PDA

View Full Version : How is AC2 going to handle religious themes?



PlaidPickle
05-06-2009, 03:50 PM
I'm sure most have read producer Puel's quote:

"They invented a modern vision of the world, where men were at the centre rather than God. They invented a new way of representing the world (perspective), they changed politics, architecture, the art of modern war and diplomacy. One man even invented planes, helicopters and tanks."

Before I played AC1 I was a little worried that the story would try to make some religious statement.
Happily I was wrong and I thought it sidestepped that touchy subject rather well.

After reading comments like the one from Puel,
I've convinced myself that AC2 will continue the popular drum beat of cutting down a religious belief or two.

I'm just worried it'll go like this:

daVinci > all other people > pope > God

Is Machiavelli going to be a hero figure?

PlaidPickle
05-06-2009, 03:50 PM
I'm sure most have read producer Puel's quote:

"They invented a modern vision of the world, where men were at the centre rather than God. They invented a new way of representing the world (perspective), they changed politics, architecture, the art of modern war and diplomacy. One man even invented planes, helicopters and tanks."

Before I played AC1 I was a little worried that the story would try to make some religious statement.
Happily I was wrong and I thought it sidestepped that touchy subject rather well.

After reading comments like the one from Puel,
I've convinced myself that AC2 will continue the popular drum beat of cutting down a religious belief or two.

I'm just worried it'll go like this:

daVinci > all other people > pope > God

Is Machiavelli going to be a hero figure?

moqqy
05-06-2009, 04:00 PM
Why does it matter how a game handles religious themes?

caswallawn_2k7
05-06-2009, 04:11 PM
it's a game, movies take the **** out of religon all the time, who cares how they do it if you belive in religon is a game going to change your life long belifes?

PlaidPickle
05-06-2009, 04:13 PM
Exactly my point.
I wish they wouldn't at all.

Does it matter how a book, movie, tv show, billboard ad, etc. handle it?

I can avoid Dan Brown, not too hard.
But I don't want to give up AC2,
so it matters to me.

PlaidPickle
05-06-2009, 04:25 PM
No media is going to change my beliefs about anything religious, political, whatever.
Change my beliefs no,
influence my beliefs yes.
As in make me more of an *** as I get sick
of seeing something I care about getting ripped on.

caswallawn_2k7
05-06-2009, 04:41 PM
if a game or movie is going to make you question your belifes you realy should be asking your self if your belifes are for you.

hollywood is always changing history and religon to make things interesting if you honestly belive films or games as 100% true then you have bigger problems than how a game portrays something.

UchihaKarasu
05-06-2009, 05:06 PM
I kind of like the religious touch, because it makes you really think (like how the Crusades were based around religion but it was also filled with bloodshed)
But they don't shove religious beliefs in your face (Like how Altair says your god instead of God) and at the end they even say that none of the religious teachings actually happen, but just because they say that doesn't mean they've dissed religion all together (*cough* holy grail *cough*)
Religion is a HUGE part of AC but it is said that there wont be as much in the second game as the first (which makes since considering the new knowledge in that time)
I will be disappointed if religion is completely removed from the game because it's one of the elements that draw me to the game. Too many people out there try to censor out religious context.

PlaidPickle
05-06-2009, 06:19 PM
caswallawn_2k7, like I said, no media is going to make me question my beliefs.

UchihaKarasu, you bring up all excellent points.
I liked the religious themes and hope they are in AC2 as well.
I just hope it's not 'da Vinci code part 2'.
AC1 I thought was very level headed, but if AC2 is all about 'science is the new religion'
'science knows all', then I'll be dissapointed.

'The Holy Grail', 'Meaning of Life' = pure awesomeness.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I just
hope that the game isn't preachy.
Make sense? Probably not.

UchihaKarasu
05-06-2009, 06:30 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by bhreifert:
caswallawn_2k7, like I said, no media is going to make me question my beliefs.

UchihaKarasu, you bring up all excellent points.
I liked the religious themes and hope they are in AC2 as well.
I just hope it's not 'da Vinci code part 2'.
AC1 I thought was very level headed, but if AC2 is all about 'science is the new religion'
'science knows all', then I'll be dissapointed.

'The Holy Grail', 'Meaning of Life' = pure awesomeness.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I just
hope that the game isn't preachy.
Make sense? Probably not. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Nah, I get what your saying.
Don't make religion a minor; keep it true to the time line.
But don't give me the Bible in game form (I've read it so I know)
That's all I ask.

WaitingDragon
05-06-2009, 06:35 PM
I agree with you bhreifert, a game shouldn't be preachy. Keep in mind though this is renaissane period Venice, science and art became popular. Be prepared to at least here reference to it. You must remember the story-line in AC1 is about that key that the old man had and that the company was templars were looking for. The storyline will probably still along lines like those and keep it's nuetrality.

Outlaw-BHA
05-06-2009, 08:35 PM
well this franchise has got to become anti-religious at some point, with all the artifacts Abstergo has alegedly found


@first post
i'm surprised you think AC1 sidestepped religion, when i specifically remember Al-mualim(sp) saying that jesus never walked on water and never turned water into wine, and moses never parted the red sea... areen't those statements a lil religion shaking?

moqqy
05-06-2009, 10:15 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by bhreifert:
caswallawn_2k7, like I said, no media is going to make me question my beliefs.

UchihaKarasu, you bring up all excellent points.
I liked the religious themes and hope they are in AC2 as well.
I just hope it's not 'da Vinci code part 2'.
AC1 I thought was very level headed, but if AC2 is all about 'science is the new religion'
'science knows all', then I'll be dissapointed.

'The Holy Grail', 'Meaning of Life' = pure awesomeness.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I just
hope that the game isn't preachy.
Make sense? Probably not. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What was so bad about the Da Vinci code? It was just a fictitious take on a story. I quite liked, however, how it used some "general knowledge" and gave a "what if" theory.

I don't see a way out of the whole "Holy Grail" business without saying it was science or somehow explainable. "Magic" just won't cut it and will hurt the game world for me..

But I doubt there will be "There is no God! The Bible is a lie!" banners all around the game.

UchihaKarasu
05-06-2009, 10:36 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Outlaw-BHA:
well this franchise has got to become anti-religious at some point, with all the artifacts Abstergo has alegedly found


@first post
i'm surprised you think AC1 sidestepped religion, when i specifically remember Al-mualim(sp) saying that jesus never walked on water and never turned water into wine, and moses never parted the red sea... areen't those statements a lil religion shaking? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Ah, but the thing about AC is that just because it is said doesn't mean it is true or final
Take the X-Files for example; no one really ever dies.
Yes it is religion shaking but keep in mind
"Nothing is True, Everything is Permitted."
Don't believe everything from a first glance....

Somehow I have this odd feeling that I misunderstood your statement XD
Did I?

An_Idea
05-06-2009, 10:51 PM
AGNOSTICISM FTW!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

(i was going to bring up the da vinci code but someone beat me to it)
so i think that Ubi is taking some risks at angering some of their customers with the subject of religion but look at it this way. assassins creed aims to be highly realistic. to do so Ubi must immerse the whole games mythology (at least the past segments of the game) into the Renaissance where mankind was striving to invent new things and some people in that time decided that science WAS more important than religion, im not saying this is right but this is what happened. Ubi needs to maintain what happened in the past even if it was anti religion. but remember, the Vatican will most likely be in the game and history has supposedly been modified from the truth, maybe nothing happened between science and religion and da vinci was just known as some crazy man with crazy ideas that no one cared about back then.

PlaidPickle
05-07-2009, 07:25 AM
Outlaw-BHA, I really liked the religious themes in AC1 and I thought it remained very neutral as you played through. All sides' views were presented equally.

WaitingDragon, that's what I'm hoping for, nuetrality.

An_Idea, agree with all of that.

I just hope Ubi understands that science isn't infallible.
We are men, and men can screw up anything, be it
religion, science, politics, et al.

idiot_finland
05-07-2009, 08:08 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by bhreifert:

'The Holy Grail', 'Meaning of Life' = pure awesomeness.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You're right, Monty Python movies are fantastic http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Virnava
05-07-2009, 09:55 AM
I think someone already said this, but just because Al-Mualim said that the artifact was the cause of the miracles that happen in the Bible doesn't mean that it was. It just means Al-Mualim believes that.

I expect that AC II will have less of a religious overtone than the first, considering the spirit of the Renaissance. If anything, I would think it would be somewhat critical of treating science as one's religion.

UchihaKarasu
05-07-2009, 04:21 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Virnava:
I think someone already said this, but just because Al-Mualim said that the artifact was the cause of the miracles that happen in the Bible doesn't mean that it was. It just means Al-Mualim believes that.

I expect that AC II will have less of a religious overtone than the first, considering the spirit of the Renaissance. If anything, I would think it would be somewhat critical of treating science as one's religion. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Lol, that's what I said XD

But I agree and obviously Vidic believed what Al Mualim did so, it makes them a bit close minded, giving the Assassin's the advantage.
^Just a theory

PlaidPickle
05-08-2009, 10:13 AM
So from computerandvideogames.com:

"It looks like Ubisoft's planning to kick off its Assassin's Creed II campaign early, as a trailer is due to premiere on UK television this weekend.

A teaser and "full trailer" are due to be broadcast on Five during - what else - The Da Vinci Code, which airs on Sunday at 8pm."

Ugh.
Does this make anyone think that AC2 will be a rehash, copycat, homage to Dan Brown?

moqqy
05-08-2009, 11:38 AM
The plot of AC has some similarities between Da Vinci code.

mojsarn
05-09-2009, 04:59 PM
yeah,as some of you said, thinking back on what al mualim said, the game explains very well, or want to show, that religion was/is just fake, an illusion.
and the piece of eden was its tool,
and now abstergo are trying to create their own "religion" and use the piece of eden,but instead trying to convince the people with tricks, like the miracles, they just brainwash everyone.
i think its a fantastic story and the sequel will be amazing in terms of what could be done of the story.