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Durchstarten
05-10-2007, 11:13 AM
Fired up IL2 for the first time in ages. Whilst loading the Normandy map I suddenly realised that we have no RAF heavies. It would be nice if these were included in future versions.

For those who aren't familiar with the roar of 4 mighty Rolls-Royce Merlin engines here's what you are missing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9dMaVeK4Sw

Sorry, had to use a Lancastrian as I don't have a Lanc on my HD.

DPS.

Roblex
05-10-2007, 01:38 PM
I don't know what it is with Combat flight sims and the Lancaster. Warbirds never modelled it either even though they were happy to provide B17 and B24 and when I last tried Aces High it did not either. "Fighter Squadron: Screaming Demons Over Europe" had one and it was awesome sitting in that rear turret pumping out heavy caliber shells at the attacking enemy http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Dance
05-10-2007, 01:44 PM
Heavies taken as forgotten, what about a Wimpy, I even modelled one for FS SDOE once, probably wouldn't have met Oleg's quality standards though http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Some of the stuff I played around with...

http://gallery.future-i.com/SDOE/1-20

PRAETORIVS
05-10-2007, 01:47 PM
Sad, isn't it? I have always wished we had some RAF heavies, even if AI only. Typhoons .... well, actually we have a Typhoon, it's just that Oleg decided to call it a Tempest V for some reason.

PBNA-Boosher
05-10-2007, 01:54 PM
search function please.

PRAETORIVS
05-10-2007, 03:33 PM
Why, Boosher! How rude.

How was he to know there was another like thread on page 7,364?

Good to keep bringing this up; keep it on Oleg's mind...

major_setback
05-10-2007, 03:38 PM
Originally posted by Roblex:
"Fighter Squadron: Screaming Demons Over Europe" had one and it was awesome sitting in that rear turret pumping out heavy caliber shells at the attacking enemy http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Oh yes. And wasn't it lovely..... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sleepzzz.gif

Picture by Ian Boys

http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~ianboys/sdoe056.gif

http://www.games-in.com.br/dicas/pic3.jpg

Dance
05-10-2007, 04:17 PM
Lanc was nice, but stock, I made this..

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/dance/wimpy.jpg

major_setback
05-10-2007, 04:24 PM
WOW!
You made that? I'm really impressed.
Nice model.
I love the colours of the landscape in that game, and the detailed farms that you just happen across as you're flying around, it really makes it an immersive sim. Also like the overcast clouds, and misty weather- better than anything in any other sim including MSFS series IMHO.

Dance
05-10-2007, 04:31 PM
Yep my only scratch built plane.

I also made the first 'driveable boat' http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

It took me a good couple of years before I abandoned SDOE for IL2 (even though I had it from the demo).

Did u ever try Snickers PBY? Or my remake of the Harrier or F14 (just for laughs)

major_setback
05-10-2007, 04:51 PM
Originally posted by Dance:
Yep my only scratch built plane.

I also made the first 'driveable boat' http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

It took me a good couple of years before I abandoned SDOE for IL2 (even though I had it from the demo).

Did u ever try Snickers PBY? Or my remake of the Harrier or F14 (just for laughs)

I never made any changes to the original game. 'Stayed with it for a long time though. I Loved some of the standard missions, the one where you down Me262s while they are taking off is still one of my all-time favorite missions.

Ground attack was very good, using ex. rockets on a Mosquito and attacking an airbase packed with exploding objects. Even the occasional farmhouse would explode on straffing with guns! Serves them right for hoarding high explosives http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif!

There was a dam somewhere in the game, I always wondered if it was possible to destroy it. Do you know if it was pssible?

Dance
05-10-2007, 04:58 PM
Yep, the dam could certainly be destroyed, my favourite method was with the 617 Squad mod (special ops) Lanc with working bouncing bomb http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Although the Tallboy would do the job if you took that version http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

EDIT: All this has reminded me of some of the people I lost contact with from SDOE, anyone from those days still flying, who remember me, PM plz http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

major_setback
05-10-2007, 05:09 PM
Originally posted by Dance:
Yep, the dam could certainly be destroyed, my favourite method was with the 617 Squad mod (special ops) Lanc with working bouncing bomb http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Although the Tallboy would do the job if you took that version http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

That's so great, and a testiment to how good the sim was, that such a feature could be hidden away for you to discover.

Dance
05-10-2007, 05:14 PM
Damn must be me birthday, drunk and nostalgic lol.

Nice to find someone who remembers the whole 'openplane' concept with fond memories though http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

thefruitbat
05-10-2007, 05:17 PM
Originally posted by PRAETORIVS:
Why, Boosher! How rude.

How was he to know there was another like thread on page 7,364?

Good to keep bringing this up; keep it on Oleg's mind...

To be fair, i don't think that boosher's being rude. I've read alot of stuff he's wrote in the past, and he isnt just saying it to take the piss. It is just something he is acknowledging is missing. He knows already that it's not going to happen in this game, thats not to say he dosent want it too. There is loads of stuff i would like to see included, that will not be, but this is quite a common issue that comes up.

This games development is coming to an end, that is fact.

I remember buying il2, and being amazed. I had the release date for il2 forgotten battles wrote on my desk for about 6 months, just waiting for the release.

I can remember when the hurricane first became flyable in a patch, what joy!

My point is, if you played the original, then take into account the game which has spawned from that, perhaps you would not be so hard.

When SOW comes out, i am certain i will be amazed again (even if its just il2 with 6dof), but what will really amaze me is what it will become. hopefully as well, oleg will have heard the many http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

cheers fruitbat

Durchstarten
05-10-2007, 07:29 PM
Yes, no doubt we'll hear the roar of RAF heavies in future. Clearly there is lots of interest.

DPS.

Skarphol
05-11-2007, 01:14 AM
Last time I 'flew' a Lancaster was in the game 'Dambusters' on my Commodore 64..


My parents cleaned out the attic on tuesday, and lo and behold; they found my old computer. Maybe I should try to find the game and do a little comparison with Il-2. I saw they had dug out the cassette-player, the shoe-box sized disk-player and the joystick too...

Skarphol

Xiolablu3
05-11-2007, 02:15 AM
Would be nicve, but really for the amount of work involved, so much more could have been done. And for the maps online, a Medium bomber like the Ju88 or B25 is very sufficient.

Would be nice, but it would take the same work as about 4 fighters to put a Lanc or flyable B17 in the game.

WOuld be nice doing Tirpitz attack or Sub pens attack missions.

major_setback
05-11-2007, 02:44 AM
Screamin' Demons over Europe / Fighter Squadron googled screenies:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v203/threedp/SDOE/SDOE_2007_03_800x600.jpg

http://www.mightydrake.com/SDOE/HistoryInPictures/05_09_98_1.jpg

http://www.mightydrake.com/SDOE/HistoryInPictures/Lancasters.jpg

http://www.mightydrake.com/SDOE/HistoryInPictures/LancAttack.jpg

http://www.mightydrake.com/SDOE/bomber1.jpg

http://www.mightydrake.com/SDOE/bomber3.jpg

http://www.mightydrake.com/SDOE/bomber5.jpg
Mods:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/hip63/SDOE/storch1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v203/threedp/SDOE/From_a_110_cockpit_2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/fshangar/SDOE/FS_0025a.jpg

Durchstarten
05-11-2007, 07:23 AM
Nice screens, Major Setback. I bought a Lancaster/Mosquito add-on (and not cheap either) for FS2002. Wasn't too impressed either. Some of AlphaSim's WWII d/ls look fine but no Lanc yet. One day perhaps.

PRAETORIVS
05-11-2007, 09:31 AM
Originally posted by thefruitbat:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PRAETORIVS:
Why, Boosher! How rude.

How was he to know there was another like thread on page 7,364?

Good to keep bringing this up; keep it on Oleg's mind...

To be fair, i don't think that boosher's being rude. I've read alot of stuff he's wrote in the past, and he isnt just saying it to take the piss. It is just something he is acknowledging is missing. He knows already that it's not going to happen in this game, thats not to say he dosent want it too. There is loads of stuff i would like to see included, that will not be, but this is quite a common issue that comes up.

This games development is coming to an end, that is fact.

I remember buying il2, and being amazed. I had the release date for il2 forgotten battles wrote on my desk for about 6 months, just waiting for the release.

I can remember when the hurricane first became flyable in a patch, what joy!

My point is, if you played the original, then take into account the game which has spawned from that, perhaps you would not be so hard.

When SOW comes out, i am certain i will be amazed again (even if its just il2 with 6dof), but what will really amaze me is what it will become. hopefully as well, oleg will have heard the many http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

cheers fruitbat </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I was being facetious. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
I like Mo'zus.

Superluminal_8
05-11-2007, 10:02 AM
Originally posted by Roblex:
when I last tried Aces High it did not either.

It´s there.

Roblex
05-11-2007, 11:23 AM
For all it's faults FS:SDOE had an amazing damage model for its time. If you accidently touched someones tailplane with your prop then he would not get some 'generic tail damage', he would lose a section of tailplane and you would find your prop was no longer balanced. Your engine would run rougher & rougher until eventually it might blow and catch fire.

The most amazing bit of modelling I saw in FS:SDOE went way beyond my expectations; I came in too heavy once and broke my under-carriage and slid off the runway then was amazed to see the wheel describing ever decreasing circles on the runway in front of me until eventually it fell over http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif That's what you get when you use a physics based model rather than pure aerodynamics. Unfortunately that did not always translate into accurate flight models.

Chivas
05-11-2007, 11:57 AM
Oleg has stated that the Lanc is one of his favorite aircraft. There should be an abundance of data required to make the model so I would be very surprised if the Lanc didn't make into the SOW series.

I believe the only stumbling block to a bomber campaign is the size of the map. The amount of work required to build it and I suppose the capability of the new engine to handle that much detail.

It will be interesting to see how the Med theater is modelled. This should give us a hint at the possiblility of a huge bomber campaign map.

PBNA-Boosher
05-11-2007, 12:41 PM
Originally posted by PRAETORIVS:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by thefruitbat:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PRAETORIVS:
Why, Boosher! How rude.

How was he to know there was another like thread on page 7,364?

Good to keep bringing this up; keep it on Oleg's mind...

To be fair, i don't think that boosher's being rude. I've read alot of stuff he's wrote in the past, and he isnt just saying it to take the piss. It is just something he is acknowledging is missing. He knows already that it's not going to happen in this game, thats not to say he dosent want it too. There is loads of stuff i would like to see included, that will not be, but this is quite a common issue that comes up.

This games development is coming to an end, that is fact.

I remember buying il2, and being amazed. I had the release date for il2 forgotten battles wrote on my desk for about 6 months, just waiting for the release.

I can remember when the hurricane first became flyable in a patch, what joy!

My point is, if you played the original, then take into account the game which has spawned from that, perhaps you would not be so hard.

When SOW comes out, i am certain i will be amazed again (even if its just il2 with 6dof), but what will really amaze me is what it will become. hopefully as well, oleg will have heard the many http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

cheers fruitbat </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I was being facetious. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
I like Mo'zus. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Fruitbat, thank you, that is exactly what I meant. Praetorivs, I'm glad we have mutual understanding. It is true, I would love to see flyable heavies, more planes, objects, etc... but the fact is that it's a LOT of work. Back when the 3rd party development was on Netwings I used to do research for the modelers there, in fact, I helped Oleg out a little as well. (You can see my callsign in the manual at the back http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif ) One of the last projects I helped with was the B-17... it never went far. It was too ambitious a project for one modeler. Modeling anything, texturing it, and keeping it to Oleg's standards is a very tough job. The deadline for the aircraft has passed. I would love it, but it's not possible anymore. This series definitely doesn't have to be buried, it's far from dead, but it will soon be surpassed by BoB. I'll continue to fly IL2 because it rocks, but I don't think any more content is headed our way.

Agamemnon22
05-11-2007, 04:36 PM
Originally posted by PBNA-Boosher:
It was too ambitious a project for one modeler.

Or there wasn't a modeler ambitious enough for the project :P
For IL2, the story is over; for SoW, it is only beginning.

ouston
05-11-2007, 05:02 PM
I am not a regular contributor to these forums but I have on several occasions lamented the lack of the British heavies and a number of other pretty important British aircraft - Whirlwind, Wellington, Typhoon and Meteor to name the obvious ones. I would also support a previous poster on a flyable B-17 and B-24, both of which were used by the RAF. However it is pretty clear that the amount of work involved is immense and not possible with a game that is coming to the end of its life in development terms - I hope to play it for a good few years to come. What has been achieved with this sim in amazing - Norway, North Africa and Burma are now possible and we have the world's finest multi-role plywood and balsa aircraft, albeit in one of its earliest marks - in my late father's opinion the world's finest aircraft without exception - he was not entirely unbiased in that he flew them.

However I can see that even with the most accurately modelled Lancaster or Halifax a six to eight hour flight in the dark is not likely to be a big pull in flight sim terms, a genre that itself flys on in the shadow of the conventional gaming market. To fly a realistic representation of a sortie to Berlin requires a degree of expertise beyond what most of us can expect to acquire. If as somebody said Oleg likes Lancs maybe there is hope and we might get those mighty Merlins roaring sometime in SOW. Maybe even the Whirlwind and Wimpey as well.

Pip pip

Ouston

Durchstarten
05-13-2007, 01:54 AM
Don't forget that the game has the Normandy map. There were many intresting Lanc and Halifax Ops in the area in June '44 - although you would have to join any mission already airborne at the edge of the IL2 world.

Feathered_IV
05-13-2007, 04:25 AM
Originally posted by Chivas:
Oleg has stated that the Lanc is one of his favorite aircraft. There should be an abundance of data required to make the model so I would be very surprised if the Lanc didn't make into the SOW series.

Don't forget, Oleg has said that one half of SoW will be open source and allow for user made aircraft and maps etc. Be prepared for a whole slew of 3rd party addon aircraft from JustFlight and the like. No doubt the Lanc' will be one of the first ones you will see http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif

XyZspineZyX
05-13-2007, 10:13 AM
I just hope that it isnt Justflight's Lanc that makes it into the game...

major_setback
05-13-2007, 10:23 AM
Originally posted by ouston:
..... maybe there is hope and we might get those mighty Merlins roaring sometime in SOW. Maybe even the Whirlwind and Wimpey as well.



Ouston

We should see the Wellington (Wimpey) in Sow BoB, we have seen it in development picures. I don't know if it's planned as flyable.

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g260/restranger/wellington-nose.jpg

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g260/restranger/wellington-flaps.jpg

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g260/restranger/wellington-retract-turret.jpg

msalama
05-13-2007, 10:32 AM
Well the maps are just too small for the heavies to be used historically unless you want to do airstarts all the time. Dunno about you, but I know I don't http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

BoB:SoW's different though, in that it kind of _HAS_ to have them at some point after the BoB part, does it not http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Dance
05-13-2007, 04:08 PM
Mine might still have stood a chance looking at that model u had there.

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/dance/wimp2.jpg

EDIT: Although the cockpit was 'almost' empty http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

VMF-214_HaVoK
05-13-2007, 04:40 PM
Originally posted by Roblex:
I don't know what it is with Combat flight sims and the Lancaster. Warbirds never modelled it either even though they were happy to provide B17 and B24 and when I last tried Aces High it did not either. "Fighter Squadron: Screaming Demons Over Europe" had one and it was awesome sitting in that rear turret pumping out heavy caliber shells at the attacking enemy http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

It is quite odd isnt it? To my knowledge there are even two Lancs still flying in the world today. I personally saw one fly and even toured it at WW2 weekend in Reading, PA. So its not like it would be hard to find modeling information. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

Feathered_IV
05-14-2007, 05:27 AM
Be a great thing if you could fly a heavy in the SoW series and actually have the crew do their jobs. Not just have the gunners call out enemy fighters, but also have the navigator give you coordinates and fix your position, plot a course or call for oxygen checks etc. Plus a bomb aimer that can call for corrections when you make a run onto the target.

Probably not very likely though. All that extra immersive stuff will be half arsed and tacked on in bits and pieces. I'm beginning to think that the job of creating a truly next-gen WW2 sim is beyond the capabilities of Oleg's little team http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

major_setback
05-14-2007, 07:20 AM
Amazing!!
For those who have'nt seen this. A panable cockpit photo. Click with the mouse to pan (credit and thanks to the original poster)..

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/904...041092503#9041092503 (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/9041092503?r=9041092503#9041092503)


<span class="ev_code_GREY">.</span>