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OldPepper
01-26-2005, 10:12 AM
Flying the earlier P-40s (1941a-b and tomahawks), I've been having a fair amount of trouble with this plane on paved runways taking off and landing. (Been practicing on Okinawa.)

The aircraft has a tendency to start a feedback wobble on the roll axis. This is especially pronounced at about 40-50 mph and not recoverable usually. No bombs, 25% fuel.

I don't generally have trouble with most planes on takeoff and landing, but this plane has presented some handling issues for me.

One technique I use to help alleviate this tendency is, to trim elevators back and pull back hard on the stick while throttling up prior to releasing the wheelbreak, and early on in the take-off, then opening the flaps once I reach higher speeds (60-80 mph), but it's no silver bullet.

Any tips on this bouncy wobbling?

OldPepper
01-26-2005, 10:12 AM
Flying the earlier P-40s (1941a-b and tomahawks), I've been having a fair amount of trouble with this plane on paved runways taking off and landing. (Been practicing on Okinawa.)

The aircraft has a tendency to start a feedback wobble on the roll axis. This is especially pronounced at about 40-50 mph and not recoverable usually. No bombs, 25% fuel.

I don't generally have trouble with most planes on takeoff and landing, but this plane has presented some handling issues for me.

One technique I use to help alleviate this tendency is, to trim elevators back and pull back hard on the stick while throttling up prior to releasing the wheelbreak, and early on in the take-off, then opening the flaps once I reach higher speeds (60-80 mph), but it's no silver bullet.

Any tips on this bouncy wobbling?

Aaron_GT
01-26-2005, 10:51 AM
All aircraftseem more wobbly of late.

Udidtoo
01-26-2005, 11:00 AM
Locking the tailwheel seems to help a little and get that nose pointed straight ahead with gentle forward pressure as soon as you start to gain enough speed to do so.

BaldieJr
01-26-2005, 11:03 AM
Don't trim up or pull back on the stick.

Crack the throttle and trickle the power in. Once you are rolling, inch the throttle up some more.

Hold half-stick forward untill the tail comes up, then ease her up to full throttle.

You'll need rudder the whole time, but be gentle.

SeminoleX
01-26-2005, 11:22 AM
This works for me:

I always use the zoomed out cockpit view for takeoff...seems to make a difference for reasons unknown...maybe better view of takeoff tracking.
All trims to neutral.
Cowlflaps full open.
Dont' lock tailwheel.
Full autorich and fine prop pitch.
Combat or take off flaps.
Full back on stick.. full up elevator.
Apply power very gradually and release brakes...keep stick full back.
When speed is around 30mph start easing forward on stick and lock tailwheel.
Continue applying power until 110% and easing the nose forward until tailwheel lifts and rudder control becomes possible.
Avoid inadvertant aileron control movements as much as possible.

Usually goes straight as an arrow unless it's raining on a dirt runway.

Chuck_Older
01-26-2005, 11:50 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

This problem's been around since Pacific Fighters Shipped. Has nothing to do with any patches or updates. Trust me.

<span class="ev_code_YELLOW">Take-off and landing procedure, PF H81A-2, P-40B and P-40C</span>

<span class="ev_code_RED">Firstly~ This happens on some maps worse than others</span>

Take-off:

The very first thing you do- push control stick full forward. Lock tailwheel. Start engine. Full throttle immediately. Do NOT lower flaps any amount. Keep canopy closed.

Your goal here is to 'fly the tail' as soon as possible. Once the tailwheel is up, stability problems vanish

Start your take-off roll. Stick is FULL forward, As you pick up speed and the nose drops, you want to keep the bottom of the gunsight circle approximately even with the far edge of the runway.

As the tail lifts, the plane wants to yaw. Correct with rudder, or slight aileron if absolutely necessary.

When you reach 150mph indicated, pull up smoothly. Immediately raise wheel and lower two notches of flap. See you later http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


Landing~

Come in,full flap, open canopy, full radiator flaps, tailwheel locked. You want to touch down on the mainwheels- NO three point landings here. Touch down at about 90-100 mph indicated.

Just like the takeoff, keep the tail up as long as possible. To do this, tap the brakes as you roll. Keep that tail up! At around 40-50 mph you can let the tailwheel hit the tarmac. At 30 mph, stability is almost approaching normal and you can unlock tailwheel, at 10 mph you barely notice the difference.

I estimate I have about 200 take-offs and landings in the H81A-2 just in playtesting my campaign. This method works, no outside views needed

<span class="ev_code_WHITE">Emergency landings:</span>

If you must force land these aircraft, as they are now you must belly land if you are not at a runway. I haven't succesfully done a wheels-down landing in the field yet, but belly landing these planes is easy. No matter how smoothly I land in the field, the plane ground loops (noses over)

You don't need any wheel brake tricks or external views- all you need is to keep the tailwheel in the air

OldPepper
01-26-2005, 12:44 PM
interesting suggestion on stick FULL FORWARD and to flaps once you reach takeoff speed.

I'll give it a go right now!

Done!

Getting the elevators off the tail wheel sure did the trick. I can get the tail up at just less than 40 mph! The plane still tries to occelate the roll quite severely, but by getting the tail up, the wobble doesn't have a chance to feedback-loop.

The same hold on landing, by keeping the tail up, the dangerous passage from 45-30 mph with the feedback occelation is rectified by passing through those speeds fairly rapidly.

Thanks again!

Chuck_Older
01-26-2005, 01:08 PM
Flaps right after takeoff, not while you are on the ground.

Keep the plane as 'clean' as possible before you pull up. You'll fly the tail sooner, and reach take-off speed quicker

I'm sure there's more than one way to skin this cat, but this way is the easiest I've tried

VVS-Manuc
01-26-2005, 01:38 PM
I hope this will be fixed in next patch. It is a totally unrealistic beaviour of some planes on some maps

Lucius_Esox
01-26-2005, 03:50 PM
I find the Brewster a very large handfull on takeoff now, but fun.

PBNA-Boosher
01-26-2005, 06:47 PM
Get up on the mains as early as possibly by pushing the stick foward. It eliminates the problem.

MGBurrows
01-27-2005, 12:51 PM
My first three take-off attempts in P-40C's ended up wheels-up with a very frustrated pilot.

Just as it starts to wobble I have learned to lift the tail from the ground and use rudder to keep it straight until I have enough lift to get off the ground. Solved the whole problem.

Chuck Older figured that out, too, I see.

I do have my flaps at take-off from the start. Prop pitch at 100%. Tail wheel unlocked. The key is getting the tail up just as the wobble begins so that you don't flip. If you do that you'll be fine.

The landing advice is good. Since I haven't yet mastered that Three Point Landing thing, my tail wheel's pretty much always still up after I touch down in pretty much any aircraft.

MGBurrows
01-27-2005, 01:05 PM
Actually, come to think about it, I consider the P-40E the easiest of all aircraft to fly. An excellent training aircraft. I was surprised the P-40B & C were so twitchy on take-off. But, then, the E was a more advanced variant.