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View Full Version : Oleg.....mp_dotrange make 3.01 Dots good for all



LEXX_Luthor
11-24-2004, 05:03 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif We Solved the 3.01 Dot Problem for all with mp_dotrange.

Here is test setup for "rcu" file and dot lineup test mission. Ask if you need help learning to use the Chat Mode and "alias" shortcuts. This works for offline play too, and it works wonders for the sim.

Yes, if you don't change Patch 3.01 Default DOT settings with your "rcu" file, the new dots that come with Patch--the dots high against the sky are too big at very long ranges and don't grow small fast enough with range. Different dot settings can help for the monitor resolutions.

In this post is how to get both large "new" dot for medium range and small "old" dots for long range--and continous change in between. (~thanks~ Oleg) http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif For any "real life" pilots here, take a look and see how this matches what you see watching distant aircraft from the ground.

At bottom of this post is FMB mission file created to test dots, Wake Island Map. I call it "dot.mis" ... Player starts on Akagi carrier, sailing East, in Zero cockpit on deck. Ten AI Zeroes are spaced to the North at 200m altitude and at 1km intervals (placed by map grid). As soon as you are in the cockpit, open canopy and quickly PAUSE the game and look to your left (north) and see paused DOTS lined up to experiment with.

Enter and exit Chat Mode to experiment with changing Zoom In view and look around. When in Chat Mode, press the any one of the commands 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,0 and press ENTER to see dot effects change. As the Chat screen is sometimes full of long white text covering the screen, you may find it useful to repeat typing in, say, the command 1 and ENTER until the text scrolls off the screen top--then you have clear view of the aircraft lineup. The command numbers relate to distance in kilometers (see "rcu" DOT numbers below). One extra command at bottom of test "rcu" file is r. Press r to see both dots and ranges written next to each dot out to 10km. Note that some range numbers are missing because if the numbers overlap and become tangled on screen, some are not displayed for clarity. This is amazing attention to programming detail from Oleg. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

For my own use, and thinking Zero as *small* aircraft, I find myself liking DOT set to 8km range, which gives classic tiny light grey old FB dots at about 6-7 kilometers and nothing visible at 8km but large "new" dots at 3km range--with continous change smaller as distance increases (*thanks* again Oleg). See what you think matches your experience watching aircraft.

Here is test file for "rcu" , including all my "rcu" file that sets up "alias." If confused, ask "rcu Tully" for help. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

==============================================

@set fast off
@set echo on
@set alias on
@set history 20

@alias h history
@alias s show

@alias f fps SHOW START
@alias nf fps SHOW STOP

@alias 1 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 1 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 2 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 2 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 3 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 3 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 4 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 4 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 5 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 5 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 6 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 6 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 7 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 7 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 8 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 8 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 9 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 9 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 0 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 10 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01

@alias r mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 10 RANGE 12 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01

==============================================
----------------------------------------------

Dot test mission "dot.mis"
Copy and Paste into new text document, save as "dot.mis" and place in Mission folder, then fire up FMB.



[MAIN]
MAP Wake/load.ini
TIME 12.0
CloudType 0
CloudHeight 1500.0
player g0100
army 2
playerNum 0
[Wing]
g0100
g0101
g0102
g0103
g0110
g0111
g0112
g0113
g0120
g0121
g0122
[g0100]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0100_Way]
TAKEOFF -200335.01 -300.60 0 0 0_Chief 0 &0
NORMFLY -172806.87 -49796.13 500.00 300.00 &0
[g0101]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0101_Way]
NORMFLY -199996.96 995.61 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -185660.14 985.57 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0102]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0102_Way]
NORMFLY -200002.16 1998.42 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -185984.25 1998.42 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0103]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0103_Way]
NORMFLY -199992.00 3001.24 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -185984.25 3051.79 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0110]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0110_Way]
NORMFLY -200002.16 3993.78 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -185984.25 3983.62 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0111]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0111_Way]
NORMFLY -200002.16 4996.47 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -186024.77 4996.47 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0112]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0112_Way]
NORMFLY -199997.08 6004.37 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -186024.77 6009.33 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0113]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0113_Way]
NORMFLY -199992.00 7007.06 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -186024.77 7062.70 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0120]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0120_Way]
NORMFLY -199997.08 8004.80 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -186024.77 8035.04 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0121]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0121_Way]
NORMFLY -199996.96 9002.42 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -186024.77 9047.89 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0122]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0122_Way]
NORMFLY -199997.20 10000.03 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -185943.74 10020.23 200.00 150.00 &0
[Chiefs]
0_Chief Ships.IJNAkagiCV 2 0 2 1.0
[0_Chief_Road]
-199994.31 5.01 120.00 0 11 13.88888888888889
-199597.14 6.06 120.00
-199199.97 7.10 120.00
-198802.80 8.15 120.00
-198405.63 9.20 120.00
-198008.45 10.25 120.00
-197611.28 11.29 120.00
-197214.11 12.34 120.00
-196816.94 13.39 120.00
-196419.77 14.44 120.00
-196022.59 15.48 120.00
[NStationary]
[Buildings]
[Bridge]
[House]

LEXX_Luthor
11-24-2004, 05:03 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif We Solved the 3.01 Dot Problem for all with mp_dotrange.

Here is test setup for "rcu" file and dot lineup test mission. Ask if you need help learning to use the Chat Mode and "alias" shortcuts. This works for offline play too, and it works wonders for the sim.

Yes, if you don't change Patch 3.01 Default DOT settings with your "rcu" file, the new dots that come with Patch--the dots high against the sky are too big at very long ranges and don't grow small fast enough with range. Different dot settings can help for the monitor resolutions.

In this post is how to get both large "new" dot for medium range and small "old" dots for long range--and continous change in between. (~thanks~ Oleg) http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif For any "real life" pilots here, take a look and see how this matches what you see watching distant aircraft from the ground.

At bottom of this post is FMB mission file created to test dots, Wake Island Map. I call it "dot.mis" ... Player starts on Akagi carrier, sailing East, in Zero cockpit on deck. Ten AI Zeroes are spaced to the North at 200m altitude and at 1km intervals (placed by map grid). As soon as you are in the cockpit, open canopy and quickly PAUSE the game and look to your left (north) and see paused DOTS lined up to experiment with.

Enter and exit Chat Mode to experiment with changing Zoom In view and look around. When in Chat Mode, press the any one of the commands 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,0 and press ENTER to see dot effects change. As the Chat screen is sometimes full of long white text covering the screen, you may find it useful to repeat typing in, say, the command 1 and ENTER until the text scrolls off the screen top--then you have clear view of the aircraft lineup. The command numbers relate to distance in kilometers (see "rcu" DOT numbers below). One extra command at bottom of test "rcu" file is r. Press r to see both dots and ranges written next to each dot out to 10km. Note that some range numbers are missing because if the numbers overlap and become tangled on screen, some are not displayed for clarity. This is amazing attention to programming detail from Oleg. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

For my own use, and thinking Zero as *small* aircraft, I find myself liking DOT set to 8km range, which gives classic tiny light grey old FB dots at about 6-7 kilometers and nothing visible at 8km but large "new" dots at 3km range--with continous change smaller as distance increases (*thanks* again Oleg). See what you think matches your experience watching aircraft.

Here is test file for "rcu" , including all my "rcu" file that sets up "alias." If confused, ask "rcu Tully" for help. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

==============================================

@set fast off
@set echo on
@set alias on
@set history 20

@alias h history
@alias s show

@alias f fps SHOW START
@alias nf fps SHOW STOP

@alias 1 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 1 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 2 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 2 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 3 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 3 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 4 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 4 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 5 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 5 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 6 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 6 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 7 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 7 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 8 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 8 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 9 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 9 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01
@alias 0 mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 10 RANGE .01 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01

@alias r mp_dotrange COLOR .01 DOT 10 RANGE 12 TYPE .01 ID 0.01 NAME 0.01

==============================================
----------------------------------------------

Dot test mission "dot.mis"
Copy and Paste into new text document, save as "dot.mis" and place in Mission folder, then fire up FMB.



[MAIN]
MAP Wake/load.ini
TIME 12.0
CloudType 0
CloudHeight 1500.0
player g0100
army 2
playerNum 0
[Wing]
g0100
g0101
g0102
g0103
g0110
g0111
g0112
g0113
g0120
g0121
g0122
[g0100]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0100_Way]
TAKEOFF -200335.01 -300.60 0 0 0_Chief 0 &0
NORMFLY -172806.87 -49796.13 500.00 300.00 &0
[g0101]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0101_Way]
NORMFLY -199996.96 995.61 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -185660.14 985.57 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0102]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0102_Way]
NORMFLY -200002.16 1998.42 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -185984.25 1998.42 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0103]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0103_Way]
NORMFLY -199992.00 3001.24 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -185984.25 3051.79 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0110]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0110_Way]
NORMFLY -200002.16 3993.78 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -185984.25 3983.62 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0111]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0111_Way]
NORMFLY -200002.16 4996.47 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -186024.77 4996.47 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0112]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0112_Way]
NORMFLY -199997.08 6004.37 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -186024.77 6009.33 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0113]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0113_Way]
NORMFLY -199992.00 7007.06 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -186024.77 7062.70 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0120]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0120_Way]
NORMFLY -199997.08 8004.80 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -186024.77 8035.04 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0121]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0121_Way]
NORMFLY -199996.96 9002.42 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -186024.77 9047.89 200.00 150.00 &0
[g0122]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.A6M2
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0122_Way]
NORMFLY -199997.20 10000.03 200.00 150.00 &0
NORMFLY -185943.74 10020.23 200.00 150.00 &0
[Chiefs]
0_Chief Ships.IJNAkagiCV 2 0 2 1.0
[0_Chief_Road]
-199994.31 5.01 120.00 0 11 13.88888888888889
-199597.14 6.06 120.00
-199199.97 7.10 120.00
-198802.80 8.15 120.00
-198405.63 9.20 120.00
-198008.45 10.25 120.00
-197611.28 11.29 120.00
-197214.11 12.34 120.00
-196816.94 13.39 120.00
-196419.77 14.44 120.00
-196022.59 15.48 120.00
[NStationary]
[Buildings]
[Bridge]
[House]

ucanfly
11-24-2004, 05:18 PM
Great work Lexx!

Since you are spoon feeding some here you might want to mention the mp_dotrange default command to get back default settings in the same mission.

LEXX_Luthor
11-24-2004, 05:22 PM
ucanfly:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>you might want to mention the mp_dotrange default command to get back default settings in the same mission. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
uh...okay...um...lol I dunno. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

rcu TULLY help

This is ~great~ stuff Oleg made here. At 1024x768 I like the "new" dots at medium range (~4km), and "old" dots at long range(~8km), with "new-old" dots at medium-long range (~6km). http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif All Oleg needs to do is reduce the Defualt dotrange a little...or make "rcu" easy to use. Like put dot size in "conf" file


"conf" file:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Dot=8 <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

WWMaxGunz
11-25-2004, 03:44 AM
It's only gonna help them that can read as well as write, if ya know what I mean!

LEXX_Luthor
11-25-2004, 09:29 PM
*bump* for new dots at medium range
*bump* for old dots at long range.
*bump* for new-old dots at medium-long range. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

tolwyn.com
12-01-2004, 10:16 AM
If FRIEND and FOE aren't implicitly used, does mp_dotrange affect both simultaneously?

What about the problematic 3.02bm dots?
I find it very difficult to see planes between 3 and 4 KM.

LEXX_Luthor
12-01-2004, 07:34 PM
tolwyn.com:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>If FRIEND and FOE aren't implicitly used, does mp_dotrange affect both simultaneously? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yes, both friend and enemy dots and text icon labels are treated the same when FRIEND/FOE are ignored.

TheGozr
12-01-2004, 10:09 PM
We Solved the 3.01 Dot Problem for all with mp_dotrange.

YES .. and the 3.02BETA_m dot is a desaster.

faustnik
12-01-2004, 11:34 PM
Lexx,

I did the test with the rcu file and it worked perfectly. If I can manage it, anyone can.

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Diablo310th
12-02-2004, 07:17 AM
3.02beta dots are teh worst I ahve ever seen. I would ratehr go back to teh orignal thank have these current dots that you can't see. I've been within 1k of a m8 and never saw him. What i would like to see is something in between.

antifreeze
12-02-2004, 10:25 AM
I really have no idea what planet you guys are on. 3.02b with dot distance set to 25km gives the best dots/fade-in/distant-aircraft-graphics I've ever seen since il2 1.00 (using 1024X768 or 1152x864). Against the sea/forest/ground you can see dots clearly below you at 5-6km, and for the first time ever, zoom view actually shows a plane outline instead of the same or smaller dot! Against the sky, dots can clearly be seen at 12km, even in the 'poor' weather setting.

I wasn't really against 3.01 dots, especially with the dot distance lowered. But 3.02b with DOT at 25km are just simply much better in my view. Please try it before following like a sheep the players who want to see a return of the 3.01 dots. (open console with shift-tab during a flight and type 'mp_dotrange DOT 25')

Diablo:
&gt; I've been within 1k of a m8 and never saw him

What? I don't understand. With 3.02b dots, at 2km (or a little more) in wide view (and at about 4km in zoom view), the graphic is no longer a dot but a fully formed aircraft graphic. If you can't see an aircraft within 1km, it has nothing to do with dot rendering, unless you were on a server which has the dot distance set at some stupid parameter like 500m. Then yes, you will not see any rendered graphic for the aircraft; it will be invisible. But that has nothing to do with the issue talked about here. Did you check what the dot distance was set to when you couldn't see your mate?

Zen--
12-02-2004, 10:32 AM
I've tried 15 and 20km DOT range but found no difference in spotting planes below me. For me at 1280x960x32 Excellent settings Ti4600, these new dots just aren't working.

I don't doubt what you see AF, but for me I can't see planes below me even just outside of the LOD shape when the target changes to a dot...they become invisible under many conditions. Also when flying way up high, the only time I can spot planes below me is if they are contrailing or are showing against the grey fog line of the sky, otherwise from 6k I routinely miss dogfights happening at 1,2 or 3k below me.

I thought 3.01 with reduced DOT range seemed to work the best...these new dots are too difficult for me to see with my system and naturally that ends up being frustrating.

Definately going to try 25km though, just so far I haven't seen any change in dot size or visbility by pushing DOT out to 20km.

antifreeze
12-02-2004, 10:54 AM
Well, I sypathise with you guys who are playing at the highest resolution, but is it not true that you are in quite a small minority? If so, should you really be dictating that the rest of us have to watch huge blobs floating around the screen like a swarm of flies? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I don't mind you pushing for a proper fix, but please, using 3.01 dots just transfers your problem from you to lower resolution users.

Zen--
12-02-2004, 02:11 PM
I don't mean to dictate anything to anybody, but whatever solution comes out needs to be fair for everyone, or else a choice must be available to set the dots how you like for your style of play and your resolution.

I just put my .02 rupees in because I have an opinion, not because I want things to be my way only. Lots of people have problems seeing the 3.02bm dots besides me and not all these people are high resolution users. To compare I ran the game at 800x600 and 640x480 to see any differences, believe it or not they aren't that much easier to see at lower resolutions either, at least for me.

A wide range of opinions on the subject is very important, I wouldn't feel right if only yours or only mine counted, this needs to be about the community as a whole.

&lt;S&gt;

Popey109
12-02-2004, 02:40 PM
Why dont some of you lower your res? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif I play at 1024x768 get good fps and the game looks great! And I got jumped by a zek the other day! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif somthing that didnt happen with 3.01...I say NO to 3.01 horsefly\dots http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif...JMA http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

antifreeze
12-02-2004, 02:55 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif 'dictate' was a choice word; sorry.
I know you aren't dictating. It's just that a poll where everyone is saying '3.01!' makes me frightened.
OK, so 3.01 was better for high resolution, but it isn't the fair solution. Even if it looks ok by decreasing the DOT parameter, that is no good really, because we should see dots at much more distance than that. Decreasing DOT means we get the disappearing aircraft syndrome. We need a solution where DOT is at least 25km. Lets keep pushing for that solution, rather than the 3.01 'quick fix'.

ucanfly
12-02-2004, 04:22 PM
Dude , maybe you aren't listening. I play at 1024X768 and still can't see 3.02 dots against certain terrain very well either (less than 1 km). If you read carefully to other users I am not alone with this problem at LOW RESOLUTIONS.

I liked the 3.01 dots with reduced range better than these 3.02 dots with increased range.

carguy_
12-02-2004, 04:46 PM
OLEG WHAT HAVE YOU DONE!!!!

3.02 dots are horrible!I have eystrain from 5minutes of playing qmb all the planes in bacground dissapear &gt;700m.I`d like to return to 3.00 dots if 3.01 can`t be restored.3.01 was the best compromise,I didn`t see planes cuz I failed to look there now even when I focus on the area where the plane is I do not see it!I had watched the same trk 5 times and the plane is there completely invisible!

A real life pilot with 10000 hours experience comes here and says 3.01 dots are the best and yet you listen to all those wheelchair esthetic experts?!

Really Oleg I`m serious my eyes hurt everytime I fly.

Diablo310th
12-02-2004, 04:50 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Antifreeze:
I really have no idea what planet you guys are on. 3.02b with dot distance set to 25km gives the best dots/fade-in/distant-aircraft-graphics I've ever seen since il2 1.00 (using 1024X768 or 1152x864). Against the sea/forest/ground you can see dots clearly below you at 5-6km, and for the first time ever, zoom view actually shows a plane outline instead of the same or smaller dot! Against the sky, dots can clearly be seen at 12km, even in the 'poor' weather setting.

I wasn't really against 3.01 dots, especially with the dot distance lowered. But 3.02b with DOT at 25km are just simply much better in my view. Please try it before following like a sheep the players who want to see a return of the 3.01 dots. (open console with shift-tab during a flight and type 'mp_dotrange DOT 25')

Diablo:
&gt; I've been within 1k of a m8 and never saw him

What? I don't understand. With 3.02b dots, at 2km (or a little more) in wide view (and at about 4km in zoom view), the graphic is no longer a dot but a fully formed aircraft graphic. If you can't see an aircraft within 1km, it has nothing to do with dot rendering, unless you were on a server which has the dot distance set at some stupid parameter like 500m. Then yes, you will not see any rendered graphic for the aircraft; it will be invisible. But that has nothing to do with the issue talked about here. Did you check what the dot distance was set to when you couldn't see your mate? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Heyy antifreeze. I was looking down into the forest when this happened. Seems teh dots appear somewhat ok when looking into the sky but not toward ground. I fly on WarClouds. Not sure what dotrange Sparx has setup there. i'll ask him tonight. Can the dotrange setting be controlled by an individual or the server? I always assumed it was set by the server. Coulkd be that the dotrange setting is not at 25 on Warclouds. I fly at 1280x960x32 myself like Zen and many others i know do.

Diablo310th
12-02-2004, 04:57 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by carguy_:
OLEG WHAT HAVE YOU DONE!!!!

3.02 dots are horrible!I have eystrain from 5minutes of playing qmb all the planes in bacground dissapear &gt;700m.I`d like to return to 3.00 dots if 3.01 can`t be restored.3.01 was the best compromise,I didn`t see planes cuz I failed to look there now even when I focus on the area where the plane is I do not see it!I had watched the same trk 5 times and the plane is there completely invisible!

A real life pilot with 10000 hours experience comes here and says 3.01 dots are the best and yet you listen to all those wheelchair esthetic experts?!

Really Oleg I`m serious my eyes hurt everytime I fly. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/351.gif I have found my eyes getting blurry after flying.....NO it isn't teh 3 beers or 3 glasses of rum I drink while flying. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

faustnik
12-02-2004, 05:04 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Antifreeze:
I really have no idea what planet you guys are on. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


When flying 3.02, I'm on planet Cantseesh*t.

Zen--
12-02-2004, 05:35 PM
Diablo, WC is running 20km DOT range at the moment, I asked SPaRX to try it out and thats what we were flying on last night. Personally I didn't see any difference in lower dots being more or less visible against the ground though, it appeared about the same as when he had 15km set.

DOT range is server/host side, we use whatever the host is using. We can ask him for trying 25km tonight perhaps, but based on what I've seen so far I don't think that will make a difference, though it's sure starting to get weird watching these planes come in from so far away when they are above you and visible against the sky.

Recon_609IAP
12-02-2004, 06:21 PM
now this is really a clusterf.

Who knows what settings are used, every server now has totally different settings, one server you can see 50 miles away, another 6 miles.

I'd rather have that dot range be locked in - so I know that no matter what server I join the dot distance is the same.

As far as distance, dot distance doesn't have you spot the 3d model up close -- and to me, that is and has been the issue since day one - whether you see him at 10km or 20km doesn't matter much if you lose him at 2km http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

LEXX_Luthor
12-02-2004, 06:30 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

Zen:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>though it's sure starting to get weird watching these planes come in from so far away when they are above you and visible against the sky. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Nailed it! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif

Recall Heinz' GD thread about 3.01 dots not letting simmers judge range to dots...because dotrange was set too high (Heinz didn't catch that though http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif ). Now we are seeing 3.02b dots with 25km dotrange so we can get away from text icon labels, and the 25km is causing the same range judging problem. With 25km dottrange, the dots don't begin to fade until long ranges.

LEXX_Luthor
12-02-2004, 06:49 PM
Antifreeze, if I may respond to your post last page. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Antifreeze:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Well, I sypathise with you guys who are playing at the highest resolution, but is it not true that you are in quite a small minority? If so, should you really be dictating that the rest of us have to watch huge blobs floating around the screen like a swarm of flies? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I don't mind you pushing for a proper fix, but please, using 3.01 dots just transfers your problem from you to lower resolution users. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Antifreeze, you posted yesterday that you flew Nvida Ti4x00 with 4x antialiasing. I am sure antialiasing hurts your resolution possible, especially with Nvida. With the new more distant aircraft grafics (or "LOD") that you post much about, try running high res and see the immersion the new tiny aircraft grafics give at high resolution. You will find high resolution also aids in aircraft identification, you can more clearly see the distant target orientation (see distant rolling, turning, pitching etc...) which helps situational awareness, and, as a bonus, with higher resolution you can better read the instrument guages even in full zoom out view. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif All these reasons are why I am *never* going back now that Oleg made Patch 3.01/02 so smooth my ATI~9200 can run 1280x960 at 25-30 fps. Granted, as offline simmer, I don't know if low resoltion helps framerate on internet servers.


----------------------------------------


Flight Simmers Always Remember ~*~ With 3.01 dots and reduced dotrange depending on simmer resolution, ALL simmers can SEE dots and play without text icon labels. This by definition is why 3.01 dots are the Fair Solution for ALL simmers, as this thread title shows. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Kadin1
12-02-2004, 07:22 PM
I agree with Antifreeze, the dots and transitions are very real to my eyes. Everytime I get to an airport I am plastering my nose at the window, looking at planes that take off. The present system is the only one that gets close to that picture. On the other hand there is a reason why planes were painted. Need to blend with the background...Or why pilots have to have excellent vision. If you focus and use your mouse to track a lower plane you cannot lose it. It is not easy, I admit, but who said it should be. And since we all use our personal experiece to determine what should be done, lets end it here. We shall not agree and everybody is right...to their eyes.
Having either as a selectable option seems to be prety fair, but only if it is not going to jeopardise all the excellent additions all around!

LEXX_Luthor
12-02-2004, 07:53 PM
Kadin, if you try the 3.01 mp_dotrange fix described at the beginning of last page, you will find what you see at the airport. Try it. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

...depending on resolution. For experiment, I tried 640x480 and YUCK I had forgotten what the sim looked like with my old Trident integrated motherboard video...not just the large 640x480 dots, but totally unreadable cockpit guages.

Kadin:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>If you focus and use your mouse to track a lower plane you cannot lose it. It is not easy, I admit, but who said it should be. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Nobody posted (yet) that seeing dots against the ground should be "easy" but ALL simmers post that it should NOT be impossible--impossible contradicts pilot accounts of Bounce. Most simmers post that it is impossible to see dots against ground--depending on resolution at least for me.

Pay attention please. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

antifreeze
12-04-2004, 02:31 AM
Well I'm glad we have a thread here that can have strong, diametrically-opposed views expressed and not one person has turned it into a ****ging match. Salut to everyone who has posted so far; I wish there was more discussion and good-humoured posts like this on the boards.