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Saburo_0
11-20-2004, 09:33 PM
Hi I need some help with a Japanese rank/title

In roman letters its: Raiden-Sentokitai-butaichou
or Sentoki-taibun-taichou

i think http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif
If you can help or know where i might get some help with this I'd be most greatful.
Thanks!!

Saburo_0
11-20-2004, 09:33 PM
Hi I need some help with a Japanese rank/title

In roman letters its: Raiden-Sentokitai-butaichou
or Sentoki-taibun-taichou

i think http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif
If you can help or know where i might get some help with this I'd be most greatful.
Thanks!!

jimmie_T
11-21-2004, 01:14 AM
I thought you were Japanese... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Well, I'm not a historian so I'll try to help you as much as I could..

First, "Raiden" is as you know, the name of the plane. "Sentouki" means fighter, and "Sentouki-tai" is a squadron/unit of fighters. Here, there is no definition of "how many fighters" for "tai" thing. It's simply a vague word for "fighter group/unit" Now, "butai" basically means "group" or "unit", and as in the case of "tai", there is no explicit definition about the size or number(how many). "tai" and "bu-tai" are similar, it's just one of Japanese lanaguage syntax rule where preceeding word decides what expression(name) follows.

Since "tai" means a group or unit, when it is with "cho" (a leader), that is, "tai-cho" is a leader of a group or unit. You cannot tell what rank a "taicho" is of, but it's likely one of "Acting Sub Lieutenant" to "Commander" in US equivalent.

Thus, "Raiden-Sentokitai-butaichou" basically does not directly suggest any explicit rank, however, one who's titled like that may at least be a flight leader of Raiden fighter unit (how many in the unit cannot be said).

And here's a ranking system table (there are differences among pre-war and mid-war and what I quote here is mid-war case)

¤"¥œ¸"µ
(Dainippon teikoku kaigun)
Imperial Japanese Navy
-------------------------------------------
¤?"*(Taisho)/Admiral
¸*?"*(Chusho)/Vice Admiral
??"*(Shosho)/Rear Admiral
¤(Taisa)/Captain
¸*(Chusa/Commander
?(Shosa)/Lieutenant Commander
¤?"(Taii)/Lieutenant
¸*?"(Chui)/Sub Lieutenant
??"(Shoi)/Acting Sub Lieutenant
€œ"(Kouhosei) /(means candidate)
...µ"'"(Heisoucho) /(leader of below ranks...)
¸€*"...µ"'(Ittou Heiso)/Petty Officer 1st Class
ºŒ*"...µ"'(Nitou Heiso)/Petty Officer 2st Class
¸"*"...µ"'(Santou Heisou)/Petty Officer 3st Class
?´...µ"(Suiheicho)/Leading Seaman
¸€*"?´...µ(Ittou Suihei)/Seaman 1st Class
ºŒ*"?´...µ(Nitou Suihei)/Seaman 2st Class
¸"*"?´...µ(Santou Suihei)/Seaman 3st Class

Below Suiheicho is for seaman, so anybody who operates an aircraft should be above Santou Heiso (I guess, not sure, but otherwise it doesn't make sense)
Oops, in addtion to that, someone who drive an aircraft may be:

"Œ...µ"'"ˆ""'""Hikouheisoucho (Hisocho for short)
¸**""Œ...µ"'ˆ¸*""'"Jotouhikouheiso (Johiso for short)
¸€*""Œ...µ"'ˆ¸€""'"Ittouhikouheiso(Ippiso for short)
ºŒ*""Œ...µ"'ˆºŒ""'"Nitouhikouheiso (Nihiso for short)
"Œ...µ"ˆ"""Hikoutaicho (Hicho for short)
¸**""Œ...µˆ¸*"...µ"Joutouhikouhei(Jouhiso for short)
¸€*""Œ...µˆ¸€"...µ"Ittouhikouhei(Ippihei for short)
ºŒ*""Œ...µˆºŒ"...µ"Nitouhikouhei(Nihihei for short)

So, Ittouhei is Private 1st Class and if he is an airman, "hikou" (means somehwat like "flying") is add in the middle, makes Ittouhikouhei, represents 1st Private who flies.


------------------------------------------
¤"¥œ¸"¸
(Dainippon Teikoku Rikugun)
Imperial Japanese Army

¤?"*(Taisho)/General
¸*?"*(Chusho)/Lieutenant General
??"*(Shosho)/Major General
¤(Taisa)/Colonel
¸*(Chusa)/Lieutenant Colonel
?(Shosa)/Major
¤?"(Taii)/Captain
¸*?"(Chui)/First Lieutenant
??"(Shoi)/Second Lieutenant
€œ"(Kouhosei) / candidate of some..
"'"(Soucho) /
"'(Gunso)/Sergeant
"(Gocho)/Corporal
...µ"(Heicho)/Lance Corporal
¸€*"...µ(Ittohei)/Private 1st Class
ºŒ*"...µ(Nitohei)/Private 2st Class
¸"*"...µ(Santohei)/Private 3st Class

BTW, the roman presentaion of Japanese words could vary. In the above case, any "to" in the middle of something could be written(or pronounce) as "tou" or "toh." In actual US english, "toh" is likely sound. Also "cho" might be written like "chou." An ear of English native will probably hear the sound like "choh" actually. (At any rate, they are sound representation of Japanese letters)

JFYI, I got above from:
http://www1.cts.ne.jp/~fleet7/Museum/Muse007.html
http://www.zeke32.com/kaigun/

Just in case you happen to have someone who can read Japanese nearby http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Hope this helps.

Saburo_0
11-22-2004, 07:56 AM
JimmieT,

Thanks very much!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gifI was confused on the size of the unit. Good to know it wasn't me, just typical Japanese vagueness. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

The links are much appreciated too!!!

Not Japanese myself, but lived their for a while '90-97 . The Missus is a regular Yamato-nadeshiko, but her WW2 Military Japanese is not so good. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif I'm pretty rusty myself so decided to try translating some stuff for practice. Which means I may have some moore questions for you before too long!

thanks again,

jimmie_T
11-22-2004, 11:27 AM
My pleasure. I'll help as long as I can http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Since I didn't contribute the Japanese voice pack, I do not deserve to criticize the voice pack, tho, if I'm allowed, well, I'd say, basically done well and thanks to who've done that(I see an effort of "direct translation" from English ones) but.. there's a bit funny expressions.. at least for *me* http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif ...and isn't the screeming a bit too much? if you have to hear that so many times... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/cry.gif

Yoshi_Toranaga
11-22-2004, 05:34 PM
Look at this link hope it be of some help to you !http://www.combinedfleet.com/kaigun.htm