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relcox
03-06-2008, 06:00 PM
Between a Fw190A5 and a FW190A5165ATA?

Xiolablu3
03-06-2008, 06:11 PM
the 1.65 ATA has better speed and power at low level.

I believe its slightly slower at other alts.

ATA is the German version of the British 'boost' rating, and the American 'HG'

Boost works best at low levels, I believe, and is less usefull the higher you go.

VMF-214_HaVoK
03-06-2008, 06:24 PM
It means Spitfires are even more doomed! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

S!

relcox
03-06-2008, 08:06 PM
"It means Spitfires are even more doomed! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif"

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

"I believe its slightly slower at other alts.
Boost works best at low levels, I believe, and is less usefull the higher you go."

How come?

furyan65
03-06-2008, 08:32 PM
Originally posted by relcox:
Between a Fw190A5 and a FW190A5165ATA?

..also FW190A5165ATA and the A5 were cosmetically identical if Im not mistaken. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

JG53Frankyboy
03-07-2008, 04:39 AM
Originally posted by relcox:
Between a Fw190A5 and a FW190A5165ATA?

download the il2compare tool http://war.by-airforce.com/downloads/il2compare-4.07.html - you will clearly see the difference in the performance curves !

in missionbuilding i use the 1,65ATA version only in -/UX condition as fighterbomber - its extra power at low speed helps to "overcome" the drag om the bombracks a little bit in comparison to a normal A-5/-6 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Ratsack
03-07-2008, 05:17 AM
The 1.65 ATA version is based (intentionally or otherwise) on a specialized fighter bomber variant of the A-5. This specialized variant had a boost system installed - C3 einspritzung fur Jabo - that allowed it to run at 1.65 atmospheres manifold pressure in low-altitude supercharger gear. The 1.65 ATA rating can be converted to the British 'boost' rating thus:

1 atmosphere = 1 ATA = 14.7 lb/square inch
1.65 ATA = 24.25 lb
Boost = 24.25 -14.7
Boost = 9.55

So, 1.65 ATA in low gear is roughly equivalent to 9 1/2 lb boost in the British system.

The C3 injection system could be used for about half an hour. It worked by injecting C3 fuel into the charge to cool it. This meant that the supercharger compressor could be run harder, producing a denser (and hotter) charge, that would then be cooled by the fuel before being introduced to the cylinder, thus preventing pre-detonation.

It was basically a low altitude rocket designed to enable the jabos to fly in, attack, then run like blazes.

cheers,
Ratsack

relcox
03-07-2008, 05:49 PM
Originally posted by Ratsack:
The 1.65 ATA version is based (intentionally or otherwise) on a specialized fighter bomber variant of the A-5. This specialized variant had a boost system installed - C3 einspritzung fur Jabo - that allowed it to run at 1.65 atmospheres manifold pressure in low-altitude supercharger gear. The 1.65 ATA rating can be converted to the British 'boost' rating thus:

1 atmosphere = 1 ATA = 14.7 lb/square inch
1.65 ATA = 24.25 lb
Boost = 24.25 -14.7
Boost = 9.55

So, 1.65 ATA in low gear is roughly equivalent to 9 1/2 lb boost in the British system.

The C3 injection system could be used for about half an hour. It worked by injecting C3 fuel into the charge to cool it. This meant that the supercharger compressor could be run harder, producing a denser (and hotter) charge, that would then be cooled by the fuel before being introduced to the cylinder, thus preventing pre-detonation.

It was basically a low altitude rocket designed to enable the jabos to fly in, attack, then run like blazes.

cheers,
Ratsack

So, should help me against the clipped wing Spits at low level?

Swivet
03-07-2008, 06:10 PM
one flies to ubermoon the other flies to ubermars

Ratsack
03-07-2008, 06:33 PM
Originally posted by relcox:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ratsack:
The 1.65 ATA version is based (intentionally or otherwise) on a specialized fighter bomber variant of the A-5. This specialized variant had a boost system installed - C3 einspritzung fur Jabo - that allowed it to run at 1.65 atmospheres manifold pressure in low-altitude supercharger gear. The 1.65 ATA rating can be converted to the British 'boost' rating thus:

1 atmosphere = 1 ATA = 14.7 lb/square inch
1.65 ATA = 24.25 lb
Boost = 24.25 -14.7
Boost = 9.55

So, 1.65 ATA in low gear is roughly equivalent to 9 1/2 lb boost in the British system.

The C3 injection system could be used for about half an hour. It worked by injecting C3 fuel into the charge to cool it. This meant that the supercharger compressor could be run harder, producing a denser (and hotter) charge, that would then be cooled by the fuel before being introduced to the cylinder, thus preventing pre-detonation.

It was basically a low altitude rocket designed to enable the jabos to fly in, attack, then run like blazes.

cheers,
Ratsack

So, should help me against the clipped wing Spits at low level? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

A little, in that you'll have an even greater speed advantage below 1,000 m than if you were flying the A-5.

However, what you need to deal Spit IXs is not more speed, which the Fw 190 A-5 has plenty of anyway, but a good tactic to get them in front of you if you get caught. A 10 mph speed advantage won't get you out of gun range by itself.

On the other hand, the 1.65 ATA version overheats much more quickly. In addition, consider the following points:

* its speed advantage over the A-5 is below 1,500 m.
* Between 1,500 and 3,200 m the A-5 is faster.
* According to IL-2 Compare, the 1.65 ATA version is then faster between 3,200 and 5,500 m. I don't think that's historically correct if it's the case.
* Most online fighting occurs below 3,500 m.
* It's not a good idea to hang around below 1,000 m in any Fw 190.

Taken together, I don't think the 1.65 ATA version offers a lot of advantage over the A-5 where it counts. That said, any advantage is nice if your life depends on it. However, this is a game and your life doesn't depend on it, and it's historically incorrect to use this version as a fighter.

You can make your own call.

cheers,
Ratsack

relcox
03-07-2008, 06:49 PM
Originally posted by Ratsack:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by relcox:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ratsack:
The 1.65 ATA version is based (intentionally or otherwise) on a specialized fighter bomber variant of the A-5. This specialized variant had a boost system installed - C3 einspritzung fur Jabo - that allowed it to run at 1.65 atmospheres manifold pressure in low-altitude supercharger gear. The 1.65 ATA rating can be converted to the British 'boost' rating thus:

1 atmosphere = 1 ATA = 14.7 lb/square inch
1.65 ATA = 24.25 lb
Boost = 24.25 -14.7
Boost = 9.55

So, 1.65 ATA in low gear is roughly equivalent to 9 1/2 lb boost in the British system.

The C3 injection system could be used for about half an hour. It worked by injecting C3 fuel into the charge to cool it. This meant that the supercharger compressor could be run harder, producing a denser (and hotter) charge, that would then be cooled by the fuel before being introduced to the cylinder, thus preventing pre-detonation.

It was basically a low altitude rocket designed to enable the jabos to fly in, attack, then run like blazes.

cheers,
Ratsack

So, should help me against the clipped wing Spits at low level? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

A little, in that you'll have an even greater speed advantage below 1,000 m than if you were flying the A-5.

However, what you need to deal Spit IXs is not more speed, which the Fw 190 A-5 has plenty of anyway, but a good tactic to get them in front of you if you get caught. A 10 mph speed advantage won't get you out of gun range by itself.

On the other hand, the 1.65 ATA version overheats much more quickly. In addition, consider the following points:

* its speed advantage over the A-5 is below 1,500 m.
* Between 1,500 and 3,200 m the A-5 is faster.
* According to IL-2 Compare, the 1.65 ATA version is then faster between 3,200 and 5,500 m. I don't think that's historically correct if it's the case.
* Most online fighting occurs below 3,500 m.
* It's not a good idea to hang around below 1,000 m in any Fw 190.

Taken together, I don't think the 1.65 ATA version offers a lot of advantage over the A-5 where it counts. That said, any advantage is nice if your life depends on it. However, this is a game and your life doesn't depend on it, and it's historically incorrect to use this version as a fighter.

You can make your own call.

cheers,
Ratsack </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I chose it for the channel front campaign I'm flying as I hadn't flown it before, so your info has been most helpful, thanks. Also, I am glad this is just a game, just been reading about JG26 and saw their casualty list..... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif