comcast.net/Tailspin/index.htm

click on air to air then gunnery

anything by andy bush is well worth reading http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

rijnton1944
12-03-2004, 11:23 AM
Thanks again.
What a great forum with all this help.
I actually asked about the way to shoot an enemy because when I choose a Quick Mission I always approach the enemy head-on (do I say that right in english ?).
So in that case the safest way would be to turn 180 degrees and chase him from behind ?

dieg777
12-03-2004, 02:17 PM
avoid head on - unless in FW190 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif its just a lottery and if you select ace as enemy ai then you get nailed.
What you are looking to do is create the best advantage for your specific aircraft - so for some it will be vertical seperation so they will climb and then zoom down on their foe - e.g. for me109s and fw 190s
for others it will be lateral seperation - move to the side then swing back -what is termed a lead turn so that you begin turning inside your enemy to use your better turn rate to get on his six faster- e.g. for spitfires , hurricanes etc

you cannot be too rigid tho as air to air is like a ches game with move-defence-counterattack all happening in real time in 3 dimensions so practice and find out what you like and what suits the aircraft you like.
one more link for you to check out - although not written for this sim it details how to deal with one-on -ones

http://www.fubarsquad.com/STKEAW105NH.pdf

bet your head is throbbing with all this info but it should set you on the right path !!!

Gerd_Schopfel
12-03-2004, 02:49 PM
rijnton1944:

Listen man, talking from a point of great experience, the best way to get started with this simulation (best of its kind out there) is to start off realistic no matter what the cost. That is the best way to learn any trade-Jump right into the real deal. This is specially true with computer simulations such as this one since a mistake will cost you nothing but time, and you'll gain everything-experience with the real deal. That is how I always start off with any simulation and it works very well.
My point is, do not waste your time with unrealistic settings, but rather go right into the mess-with full realism and everything as real as possible, because the ONLY way to learn it better than others is to start out tough-build up your instincts and skills from the real deal because that is the only way to aquire the skills to be part of the few, the proud, the elite.
All but a few people out there understand the logic of what I've just told you, hopefully you are one of those few.

Good hunting and remember:

"SUCCESS FLOURISHES ONLY IN PERSEVERANCE - CEASELESS, RESTLESS PERSEVERANCE.€œ
-BARON MONFRED BON RICHTHOFEN

jonboyjlc
12-03-2004, 09:51 PM
Here's a few "flying" tips:

1. Some planes in this sim handle better than others. If you have stalls turned on, learn to sense when your plane is about to stall. When you're pulling on the stick, and it starts to shake, it usually means the plane is about to stall. Ease off the stick. If it does stall, you can hit Autopilot, or zero your speed and hit opposite rudder (no tail or aileron).

2. Speed is life. If you get down low and slow... you're a target.


Here's a few "combat" tips:

1. Start with the "Quick Mission" builder and select any desired fighter vs 1 bomber. A good fighter to fly for a beginner would be a Spitfire or Zero. For the enemy bomber, select the first IL2 in the drop down list. This version has "no" rear gunner. Pratice getting in on its six and then try to get within 200m-300m before firing. You need to learn now bullets fired closer to the enemy can cause a lot more damage than from longer range. Also recommend that you turn on "track" save. With this, you can go back and see how you performed during combat. You'll be able to see where you made any mistakes.

2. Once you've gotten good at blasting a single IL2 with no gunner, select a later version that has a rear gunner. Now you need to alter your tactics a little. If you attempt to get in on its six, you'll probably wind up dead. Learn to go higher, and slightly off centered from the bomber, then swoop down and across to rake it. Check the mission tracks; one of them shows how to engage bombers with gunners.

3. When you're ready, switch to a single enemy fighter. Now here's the choice. Do you want to "turn fight" or "zoom and boom"? If you want to be able to out turn the enemy, pick the Spitfire with clipped wings or the Zero. If you want to zoom and boom, try the P51D. For example, if you pick the P51D and go against a Zero, don't try to out turn the Zero. Won't happen. If the Zero does start to turn on your six, put a slight down nose, hit the throttle, and run away. As the distance increases, start to climb. When you get more than 1km away, you can Split S and re-engage the Zero.

4. Most of the time, you'll want to fire at the enemy, but you'er not exactly on his six. You have to learn to lead the target. Try aiming at where you thing your bullets will arrive when the enemy reaches that point. Then add a little more lead to it. Most of us wind up short of the expected spot. With track save on, go back and watch your bullets and see how well you did.

note: If things are going by too quickly, try slowing the "time speed" down. Also, you can hit CTRL + F1 to turn off the cockpit. Once you start to learn how to fly and fight, you won't need these. Although I still like to use them in Quick missions. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif And use Unlimited Ammo while you're learning how to engage the enemy.

hope this helps
OldDog

rijnton1944
12-04-2004, 09:14 AM
Thanks again.
jonboyjlc: It's probably my knowledge of the english language but I don't know what is meant with "lead the target" and/or " add a little more lead to it" and then especially the word "lead".
Could you explain that a little more ?
Btw, this "no cockpit" view is great for me as a newbie. I now see where my enemy should be when he disppeared from my view. I already tried 2 with reargunners and succeeded to shoot down both.
After playing a little with the No Cockpit View I would like to add another question:
In my view I have 2 circles: 1 larger one and "fixed" and a smaller one that is "floating", that is sometimes inside and sometimes outside the larger one (if I can call it so). The large one is of course my flying direction but I am not sure what the smaller one means. I suppose this is for aiming to shoot and has to be right in the middle of the larger one for a good shoot, or am I wrong ? (Can't find anything in the manual about it)

Friendly_flyer
12-04-2004, 03:13 PM
&gt;what is meant with "lead the target" and/or " add a little more
&gt;lead to it" and then especially the word "lead".

In this case he means to aim a bit in front of where you want to hit. Since the enemy plane is moving, you have to take his movements into account when you are shooting. If you shoot right at his engine, your bullets will fall behind, hitting the tail or even miss. You will have to aim a bit in front of the plane. This "a bit in front" is what we call lead.

Knowing where to aim is an art all of its own. It will depend on your enemy€s speed, distance, angle of shooting and so on. With a bit of practice, you'll start to get a hang of it.

LStarosta
12-04-2004, 03:43 PM
The biggest tip anyone could give you is to start flying full real right away. Don't baby yourself into flying with stalls and spins, or overheating, or realistic gunnery, or cockpit off. Start getting used to them. It may be harder to take at first, but it will be well worth it. Also, you won't have any easier frame of reference to return to should you get discouraged. Also turn on Arcade mode in your .cfg file and go flying in the QMB. When firing a burst at an enemy, pause the game with "P" and then switch to his external view and see where your tracers are falling. If you scored hits, they will be represented by long arrows showing the vector at which your rounds struck the aircraft. (Come to think of it, the arrows only show vector direction, not magnitude, but you get my point, right?)

To recap, fly full real in terms of Flight Model to get the basics down. Then it's your choice from there on whether you want icons or not or whatever.

And may I suggest TrackIR? It takes a week or two to get used to, but it will make you a better pilot in terms of situational awareness and also noncombat aspects such as navigation by landmarks, formation flying, sightseeing, etc.

rijnton1944
12-04-2004, 05:24 PM
I edited my last post with another question but didn't notice that there was already a page 2, so my question gets probably lost. That's why I repeat it here:
Btw, this "no cockpit" view is great for me as a newbie. I now see where my enemy should be when he disppeared from my view. I already tried 2 with reargunners and succeeded to shoot down both.
After playing a little with the No Cockpit View I would like to add another question:
In my view I have 2 circles: 1 larger one and "fixed" and a smaller one that is "floating", that is sometimes inside and sometimes outside the larger one (if I can call it so). The large one is of course my flying direction but I am not sure what the smaller one means. I suppose this is for aiming to shoot and has to be right in the middle of the larger one for a good shoot, or am I wrong ? (Can't find anything in the manual about it)

LStarosta
12-04-2004, 05:42 PM
The second smaller circle is for landing approaches. It will show you where your aircraft will go at its velocity at that instant.

Please do yourself a favor and fly with the cockpit ON. You're just babying yourself with no-cockpit view. The longer you fly with Cockpit Off, the harder it will be for you to learn to fly with it ON. One of the criteria for a new plane being designed by a third party (or otherwise) modeller is a good looking and functioning cockpit. The plane set could be HUGE if cockpits weren't part of the criteria. Instead, people work REALLY hard to make these great looking cockpits, leaving us with a limited, but very high quality planeset, and it's a shame if people just fly without them on. They really are the defining factor between "just a game" and a simulation.

jonboyjlc
12-05-2004, 10:54 PM
Flying with the cockpit on can be fun & challenging. Two things that I don't like about having the cockpit on are:

1. In some planes, the forward view is restricted. Others like the P38L have a nice forward view.

2. (people are going to laugh at me over this one) I like to fly the P51D, but the prop on it really blurs the forward view. I actually get a headache peering thru it.

Bottom line: Each person needs to find the settings that give them the most joy out of this sim. (And if you can kill a bandit on max realism with Ace A/I, you know the girls are going to luv you)

OldDog