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kenspiker
07-14-2008, 05:41 PM
I'm flying a single player mission from Midway, fighters approaching the base. We scramble and are heading toward the enemy. Then comes over the radio "No. 4, return to base!" I am No. 4. Am I supposed to return to base? I know a lot of the radio chatter is just background, but it always refers by number in landing approaches. It would be more honorable to fight the zeros, but the mission appears to be heavily against the Allies here. I always get shot down.

Anyway, can anybody tell me how to interpert the radio messages? Thanx.

KrashanTopolova
07-14-2008, 06:46 PM
Sorry to inform you that you have been hit and your aircraft has sustained enough damage that fighter control is worried about you.

kenspiker
07-14-2008, 07:04 PM
That has happened to me. But this time I haven't been hit, we haven't got near the zeros yet and I get that message. Number 3 is told to return to base too, but he doesn't. I suppose it's a glitch. This is one of those missions where I'm not sure what is considered a completion. I fight the zeros, but we're heavily outnumbered. Do I have to shoot one down to complete the mission? Hmm.

WTE_Galway
07-14-2008, 07:06 PM
Originally posted by kenspiker:
That has happened to me. But this time I haven't been hit, we haven't got near the zeros yet and I get that message. Number 3 is told to return to base too, but he doesn't. I suppose it's a glitch. This is one of those missions where I'm not sure what is considered a completion. I fight the zeros, but we're heavily outnumbered. Do I have to shoot one down to complete the mission? Hmm.

Are you the only flight ? Perhaps there is an AI flight under attack somewhere else on the map and they are referring to them.

triad773
07-14-2008, 07:26 PM
I'd maybe disregard the message and see if it repeats, then maybe.

Like what WTE_Galway said- maybe someone else.

Good luck http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Triad

kenspiker
07-14-2008, 07:38 PM
Yes, I think that's what's happening, they're referring to somebody else. Now if only I could figure out what I need to do to complete the mission. I shot down an enemy, but that didn't do it. Anyway I had to bail out and landed in the ocean near Midway. Don't I get rescued in that event?

SeaFireLIV
07-14-2008, 07:46 PM
Originally posted by kenspiker:
Yes, I think that's what's happening, they're referring to somebody else. Now if only I could figure out what I need to do to complete the mission. I shot down an enemy, but that didn't do it. Anyway I had to bail out and landed in the ocean near Midway. Don't I get rescued in that event?

Turn `No instant mission success` to OFF. Then if you land or bail in friendly territory, you`ll be returned home to fight again. If you land in enemy territory you may or may not be captured. If you are, it`s game over/reload. You will also still fail if you get killed.

The name of this setting is misleading because it`s actually more realistic with it off than on.

But you will need to start a New Campaign for this to take.

WTE_Galway
07-14-2008, 07:47 PM
Originally posted by kenspiker:
Yes, I think that's what's happening, they're referring to somebody else. Now if only I could figure out what I need to do to complete the mission. I shot down an enemy, but that didn't do it. Anyway I had to bail out and landed in the ocean near Midway. Don't I get rescued in that event?

Bail out seems to be an automatic mission fail in dgen .

Oddly, if you crash land way behind enemy lines through sheer stupidity (ground striking the prop for example) and have taken no damage from enemy fire you can still get away with a sucessful mission.

The ways of the mission generator are mysterious and hard to fathom. It may be you need to destroy one particular enemy fighter (not necessarily the leader)but its just as likely you need to fly over a random bit of the map or even do something counter intuitive like cross into enemy airspace even though its 20km away.

With default settings a successful landing at any airbase should give you mission complete so you could just do a circuit and land.

Alternatively try climbing high above your own base and asking ground control to send you assistance. With luck this may draw all your AI into a good defensive formation in a position protected by AAA.

mortoma
07-15-2008, 10:10 AM
Bailing out is not an automatic mission fail in Dgen at all if you bail in your own territory. Maybe you need to untoggle "No instant success" in the difficulty settings??

Flip the switch so the light goes out. In game, this is supposedly "less realistic" or "less difficult" but it's nothing of the sort. Far more realistic to not use it. In real life, if you failed to blow up a bridge or something, you could not go back in time to the same instant and start the mission all over again but this is what "no instant success" forces you to do. There are no time machines. Maybe you would go back later in the day or the next day or week or something. This was not well thought out on Oleg's part at all. Not all missions in WWII ( or any war for that matter ) are successful. So you want "instant success" in this case, even if the mission really was not successful.

What the switch should say but it would be too clunky is; "Don't move onto the next mission unless the current mission's objectives are met and go back in a time machine and do it again if they aren't"!!

kenspiker
07-16-2008, 09:35 AM
Thanx everybody for your advice. I notice that I'm getting a message that says: Hidden Target Complete. By that I gather that the specific goal for any mission is intentionally obscure. Maybe this is an attempt to keep players from "gaming" the system and ignoring the intent of the missions. Just my guess.

Blottogg
07-16-2008, 06:04 PM
The chatter is there for effect, though it can sometimes be helpful. There are often several flights with the same numbers, which is one reason I'm hoping Oleg and crew incorporate callsigns in Battle of Britain: Storm of War, instead of just using numbers. It would clear up a lot of the chatter confusion, including those random GCI vectors, that supposedly make some sense to one of the flights in the mission.

Missions can have more than one objective. The primary might be "bomb target XXX" or "escort bombers", while additional hidden objectives might involve intercepting another enemy formation, or flying close enough to a waypoint to accomplish a reconnaissance objective. Recce objectives are placed at the player's base in a lot of static campaigns to get around the problem of having selected "no instant success", since this would allow the player to "succeed" as soon as the mission started.

Ba5tard5word
07-16-2008, 07:30 PM
Yesterday I was in a tight dogfight in an I-16 against a Finnish Buffalo, and I accidentally whacked him with my wing and caused him to disintigrate and fall into the ocean. I was still flyable (though wobbly due to wing damage) but my wingmen told me to return to base.

WTE_Galway
07-16-2008, 08:21 PM
Originally posted by Blottogg:
There are often several flights with the same numbers, which is one reason I'm hoping Oleg and crew incorporate callsigns in Battle of Britain: Storm of War, instead of just using numbers. It would clear up a lot of the chatter confusion, including those random GCI vectors, that supposedly make some sense to one of the flights in the mission.



The vectors seem to be generated by flight leaders who are in transit between waypoints. The vector confusion seems to arise from 3 main sources.

- the vector calls, as pointed out, are often not from your own flight
- assuming it actually IS your flight, the vector is the current heading of your leader, not necessarily the vector you need to take for yourself to find the leader
- there is long standing bug in the game where vectors are sometimes called 180 degrees out, so your flight leader is actually heading at 270 but calls out 90.

The only time the vectors are of actual use is the unusual situation of flying with map icons OFF but the map path turned ON. In that scenario if you have lost track of your flight you can find them by comparing the vector called out with the bearings of the various legs on the plotted flight path.

unreasonable
07-16-2008, 09:13 PM
Just to expand on that, actually they are sometimes useful even with the map path off, provided that you know your vector to the next waypoint.

Suppose you have been in a fight and have been unable to keep your leader in view due to cloud or his wild bat-turns. After the fight ends (you know this because you have counted the enemy a/c and then counted the victory claims) you climb and go on your vector - say 270 degrees. You hear a leader calling a vector - say 300 degrees. If that is your leader and he is heading for the same waypoint as you - which will usually be the case because of the context - you know he must be on your left. Since you also know the default or mission cruising height you can usually find the leader again.

WTE_Galway
07-17-2008, 06:50 PM
Originally posted by unreasonable:
Just to expand on that, actually they are sometimes useful even with the map path off, provided that you know your vector to the next waypoint.

Suppose you have been in a fight and have been unable to keep your leader in view due to cloud or his wild bat-turns. After the fight ends (you know this because you have counted the enemy a/c and then counted the victory claims) you climb and go on your vector - say 270 degrees. You hear a leader calling a vector - say 300 degrees. If that is your leader and he is heading for the same waypoint as you - which will usually be the case because of the context - you know he must be on your left. Since you also know the default or mission cruising height you can usually find the leader again.

Aye that is true. There is also the fact if the rest of your flight are still on course the vectors are often called as the flight leader passes over the last waypoint so if you have the waypoints marked on a printed map that can pretty much give you a pinpoint location.

Blottogg
07-18-2008, 05:22 PM
I'm not ashamed to admit that I'll use autopilot to get me to the point where I've got to do some maneuvering (dogfighting, bombing, landing...) You guys are way more hard-core than I am. Thanks for the tips.

Tully__
07-19-2008, 02:01 AM
Originally posted by kenspiker:
Thanx everybody for your advice. I notice that I'm getting a message that says: Hidden Target Complete. By that I gather that the specific goal for any mission is intentionally obscure. Maybe this is an attempt to keep players from "gaming" the system and ignoring the intent of the missions. Just my guess.
The game has three types of targets, Primary, Secondary and Hidden.

For the most part, a message stating "Hidden Target Complete" in an offline campaign means that someone on your side has found and destroyed a "bonus" target, however with community made missions the more inventive mission designers use the target definitions to make life more interesting.

If there are one or more primary targets set, you'll get a mission complete statement when all the primary targets are completed.
If there are no primary targets, missions success will depend on secnodary of any secondary objectives.
If there are no primary or secondary targets, completion of Hidden objectives decides mission success.

In real life it was sometimes the case that a mission would find its primary target unavailable due to weather, the target being overrun by friendly ground forces, the target has moved etc. In these cases, success of the mission was often determined by completion of a secondary objective or destruction of suitable "targets of opportunity". Good missions designers will often set up the objectives in a mission with an eye towards this sort of realism.