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View Full Version : How has Ubisoft still not Changed the "1 Guard Attack" Combat?



ACSineQuaNon
12-03-2011, 11:33 PM
This has been a problem since AC2 (perhaps even AC1 - I forgot?). Why hasn't this been fixed? Since 2009, fans have asked for simultaneous attacks. At the 2010 E3 demonstration of Brotherhood, developers claimed guards would be now allowed to attack more than one a time, but obviously that was not the case. To this day, guards still form a circle around you, leaving you to wait until one attacks so you can counter and begin a chain.

There used to be so many threads about this around the launch of ACB, but no one seems to specifically address this anymore. It's not like it's been solved. Four years of development and the difficulty of AC combat has hardly evolved. Please, revamp the combat system for AC3, Ubisoft.

NineteenHealer
12-03-2011, 11:51 PM
for me when i counter a kill another guard a Janissary aims his gun and shoots me or slash his sword at me this usually happens to me.

ACSineQuaNon
12-04-2011, 12:05 AM
Originally posted by NineteenHealer:
for me when i counter a kill another guard a Janissary aims his gun and shoots me or slash his sword at me this usually happens to me.

That's different. I'm talking about a guard attacking you from one angle, say in front, and another guard attacking from another angle, say behind. There's no denying the majority of battles end up with Ezio standing in the middle of a circle of guards.

LightRey
12-04-2011, 02:45 AM
They haven't changed it because the amount of fans that want it changed is just too small. Not to mention that there are likely quite a few players out there that find the games hard enough as is.

Eregost
12-04-2011, 09:26 AM
LightRay are you on ubisoft's payroll? You are always defending them even for things that are inexcuseable like this. How do you know the amount of fans that think the combat system should be revamped is small, have you done a survey? Please stop always stating your assumptions as fact.

RzaRecta357
12-04-2011, 09:58 AM
No, LightRey is just right.

I think the games are to easy but more attacking at once just doesn't make sense.

They'd have to revamp the whole system. You can counter two at a time. Hell, why don't they just steal Batmans entire formula while they're at it?

There are complaints, and there are stupid ideas. I think this idea falls into the latter when you really think about it.

LightRey
12-04-2011, 10:10 AM
Originally posted by Eregost:
LightRay are you on ubisoft's payroll? You are always defending them even for things that are inexcuseable like this. How do you know the amount of fans that think the combat system should be revamped is small, have you done a survey? Please stop always stating your assumptions as fact.
No, I'm just being a realist and I'm observant enough to notice that only a small amount of the players, even amongst the diehard fans, actually want it changed.

I myself have my own preferences. For instance, I don't really like the MP and I wouldn't mind if they'd eliminate it entirely. However, I also consider the fact that there are a lot of players out there that really like the MP and don't want it eliminated at all. For Ubisoft to listen to me, who simply feels it's a minor annoyance, would be both unfair and stupid.

RzaRecta357
12-04-2011, 10:13 AM
Originally posted by LightRey:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Eregost:
LightRay are you on ubisoft's payroll? You are always defending them even for things that are inexcuseable like this. How do you know the amount of fans that think the combat system should be revamped is small, have you done a survey? Please stop always stating your assumptions as fact.
No, I'm just being a realist and I'm observant enough to notice that only a small amount of the players, even amongst the diehard fans, actually want it changed.

I myself have my own preferences. For instance, I don't really like the MP and I wouldn't mind if they'd eliminate it entirely. However, I also consider the fact that there are a lot of players out there that really like the MP and don't want it eliminated at all. For Ubisoft to listen to me, who simply feels it's a minor annoyance, would be both unfair and stupid. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Light!? You really don't like it? It's so assasiny though :P

I hate when kids smoke bomb and stand there to get a score up.

But Deathmatch, with morphing civilians and disguising yourself is very fun if you actually play the intended way and stalk and walk up to your kills. I usually end up top place doing it the way your SUPPOSED to.

Sometimes you get those cheeseballs that NEED to smoke and wait for their bar to rise though.

LightRey
12-04-2011, 10:48 AM
Originally posted by RzaRecta357:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LightRey:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Eregost:
LightRay are you on ubisoft's payroll? You are always defending them even for things that are inexcuseable like this. How do you know the amount of fans that think the combat system should be revamped is small, have you done a survey? Please stop always stating your assumptions as fact.
No, I'm just being a realist and I'm observant enough to notice that only a small amount of the players, even amongst the diehard fans, actually want it changed.

I myself have my own preferences. For instance, I don't really like the MP and I wouldn't mind if they'd eliminate it entirely. However, I also consider the fact that there are a lot of players out there that really like the MP and don't want it eliminated at all. For Ubisoft to listen to me, who simply feels it's a minor annoyance, would be both unfair and stupid. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Light!? You really don't like it? It's so assasiny though :P

I hate when kids smoke bomb and stand there to get a score up.

But Deathmatch, with morphing civilians and disguising yourself is very fun if you actually play the intended way and stalk and walk up to your kills. I usually end up top place doing it the way your SUPPOSED to.

Sometimes you get those cheeseballs that NEED to smoke and wait for their bar to rise though. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Well it's not that I really dislike it, but more that, though I find it an interesting and relatively enjoying change of pace compared to most MP games, I still really don't like competitive play that much and after a while I feel it gets a little boring and repetitive. :/

kriegerdesgottes
12-04-2011, 09:52 PM
agreed, I can force myself to play it for a while and I dare say even enjoy it a little but I don't enjoy competitive play either and I too would rather it be eliminated and I'm not so sure we are even in the minority for thinking that although I could def be wrong. Either way there is no way in this world that Ubisoft will ever eliminate it at this point. It's there to stay no matter what.

DavisP92
12-04-2011, 10:02 PM
Originally posted by RzaRecta357:
No, LightRey is just right.

I think the games are to easy but more attacking at once just doesn't make sense.

They'd have to revamp the whole system. You can counter two at a time. Hell, why don't they just steal Batmans entire formula while they're at it?

There are complaints, and there are stupid ideas. I think this idea falls into the latter when you really think about it.

I wouldn't call it a stupid idea, in fact it would make it more interesting. And I don't think double counters are copyrighted. Imo, guards should attack more then one at a time. Kinda doesn't make sense honestly, who stands there while their ally is being killed hah. And it would do more damage to the player (more attacks), messing up the first counter or it could allow you to kill twice as many guards. I say if they can do it well then do it, but if they can't then just focus on other things

ACSineQuaNon
12-04-2011, 10:05 PM
Originally posted by LightRey:
They haven't changed it because the amount of fans that want it changed is just too small. Not to mention that there are likely quite a few players out there that find the games hard enough as is.

What are you talking about? People are ALWAYS complaining about the difficulty of the game. Just read the feedback threads of AC2, ACB, and ACR. Eregost is right, you're like Ubisoft's personal whiteknight.

naran6142
12-04-2011, 10:09 PM
actually sometime 2 guards will attack at the same time

Rey, is probably right, i dont think there are enough fans that want the combat to be harder. difficulty just becomes frustration in the end. kinda like playing veteran on COD, it not fun just annoying

kriegerdesgottes
12-04-2011, 10:10 PM
Originally posted by ACSineQuaNon:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LightRey:
They haven't changed it because the amount of fans that want it changed is just too small. Not to mention that there are likely quite a few players out there that find the games hard enough as is.

What are you talking about? People are ALWAYS complaining about the difficulty of the game. Just read the feedback threads of AC2, ACB, and ACR. Eregost is right, you're like Ubisoft's personal whiteknight. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

There is probably an equal number of people who love the combat as is and wouldn't want it to be more difficult.

ACSineQuaNon
12-04-2011, 10:28 PM
Instead of simply stating that "the amount of fans that want it changed is too small" or "there is probably an equal number of people who wouldn't want it to be more difficult," you must substantiate those claims. As far as I can tell, most fans and critics have repeatedly called for Ubisoft to increase AC's difficult. This has been the case since AC2.

Read the ACR SP Mission Difficulty and ACR SP Game Feedback threads. If those nearly twenty pages don't convince you, then read the AC2 and ACB feedback threads. From 2009-2010, a thread about the difficulty was always on the first page.

Where are all the fans that don't want the difficulty to be increased?

1- LightRey
2- Kriegerdesgotte
3- naran6141
4- ProdiGirl

I'm sure there are many more, but it's obvious the majority prefers otherwise.

DavisP92
12-04-2011, 10:30 PM
Originally posted by kriegerdesgotte:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ACSineQuaNon:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LightRey:
They haven't changed it because the amount of fans that want it changed is just too small. Not to mention that there are likely quite a few players out there that find the games hard enough as is.

What are you talking about? People are ALWAYS complaining about the difficulty of the game. Just read the feedback threads of AC2, ACB, and ACR. Eregost is right, you're like Ubisoft's personal whiteknight. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

There is probably an equal number of people who love the combat as is and wouldn't want it to be more difficult. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

yea there could be, but normally i hear about how the game should be harder. it's kinda way to easy, how u can just shoot ppl without reloading now and guards don't even hear the gun anymore

Edit: @naran. I think i've seen that too, but u don't kill both u stop ur counter on one and kill the other. It would look better if there was an animation to kill both, rather than some weird pause and continue motion. ANd idk about the not enough ppl that want combat harder, i think there are a lot. But wouldn't it just be easier if someone just made a poll for who wants the game harder or not

@Go_clo, have u ever just shot the janassaries with ur gun, it takes 3 shots (same with the knives) so u could just stand there and kill them like that. I was bored one time and tried it out, it was kinda sad how easily they die.

goclo822
12-04-2011, 10:32 PM
While I sort of agree with the OP, especially in regards to the 1st game, I also found that the combat was a lot more difficult in Revelations. With the addition of the Janassaries and every guard having a gun, I found the combat could be quite difficult. And actually I found that when trying to do combo kills or counter attacks, I was often interrupted by the other guards hitting me half way through a move and saving the guard I was attacking. So I wouldn't say they completely ignored the request for harder fights.

kriegerdesgottes
12-04-2011, 10:57 PM
@Go_clo, have u ever just shot the janassaries with ur gun, it takes 3 shots (same with the knives) so u could just stand there and kill them like that. I was bored one time and tried it out, it was kinda sad how easily they die.

How many shots should it take to kill a guy!? lol. It would be impressive to take ONE shot from a crossbow and still be able to walk around like nothing happened. These games are meant to be realistic and I will agree I wish the guards would notice things I do more and they would react more realistically at times but I don't want these games to be unrealistic so people can have some kind of challenge that many people find unnecessary.

PR030T
12-04-2011, 11:24 PM
These games are meant to be realistic, look at Ezio, he's extremely realistic: 1000 kg suit, large hammer, crowsbow, dagger, bombs, 15 parachutes which are invisible untill he needs them, medicine that heals within a split-second and all of this while being able to climb anything and jump from almost any height without dying. Sooo please, don't make the guards a bit stronger, otherwise Ezio will get hit and he'll then have to take his split second medicine in order to decapitate the guard with his pinky. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

E-Zekiel
12-04-2011, 11:29 PM
Dunno about you, but guards attacked me simultaneously in Brotherhood.

Didn't really seem to in Revelations though.

Dagio12
12-04-2011, 11:45 PM
Originally posted by ACSineQuaNon:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LightRey:
They haven't changed it because the amount of fans that want it changed is just too small. Not to mention that there are likely quite a few players out there that find the games hard enough as is.

What are you talking about? People are ALWAYS complaining about the difficulty of the game. Just read the feedback threads of AC2, ACB, and ACR. Eregost is right, you're like Ubisoft's personal whiteknight. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The thing is.. statistically, people on the negative side of things, tend to be more likely to post and voice there opinions about there beliefs then others. So although it seems like there are a lot of people who want change in the combat system, its probably still a relatively small portion in comparison to the people that enjoy it just the way it is. Not that I wouldnt mind a little more challenge in the system, but overall... there are probably a lot more people that are ok with the way it is then people that are not. However, the people that are satisfied tend to not find it necessary to talk about it.

kriegerdesgottes
12-05-2011, 02:13 AM
Originally posted by PR030T:
These games are meant to be realistic, look at Ezio, he's extremely realistic: 1000 kg suit, large hammer, crowsbow, dagger, bombs, 15 parachutes which are invisible untill he needs them, medicine that heals within a split-second and all of this while being able to climb anything and jump from almost any height without dying. Sooo please, don't make the guards a bit stronger, otherwise Ezio will get hit and he'll then have to take his split second medicine in order to decapitate the guard with his pinky. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Oh you're right. It would be so much better if nothing was realistic and it was like Halo where not even the setting was realistic and we all know it's impossible to swim if you're carrying any kind of weight and in the 16th century everyone would look at you for having a crossbow on your back and a sword so we should just throw realism out the window. I'm so glad people like you are here to set the franchise straight. Also it's probably true that the MENTOR of the assassin order should struggle to fight a couple janissaries so you can have some little challenge. Good call. I'll send Gabe a message right now. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Dagio12
12-05-2011, 02:49 AM
Originally posted by PR030T:
These games are meant to be realistic, look at Ezio, he's extremely realistic: 1000 kg suit, large hammer, crowsbow, dagger, bombs, 15 parachutes which are invisible untill he needs them, medicine that heals within a split-second and all of this while being able to climb anything and jump from almost any height without dying. Sooo please, don't make the guards a bit stronger, otherwise Ezio will get hit and he'll then have to take his split second medicine in order to decapitate the guard with his pinky. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

1000kg suit eh?.. so like almost 2200lbs ( aka. a ton) man thats one hell of a suit... not sure if we are playing the same game here... but thanks for exaggerating just to "try" and prove a point. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif

orangebionic
12-05-2011, 02:50 AM
i cant believe it , honestly i cant, that some ppl feels that combat part of ac is even remotely difficult, not to mention too hard.
I'm not a awesome player, but combat part of story mode(fighting guards, etc) in all part of franchise are just ridicolously easy! Compare this combat to God of War, Batman, or to Tenchu from ps2, where i felt I have to go stealthy way to do missions, when in AC i know i can always muscle my way to the enemy(borgia towers, for example ,only 2 were really difficult)

Come one,all that guards standing around, kindly waiting for Ezio to anihilate them, one by one ,oh, phhluuueezeee!!!!

LightRey
12-05-2011, 03:49 AM
Originally posted by SF2themax:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PR030T:
These games are meant to be realistic, look at Ezio, he's extremely realistic: 1000 kg suit, large hammer, crowsbow, dagger, bombs, 15 parachutes which are invisible untill he needs them, medicine that heals within a split-second and all of this while being able to climb anything and jump from almost any height without dying. Sooo please, don't make the guards a bit stronger, otherwise Ezio will get hit and he'll then have to take his split second medicine in order to decapitate the guard with his pinky. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

1000kg suit eh?.. so like almost 2200lbs ( aka. a ton) man thats one hell of a suit... not sure if we are playing the same game here... but thanks for exaggerating just to "try" and prove a point. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Lol, maybe he's wearing a car?

kriegerdesgottes
12-05-2011, 03:55 AM
Originally posted by LightRey:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SF2themax:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PR030T:
These games are meant to be realistic, look at Ezio, he's extremely realistic: 1000 kg suit, large hammer, crowsbow, dagger, bombs, 15 parachutes which are invisible untill he needs them, medicine that heals within a split-second and all of this while being able to climb anything and jump from almost any height without dying. Sooo please, don't make the guards a bit stronger, otherwise Ezio will get hit and he'll then have to take his split second medicine in order to decapitate the guard with his pinky. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

1000kg suit eh?.. so like almost 2200lbs ( aka. a ton) man thats one hell of a suit... not sure if we are playing the same game here... but thanks for exaggerating just to "try" and prove a point. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Lol, maybe he's wearing a car? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Or he's apparently hiding an elephant under his robes.

ProdiGurl
12-05-2011, 03:56 AM
Originally posted by Eregost:
LightRay are you on ubisoft's payroll? You are always defending them even for things that are inexcuseable like this. How do you know the amount of fans that think the combat system should be revamped is small, have you done a survey? Please stop always stating your assumptions as fact.

This is inexcusable? Heck, they even do this in alot of fight scenes in movies where you aren't controlling the person yourself & doing their fighting.

He's partly right about the fan base's opinion, go to youtube AC Walkthrough vids and read all the comments.
I lost count in ACB vids of people wanting to throw their controllers thru their TV's lol
I saw plenty say that they pulled the disk out & won't deal w/ AC again.

Again this goes to the problem of people having different skill levels - I truly hope Ubi goes with a choice of skill levels for us so they can stop this constant complaining about combat & syncs.

EzioAssassin51
12-05-2011, 05:10 AM
Originally posted by go_clo:
While I sort of agree with the OP, especially in regards to the 1st game, I also found that the combat was a lot more difficult in Revelations. With the addition of the Janassaries and every guard having a gun, I found the combat could be quite difficult. And actually I found that when trying to do combo kills or counter attacks, I was often interrupted by the other guards hitting me half way through a move and saving the guard I was attacking. So I wouldn't say they completely ignored the request for harder fights.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif same happened to me!!

ACR guards are way harder and are always interrupting my combos. This'll be more to the end of the game, where there are Janissaries in every walking group!

Plus, ever considered maybe Ubisoft deliberately made AC combat easy to turn people off it, so they can concentrate on being stealthy http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

ProdiGurl
12-05-2011, 05:52 AM
Those riflemen in the booths when you're trying to take a tower are merciless. I got killed more than once (well not literally, I snuck some medicine right before I went down).
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

DavisP92
12-05-2011, 06:30 AM
Originally posted by kriegerdesgotte:
How many shots should it take to kill a guy!? lol. It would be impressive to take ONE shot from a crossbow and still be able to walk around like nothing happened. These games are meant to be realistic and I will agree I wish the guards would notice things I do more and they would react more realistically at times but I don't want these games to be unrealistic so people can have some kind of challenge that many people find unnecessary.

haha idk how many shot's it should take. I was just telling him they aren't that hard. It's nice tho that now every guard doesn't die from one shot... I don't think anyone wants the game to be unrealistic. What kind of challange are you refering to http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif (just woke up, so i'm not fully here yet)

luckyto
12-05-2011, 09:02 AM
To the OP, they have too changed it. I'll be in the middle of a counter attack and get sliced by another guard. Or have one guard shooting at me and another attacking me. Please don't take the AI any farther.

luckyto
12-05-2011, 09:05 AM
Originally posted by ProdiGurl:
Those riflemen in the booths when you're trying to take a tower are merciless. I got killed more than once (well not literally, I snuck some medicine right before I went down).
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Hate those guys.

PR030T
12-05-2011, 09:06 AM
Originally posted by kriegerdesgotte:
Oh you're right. It would be so much better if nothing was realistic and it was like Halo where not even the setting was realistic and we all know it's impossible to swim if you're carrying any kind of weight and in the 16th century everyone would look at you for having a crossbow on your back and a sword so we should just throw realism out the window. I'm so glad people like you are here to set the franchise straight. Also it's probably true that the MENTOR of the assassin order should struggle to fight a couple janissaries so you can have some little challenge. Good call. I'll send Gabe a message right now. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
All I'm saying is that the lack of realism when increasing the difficulty is a bad argument. Ezio is, when fighting, unrealisticly strong, thus by increasing the difficulty of the guards in a way you're actually making everything more realistic, as he isn't killing 40 (well) trained men, who can easily swarm him, but somehow don't. That is fine, but a little difficulty could/should be added. And yes, I do prefer realism over Halo-like crazyness. But it's just not believable that a(n extremely) good fighter like Ezio finishes off a couple of Janissaries without breaking a sweat. The man is 52, and the Janissaries are well-trained and have guns... and masks. Ever see someone unskilled wearing a mask and a gun? I thought so! XD