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XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 05:43 PM
Looking forward to the P38 FM - the pilot should be decapitated by the rear control surface when he bails out. Who'll be first to do the blood stained texture complete with lumps?/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Tedious unoriginal philoshophical statement the pith of which is lost in repetition.

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 05:43 PM
Looking forward to the P38 FM - the pilot should be decapitated by the rear control surface when he bails out. Who'll be first to do the blood stained texture complete with lumps?/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Tedious unoriginal philoshophical statement the pith of which is lost in repetition.

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 06:16 PM
flapbuster wrote:
- Looking forward to the P38 FM - the pilot should be
- decapitated by the rear control surface when he
- bails out. Who'll be first to do the blood stained
- texture complete with lumps?<

Do you know of any instances of this happening? It was my understanding that the airflow allowed the bailing pilot to slide down the wing, then under the afore mentioned control surface.

http://www.uploadit.org/files/010903-nedChristie.jpg

Tsalagi Asgaya Equa!

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 06:23 PM
Saw a documentary about P38's in the pacific theatre: pilot said it was a real fear if the aircraft was in a certain attitude - probably your attitude actually.

Tedious unoriginal philoshophical statement the pith of which is lost in repetition.

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 06:38 PM
flapbuster wrote:
- Saw a documentary about P38's in the pacific
- theatre: pilot said it was a real fear if the
- aircraft was in a certain attitude - probably your
- attitude actually.
-



Don't misunderstand me. What I posted was not a rebuttal. I simply hadn't heard of it happening and thought that perhaps you had. The info that I have seen was on Zeno's site in the P-38 movie. Of course, that was made by the USAAF, and is always subject to scrutiny. Save the flames for Winter.


Tsisqua

http://www.uploadit.org/files/010903-nedChristie.jpg

Tsalagi Asgaya Equa!

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 06:41 PM
sorry it came out more ascerbic than intended..

did a quick look up:
excerpt:
What did you think about when you bailed?" He grinned and said "You know that the P38 has that twin boom tail, right? That thing would cut you right in half if you hit it when you bailed out, so you really had to be careful! You had to roll that plane on its side and kinda upside down, throw open the canopy and fall clear." He chuckles, "When I did that and seen that water, I wondered what I would do if this parachute didn't open!"

I think some people did get injured by that thing.

Tedious unoriginal philoshophical statement the pith of which is lost in repetition.

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 06:55 PM
If this happened, it was very rarely. If you actually took a look at the plane's design, it was no harder, if even easier to bail out of, than any other plane. The stabilizer in between the booms was set higher behind the wings. IF the pilot jumped out of the cockpit like an idiot, yeah, sure, he'd get hurt, but you were taught to bail out by either turning the plane over and falling out, no harm to the pilot there, or climbing onto the wing inside the booms and slipping off the aircraft. You would be dragged below the stabilizer's level even before you passed it. This is something that would not happen.

Boosher-PBNA
----------------
<center>It's your fault... <center>
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http://www.uploadit.org/files/220903-Boosher%20Sig.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 06:55 PM
Lt. Maurice Nickle, 15th Army Air Force in an interview:

I thought the P-38 canopy slid back but it was hinged to the right so you had to go out the left hand side and between the booms. Can you describe the bailout procedure as it was communicated to you? Was getting out of a P-38 more of a concern for you than a P-40 or 39?


Morrie: As I remember the bail out procedures simply to go out head first after slowing the plane down to 120 mph or so. It was describes something like just going into a pool from the deck, just lean forward and roll in.

Note: After seeing the P-38 up close I wondered what his chances were of an successful bailout in a potentially tumbling battle damaged aircraft with two props spinning close by. More than one pilot died hitting the tail or (sic?) their single tailed aircraft.

http://www.uploadit.org/files/010903-nedChristie.jpg

Tsalagi Asgaya Equa!

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 09:03 PM
The airflow over the canopy would push the pilot down and under the rear spar. If you overlay the dimensions of the horizontal stabilizer of the P-38 and that of a typical single boom fighter aircraft you will notice the horizontal stabilizer dimensions are near identical.

Because of the open space between the boom and resultant airflow the P-38 was actually safer to bailout of than a typical single boom aircraft at any attitude. All the pilot had to do was release the canopy and slide down the side of the aircraft and physics would take care of the rest.

The Lockheed P-38 introduction film shown to trainees during WW2 clearly addresses and dispells this old myth then as much as it is now. Now if only I could remember the link for it.

http://www.redspar.com/redrogue/CraggerUbisig.jpg

About after 30 minutes I puked all over my airplane. I said to myself "Man, you made a big mistake." -Charles 'Chuck' Yeager, regards his first flight

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 09:04 PM
Here it is
http://www.zenoswarbirdvideos.com/P38.html

http://www.redspar.com/redrogue/CraggerUbisig.jpg

About after 30 minutes I puked all over my airplane. I said to myself "Man, you made a big mistake." -Charles 'Chuck' Yeager, regards his first flight

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 09:09 PM
flapbuster wrote:
- Looking forward to the P38 FM - the pilot should be
- decapitated by the rear control surface when he
- bails out. Who'll be first to do the blood stained
- texture complete with lumps?/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
-
- Tedious unoriginal philoshophical statement the pith
- of which is lost in repetition.



You are an idiot. No body except a 13 year old kid who doesnt understand death would do that, and laugh at it.


-------------------------------------
Sigs are over rated. Screw them. Screw them all.

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 09:28 PM
My grandfather had to step outside of his F-4 (P-38 photorecon) over Anzio when a Fw190 shot off one of his engines.

At 200ft, 450 mph, an enemy fighter poundnig on you, and your plane about to come apart, you don't have time to neatly roll the plane to the correct position and follow procedure.

You GET OUT OF THE AIRPLANE.

He caught his shoulder on one of the vertical stabilizers, and it still bothers him. He said he's lucky the elevator didn't cut him in half.

Stenciled on the side of my Dora:

"Lasst das H√¬∂llentor √¬∂ffen, es friert hier oben!"
("Leave the gates to Hell open, it's FREEZING up here!")

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 10:42 PM
PlaneEater wrote:
- My grandfather had to step outside of his F-4 (P-38
- photorecon) over Anzio when a Fw190 shot off one of
- his engines.
-
- At 200ft, 450 mph, an enemy fighter poundnig on you,
- and your plane about to come apart, you don't have
- time to neatly roll the plane to the correct
- position and follow procedure.
-
- You GET OUT OF THE AIRPLANE.
-
- He caught his shoulder on one of the vertical
- stabilizers, and it still bothers him. He said he's
- lucky the elevator didn't cut him in half.
-



Now, there is first-hand info. Thanks.


I found this thread interesting, and I don't think that the point of the thread is blood, and gore, but what exactly WILL we see when we bail from the P-38? I think that everyone knows that blood and gore are not a real feature of this simulation.

There is a problem, though, in that no matter how badly your pilot has been wounded, he is just fine after bailout. He might be killed on the way down, or if too close to plane if it explodes. However, if he makes it all the way down, he runs like nothing is wrong. It must be the miracle healing power of Mother Earth.

This is not a whine, fix it for realism and I'll be happy, or leave it for the humor. I find it nothing short of hilarious to see the invincible little man with my face, running away from the drop-site. I always hit slow motion, and laugh even harder, because I am running like a "girly-man".


Tssiqua

http://www.uploadit.org/files/010903-nedChristie.jpg

Tsalagi Asgaya Equa!

XyZspineZyX
09-26-2003, 10:45 PM
Makes you wonder how many pilots would have been saved by ejection seats if the respective air branches hadn't been so stubborn to accept the idea of using special explosive charges to throw the pilot out of a striken aircraft.

Just like parachutes weren't accepted till the end of WW1 and only by the Germans. Even though they had been giving them to ballon observers since 1904.

Ironically it was the Germans the first accepted the idea of ejection seats with the He-162.

http://www.redspar.com/redrogue/CraggerUbisig.jpg

About after 30 minutes I puked all over my airplane. I said to myself "Man, you made a big mistake." -Charles 'Chuck' Yeager, regards his first flight

Message Edited on 09/26/0304:46PM by Cragger

XyZspineZyX
09-27-2003, 08:56 AM
m_preddy wrote:

You are an idiot. No body except a 13 year old kid
- who doesnt understand death would do that, and laugh
- at it.

Thankyou. Its just a game, hope you dont get upset when you shoot down a plane in FB. I simply wanted to highlight a consequence of the P38 design which is not immediately obvious, and the lack of collision detection in FB.

Tedious unoriginal philoshophical statement the pith of which is lost in repetition.

XyZspineZyX
09-27-2003, 09:02 AM
To be honest, when bailing out of any aircraft it is always a worry about hitting any part of the airframe, or opening the chute too soon and getting it snagged on the aircraft.

Rar! For Ejector seats :+)

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