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XyZspineZyX
09-01-2003, 08:05 PM
I am getting rid of my CH Flightstick Pro due to a Pitch glitch which causes a shudder in the aircraft whenever I pitch down due no doubt to being analogue and old.

SO! I am looking for a good stick for these flight sims and it has to meet the following criteria...

#1. NO FORCE FEEDBACK PLEASE! (Just a preference)
#2. Must be below $40 US or $60 CDN.

What I have tried so far...

I bought a Logitech Wingman Extreme 3D (Dark blue not light blue base). And I liked it for the first couple of missions but the POV hat is a little too far to the right and then I decided to lock the rudder twist handle feature as I was inadvertently causing rudder action when pushing the stick into the corners. Upon locking the twist action via the screw in the handle, It now makes a loud click when pushing the stick to the left and has a slight calibration issue favoring the left now. This problem will not go away locked or unlocked. Then I went out and read 24 user reviews on it and everyone complained that "while it feels quality in initial use, it breaks or de-calibrates very quickly in it's life span". Magazines and websites said it was a great stick though. The users mainly complained that the twist handle rudder action breaks very easily inside and stops working all together.

So! What are my alternatives. The only one I can find in that price point that has has equally good reviews is the Thrustmaster Fox 2 Pro USB. Actually it appears to get even better reviews to some degree and is the same price. But I have been unable to track down user ratings. Anyone here own and use that stick (the blue/black one or the silver one)?

Or is there another idea?

Charles.

XyZspineZyX
09-01-2003, 08:05 PM
I am getting rid of my CH Flightstick Pro due to a Pitch glitch which causes a shudder in the aircraft whenever I pitch down due no doubt to being analogue and old.

SO! I am looking for a good stick for these flight sims and it has to meet the following criteria...

#1. NO FORCE FEEDBACK PLEASE! (Just a preference)
#2. Must be below $40 US or $60 CDN.

What I have tried so far...

I bought a Logitech Wingman Extreme 3D (Dark blue not light blue base). And I liked it for the first couple of missions but the POV hat is a little too far to the right and then I decided to lock the rudder twist handle feature as I was inadvertently causing rudder action when pushing the stick into the corners. Upon locking the twist action via the screw in the handle, It now makes a loud click when pushing the stick to the left and has a slight calibration issue favoring the left now. This problem will not go away locked or unlocked. Then I went out and read 24 user reviews on it and everyone complained that "while it feels quality in initial use, it breaks or de-calibrates very quickly in it's life span". Magazines and websites said it was a great stick though. The users mainly complained that the twist handle rudder action breaks very easily inside and stops working all together.

So! What are my alternatives. The only one I can find in that price point that has has equally good reviews is the Thrustmaster Fox 2 Pro USB. Actually it appears to get even better reviews to some degree and is the same price. But I have been unable to track down user ratings. Anyone here own and use that stick (the blue/black one or the silver one)?

Or is there another idea?

Charles.

XyZspineZyX
09-01-2003, 08:09 PM
I got a PERFECT solution!

Get a reconditioned Saitek X45:

http://store.yahoo.com/saitekusa/recprod.html

For exactly US$40.

Unfortunately, this does not include shipping to Canada (Which I assume you live in) - which will be (apparantly) around US$30 /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

Believe me though - an X45 is MORE than worth the investment.

XyZspineZyX
09-01-2003, 08:15 PM
I had the same thing happen with the Extreme 3D. If I rudder right I go left. Its funny to watch the pedals in the cockpit, when i rudder right the left pedal is pressed.

XyZspineZyX
09-01-2003, 09:17 PM
B.E.L.B.H.D. wrote:
- I had the same thing happen with the Extreme 3D. If
- I rudder right I go left. Its funny to watch the
- pedals in the cockpit, when i rudder right the left
- pedal is pressed.


Um ya I know that "opposite rudder problem well". It was fine until I went into the controls and tested if the game saw my rudder and selected the rudder in the HOTAS controls and twisted the handle and it goes from a Z to a -Z regardless of a twist left or twist right when you assign the function. From that point on, you have reversed rudder control. While I am sure it can be changed in an ini file somewhere, I was lazy so I reset controls to default. Dang! now I had to go fiddle with my POV and vew settings again. But the rudder was back to normal.

Now since I posted I ran to the store and exchanged for another Wingman Extreme 3D and came back home. Damn! it's already screwed! The POV hat is flakey. It does not click when you push it up and is like it somehow was stuck in that position at the factory. It's (POV) soft in the up postition. Instead of the resonsive hard click in all directions (AGAIN TALKING POV), only left and right act like they should.

THIS POS is going back! Why oh why did'nt I take the BLUE pill! I mean, I should have listened to the 80% personal user reviews that said stay away from that stick and get somehting else.

I have seen a few more really good reviews on the TM Fox 2 Pro. I am going to try and find one before all the stores close.

If anyone is interrested, I will post my feelings on that product after some tourture testing is completed.

Charles.

XyZspineZyX
09-02-2003, 02:07 AM
Get an X45. Hands down the best non FFB stick for the money. Even at full price it is more than worth it.

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XyZspineZyX
09-02-2003, 02:17 AM
I know you said no FF, but...

Get a MS FF2. it's just too much fun to miss.

Otherwise, get a MS Sidewinder. Tough, cheap, easy to load, and it has a twist-rudder handle. Had one for years.



"Official Lancaster Whiner"

XyZspineZyX
09-02-2003, 07:16 AM
That X45 sounds real nice but out of my budget. Have a family to raise and I have blown enough dough on this rig...

P4-2.6C 800Mhz FSB, Gigabyte 8KNXP Mobo, 512MB Corsair XMS CAS 2.0 PC3200, ATI Radeon 9700 Pro Retail, SB Audigy Gamer, Viewsonic G90F 19" ect, ect...

I was lucky the wife indulged me in this joystick after all that.

Anyway, X45 not available at any of the stores I looked at. I read several reviews about the MS Sidewinders or at least the non-ffb models and there were a few complaints about it being too light to the touch or very twitchy and the throttle being very loose or not enough resistance as well. I don't know. It felt really too easy to move the stick and the throttle was really weak. Not good as I tend to shake a bit in long flights http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.

I settled on trying the Thrustmaster Top Gun Fox 2 Pro USB (black one). Not as sexy as the Logitech but at least it works out of the box right. All reviewers liked it alot and and now see why. At first impression just playing with the stick in the store was that it was lighter than the Logitech and that that would mean lower quality. Well it was the same price so I traded to it anyway.

Took 3 mission for a spin and a custom one as well. Of the 3 Sticks I have owned (Logitech Wingman Extreme, CH Flight Stick Pro and Gravis something or other), this is the best so far. I just wish botton 2 was not painted yellow with black stripes. Even though it was supposed to signify fox 2 button in a fighter, it looks cheesy. Outside of that it feels made for me and I have very precise control of the plane now without any over steering I have had in the past. The POV is exactly where it should be, on the left. Now my thumb is not strained using the views. As for quality and longevity, only time will tell.

There was only Microsoft, Logitech and Thrustmaster in my city, however, thanks for all the suggestions.

Charles.



Message Edited on 09/02/03 06:19AM by froazan

Message Edited on 09/02/0306:20AM by froazan

XyZspineZyX
09-03-2003, 03:18 AM
I am bumping only to help another poster that was asking this same question...

Or I should have just linked in my reply. Sorry.

Charles.

XyZspineZyX
09-03-2003, 03:48 AM
I've had the thrustmaster fox 2 pro shock and it was definately worth the $60 (cnd) i payed for it. It's just as solid today as it was 2 years ago. I especially like the capability to tighten the sensitivity manually through the knob underneath the base. I like the tightness you can get with it. However, i'm tired of fooling around with the ingame joystick settings, especially with pitch. Many guys from my squad have microsoft products so i figured i'd try it. So today i bought the microsoft sidewinder precision 2 with no force feedback for $70 canadian. Now i'm really upset. I had my wife pick it up for me and i thought it had the same mechanics as the force feedback model. Not the case. I find it way to light in feel for my taste and there;s no way to tighten it up like the force feedback 2 model, which i've tried before and liked very much but was out of my price range. Now i'm stuck with this precision 2 model which i'm not at all happy with and unable to return it due to store policy cause i opened the box/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif Not to mention the cyborg 3d gold i have collecting dust for the same reason.
Mani

"An excellent weapon and luck had been on my side. To be successfful, the best fighter pilot needs both"
Adolph Galland

XyZspineZyX
09-03-2003, 05:01 AM
B.E.L.B.H.D. wrote:
- I had the same thing happen with the Extreme 3D. If
- I rudder right I go left. Its funny to watch the
- pedals in the cockpit, when i rudder right the left
- pedal is pressed.
-
-

I had the same problem. Go into Audio, click 'Reverse Stereo'. Did the trick for me. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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XyZspineZyX
09-03-2003, 05:19 AM
http://store.yahoo.com/saitekusa/recprod.html

X45 here for $39 bucks....cant beat it with a stick..

<CENTER>http://www.world-wide-net.com/tuskegeeairmen/ta-1943.jpg <marquee><FONT COLOR="RED"><FONT SIZE="+1">"Straighten up.......Fly right..~S~"<FONT SIZE> </marquee> http://www.geocities.com/rt_bearcat

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XyZspineZyX
09-03-2003, 05:52 AM
X-45 is a nice stick but the rudder ..ahhhh/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

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U.S. infantry 84-91

XyZspineZyX
09-07-2003, 10:58 AM
Well. I have used this new Fox 2 Pro for several missions in IL2 and even a few games of Midnight Club II and I'd have to give this stick a HUGE thumbs up! I first read about this stick here... www.joystickreview.com, (http://www.joystickreview.com,) and they loved it. I personally agree and I recommend this stick if you need to be under $40 US.

DO NOT GET A Wingman Extreme 3D USB. I had trouble with 2 in a row and dozens of reader reviews were very negative towards it. I should have listened before buying it twice in a row.

Charles.

XyZspineZyX
09-07-2003, 02:39 PM
Well I know your not looking for force feedback, but I have a Logitech Wingman Force 3D. I paid $50 at Wal-Mart for it US dollars. Could probably be found cheaper online maybe. Anyway I've had absolutely no problems of any kind with it so far. No calibration issues or twist rudder problems.

XyZspineZyX
09-07-2003, 03:01 PM
HE's got a point, The wingman force3d is cheap and cheerful! With 7 buttons, and selection 1 button as a shift key doubles it to 12 buttons all programmable.

FB has the ability to disable forcefeedback from it's hardware menu. So Value and features it excellant!

Personally , I love feeling the ground moving when I touch down after a succesful mission! as for feeling those shots hit me! I wish I didn't but I'm not invincible /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-07-2003, 07:19 PM
Yeah not to mention that gentle shudder you get in most aircraft right before they spin. Or when your exeeding maximum speed you get a shudder. Bumps in the runway, shakes when firing, when hit etc. Wouldn't fly without unless I had too. Plus it's adjustable to your liking.