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View Full Version : Real aces dont use trim



Hawgdog
07-11-2003, 05:00 AM
Never did, never had to.

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Hawgdog
07-11-2003, 05:00 AM
Never did, never had to.

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XyZspineZyX
07-11-2003, 05:06 AM
Start fling He 111's or any bomber and you'll change you mind quickly. It really cuts your workload. As far as fighter ac, I don't see how anyone can do w/o rudder trim if it's available. Having spent some time in a 109 recently I really miss my rudder trim.

As far as using trim to cheat, well if that's the best cheat that someone can come up w/ then that's just a testament to the unhackability of this game.




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Hawgdog
07-11-2003, 05:07 AM
fennec what the?!!
I keep clicking on the thumbnail but Windows Media Player wont start, please fix the link.

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XyZspineZyX
07-11-2003, 05:09 AM
I use it.... I really do.... But (there's allways a "but") only to keep the plane in level flight at desired speeds, never in combat.

Flying in real life without proper trimming can be done, but you'll end up with some big muscles /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

We once had a ferrypilot flying for five hours without trim, he had to strap his belt around the yoke in an attempt to stay level.

XyZspineZyX
07-11-2003, 05:11 AM
So Chuck Yeager and his wingmate weren't real aces????

Pull the other one, it's got bells on it.


Neal

Hawgdog
07-11-2003, 05:12 AM
shhhh, be vawee vawee vawee quiet, we're trollin' for RBJ's

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XyZspineZyX
07-11-2003, 05:26 AM
Hawgdog wrote:
- shhhh, be vawee vawee vawee quiet, we're trollin'
- for RBJ's

LOL, are you sure the bait is strong enough? They may be hibernating /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
07-11-2003, 05:27 AM
WWMaxGunz wrote:
- So Chuck Yeager and his wingmate weren't real
- aces????
-
- Pull the other one, it's got bells on it.
-
-
- Neal
-
-
-
-

Yea I was just going to say that Clarence "Bud" Anderson said he was always trimming his plane constantly - it was second nature after a while. Seemed pretty important in a P-39 and a P-51 B and D anyway. Somewhere I read the same from Colonel Kit Carson as well.

XyZspineZyX
07-11-2003, 12:11 PM
Real aces aren't called RBJ.

He's just a fraudster and a second-rate con artist.

And a third-rate troll, as well.

There, that should do the trick.

Let's have lots of smilies now.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

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XyZspineZyX
07-11-2003, 05:48 PM
Using trim to level out in flight is one thing, but the trim junkies whom use it to make bat turns are just cheating themselves. Every arcade fan boy (Ray) that relies on exploits to win will only make him/her as good as their exploits. Put the exploit down and learn to REALLY fly that plane.

If IL-2 FB came with an 'automatically win' button, would you push it?
I feel sorry for those whom answer yes.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

What's even funnier is the so-called ace that brags about how easy it is to win.
I bet they'd still brag when using the 'auto win'.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif



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XyZspineZyX
07-11-2003, 10:30 PM
The good thing is that hopefully Olegs next sim will not model Trim in the same way /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

That way these Trim Exploiters will not be able to gain a "gaming edge" using such an exploit - they will have learned nothing about ACM /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

JG5_UnKle

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XyZspineZyX
07-11-2003, 11:13 PM
Does the blackout effect take into account trim? In other words, if I was to trim my plane all the wan back, so that I am looping like a freak, do those G's not count toward bringing me into blackout? I have never tried this... but as long as blackout is still the same, I don't see why it matters if someone trims up to the 1000000nth degree to turn... not that I do it lol. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

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XyZspineZyX
07-11-2003, 11:33 PM
O.K... Lets see those books you are reading. Of Course the real Aces used trim, read any personal account or talk to a vet, and you'll see. But... I know were you are coming from in the games. It is not absolutely vital, if you don't like to shoot them down! The Aileron trim is the most important. Have a furball! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

For we give thanks to the Father
who has qualified us to share in
the inheritance of the Saints In Light.

XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 12:12 AM
Well, I just got back from Seattle on the 4th of July talking to 14+ P-51 drivers who also flew:

P38
P39
P40
P47



One of them was the last surviving highest-scoring ACE in the Sunsetters.

None of the 14 total that I personally spoke to EVER used trim in combat.

It was if I asked them a strange question.

If not a blatant "NO" the common answer was:

"In a dogfight, there is simply no time to mess with trim."

I'm not saying the use of trim in the sim is UNHELPFUL or not without VALUE, I'm just reporting what I know, folks.

Also about the P-51:

It can only pull about 6.5 Gs or the airframe will tear itself apart.

The P47 could withstand 12 Gs (even though the pilot could not).

When asked about the P-51 being the "Best all Around Fighter" in World War II...

NONE of the pilots I spoke to gave any value to that statement. They said that was PURE PRESS. And it all depended upon what you're using to measure "success."

High Altitude?
Kills?
Mission Succeses?
Successful Escorts?

Best all around fighter is too subjective.

ALL of them said that.

MOST of them preferred the P47. Why?

"It was a hard sumb√¬Ětch to bring down."


I will be posting the audio of this 45-50 minute panel discussion soon. Be on the lookout.

XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 02:12 AM
Maybe that Aces doesn't trim his hair is what he truly refer to.

When you are rotten with that hair style, kids would call you punk. When you are skilled with that hair style, kids would call you stylish. LOL

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XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 02:15 AM
I use trim because it makes the plane perform better. (It's been that way in Combat Sims for 6 years)

Aces are always on the lookout for performance enhancing functions.

People who don't use trim are just arcade. (because arcade flight games don't have trim either) Therefore, using trim to turn harder is the mark of a true simmer.

If you are one who just taps it a few times and leaves it alone then I feel sorry for you. You are missing out on one of the things that makes this game a classic.

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XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 02:22 AM
i tap tap tap it all that i can

word?

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XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 02:31 AM
"Those who tap will always loose to those who slide."

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"The Force is strong with this one." -What an ace said of RayBanJockey during a fight when he was still a newbie.
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XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 03:21 AM
Hawgdog wrote:
- shhhh, be vawee vawee vawee quiet, we're trollin'
- for RBJ's


Time to close the trap!! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 05:02 AM
Real aces use wyhat ever tools are at their disposal to come home alive and with as few dings and as many kills as possible....

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XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 05:25 AM
I do hate to be a "wet blanket", but you normally trim for level flight. Once "all hell breaks loose" there just is NOT enough time to worry about the "quaintness" of trim. All bets are off and you HAVE to "run what you brung". I know that may not be the case for many who fly on line, but it IS the case for any poor duffer who has to face real cannon fire.
With respect,
peine27

A sedentary Offliner!

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XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 06:00 AM
Here is the catch, now if you can prove what you say with facts we might consider believing you, I think you have a high degree of dyslexia...you should have said:


- People who abuse of trim are just arcade. (because
- flight simulations use trim only for flight
- configurations that require of stability, like straffing
- runs or precission bombing)
- Therefore, using trim to turn harder is the mark of
- a true arcader.
-


RayBanJockey wrote:

- People who don't use trim are just arcade. (because
- arcade flight games don't have trim either)
- Therefore, using trim to turn harder is the mark of
- a true simmer.
-
- If you are one who just taps it a few times and
- leaves it alone then I feel sorry for you. You are
- missing out on one of the things that makes this
- game a classic.


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XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 11:35 AM
Yeah loco S! Give that RayBanJockey what he deserves. I've never flown online and I get shot down all the time when I play single player. But I'd beat RayBan with my eyes folded if he didn't use trim.

Riiiiight, buuuuuddie?



The G forces Buzz the G forces!

XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 11:49 AM
i agree with bearcat.

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XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 10:39 PM
I understand what you're saying, RBJ.

You use the trim in the game; even though it wasn't used in real life.

I think we get it.

Apparently, you're just not busy enough.

XyZspineZyX
07-12-2003, 10:47 PM
I'm confused. Are you a "simmer" or a "gamer". You've contradicted some of your earlier posts. Oh, wait. I forgot. You do that on purpose. Never mind


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Kunsan AB, Korea

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XyZspineZyX
07-13-2003, 01:39 PM
LOLOLOL Hawg