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soldierforever
10-29-2005, 10:40 AM
I have read a few books, and all of them say the spitfire was a very fast plane, but in the game, it is outflown by most other planes, so was the spit fast or not? o_O

agarofa
10-29-2005, 11:40 AM
The spitfire was a superb turn-fighter. It wasn't the fastest plane in WW2 but it certainly wasn't the slowest either. The AI knows how to get the absolute max out of all the planes it flies so this may explain why some of them are apparently faster than the Spitfire when you fly it.

neural_dream
10-29-2005, 12:03 PM
Depends on what planes you fly against.
This one will tell you most of what you want to know
http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/26310365/m/8311086963

For a quick answer, the Spitfire is not very fast.

VW-IceFire
10-29-2005, 03:09 PM
Well...I think you need to do alot more reading.

The Spitfire was a very fast plane but you have to put things into context and understand which Spitfire served when, which was fastest, and how did they compare against their contemporaries?

For instance, during 1940 with the Spitfire Mark I against the Bf109E, the Spitfire was slightly slower than the 109E. It turned a bit better (sometimes) and had some of its own advantages (it was easy to handle) so it did very well.

In 1941, the Spitfire Mark V was the supreme fighter over the English Channel. Faster and more capable than the late 109E's and arguably equal or a bit better than the 109F's that were showing up.

By 1942 the situation had changed. The newer 109F's and the FW190A-3 were more capable than the Spitfire V in terms of speed and climb.

By the end of 1942 the first of the Spitfire Mark IX came around. They were faster than the contemporary FW190 at most altitudes. By 1943 it was the Spitfire LF.IX which was faster than the FW190 at all altitudes.

By the end of the war you had the Spitfire XIV which was faster and climbed better than virtually all of its opponents. However, it was a very close match against the Bf109K-4 and FW190D-9 and they were almost as fast or sometimes faster (depending on alt).

So you see there is quite a crossection of Spitfires with different models, engine powers, and the whole deal. There isn't just ONE Spitfire that remains static for 5 years of conflict.

So...which Spitfire are you flying and what is outflying you?

neural_dream
10-29-2005, 03:30 PM
I'm pretty sure that soldierforever meant speed at sea level speed and generally low altitudes, where most spitfire variants aren't very fast. Rookies do not fly over 3000m.

p1ngu666
10-29-2005, 04:25 PM
mk1/2 was actully faster than 109s at some heights.

including, much whineing ahoy- at low level http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

fastest spits where the PR ones, no guns, more lovingly cared after and a smoother canopy and retractable tailwheel

VW-IceFire
10-29-2005, 04:39 PM
Originally posted by neural_dream:
I'm pretty sure that soldierforever meant speed at sea level speed and generally low altitudes, where most spitfire variants aren't very fast. Rookies do not fly over 3000m.
Well thats just flying the Spitfire all wrong then http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Spits are happiest at about 6000m-8000m.

FoolTrottel
10-29-2005, 05:17 PM
Originally posted by p1ngu666:
(...)

fastest spits where the PR ones, no guns, more lovingly cared after and a smoother canopy and retractable tailwheel

And those were coloured bluetifully! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

Kuna15
10-29-2005, 05:54 PM
Originally posted by p1ngu666:
mk1/2 was actully faster than 109s at some heights.

including, much whineing ahoy- at low level http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

fastest spits where the PR ones, no guns, more lovingly cared after and a smoother canopy and retractable tailwheel

We know who is going to be a winner in Oleg Maddox BoB (the Battle itself, not expansions etc.). Hurris+Spits vs. Bf-109s and... ummm... Falco's http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif?

Anyway when BoB comes out, I'm joining RAF be sure http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif.

HellToupee
10-30-2005, 03:43 AM
Spitfire was fast, the spit V in game was faster than the F cept on the deck LF V being faster. The mk9 was generally faster than its contemporary the G6, its only the late war mw50 birds that are faster, which were pretty much XIV contemporaries. But hinted at 25boost spitty which will make MK9 low level speed close to that of late 109s and 190s.

JG52Karaya-X
10-30-2005, 06:17 AM
Originally posted by p1ngu666:
mk1/2 was actully faster than 109s at some heights.

including, much whineing ahoy- at low level http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

I don't know about sea level speed but in my book ("Die großen Luftschlachten des zweiten Weltkriegs") which dedicates a long chapter on a comparative discussion of the Spit and Bf109 it says 556km/h for the Spit Mk.I at 15k feet and 560km/h for the Emil at 14.765 feet...which is pretty much equal
But beware as even before the BoB started production of the DB601N with increased power output had begun. The corresponding Emil, the Bf109E4/N (and later the Bf109E7) had roughly 1270hp at their disposal giving them an extra 20-25km/h and increased climb output

That's enough to keep the Emil competitive until the Friedrich charges into the fray

p1ngu666
10-30-2005, 09:22 AM
yeah, there was various spitfire fitments aswell

spitvb ingame is completely outclassed by 109f ingame http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

soldierforever
10-30-2005, 09:31 AM
maybe it's just my bad piloting http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

ImpStarDuece
10-30-2005, 03:15 PM
Originally posted by JG52Karaya-X:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by p1ngu666:
mk1/2 was actully faster than 109s at some heights.

including, much whineing ahoy- at low level http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

I don't know about sea level speed but in my book ("Die großen Luftschlachten des zweiten Weltkriegs") which dedicates a long chapter on a comparative discussion of the Spit and Bf109 it says 556km/h for the Spit Mk.I at 15k feet and 560km/h for the Emil at 14.765 feet...which is pretty much equal
But beware as even before the BoB started production of the DB601N with increased power output had begun. The corresponding Emil, the Bf109E4/N (and later the Bf109E7) had roughly 1270hp at their disposal giving them an extra 20-25km/h and increased climb output

That's enough to keep the Emil competitive until the Friedrich charges into the fray </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

556 kph is quite slow for a Spitfire Mk I. That is only 345 mph.

British service testing gives 366 mph (590 kph) as the top speed for a Mk I with a metal, 2 bladed fixed pitch airscrew.

Tests on a BoB representative Spitfire (3 bladed constant speed propellor, bulletproof winscreen, new exhaust fittings) give 355 mph (572 kph) at 18,900 feet (5790 m).

Also remeber that by the time of the Battle of Britain the vast majority of squadrons had switched to +12 1/2lbs boost and Merlin III engines. These produced an additional 280 hp at low level. The normally quoted rated hp figure of 1030 hp is for 6 1/2 lbs boost. Pinggu is right, the Merlin could pull 1,310 hp at low level.

The Spitfire Mk II, which began seeing service in September had a Merlin which was rated to 9lbs boost/ +12 1/2 boost emergency rating on 100 octane. It was generally 4-8 mph faster than the Mk I at low level, but 5-10 mph slower at high altitude. Best speed was 354 mph at 17500 feet.

p1ngu666
10-30-2005, 07:02 PM
there was none engine equipment things changed too, like friend or foe stuff

Vipez-
10-31-2005, 03:32 AM
Originally posted by VW-IceFire:

By the end of 1942 the first of the Spitfire Mark IX came around. They were faster than the contemporary FW190 at most altitudes. By 1943 it was the Spitfire LF.IX which was faster than the FW190 at all altitudes.


Spitfire 9 beeing faster than A-5/A-6 at all altitudes? Hmm I would imagine A-4/A-5/ A-6 running at 1.42ata boost esspecially with outer wing cannons removed to save weight would hold the perfomance crown below 4000 meters, above that Spit 9 was probably better..And A-5/A-6 with weight cutbacks running at Ata 1.58 would be superb perfomers over Spit9LFs at low alts.. Though the speed difference was rather small compared to Clipped Wing Spit9LFs..

Don't know how the Typhoon holds out, though.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

JG52Karaya-X
10-31-2005, 06:49 AM
Originally posted by ImpStarDuece:
British service testing gives 366 mph (590 kph) as the top speed for a Mk I with a metal, 2 bladed fixed pitch airscrew.

That would make the Mk.I faster or as fast as the Mk.Vb now wouldn't it... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

MEGILE
10-31-2005, 06:57 AM
Originally posted by JG52Karaya-X:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ImpStarDuece:
British service testing gives 366 mph (590 kph) as the top speed for a Mk I with a metal, 2 bladed fixed pitch airscrew.

That would make the Mk.I faster or as fast as the Mk.Vb now wouldn't it... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

371 mph for the Spitfire Vb

ImpStarDuece
10-31-2005, 03:53 PM
Originally posted by Megile:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG52Karaya-X:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ImpStarDuece:
British service testing gives 366 mph (590 kph) as the top speed for a Mk I with a metal, 2 bladed fixed pitch airscrew.

That would make the Mk.I faster or as fast as the Mk.Vb now wouldn't it... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

371 mph for the Spitfire Vb </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

British service testing gives

375-6 mph for Spitfire VA (8 machine guns)
371-374 mph for Spitfire Vb (2 20mm 4 .303)
374 mph for Spitfire Vc (4 20mm, without Volkes tropical filter)
375 mph for Spitfire Vc (2 20mm, 4. 303)

Improvements to the Vb over its lifetime also improved speeds. Improved bearings and carburettors added about 1 mph, replacing the fish tail type exhaust stack with multi-ejector types gave about 6-7 mph, improved mirror fairings gave 1.5 mph, improved radio aerial fairings added about .5 mph


In early 1943 the RAE took a Spitfire Vb and clocked it at 359 mph at critical alt (or about 16 mph under spec). Repainting, repairing minor damage and cleaning the aircraft brought it back up to specification. Further modifications such as new exhaust stacks, cutting the cartridge ejector shoots flush, polishing the wing leading edge ect gave it a maximum speed of 387 mph.

So with a few minor adjustments there was a 28 mph improvement in speed of a service airframe. It just goes to show how important a good ground crew could be to a planes performance and a pilots sucess. You could have a plane that performed ABOVE the official documentation, or one that performed worse than the official documentation.