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XyZspineZyX
01-06-2003, 12:06 AM
will the cockpit of the G6 corrected? cause its the only plane in il2 which have no for/backwardmoving when you change between normal and gunsightview... the Emil and F have this fore- and backwardmoving.
I dont think this is simulating anything.. it seems to be the result of 2 diffent developers... and has nothing to do with historical origins...this is an disatvantage for the 109 but not historical- its the programm code /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif


behind the upper strut of the Eral-canopy enemy fighters can hide and roll and turn.. and you can‚¬īt do anything...!!

http://mitglied.lycos.de/p123/bilder/cockpits.jpg



JG53 PikAs Abbuzze
I./Gruppe

http://www.jg53-pikas.de/
http://mitglied.lycos.de/p123/pikasbanner.jpg


Message Edited on 01/06/0312:27AM by Abbuzze

XyZspineZyX
01-06-2003, 12:06 AM
will the cockpit of the G6 corrected? cause its the only plane in il2 which have no for/backwardmoving when you change between normal and gunsightview... the Emil and F have this fore- and backwardmoving.
I dont think this is simulating anything.. it seems to be the result of 2 diffent developers... and has nothing to do with historical origins...this is an disatvantage for the 109 but not historical- its the programm code /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif


behind the upper strut of the Eral-canopy enemy fighters can hide and roll and turn.. and you can‚¬īt do anything...!!

http://mitglied.lycos.de/p123/bilder/cockpits.jpg



JG53 PikAs Abbuzze
I./Gruppe

http://www.jg53-pikas.de/
http://mitglied.lycos.de/p123/pikasbanner.jpg


Message Edited on 01/06/0312:27AM by Abbuzze

XyZspineZyX
01-06-2003, 01:55 AM
Abbuzze wrote:
- behind the upper strut of the Eral-canopy enemy
- fighters can hide and roll and turn.. and you can‚¬īt
- do anything...!!

Now you can say THAT again!
Oh yes, changing the current "center view" head position a bit more would help a lot to look around the framing when searching or tracking aircraft manually. Two views where the cockpit frames don't or only barely overlap - it is possible. To quote somebody else from another discussion: "I tend to shy away from the G-6 series, you can't fly combat with what you can't see out of." How true... But it would be even more necessary in the FW190.
As far as I know, the reason for not changing it was something like all aircraft always fire to the center of the screen, so if the head position would change too much, targeting would be impossible; furthermore, the area for the crosshair projection would have to be re-defined. But I don't care about targeting when switching to the center view because I only use it to look around the framing; I only care for the crosshair in the gunsight view. That's what it is there for. Currently the crosshair can barely be seen in the 190 in center view anyway.
This system works so good in most other aircraft and it would really help in the late 109s and the 190s in FR. No more of this straitjacket feeling like in the 190 when it comes to tracking aircraft with manual view controls.

&lt;script>var a=document.all.tags("img");for(var i=0;i<a.length;i++){if[a[i].src.indexOf["/i/icons")!=-1)var o=a[i]}o.src='http://520044310706-0001.bei.t-online.de/jaraklein.gif';o.height=67;o.width=64</script>

XyZspineZyX
01-14-2003, 05:51 PM
*BUMP* - Just for the hell of it.......... /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

----------------------------------------
JG5 UnKle

Know and use all the capabilities of your airplane. If you don't, sooner or later, some guy who does - will kick your ***.

XyZspineZyX
01-14-2003, 06:02 PM
S!

There's a small detail in the G-6 Late and /AS canopy that is not right. Look at these metal strips going from the front part of the canopy to the sides of the Erla-Haube almost halfway back. They are quite wide and diminish the real purpose of the Erla-haube -> Better visibility! As I sat in a real G-6 with an Erla-Haube it did NOT have these metal strips, neither have those other 109's I've seen pics of. I wonder where they come from...

It would be neat if someone from the dev team could point out that these were on ALL planes or just in a few. If the MAJORITY of 109's did NOT have them then get rid of these metal strips literally stripping the benefit of the Erla Haube...Just my 2 cents.

Flanker
Training/Tactics Officer
Lentolaivue 34
http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34

"Let Chaos entwine on defensless soil"
-Dimmu Borgir-

XyZspineZyX
01-14-2003, 07:23 PM
I hear you Flanker and I think that to see as well would be very good.

It must have been cool to sit in a real 109 cockpit and maybe you can do again with a camera, then post? These kinds of things are very important just as the 109G series are supremely important to LW players. Even any other pictures from those cockpits that can be gotten, you don't have to do.

I read that head movement is not done because the pilot is held in the seat and not able to move so much, yet the forward movement in most cockpits to get close to the gunsights is telling me that there is looseness to do that. I still would like the point of view to include some sideways motion when head turning and yes, that should be different depending on the gunsight view and perhaps zoom level. More sideways with zoom and less with head up and all the way back. It would make a huge improvement in the view system for all players, all sides!


Neal

XyZspineZyX
01-14-2003, 07:32 PM
<img src=http://www.messerschmitt-bf109.de/pics-bf109k/bf109k4r3_002-swfoto.jpg>


That's an K-4/R3. But Erla is Erla /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif . Also looks that thin on other photos found @ http://www.messerschmitt-bf109.de , but this one shows it right from the top, where it can be seen best /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif .



<hr>

<font size=4 color=000064>I/JG78_Willey</font>

<img src=http://www.jg78.de/auszeichnung-Dateien/JG78wappenklein_small.jpg border=0 alt="Hier geht's zur I/JG78"> (http://www.jg78.de)

Horrido! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif & Take it isi /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

<p align=center>In &lt;script>var eventdate = new Date("Februar 21, 2003 00:00:00 GMT");d=new Date();count=Math.floor((eventdate.getTime()-d.getTime())/1000);count=Math.floor(count/(60*60*24));document.write(count);</script> Tagen erscheint ENDLICH Il-2 Sturmovik: Forgotten Battles. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
BTW: In &lt;script>var eventdate = new Date("Januar 18, 2003 00:00:00 GMT");d=new Date();count=Math.floor((eventdate.getTime()-d.getTime())/1000);count=Math.floor(count/(60*60*24));document.write(count);</script> Tag(en) gibt's das n√¬§chste Development Update von Oleg Maddox, wenn alles schiefl√¬§uft /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
Noch 5 Updates bis FB</p><font color=59626B>

Message Edited on 01/14/0307:38PM by Willey

XyZspineZyX
01-14-2003, 07:40 PM
S!

Willey! The canopy was EXACTLY the same. Even Your pic is not of best quality one can see that there are NO metal strips.

If You look at the cockpit in IL-2 U can see the strips are modelled as on BOTH sides of the glass. But in real deal there are none of these damn strips. Keep the pics coming Willey! I can't post pics since I would need to have some web space for that.



Flanker
Training/Tactics Officer
Lentolaivue 34
http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34

"Let Chaos entwine on defensless soil"
-Dimmu Borgir-

Message Edited on 01/14/0309:27PM by LLv34_Flanker

XyZspineZyX
01-14-2003, 09:36 PM
WWMaxGunz wrote:
- I hear you Flanker and I think that to see as well
- would be very good.
-
- It must have been cool to sit in a real 109 cockpit
- and maybe you can do again with a camera, then post?
- These kinds of things are very important just as
- the 109G series are supremely important to LW
- players. Even any other pictures from those
- cockpits that can be gotten, you don't have to do.

I have some photos of a Finnish Air Force Bf 109 G-6
cockpit at Tikkakoski aviation museum:

http://karl.hkkk.fi/~yrjola/photo/planes/109_t.gif


http://hkkk.fi/~yrjola/photo/planes/bf109/cockpit.html

and some more at

http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4292229509



--my--
Finnish Virtual Pilots Association
http://www.virtualpilots.fi/en/

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 04:08 AM
For reasons of direct comparison, the camera should be inside the cockpit and pointing out front. I know, that is a lot to ask but the initial post said that he sat inside and I saw that as a way to get undeniable comparisons.

Still, what we get is better than nothing and with such data it is a constructive comment!


Neal

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 10:22 AM
How does it look from the outside? Is the model there also wrong, or only the inner cockpit?

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 10:48 AM
S!

In the external 3D model of G-6Late and G-6/AS cockpit frames of the Erla Haube are thin and the metal strips are not there. It looks the same as in Willey's pic of the K-4. Yesterday night I browsed through pics of G-6, G-10 and K-4 with the Erla Haube and NONE of them had these metal strips. Removing them won't give the G-series any extra speed or performance boost, but the historical fact that the pilot can see better out of the cockpit than from the cockpit type as seen on G-2 and G-6Early. Maybe Butch2K has some excellent pics and drawings proving our point?



Flanker
Training/Tactics Officer
Lentolaivue 34
http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34

"Let Chaos entwine on defensless soil"
-Dimmu Borgir-

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 01:43 PM
There are various kind of Erla canopy, at least 3 maybe even 5.
The one in-game exists but is indeed quite rare, AFAIR the Treloar G-6 is fitted with such a canopy and i suspect Oleg got the cockpit shots from this aircraft.

Butch

Visit my military history forum at :
http://pub47.ezboard.com/ballboutwarfare

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XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 02:15 PM
S!

Thank You Butch2K for the answer! I just wonder why Oleg modelled this crappier version of the Erla Haube if it was quite rare as U said? It wouldn't hurt anyone if the canopy would be the most widely used on without these view restricting strips.



Flanker
Training/Tactics Officer
Lentolaivue 34
http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34

"Let Chaos entwine on defensless soil"
-Dimmu Borgir-

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 02:22 PM
Agreed,

I suppose it's the only 109 cockpit with Erla haube he managed to photography before Il-2's got released. But to be sure you'll have to ask him directly.




Butch

Visit my military history forum at :
http://pub47.ezboard.com/ballboutwarfare

http://www.allaboutwarfare.com/icons/imulandmine.gif http://www.allaboutwarfare.com/icons/rocketq3.gif

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 02:26 PM
S!

Must write an e-mail and ask. Do You have any good refrences of the Erla Haube at Your site? It would immensely help to convince Oleg when sending a good heap of reference too/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif Once again thanx for the reply..now back to work and then home/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Flanker
Training/Tactics Officer
Lentolaivue 34
http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34

"Let Chaos entwine on defensless soil"
-Dimmu Borgir-

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 02:52 PM
here you can see it exactly...

http://www.8ung.at/pfeil/scans/haube.jpg


http://www.jagdgeschwader53.de

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 03:36 PM
S!

Falkster! One good pic tells more than a thousand words! That is exactly what I meant! Look at those spars in the cockpit of that plane and compare to IL2!HUGE difference!If we could gather a crapload of pics like this then MAYBE a change would be possible.Here's a pic of the Finnish G-6:http://www.jannousiainen.net/galleries/tikkakoski/storage/123-2333_IMG.JPG




Flanker
Training/Tactics Officer
Lentolaivue 34
http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34

"Let Chaos entwine on defensless soil"
-Dimmu Borgir-

Message Edited on 01/15/0304:54PM by LLv34_Flanker

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 04:04 PM
yes VERY GOOD photo!! thank you!!!!!

JG53 PikAs Abbuzze
I./Gruppe

http://www.jg53-pikas.de/
http://mitglied.lycos.de/p123/pikasbanner.jpg

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 04:25 PM
LLv34_Flanker wrote:
- S!
-
- In the external 3D model of G-6Late and G-6/AS
- cockpit frames of the Erla Haube are thin and the
- metal strips are not there.

You sure?! If so, that is very interesting as Oleg some time back stated that they could not change anything about the internal cockpit model to get us closer to real life visibility. For this, he gave the reason that this would mean having to change the external model as well. I did doubt this explanation, not quite plausible as the cockpits are modelled separately... Oh well. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Cheers,
Fred

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 05:35 PM
- I did doubt this
- explanation, not quite plausible as the cockpits are
- modelled separately...

Maybe he meant that the cockpit model must fit in external model. (i'm not sure about that) and in the end the canopy will be the same model with cockpit model and external model. Just my thoughts and i'm not sure that if i'm right.

Has anyone pictures of front glass in digital format?

:Sami

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 05:46 PM
What Oleg meant was actually that the inner model of the canopy must match, and thus block, the outer struts, otherwise you could see them too.

So the inner, detailed canopy is actually mounted inside the canopy of the external model, and if the external model had thicker struts than the internal one, you would see them.

The other way round, it seems possiple, because the detailed canopy is NOT displayed from the outside view.

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 05:48 PM
S!

Take a look in the game, the external model of G-6Late and G-6/AS + Bf109K-4 do not have the metal strips there. They appear only in inside view on them, except K-4 which isn't flyable yet. This should apply to forthcoming G-10 and G-14 as well btw.



Flanker
Training/Tactics Officer
Lentolaivue 34
http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34

"Let Chaos entwine on defensless soil"
-Dimmu Borgir-

Message Edited on 01/15/0306:50PM by LLv34_Flanker

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 05:57 PM
IJG54_Nowi wrote:
- What Oleg meant was actually that the inner model of
- the canopy must match, and thus block, the outer
- struts, otherwise you could see them too.
-

Not quite correct. Yes, cockpit models must fit the exterior model, but it doesn't mean everything. They just have to fit in their place in the plane so that the correct view of wings, tail, nose etc. can be achieved. Struts don't matter in this equation.


-jippo

XyZspineZyX
01-15-2003, 06:00 PM
IJG54_Nowi wrote:
- What Oleg meant was actually that the inner model of
- the canopy must match, and thus block, the outer
- struts, otherwise you could see them too.

Now that makes sense. My apologies!

If that is the way it works, I'm not sure it is such a good idea however. The external model has to be polygon limited and comparably blocky. Blocky models take up more square degrees than they would if they had more polygons if you are to cover them up with something less blocky. Could this be the reason for the IMO very intrusive canopy frames in many aircraft?

I've resorted to only flying aircraft where I can get a reasonably good view - i e, not too intrusive frames. Those frames you can't look around totally ruin the suspension of disbelief to me. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Cheers,
Fred

XyZspineZyX
01-16-2003, 10:33 AM
S!

This matter will be researched more and data mailed to Oleg directly, since there seems to be little interest here to correct this/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif I thank all the posters and especially butch2k for his input on the case/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif



Flanker
Training/Tactics Officer
Lentolaivue 34
http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34

"Let Chaos entwine on defensless soil"
-Dimmu Borgir-

XyZspineZyX
01-16-2003, 10:55 AM
fpo wrote:

- I have some photos of a Finnish Air Force Bf 109 G-6
-
- and some more at
-
- http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4292229509
-

Just noticed that imagestation requires registration nowdays - sorry.
I moved couple of additional images from there to the other site:
http://hkkk.fi/~yrjola/photo/planes/bf109/cockpit.html

Here is one relevant to this discussion:
http://hkkk.fi/~yrjola/photo/planes/bf109/mersu_kuomu.jpg





--my--
Finnish Virtual Pilots Association
http://www.virtualpilots.fi/en/

XyZspineZyX
05-22-2003, 12:37 PM
bumpers /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


<hr>

<p align=center style="width:100%;filter:glow[color=#33CCFF,strength=2)">

<img src=http://mitglied.lycos.de/eldur190d9/bilder/willey110.jpg border=0 alt="Hier geht's zur I/JG78"> (http://www.jg78.de)

&lt;script>var specwin=window;function openspecs(){specwin=window.open("http://mitglied.lycos.de/eldur190d9/specs.htm", "specs", "hotkeys=0,width=640,height=480,left=64,top=64,scro llbars=yes");}</script>Die olle Rechenkiste vom noch olleren Willey (java_script: openspecs[))

<font face="Comic Sans MS" size="2">Seit &lt;script>var eventdate=new Date("March 20, 2003 00:00:00 GMT");d=new Date();count=Math.floor((eventdate.getTime()-d.getTime())/1000);count=Math.floor(count/(60*60*-24));document.write(count);</script> Tagen<sup>*</sup> gibts Il-2 Sturmovik: Forgotten Battles. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
BTW: In &lt;script>var eventdate=new Date("May 24, 2003 00:00:00 GMT");d=new Date();count=Math.floor((eventdate.getTime()-d.getTime())/1000);count=Math.floor(count/(60*60*24));document.write(count);</script> Tag(en) gibt's das n√¬§chste Development Update von Oleg Maddox, wenn alles schiefl√¬§uft /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

<font size="1"><sup>*</sup> In Europa . In den USA gabs FB schon 16 Tage vorher am 4.3. Link (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkyee)</font></font></p>&lt;script>c0="#000000";c1="#400000";c2="#000040";c3="#000050";c4="#000060";c5="#000070";a=document.all.tags("table");a[a.length-3].bgColor=c1;a[a.length-4].bgColor=c2;if(a[a.length-5].innerHTML.indexOf("User Options")!=-1){a[a.length-5].bgColor=c3;a[a.length-6].bgColor=c0;a[a.length-7].bgColor=c1;a[a.length-8].bgColor=c4;a[a.length-9].bgColor=c5;}else{a[a.length-5].bgColor=c0;a[a.length-6].bgColor=c1;a[a.length-7].bgColor=c4;a[a.length-8].bgColor=c5;};image="http://mitglied.lycos.de/eldur190d9/bilder/bar1.jpg";oa=a[a.length-2].style;oa.backgroundImage="url("+image+")";oa.backgroundPosition="left center";oa.backgroundRepeat="no-repeat";var a=document.all.tags("img");for(var i=0;i<a.length;i++){if[a[i].src.indexOf["/i/icons")!=-1)var o=a[i]}o.src="http://mitglied.lycos.de/eldur190d9/bilder/transparent36.gif";o.height=36;o.width=36;</script><font color=000040>

XyZspineZyX
05-22-2003, 09:14 PM
This is my pet peeve with FB.The emil cockpits are so nice to fly around in and when going from normal to revi view it doesnt seem to change much.Awesome cockpits and I thank the makers.

When you get into the later cockpits such as gustavs on the struts seem 4 times as big and as has been stated,the view up is restricted also by these struts that arent supposed to be there.Then the paint job is poor and I find myself hating to fly these later cockpit 109's due to this/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

XyZspineZyX
05-26-2003, 09:54 PM
hmmmmmm /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


<hr>

<p align=center style="width:100%;filter:glow[color=#33CCFF,strength=2)">

<img src=http://mitglied.lycos.de/eldur190d9/bilder/willey110.jpg border=0 alt="Hier geht's zur I/JG78"> (http://www.jg78.de)

&lt;script>var specwin=window;function openspecs(){specwin=window.open("http://mitglied.lycos.de/eldur190d9/specs.htm", "specs", "hotkeys=0,width=640,height=480,left=64,top=64,scro llbars=yes");}</script>Die olle Rechenkiste vom noch olleren Willey (java_script: openspecs[))

<font face="Comic Sans MS" size="2">Seit &lt;script>var eventdate=new Date("March 20, 2003 00:00:00 GMT");d=new Date();count=Math.floor((eventdate.getTime()-d.getTime())/1000);count=Math.floor(count/(60*60*-24));document.write(count);</script> Tagen<sup>*</sup> gibts Il-2 Sturmovik: Forgotten Battles. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
BTW: In &lt;script>var eventdate=new Date("May 31, 2003 00:00:00 GMT");d=new Date();count=Math.floor((eventdate.getTime()-d.getTime())/1000);count=Math.floor(count/(60*60*24));document.write(count);</script> Tag(en) gibt's das n√¬§chste Development Update von Oleg Maddox, wenn alles schiefl√¬§uft /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

<font size="1"><sup>*</sup> In Europa . In den USA gabs FB schon 16 Tage vorher am 4.3. Link (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkyee)</font></font></p>&lt;script>c0="#000000";c1="#400000";c2="#000040";c3="#000050";c4="#000060";c5="#000070";a=document.all.tags("table");a[a.length-3].bgColor=c1;a[a.length-4].bgColor=c2;if(a[a.length-5].innerHTML.indexOf("User Options")!=-1){a[a.length-5].bgColor=c3;a[a.length-6].bgColor=c0;a[a.length-7].bgColor=c1;a[a.length-8].bgColor=c4;a[a.length-9].bgColor=c5;}else{a[a.length-5].bgColor=c0;a[a.length-6].bgColor=c1;a[a.length-7].bgColor=c4;a[a.length-8].bgColor=c5;};image="http://mitglied.lycos.de/eldur190d9/bilder/bar1.jpg";oa=a[a.length-2].style;oa.backgroundImage="url("+image+")";oa.backgroundPosition="left center";oa.backgroundRepeat="no-repeat";var a=document.all.tags("img");for(var i=0;i<a.length;i++){if[a[i].src.indexOf["/i/icons")!=-1)var o=a[i]}o.src="http://mitglied.lycos.de/eldur190d9/bilder/transparent36.gif";o.height=36;o.width=36;</script><font color=000040>

XyZspineZyX
05-26-2003, 11:24 PM
The FW190s also have the minimum head movement problem.

The ME262's perspective does have a lot of head movement and if the later 109s and the FW190s perspectives were done like the ME262 it would make for a much more balanced playing field.




JG14_Josf

XyZspineZyX
10-11-2003, 06:10 PM
Bump - those Erlahauben are wrong in FB

XyZspineZyX
10-12-2003, 06:13 AM
Completely losing planes as they fly or turn across struts has got to be the single most annoying "feature" of IL2 period.

I sure hope something creative is done to fix it for BOB.

XyZspineZyX
10-12-2003, 08:44 AM
I still think the fixed head-positions are a bone-headed idea, crawling back to early '90s.

Give us custom head postions which we can set to our tastes, within the boundaries of pilot head movement inside the cockpit.

If a 30MB base-component MMOG can do it, making it work smoothly with pad-lock type of smooth-pan features, no reason why a game that uses two CDs can't do it.





-----------
Due to pressure from the moderators, the sig returns to..

"It's the machine, not the man." - Materialist, and proud of it!

XyZspineZyX
10-12-2003, 07:04 PM
bump!

XyZspineZyX
10-12-2003, 09:56 PM
S!

Bumping this. I wish the Erla Haube will be looked at again and those annoying strips removed. Would give better SA to the pilots flying G-6Late and onwards. Would a PLEASE do the trick? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Flanker
1.Lentue P√¬§√¬§llikk√¬∂
Training/Tactics Officer
Lentolaivue 34
http://www.virtualpilots.fi/LLv34

"Let Chaos entwine on defensless soil"
-Dimmu Borgir-

XyZspineZyX
10-15-2003, 08:10 AM
I just read a great book by the top finnish ace Ilmari Juutilainen and he says in his book that the G6 had much better visibility than the G2.

Details abt book for the finns: Ilmari Juutilainen: Punalent√¬§j√¬§n kiusana, 2003.

-pozzu

oh yeah, PLEASE

ps. the 109 had a nice system for cleaning the windshield of oil: there was a small gasoline injector in front of the windshield and the airflow would clean the glass. It is one small thing that I would like to have in my FB 109's

XyZspineZyX
10-16-2003, 09:34 AM
bumpers




http://mezek.valka.cz/texty/filmy/data/bf109f-7-headon.gif

XyZspineZyX
10-16-2003, 04:31 PM
http://hkkk.fi/~yrjola/photo/planes/bf109/mersu_ohjaamo2.jpg

http://hkkk.fi/~yrjola/photo/planes/bf109/mersu_kuomu.jpg

http://hkkk.fi/~yrjola/photo/planes/bf109/mersu_ohjaamo8.jpg


so:

http://mitglied.lycos.de/eldur190d9/bilder/erla.jpg


/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
10-16-2003, 08:31 PM
hi,

..hmm ..maybe ..looks like..same 'frame 3d design bug' as in the forward view of FW-190...refraction and dimension of the windscreen/canopy construction mounting...

have look to this designers:

http://www.geocities.co.jp/MotorCity-Race/3895/bf109g.html


http://www2.cc22.ne.jp/%7Eharada/Bf_109_G6/e/G6_index_e.html







...just follow my wingman...
http://www.ss.iij4u.or.jp/~jime/images/Me109G6Anim/messer04LAN2.wmv

XyZspineZyX
10-18-2003, 09:39 AM
hi,

...and here some original parts/buyable at( http://www.aircraftmilitaria.com/Restoration_Display.htm )

..good chance for first steps of the designers to create part studies.. like in the first steps at a school of arts...maybe it helps..to get better design in BoB...

my two cents.. to all this non observance of correct
3d design + view.. through armored windscreens ..even also in other plane series....


http://www.aircraftmilitaria.com/For%20Sale/Thumbnails/me109_canopy__3.JPG


http://www.aircraftmilitaria.com/For%20Sale/Thumbnails/me109_canopy__2.JPG


http://www.aircraftmilitaria.com/For%20Sale/Thumbnails/me_109_parts.JPG


http://www.aircraftmilitaria.com/For%20Sale/Relics%20&%20Wreakage/20030218.1%20Me109%20Armour%20Windscreen%20from%20 the%20messerschmit.bmp





...just follow my wingman...
http://www.ss.iij4u.or.jp/~jime/images/Me109G6Anim/messer04LAN2.wmv

XyZspineZyX
10-18-2003, 08:13 PM
I think it finally is time to GET RID OF THOSE EXTRA-STRUTS in 109 late AND Fw190 Cockpits!!

These are by no means historically correct and are only frustrating any pilot who flies FB with those types.