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Kaleun1961
10-14-2005, 03:59 PM
Up to now I have been using the auto-target feature and am about to make my first patrol on manual targeting. When using auto-targeting I would most often hold my fire until the triangle turned green. While manual targeting, when is the best moment to fire? How do you aim at a specific part of the target ship as when targeting the vulnerability zones [ammo, fuel, engines, etc?]

For now I am going to try using the notepad method and try to be perpendicular to the target, using map updates until I get good at it. I am aware of other methods such as using that AoB wheel. I'm wondering how many people use which methods and what are their favourite methods/techniques?

Bogoliubon
10-14-2005, 04:40 PM
My favorite way to find the AOB is the so-called 'basic 90', you need to first align your u-boat perperdicular to the calculated target course (if you still have the 'god eye' feature checked in your realism setting, finding the target's course is then straightforward), once you have a 90 degree intersection course in relation to the target's course, the AOB is simply:

AOB = 90 - target bearing angle(for targets closing from starboard)

or

AOB = 360 - target bearing (for targets closing from port)

NaturalBornGoth
10-14-2005, 04:45 PM
My fav method is what i have baptized the "funnel web spider"-maneuver:

When i have spotted a target or i'm being informed of a target, i try to intercept it without it's knowledge. I maneuver myself well in front of my target. Then i wait there submerged, so that my bow is in a right angle to the target's projected path (using the ruler on the map) and 600m away from it. I mark the spot where the target should pass right in front of my bow with a circle of 600m radius (my funnel web, so to speak http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif).

Then i wait until the target arrives,lock it with my periscope and identify it. As soon as it touches the circles on the map (provided you use the map contact updates, which, due to a bug, is a must if you want your SONAR guy to work properly) it should be in a 45‚?angle to my boat and i collect the notepad data the first time and send it to the tube that i wanna fire. This should result in a perfect speed measurement, because most errors result out of bad AOB estimates. But by using the circle on the map you know that the target was 45‚? off your bow at the time of that reading. That way you don't need to fiddle with te AOB tool, although that is just fine either. I just prefer it my way. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

After that i wait a little, until the target is about 15-20‚? off my bow. Then i take a second batch of readings of distance and my AOB, but NOT the speed. The tube already has good speed data and just needs an update on your angle to the target and the distance. I send this data, with the same speed, to the tube again.

With your collected data and the periscope locked at the center of the target, you should hit it right in the middle if you fire the torpedo now. If you want to hit another part of it, quickly unlock the periscope, aim for the part of the ship that you wanna hit and fire the torpedo. It will automatically offset by the degrees you move the periscope and should hit right where you aimed the periscope at.

I hope this description was comprehensible. If not i'm going to provide a screenshot that should clear up a few things. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Kaleun1961
10-14-2005, 05:20 PM
That sounds pretty clear, except I'm wondering how you get your speed estimate? I sink most of my targets using this same method, by plotting their course on the map then positioning myself perpendicular to its course. I get in very close, getting most of my kills within the 300-400 metre range.

A screenshot would be appreciated, if it's not too much bother for you.

Thanks.

NaturalBornGoth
10-14-2005, 05:58 PM
No problem, here you go:


http://img425.imageshack.us/img425/8049/map5iy.th.jpg (http://img425.imageshack.us/my.php?image=map5iy.jpg)
The first screenshot shows my markings on the map. I'm sure you are familiar with the symbols already. As you can see, the enemy and my boat are touching the circle. At that moment you can easily set the AOB because the target is in a 45‚? position to you.


You can see on the following screenshot that the AOB setting on the notepad reflects the situation on the map. The ship symbol in the middle of the the notpad resembles the target, while the purple marker represents you own boat and your angle to the target. Some people mix that up. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://img425.imageshack.us/img425/7981/aob9ve.th.jpg (http://img425.imageshack.us/my.php?image=aob9ve.jpg)

At this distance it doesn't matter if the angle is a few degrees off. It's just important that you read the distance shortly before or after taking the AOB reading and that you take the speed reading right after taking the AOB and distance or the figures want add up, because the ship's distance and AOB will have changed too much if you wait too long, thus making the speed reading inaccurate.

Maj_Solo
10-14-2005, 06:01 PM
why not just use my shake and bake recepie. Go down and turn on manual targetting. Make the torpedo steer straight ahead. On a convoy come in from the side and then fire slow torpedoes with a lead of about 11-12 at *ANY* distance. Some of them will hit I guarrantee thatt.

On those irritating small ships use fast torpedo with lead 6.5 degree. if that dont work use 7 degree.

NaturalBornGoth
10-14-2005, 06:37 PM
Sounds interesting, but "some will hit" and "if that doesn't work try that" sounds an awful lot like a waste of precious torpedos to me. And that just doesn't cut it. As opposed to your "from the hip" method you make every single torpedo hit the mark dead on with a decent firing solution. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Kaleun1961
10-14-2005, 07:25 PM
Thanks for you tips, Goth. It really helps to see it in pictures like that. I'm a dead-ringer of an ace when it comes to just about everything else in this game, so manual targeting is going to be a real challenge for me.

Ahopelto
10-14-2005, 07:32 PM
Kaleun1961, is that hte "sudbury wolf" in your sig?

W.Irving
10-15-2005, 02:58 AM
Maj_Solo's method would be quite good actually provided our boats had triple large calibre fast firing cannons.

I don't use the "god's eye view". Right now I delegate the whole process of targeting to my WE, but I do wish I could do it myself sometimes.

So for you people who do manual targeting, how do you accurately establish the range?

Fish40
10-15-2005, 04:45 AM
A detailed, step by step guide to manual targeting, speed calculations,ect.. can be found here: http://www.paulwasserman.net.

Kaleun1961
10-15-2005, 08:23 PM
Originally posted by Ahopelto:
Kaleun1961, is that hte "sudbury wolf" in your sig?

I can't say for sure, but perhaps it is. I got the wolf from the "Atlantic Wolf" mod and a friend in the forum used it to design my banner. You from Ontario too?

NaturalBornGoth
10-15-2005, 10:13 PM
Originally posted by W.Irving:
So for you people who do manual targeting, how do you accurately establish the range?

Getting the range is the easiest part of the whole process: identify the target and use the range tool in the periscope. Align the horizontal line of your peri crosshair with the waterline of the target. Select the range tool and keep the second horizontal line aligned with the masttops of the target. Now, because your own boat bops up an down due to the water movement, you have to manually keep the second line ton the top of the masts, and as soon as the waterline of the target touches the crosshair line again, you click the mousebutton for getting a fix on the range.

Sounds complicated but is easy as pie. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

W.Irving
10-16-2005, 01:55 AM
Of course it's easy.

The difficult part lies in getting an accurate reading since it's da‚¬*mn well near impossible to actually see the highest point of the ship beyond 3000 metres.

NaturalBornGoth
10-16-2005, 12:54 PM
Originally posted by W.Irving:
Of course it's easy.

The difficult part lies in getting an accurate reading since it's da‚¬*mn well near impossible to actually see the highest point of the ship beyond 3000 metres.

Okay, that might be a problem. A problem which i don't have, because i'm the "up close and personal" type of Captain. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I ususally make my kills from a distance of 600-1000 meters. Not more. I love to get my hands dirty and play a dangerous game of cat and mouse with escorts, if present.

The_Silent_O
10-17-2005, 01:14 PM
Originally posted by NaturalBornGoth:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by W.Irving:
So for you people who do manual targeting, how do you accurately establish the range?

Getting the range is the easiest part of the whole process: identify the target and use the range tool in the periscope. Align the horizontal line of your peri crosshair with the waterline of the target. Select the range tool and keep the second horizontal line aligned with the masttops of the target. Now, because your own boat bops up an down due to the water movement, you have to manually keep the second line ton the top of the masts, and as soon as the waterline of the target touches the crosshair line again, you click the mousebutton for getting a fix on the range.

Sounds complicated but is easy as pie. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You know Goth (love the name, btw...). Using your method, there is even an easier way to get distance without using the stadio-meter. Just use the Pythagoras Theorum to solve for the third side of the triangle. for your example...in 'Excel' it would look like:

Distance = ((600)^2+(600)^2)^(1/2) = 848 meters

So if you are always shooting from 600 meters using your circle, you should be getting your 45 degree reading always at a distance of 848 meters...you could make a table for different firing distances (circles).

Now the downside of this is that you cannot enter a distance manually into the notepad...you've always got to use the stadio-meter in rough seas! But knowing it should be 848 for 600meters you can try to get close by playing with it!

Regardless, I'm going to use your method tonight with my knowledge above...thanks! and I hope my advice also leads to more kills!

Kaleun1961
10-17-2005, 01:21 PM
I have to confess, gang, that for now at least I've backed down on doing the manual targetting. What discouraged me was spotting a contact at night time, well, my crew spotted it, I couldn't see a darned thing. I know about the gamma setting thing. I guess what I should have done was kept my map updates while learning; instead I went to full 100%.

Nevertheless, I have not given up for good. I am overhauling my older P4 this week, which has a different video card in it. I'll set that rig up as my manual learning machine, and try that gamma utility that is available from Adobe, which others have suggested.

That machine uses the older PC133 memory. I have three slots for memory. Two are taken up 256 each, leaving one slot. So, unless I get rid of the existing memory, it looks like I will upgrade to 1 gig. You think that will be enough? The system is a P4 1.7 Ghz, with a Radeon card, 128 Mb, forget the exact spec of the card.

Can I get the weapon officer to do my night time targeting for me, and I can handle the daylight shots?

NaturalBornGoth
10-17-2005, 02:28 PM
Originally posted by The_Silent_O:
You know Goth (love the name, btw...).

Thanks! Me too! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif



Using your method, there is even an easier way to get distance without using the stadio-meter. Just use the Pythagoras Theorum to solve for the third side of the triangle. for your example...in 'Excel' it would look like:

Distance = ((600)^2+(600)^2)^(1/2) = 848 meters

So if you are always shooting from 600 meters using your circle, you should be getting your 45 degree reading always at a distance of 848 meters...you could make a table for different firing distances (circles).

Now the downside of this is that you cannot enter a distance manually into the notepad...you've always got to use the stadio-meter in rough seas! But knowing it should be 848 for 600meters you can try to get close by playing with it!

Regardless, I'm going to use your method tonight with my knowledge above...thanks! and I hope my advice also leads to more kills!

Sounds interesting. I was never much of a math person, though. Which is a shame, considering my interest in astronomy and such. That's why i didn't think about doing it that way. I also have yet to figure out how to use the angle tool on the map properly, in order to calculate my firing solution. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

lecek
10-17-2005, 05:24 PM
I use my own method very close to the 90's. (Basic 90, fast 90 whatever)

First if I can usually tell whether I will be to his port or starbord when I shoot well off. So at a scope I press the '-' key and then press 'f6' and set the AoB to 90 to whatever side I expect to pass him on.

AoB is now set.

To actually set my boat up to AoB I either eyeball it with help from the manual or I do as the other guy and go ahead of it. In fact I go ahead of it most often because it is easiest if not fastest.

To find speed I use the chart from the sound tester trainer. This involves counting prop wash beats and looking up the ships speed. I don't use the 15 second method the trainer suggests. Instead I listen for 20 or 30 seconds. This gives better resolution as you don't have to multiply by four to get beats per minute.

I have also used the 3 minute 15 second method when ahead of him and stationary. This involves asking my watch officer his range, waiting 3 and 15 and then asking him again. The difference in range gives his speed in the form 100 meters = 1 knot.

I have plotted the contact on the map to find speed but I don't really like that method.

I don't worry about range. I most often shoot directly ahead with a gyro angle of 0. Range is not important with that solution. The benifit is one less variable to get wrong. I take range with the notepad if I need to hit targets not directly ahead or behind me.

When you hit the checkmark on the notepad, only what values are on the pad are updated on the TDC. So if you have only AoB on the notepad and click the checkmark you will only cange the AoB on the TDC.

The_Silent_O
10-18-2005, 09:06 AM
lecek,

good info! especially about the TDC

lecek
10-18-2005, 11:09 AM
I am glad I could help.