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XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 04:22 AM
Oleg,

I understand that the plane add ons may be a ways off in the future but would you consider adding the flyable version of the P-51D to the final patch? I know a LOT of people are looking forward to this particular plane so it would be a pleasant surprise if you could put us in the cockpit of the Mustang ahead of schedule.

Thank-you



For Thread Posters: Please don't muddle this post with criticisms of the request. It is a legitimate question so I would really rather only see posts from those who second it.


Message Edited on 09/08/0303:26AM by Bucinda

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 04:22 AM
Oleg,

I understand that the plane add ons may be a ways off in the future but would you consider adding the flyable version of the P-51D to the final patch? I know a LOT of people are looking forward to this particular plane so it would be a pleasant surprise if you could put us in the cockpit of the Mustang ahead of schedule.

Thank-you



For Thread Posters: Please don't muddle this post with criticisms of the request. It is a legitimate question so I would really rather only see posts from those who second it.


Message Edited on 09/08/0303:26AM by Bucinda

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 04:32 AM
That would definitely be a nice gift http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

S!
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XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 04:37 AM
Hell, I'm still waiting on actually getting the P-47. Not just it's 3D model. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 04:50 AM
I'll third that motion and if you are feeling really nice the B and C models would be awesome. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
~S!
Eagle
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XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 05:01 AM
God yes please. Throw us a bone.

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 05:07 AM
I support this,but something tells me the P-51s will be in the pay-for add-on....

47|FC
http://rangerring.com/wwii/p-47.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 05:25 AM
Please Oleg. Or just parts of P51-D. Anything will do. If your not finished coding flight control surfaces, that is OK. We will be Happy. Just don't make us wait like everybody else has to for their favorite.


Thank you Oleg. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


a Bear in a P~51 without a red tail rudder is a Mad Bear

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 05:36 AM
What a great idea!

Making the P-51 flyable would be a low cost boost to public relations; something much needed in this lean time.

next week?

this month?

A little neighborly chat from one of Oleg's mates concerning one of the most requested aircraft yet would be great too; and even cheaper!

Falcon

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XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 05:53 AM
LEXX_Luthor wrote:
- Please Oleg. Or just parts of P51-D. Anything
- will do. If your not finished coding flight
- control surfaces, that is OK. We will be Happy. Just
- don't make us wait like everybody else has to for
- their favorite.
-
-
- Thank you Oleg.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif LOL..Luthor's sarcasm is noted!/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

47|FC
http://rangerring.com/wwii/p-47.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 07:01 AM
awww gaaawdddd The P51 whining as started already

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 07:14 AM
It's not whinning, we are just anxious for the Mustang to be flyable. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
~S!
Eagle
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XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 09:29 AM
This sounds like an excellent idea. Good Post!/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 10:53 AM
Just fix the GD P-47 already. NO NEW PLANES until the ones we have, work.

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XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 11:13 AM
If you want to start a thread asking Oleg to not release any new planes then be my guest but please don't use my thread to vent about something that is not even remotely related to the subject. You can see from my first post that I specifically asked people to not do this so I am not sure why you did anyway.

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 12:26 PM
o yes yes please do that i swear if they give us the p=51 i will buy every producd made by 1c maddox (p-51 is my fave plane if u haddnt guessed)

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 04:41 PM
Please...../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
~S!
Eagle
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XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 04:53 PM
necrobaron wrote:
- I support this,but something tells me the P-51s will
- be in the pay-for add-on....
-
- 47|FC
http://rangerring.com/wwii/p-47.jpg
-


Hehe, same here - I don't think they are morons at 1C /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif . We all should have acted like the Luftwhiners, saying:"Well, who cares about the Mustang, what's up with it anyway?" We would have gotten it in FB from the start /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif .

=38=OIAE

47|FC=-

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 04:56 PM
But actually, we would have been fooled if it's payware. I remember prior and during the very first weeks / first month of FB, it was said the Stang 3D model is included, the pit is being worked on already, and it will be included in a *patch*. For me, a patch is something which costs nothing. Not an add-on...

=38=OIAE

47|FC=-

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:47 AM
Oleg's original plan a couple months back was to release the beta patch and then release the final version of the patch with some add-on planes. The P-51 was always at the top of the list for completed planes and I think it is a given that it would be one of the first ones out.

I was actually under the impression that the P-51 was flyable when I bought the game and it is definitely the plane I have been looking forward to the most. If I got that I really wouldn't care about having to wait for other things.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 08:50 AM
Would be nice, Im hoping they give the .50s justice in the planes patch.



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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 09:01 AM
Yes I am crossing my fingers that the P-51s will be modelled well. I don't want an uber plane, just one that is accurate. I think that if you really put in time with almost any plane in this game you can be competitive and the Mustang is definitely the plane I want to really focus on being good with.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 10:48 AM
The P-51 would be nice, even though I cant stand the plane, myself. But from a producers point of view, it would not make much sense to release it now.

A "Pay" add-on including a venerable aircraft like the P-51 would help to capture the American based market which is actually behind the Euro market for this sim.

In turn, the added revenue generated for 1C would help with additional costs for future sims. So, as you can see, getting the P51 now might actually hurt future 1C games and the entire future of prop sims as we know it... LOL

Now the 110 wouldnt hurt anyone, would it? *Evil Grin*

Fehler

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 11:07 AM
Everybody has these conspiracy theories about how ubi soft is trying to maximize their profits but I just don't buy it. Oleg said the only reason he didn't include planes in the beta patch was because it was big enough already. The plan was definitely to release a few planes in a free add on very close to the first patch release. A later add on may be payware but I have yet to hear that from a single representative of ubi soft or the Maddox team. I think they would be crazy not to charge a little for all the stuff they are planning to add in the future.

I think the P-38, B-17,and F4U will have plenty of pull with American fans of the game to spur a purchase of an add on. The P-51 is unique in the sense that it already exists in the game but is just not flyable yet. I don't think the Mustang is the major cash cow that ubi soft will leverage to draw in American buyers like everybody is making it out to be.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 11:52 AM
I wouldn't mind getting it in early.

If the plane is pretty much 'done' according to Maddox, the same way the P47-d27 is "fixed", then I'd like to have it before all FB development ceases so that community feedback can be taken into account.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 01:04 PM
I would appreciate the P-51D early, but think, if he's not done coding it, and you guys are angry, you're going to flame him!! Give Oleg a break, good things take time.

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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 04:35 PM
Hi all
Just like to pointout that the P51D was still out classed by the La 7 in every aspect upto around 3000m. I find most fights occur below this so you may find that when it arrives you will be a little disapointed... just like all the Fw190 flyboys waiting for the dora 9 to arrive. when it did it was pants at low altitude. The P51D was mainly used as a high altitude bomber escort where its flight characteristics suited it and it excelled.

I looked at another forum where they are moaning about the 262 being unfair. WELL it was way ahead of its time guys thats why the allies hit it while it was on the ground or during takeoff & landing.

I personnally prefer servers where its setup for 1942 early 1943. The aircraft are closly matched and the dogfights are pretty close. What do you think?

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 04:58 PM
Bucinda!

" If I got that I really wouldn't care about having to wait for other things."



Exactly, if I had the 'Stang, I would sit quietly, stay on task and play well with other kids. I expect that Oleg will keep his word and include the a/c in a free add on "soon". I also expect he will do his best to get it right.

I know the P-51 is not the greatest a/c around, but it IS the P-51 and that's enough for me. So, when I'm on a server with a '44-'45 plane set, I'll be ridin' a Pony.

Just let us know, Oleg, about when you may be ready to hand it over. No charge!


Falcon

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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:08 PM
could always give us p51 early model /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
if/when il2 fb stops being devloped/patched, be nice if they let the secrets out, howto add your own planes, and terrain /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:42 PM
Yes - let's have another USA plane - after all, we have
the Hurricane, so there are far too many UK planes.

Seriously, I think introducing the P51 at this stage
would be a distraction from fixing other issues, and
you can be sure that as soon as it is included the boards
will be alive with posts saying how it has been undermodelled.
Until other issues are fixed, and until the P51 has been
very well tested, releasing it would be a PR disaster.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 07:40 PM
I agree with the last entry olegg how about some more brit planes ? Oh i forgot the p51 was built on British specs for the RAF by the americans then they bolted the cack alison engine on it like the P-38's they sold us 'the castrated' lightning. Whoa didn't they change thier minds when we stuck the rolls royce engines on it and produced a class aircraft. (did you know that the design of the p51 was drawn up by a german. What a kick in the undercarraige)
cheers guys.
Sorry to the author of this subject i know its got sort of side tracked.

(best laid plans always go wrong when they are executed)

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 07:57 PM
Aaron, I agree that it is sad that there are too few British a/c now. I'd love to have a Spit too.

Diablotye, let's not start that please. This has been a fairly decent thread up until now.

This is about the P-51. Okay?

Thanx


Falcon

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Message Edited on 09/09/0309:05PM by Falcon_41

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 08:48 PM
Falcon_41 wrote:
- This is about the P-51. Okay?

It's about whether it is possible to have the P51
early or not. I just pointed out that we only have
one UK flyable. Any effort that goes into making the
P51 flyable is effort that cannot be expended on
anything else - either fixing current issues, or
making a UK aircraft flyable. With limited effort
available if it would take similar effort to get
the P51 flyable or a UK plane flyable, then it would
seem fairer to delay the P51. If the P51 is nearly
ready to go, then fair enough. Also the P51 might
give a sales boost, so fairness doesn't really enter
into it.

All these factors are interrelated.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 09:11 PM
AaronGT,
Yes it is truely a shame there is no Spitfire or any other RAF plane in this game rather shocking too. BUt it has more to do with the 3D modellers who are doing those various projects, not Oleg himself. It seem's to me that in the case of the Spit, there have been alot of bumps in the road to get her done, But none of us can control that, we can only hope it get's sorted out or Gibbage takes over the project. However the P-51 is done completely, cockpit, 3D model and FM as far as I am understanding. We are just curious how much longer we will have to wait before getting to fly it. No sense in holding it until there are more RAF planes if you get what I am saying. If I knew anything at all about how to make that Spit become a reality I would. And I offer any assistance I can lend to get them done. But our Mustangs are ready to rock and we want them.
~S!
Eagle
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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 09:21 PM
This'll really get your goat. Think about it... Oleg and crew have already received a few planes made by third party modellers, like Gibbage. So that means that someone, probably Mr. M himself, actually CAN fly the 51, 229, 38, 88 (maybe they don't have that one yet), and who knows how many more. Wouldn't it be groovy if they flew them online someday, just to show off? Imagine everyone's comments if some unknown flyer showed up and started blasting the unsuspecting outta the sky with the P-38!! Oy, am I envious of those guys.


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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 10:03 PM
Eagle_361st wrote:
- AaronGT,
- Yes it is truely a shame there is no Spitfire or any
- other RAF plane in this game rather shocking too.
- BUt it has more to do with the 3D modellers who are
- doing those various projects, not Oleg himself.

I know - that's why I said "if it would take the same
amount of effort" or words to that effect. Obviously
all bets are off if there is no 3D model.

- However the P-51 is done completely, cockpit, 3D
- model and FM as far as I am understanding.

That presumes that there were no tweaks to the physics
engine in the latest patches. If there were, I would
imagine that it would be, to a certain extent, back to
the drawing board with the FM to get it right. Given
the high profile of the P51 it probably warrants extra
testing, since it is bound to get gone over with a fine
tooth comb.

In fact if I was Oleg I'd put it in a pack of other things.
If exposed on itself with a few weeks of clear blue air
between it and anything else, it would be dissected in
fine detail, and no doubt there would be criticism of
every tiny flaw. (It seems to be that good aspects are
rarely praised as consumer expectations can be very high).
So holding off until there is a package of planes might be better for 1C:Maddox, in that it exposes the product
to less criticism.

- No sense in holding it
- until there are more RAF planes if you get what I am
- saying. If I knew anything at all about how to make
- that Spit become a reality I would.

Ditto. I've tried with 3D modelling packages. It's a black art.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 10:13 PM
Very good, Eagle, thanx.

Aaron, I'm on your side, but the P-51 needs only the code that will integrate it into the game fully; from AI only a/c to full activity.

My beef was with diablotye who seemed to be denigrating the thread and sending it into a childish tailspin.

Up the Spitfire, Typhoon, Blen, Lancaster, Bristol and all, but when are the a/c that are most finished going to be released?


Falcon

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Message Edited on 09/09/0311:38PM by Falcon_41

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 11:59 PM
im not too sure i want a p-51 with all the whining that will come out on the forums. some ppl will think it is too good, others not good enough.

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 12:07 AM
P~51 Forgotten Battles


-- im not too sure i want a p-51 with all the whining that
-- will come out on the forums. some ppl will think it is
-- too good, others not good enough.

Wait till the first time a I~153 out-turns a P~51D. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

Of course they will only dogfight with P~51 at low level because they must have socially presentable landscape in the online server screenshots.

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 12:43 AM
Why would anybody be against adding a new plane? You don't have to fly it. By the way, I am all for the Brits getting their venerable Spit as well but you have to make your own thread! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 04:52 AM
Excellent point Aaron, I agree the P-51 will be the most dissected plane both pro and con. And I too fear that there will be alot of whinning about it, both victims of it's guns or victim of their poor flying. I think that is a good idea to release it with other a/c that way it isn't under the microscope all by itself. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif Now that doesn't mean let's wait until X-mas though. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
~S!
Eagle
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XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 09:03 PM
Well there is no doubt that many people will whine about the P-51 but that is certainly not a good reason to not have it. The idea that whiners of any kind are starting to influence the direction this game takes is kind of sad. By the way, I make a distinction between "whiner" and person who uses factual information to point out a possible bug.

XyZspineZyX
09-11-2003, 10:00 AM
Bucinda wrote:
- Well there is no doubt that many people will whine
- about the P-51 but that is certainly not a good
- reason to not have it.

From Oleg's perspective, the whining may be an issue
if it affects the perception of the quality of the
game. After all, he has to sell products to make
his living, so if a free add on garners criticism,
he's put in effort with the possible result of losing
sales. That's not good for his bottom line.

Better for Oleg's bottom line is probably to spend
some time making the P51 really good, and then releasing
it with other aircraft so it is not so much in the
spotlight. Whining gets lost in positive comments about
other parts of the add ons. Magazines review the add on
as a whole.

As long as the add on doesn't come so late as to annoy
people desperate for the P51 and cause adverse sales
that way, it makes more commercial sense for him to
wait until several things are ready. Ultimately no
commercial advantage for Oleg means no more product.

That's how I'd play it if I was Oleg.

Now ideally I'd like the P51 right now too of course!
But that's me thinking purely of myself! and some
Spitfires and a Tempest to go with it soon would be nice :-)

XyZspineZyX
09-11-2003, 10:07 AM
Aaron has a very good point...

47|FC
http://rangerring.com/wwii/p-47.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-11-2003, 12:44 PM
necrobaron wrote:
- Aaron has a very good point...

Thanks. Being married teaches you nothing if not patience :-)

XyZspineZyX
09-11-2003, 02:20 PM
Doesn't anybody else think it would be nice to get an accurate P-47D-27 first? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-11-2003, 03:07 PM
Sure, let's get a better P-47. While one or two guys work on the P-47, let the guy over by the water cooler ...

yeah, that guy ...

let him go over to *another* computer and send to us a rough, approximate, ballpark idea as to when we will get the P-51. The one that Oleg said would be in the first and free add on.

Yeah, that's a good lad!

Log on ...


Falcon


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XyZspineZyX
09-11-2003, 04:34 PM
Purely to help you all out,I will Beta the P-51.
Oleg send it along,I'll fly it and get back to you all as soon as I can.
To show how unselfish I am I'll update everyone on this Board every day,screenies,DM's,turn-rates,etc.
Then when it's released I get the heat if it's wrong.
Cant say fairer than that.
"Never in the field of flight sims,has so much been owed by so many,to so few,etc,etc"

XyZspineZyX
09-11-2003, 09:49 PM
bull *sh__iii____it* talk

XyZspineZyX
09-11-2003, 10:43 PM
Let my people go. Release the P-51, please.

How about it Oleg??

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XyZspineZyX
09-12-2003, 10:18 AM
BlitzPig_DDT wrote:
- Doesn't anybody else think it would be nice to get
- an accurate P-47D-27 first?

I do. I suggested fixing existing issues should be the
priority over adding new stuff. As soon as new stuff is
added there will be calls for that to be fixed too, so
then there won't be any time to fix the original issues,
as if the new issues are not fixed instantly people will
complain about support being poor, etc...