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pbfreek
06-08-2006, 11:41 PM
i am confused...are you supposed to be playing the role of a hashishin or templar in this game? i have been reading alot about the crusades recently and i dont see anything about the hashishins killing both muslims and christians like the templars did to protect the holy land...can someone explain this to me?

Lhorkan
06-08-2006, 11:47 PM
You play as Alta├┬»r, one of the hashashin. You kill both muslim and templar leaders to prevent the third crusade (not historical I guess, but hey, it's a game http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif ). At least, that's what we know about it now. There seems to be some kind of conspiracy that we will uncover along the way.

pbfreek
06-08-2006, 11:49 PM
templars were killing both sides as well to prevent another crusade tho...

mrsmooth_840
06-09-2006, 12:19 AM
Though as Producer Jade Raymond(I think that's her name) clearly stated in all her interviews, you play the role of an assassin, one of the first assassins who was a member of a secret underground alliance of warriors called the hashashin/hashishin. I know it's early days and the game could be changed, but wouldn't that imply that in the game your working for the assassins?

Lhorkan
06-09-2006, 03:59 AM
Originally posted by pbfreek:
templars were killing both sides as well to prevent another crusade tho...

...what? They wouldn't go all the way to Jerusalem to kill eachother off, no? Where'd you get that information?

mrsmooth_840
06-09-2006, 08:31 AM
Well, there isn't just a single party responsible for the third crusade, there's always a fuse leading up to a war, and there will always be a trigger that makes the bang, world war one for example, germany was getting ahead of it's game industrialy, and the britts didn't like that, they were also in competition with one another to try and make the bigggest naval fleet. then Austro-hungarian duke franz ferdinand got assassinated by this serbian student. austro-hungari acused rusia for helping them pull it off and declared on rusia, then germany declared war on france for being envolved and us britts joined in to help them and BAAAANG, world war one. so you see, there is never just one side involved, who evers side your on, there will always be heros and villains among you, no matter who ther'e alligance is to

Lhorkan
06-09-2006, 10:54 AM
Originally posted by mrsmooth_840:
Well, there isn't just a single party responsible for the third crusade, there's always a fuse leading up to a war, and there will always be a trigger that makes the bang, world war one for example, germany was getting ahead of it's game industrialy, and the britts didn't like that, they were also in competition with one another to try and make the bigggest naval fleet. then Austro-hungarian duke franz ferdinand got assassinated by this serbian student. austro-hungari acused rusia for helping them pull it off and declared on rusia, then germany declared war on france for being envolved and us britts joined in to help them and BAAAANG, world war one. so you see, there is never just one side involved, who evers side your on, there will always be heros and villains among you, no matter who ther'e alligance is to

Crusades were the will of the pope. It's that simple. He wanted to enrich the vatican or something, I guess.

pbfreek
06-10-2006, 01:31 PM
the templars were the best of the best knights and considered themselves warriors of God and wre also considered the first conception of a "special forces" group of soldiers...but knights

they had no desire for there to be another crusade and were trying to protect the holy land from being destroyed by killing the christian and muslim leaders

i get my information from internet and text books and the history channel because the crusades have always facinated me

mrsmooth_840
06-11-2006, 12:43 AM
Oh yes, we all no about what the freakin' pope wanted with out a doubt, but once things are set in motion, There will be people on your side of the fence wanting to join the opposition to get a better slice of what is gained at the end of it all and so on. and besides that, It's just a game isn't it? you can't expect them to base the game completley on fact can you? otherwise it wouldn't give that freedom that AC has , you'd just kill crusaders. sure it's fun, for a while, but you need a bit of variation to the game play. I too got my info from internet, www.wikipedia.org (http://www.wikipedia.org) search for "hashashin"

pbfreek
06-11-2006, 11:46 PM
wow...i think your getting a little to butt hurt over this....

and i never said that the game was based entirely on fact...i wanted to know who you played hashishin or templar....and i explained why i asked the question

you asked where i got my info...so i told you

jesterofPoP
06-12-2006, 12:29 AM
Originally posted by mrsmooth_840:
Well, there isn't just a single party responsible for the third crusade, there's always a fuse leading up to a war, and there will always be a trigger that makes the bang, world war one for example, germany was getting ahead of it's game industrialy, and the britts didn't like that, they were also in competition with one another to try and make the bigggest naval fleet. then Austro-hungarian duke franz ferdinand got assassinated by this serbian student. austro-hungari acused rusia for helping them pull it off and declared on rusia, then germany declared war on france for being envolved and us britts joined in to help them and BAAAANG, world war one. so you see, there is never just one side involved, who evers side your on, there will always be heros and villains among you, no matter who ther'e alligance is to
well actually it was more of the fact that GER gave AH a blank check(which means that they would back them no matter what) then the serbs found out and the rest u kinda got right but not rlly. Its ok tho........ A history major would help me some time.

jesterofPoP
06-12-2006, 12:34 AM
srry about the double post but, the pope didnt declare the holy war. well kinda, he was forced by the council of something then he went to a messenger who spread the word to villages saying that they were to cleanse the holy land. Nextly, most templars were former nights who had debts to be repayed or were hired to fight. shouldnt this topic be done now b/c the kids quesiton waz answered.

icestorm06
06-23-2006, 03:52 AM
Actually the hashashins did assasinate christians as well as muslims during the crusades and the even attempted to assasinate saladin himself. As far as what started the crusades there are many factors that led to the wars. The events started way before the pope declared it. Before Muslims entered Jerusalem it was occupied by the Jews and the Christians. The Muslims invaded in the 600's capturing Jerasulam. The first major spark of the crusades was when AL-Hakim bi-Amr Allah sacked Jerusalem and destroyed the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in 1009. He was known for harassing and slaughtering christian pilgrims. Another major factor was major defeat of the Byzantine Empire by the Selijuk Turks. This lead to the Council of Clement in which all christians were called to join the war agaisnt the turks. This lead to the first crusades and the recapturing of Jerusalem. Ironically the crusaders pretty much slaughtered a lot of muslims, jews, and armenian christians. As far as the knights templar, they were formed to as an order for the protection of the christian pilgrims. They where very skilled fighters and very good in the trade of banking. They were eventually disbanded, blamed for heresy, and killed all because the King of France was in debt and owed them. So there was a little history lesson. It is my opinion that although most thought the crusades as holy wars, they were really wars that behind the scenes dealt with old grudges, greed, and power by both sides. And both sides used people into making them believe that they were defending there religion.

savage1965
06-23-2006, 06:42 AM
It is my opinion that although most thought the crusades as holy wars, they were really wars that behind the scenes dealt with old grudges, greed, and power by both sides. And both sides used people into making them believe that they were defending there religion.

No different to what is going on today really. How little humanity has moved on in a 1000 years.

Mattius83
06-30-2006, 01:09 PM
I'm not positive about this, but I heard that the crusades were started when pilgrims were denied entry to the Holy Land, and one pilgrim, who later became a saint, went to the Pope, and Kings and Queens of Europe, claiming that the Muslims were mistreating pilgrims. Along with that I have heard that he also fabricated many lies about the Muslims treatment of Pilgrims.

As for the game, I believe that you have the choice of fighting for the Crusaders, or the Muslims, and that you are not a true Hassasin, but a member of another, similar sect, dedicated to stopping the war. I think it would have a similar setup to Thief: Deadly Shadows, in which you can do missions and favors for certain factions and make them your friend, while the outcomes of those missions could make the other faction your enemy. I believe the trick is to balance out the missions so you stay allied, or at least neutral, with both sides.

NewtypeSC
06-30-2006, 07:01 PM
The Assassins were formed right after the 2nd Crusade was announced by the Pope. Saladin was trying to rise to power after Nur Al Din's mysterious death. His son was then appointed ruler at the age of 19. This made Saladin furious, and he set out to try and overthrow Nur Al Din's son. This is when the son of Nur Al Din got the Hashishin's (I think it actually is a term for marijuana; and also the first assassins) to kill Saladin, but failed twice.

So I think that might answer some of your questions, because seeing as Saladin was a Muslium, Yes, they were killing both sides.

pbfreek: The templars didn't kill people on their own side. Alot of the templars were killed by Saladins army before the 3rd crusade even happened.

terminalShock09
06-30-2006, 11:59 PM
Yeah, hashish is technically a better quality marijuana. The assassins didn't actually fail the second time, though. They left a poisoned cake and a threatening note next to Saladin, which seemed to work since he decided to stop attacking their bases afterwards.

zero24473
07-03-2006, 09:22 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif
Can anyone say OWNED!? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/crackwhip.gif

FableB
07-08-2006, 05:08 PM
Poisened cake? there wasnt any cakes at that time now was there? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

terminalShock09
07-08-2006, 10:29 PM
Haha, well no birthday cakes with frosting, but there were sweetened breads back then called cakes.

FableB
07-09-2006, 03:38 AM
Thought so....I cant imagine Saladin with a cake in his hand and remains of it around his mouth...http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Woozles
04-16-2007, 08:26 PM
Well its generally accepted that the word 'Assasin' was derived from the word 'Hashishin'. Another theory is that the word was derived from 'Al-Hassan', the founder and leader of the Hashishin. Either way, I'm quite certain that the main character of this game (his name escapes me at the moment) is Hashishin. The Hashishin are believed to have killed both Christians and Muslims to furthur their cause. Additionally, they were known to deliberatly make thier executions in public places, so as to furthur their reputation.

rubent1981
04-17-2007, 07:49 AM
Saladin thought he was untouchable after the assassins failed to kill him. To show him that they could kill him any time, a group of assassins sneaked in his tent and put an apple with a knife in it next to his bed.

assassin1994
04-17-2007, 11:49 AM
first it was a cake now its an apple, the assassins might aswell leave the saladin a whole feast-lol

Karl_93
04-17-2007, 01:07 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.giflol wuts it gonna be next? lol i think ill provide some more info.
after offering the cake and sticking the knife in the apple, the assassins promply walked out of the tent and called out free drinks on them for the night!!! the camp cried out in glee and fell into childlike disires, gulping down the beer. they all got drunk and some clumsy man set fire to Saladins tent killing him in a painfully painfull way. {This was of course after Saladin had found the apple and eaten it thinking that the gods had sent it down from heaven} http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif yup so thats how it happened! im pretty sure ive heard this story somewhere.... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Boromir323
04-17-2007, 01:08 PM
lol

SMOOTHRJ1
04-17-2007, 08:51 PM
I dont feel like typing and correcting you guys so im just gonna say this.... Where is noobfun when u need him

noobfun
04-18-2007, 05:13 AM
you called? ^_^


Originally posted by terminalShock09:
Yeah, hashish is technically a better quality marijuana. The assassins didn't actually fail the second time, though. They left a poisoned cake and a threatening note next to Saladin, which seemed to work since he decided to stop attacking their bases afterwards.

that story refers to the third attempt, well not really an attempt

saladin survived 2 attacks that tried to infiltrate his encampments, the second time they made it in to saladins tent and killed severeal of his general (good job he was having a meeting really)

the third attempt, while saladin was laying siege to kapf (one of the syrian storngholds) sinan(the head of the syrian nizari) went for a wonder in to saladins tent while he slept, rearranged the furniture a bit left him a poisoned cake(maybe a piece of bread or somink) and a note saying 'we are in your power' (theres a few variations of this story as you can see, the original story it was sinan himself who went)

the other story is

Sinan sent a messenger to Saladin. The man was searched and found to be unarmed. He was therefore brought to Saladin, who told him to deliver his message, but he replied that Sinan had ordered him to do so only in private. Saladin therefore told everyone to leave except for two officers, but still the man would not give his message. Sinan refused to dismiss his two remaining companions, saying that he regarded them as his own sons. The messenger then turned to the two men and asked them whether they would kill Saladin if ordered to do so in the name of Sinan. "Give us your orders," they said, and drew their swords. Saladin was speechless; and the messenger left, taking with him the two officers. After this, Saladin decided to make peace with Sinan.


which everversion of the story happened, saladin broke camp, made an alliance with the nizari and left the nizari alone and carried on persecuting all the other heretical muslim sects


Templars
the templars were formed to protect pilgrims, its not so much they were good at banking but every knight took a vow of poverty and gave thier land and valuables to the order (knights meaning they were titled and usually held land) the order quickly gained large chunks of europe and a hefty bank balance.

they didnt try and stop the war, they were working for god(allegedly lol) to protect pilgrims and the holy land, although they were well known for raiding muslim trade caravans, 1 such raid was the final straw that saladin used to unite the muslim factions and regain the holy land resulting in the capture of jerusalem shortley before the third crusade

also when sinan sent an emissary to the king of jerusalem to speak of the syrian nizari (see they aint hashassins silly) converting to christianity it was a group of templars that ambushed and killed the nizari ambassador on his return journey (strangley they didnt convert after that incident ......)

p.s. they arnt hashassin they didnt refer to them selves as such, muslim scholars didnt refer to them as such either

now say after me ..... NIZARI = the people, FIDA = a term used for the assassins of the NIZARI

p.p.s i loved the free drinks and partying story, but they were muslims and couldnt drink ... well except the nizari its hinted they drunk wine openly (they just kinda turned thier backs on most aspects of sharia law for a couple of hundred years)

assassin1994
04-18-2007, 07:32 AM
wow, http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif smoothrj1, i dont blame ya for not bein bothered 2 write that much writin,but i guess noobfun really liks it lol http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/typing.gif

noobfun
04-18-2007, 09:03 AM
Originally posted by Woozles:
Well its generally accepted that the word 'Assasin' was derived from the word 'Hashishin'. Another theory is that the word was derived from 'Al-Hassan', the founder and leader of the Hashishin.

no it isnt .. the term hashassin means eater of hash.. the lowest rung of muslim society, kinda like calling someone scum or trailer trash ... the term was around long before the nizari and was still in use during the 1950's in egypt, used to mean noisey or disruptive people. if it was around before the nizari it was around before HASAN-I-SABBAH (the guy responsible for founding the nizari states) so it doesnt mean men of hasan either


Originally posted by Woozles:
The Hashishin are believed to have killed both Christians and Muslims to furthur their cause. Additionally, they were known to deliberatly make thier executions in public places, so as to furthur their reputation.

believed? they did kill on both sides of the fence

it wasnt so much to further thier cause more to keep them in fear of attacking, with only a small standing army the nizari couldnt openly defend them selves in pitched battles, so used the fear of assassination or the actual assassaniation to prevent people raising armys against them

SMOOTHRJ1
04-18-2007, 03:58 PM
assassin1994- trust if i would correct theses guys you would be here for 4hrs readin my post. i like noobfun bcuz he knows how to explain things very well and i havent seen him tell us one incorrect fact. But if you guys need anything im here i feel better now

Spblob
04-18-2007, 04:46 PM
Originally posted by SMOOTHRJ1:
assassin1994- trust if i would correct theses guys you would be here for 4hrs readin my post. i like noobfun bcuz he knows how to explain things very well and i havent seen him tell us one incorrect fact. But if you guys need anything im here i feel better now Yes I do love his information sharing. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif

noobfun
04-19-2007, 01:09 AM
Originally posted by Spblob:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SMOOTHRJ1:
assassin1994- trust if i would correct theses guys you would be here for 4hrs readin my post. i like noobfun bcuz he knows how to explain things very well and i havent seen him tell us one incorrect fact. But if you guys need anything im here i feel better now Yes I do love his information sharing. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

*happy happy joy joy playing in back ground*{and if ya dont know this song you should go watch ren and stimpy sillys}

YAY im a hero ^_^

lol

Karl_93
04-19-2007, 12:18 PM
awww i like my story better lol

assassin1994
04-20-2007, 03:09 PM
times change, lol http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif only kiddin Karl http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

noobfun
04-21-2007, 04:28 AM
Originally posted by Karl_93:
awww i like my story better lol

lol youve been watching the godfather to much

its like mafia doing thier own lol

give em a good meal, plenty to drink give em a ride home from the restant because they are drunk, then waste them

mastoner20
01-17-2008, 10:29 PM
Originally posted by pbfreek:
i am confused...are you supposed to be playing the role of a hashishin or templar in this game? i have been reading alot about the crusades recently and i dont see anything about the hashishins killing both muslims and christians like the templars did to protect the holy land...can someone explain this to me?

Well, throughout history, several groups have been assassinating both their enemies, and their own leaders. In fact, most notably to me, was the fact that in WWII, several of Hitler's men, attempted multiple assassinations of the man for his craziness. The most notable, is the bomb that his major general left in Hitler's brief case for a large meeting with him and his chief commanders. The only reason (according to most historians) for the bomb failing, is he set the brief case UNDER a maple carved table, and walked out of the room when it exploded.

So killing people of both sides is nothing new, nor old. It has all ways happened throughout history, and probably all ways will.

moqqy
01-18-2008, 06:56 AM
Originally posted by mastoner20:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by pbfreek:
i am confused...are you supposed to be playing the role of a hashishin or templar in this game? i have been reading alot about the crusades recently and i dont see anything about the hashishins killing both muslims and christians like the templars did to protect the holy land...can someone explain this to me?

Well, throughout history, several groups have been assassinating both their enemies, and their own leaders. In fact, most notably to me, was the fact that in WWII, several of Hitler's men, attempted multiple assassinations of the man for his craziness. The most notable, is the bomb that his major general left in Hitler's brief case for a large meeting with him and his chief commanders. The only reason (according to most historians) for the bomb failing, is he set the brief case UNDER a maple carved table, and walked out of the room when it exploded.

So killing people of both sides is nothing new, nor old. It has all ways happened throughout history, and probably all ways will. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Why exactly did you do that? WHY? This thread is almost a year old, and you just raised it from dead. Check the dates..