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View Full Version : Forgotten AI improvements!



Taivastelija
04-05-2005, 03:22 AM
Hi!

Does anyone fly this offline anymore?

I am just a offline player and fan of WW2 sims from EAW to Pacific fighters and found the EAW although very obsolete more playable and enjoyable game what comes to the joy of computer game(yes, sturmovik is also just a game) dogfighting.

Big negative thing is lack of JUMP TO ACTION key
quote from a friend: "If I just wanted to fly around I would buy a MS Flight Fimulator"
I think this said it all.
Especially escort missions can be very boring due the long zigzag and flight time even with the new skip time button.Too often I fly 20 minutes and get shot down by AI sharphooter.

IL series games truely needs a equally great AI than its FM and range of planes. What good its to fly diffirent range of planes, if the AI flys all the same formula (ie Energy fighters go in dogfighting more nimble opponents and all gets shot down). Should welcome few optional tactics zoom and boom, hit and run etc.

Another bug is the behaviour of escort fighters and their position and distance of the escorted planes, always many miles behind.

One of above mentioned annoying point is AI sharpshooters who will pick you up at any angle of attack. Found the first sturmovik AI accuracy better than FB an PF. Ground AA accuracy although should be at this present level.

And Mistakes, humans do make mistakes but AI robots don´t ever stall or lose control or miss of chicken in combat.They act what they are a terminator robots with IR sight!

This is hard criticism but seem that some elements have left in the state of flight sims were in late 1990s. These are the negative issues I found from this "raw diamond" of combat simulators.

Taivastelija
04-05-2005, 03:22 AM
Hi!

Does anyone fly this offline anymore?

I am just a offline player and fan of WW2 sims from EAW to Pacific fighters and found the EAW although very obsolete more playable and enjoyable game what comes to the joy of computer game(yes, sturmovik is also just a game) dogfighting.

Big negative thing is lack of JUMP TO ACTION key
quote from a friend: "If I just wanted to fly around I would buy a MS Flight Fimulator"
I think this said it all.
Especially escort missions can be very boring due the long zigzag and flight time even with the new skip time button.Too often I fly 20 minutes and get shot down by AI sharphooter.

IL series games truely needs a equally great AI than its FM and range of planes. What good its to fly diffirent range of planes, if the AI flys all the same formula (ie Energy fighters go in dogfighting more nimble opponents and all gets shot down). Should welcome few optional tactics zoom and boom, hit and run etc.

Another bug is the behaviour of escort fighters and their position and distance of the escorted planes, always many miles behind.

One of above mentioned annoying point is AI sharpshooters who will pick you up at any angle of attack. Found the first sturmovik AI accuracy better than FB an PF. Ground AA accuracy although should be at this present level.

And Mistakes, humans do make mistakes but AI robots don´t ever stall or lose control or miss of chicken in combat.They act what they are a terminator robots with IR sight!

This is hard criticism but seem that some elements have left in the state of flight sims were in late 1990s. These are the negative issues I found from this "raw diamond" of combat simulators.

Brain32
04-05-2005, 05:50 AM
Yes I am annoyed with AI too, BUT Oleg said that AI will use the same FM in 4.0 patch so it's http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif when they release it.

VW-IceFire
04-05-2005, 08:02 AM
I have to disagree about their perfect deflection shooting and their no mistakes.

They sometimes achieve uncanny deflection shots in the head on merge but after that...they can be on someones six all day and keep missing as long as you apply a little rudder. No deflection shooting going on at all.

They sometimes act perfectly but on the other hand sometimes they get themselves into high AoA situations or they pull up and loose energy right infront of you...which makes them easy targets. No problems.

Brain32
04-05-2005, 01:19 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I have to disagree about their perfect deflection shooting and their no mistakes.

They sometimes achieve uncanny deflection shots in the head on merge but after that...they can be on someones six all day and keep missing as long as you apply a little rudder. No deflection shooting going on at all.

They sometimes act perfectly but on the other hand sometimes they get themselves into high AoA situations or they pull up and loose energy right infront of you...which makes them easy targets. No problems. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's true. My annoyance with AI is strictly FM related.
It's a funny thing, nobody commented the announced AI FM improvement - to me that's the greatest(no flyable Tempest confirmed yet http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif ) news for 4.0.

Bearcat99
04-05-2005, 07:29 PM
To make this sim more fun and more challenging offline you have to use it. All of it. I think it is great offline the AI is great as well. (Not perfect but the best I have seen...) Make a mission and mix up the AI... some veteran.. some Ace with a few rookies..... even on all veteran I have made AI stall out trying to get me.... I have made them crash into each other.. (not on cue of course but I have tried it more than once and it worked....) I have made them miss.... I have seen AI panicand bail... I have seen them bug out and run.. I have seen them stick to me like glue.. even while in flames till they exploded.... I have made them crash into stuff... like buildings or hangers.... I have made them leave an AI of mine to assist one of thier own...... You have to get into this sim. Look at this mostly full glass we have here and drink deeply from it... Dont take a few grudging sips and start talking about how empty it is....

Brain32
04-06-2005, 12:42 PM
Hi Bearcat, just to add some of my expirience to those you mentioned...

I have seen them recovering from a 900km/h+ dive at a 90 degree angle...I have seen them doging bullets after I pressed the trigger(OK only once)...I have seen them riping my wings off from 500-600 meters...I have seen them climbing at 90km/h...I have seen a FW out turning spitfire at low speed & altitude etc. etc.

Yes I can still agree that is the best AI I ever saw, and I don't have anything against challenging AI enemy but if you play vs AI long enough(I started about 1year after the release of Original IL2) you can find yourself in many not challenging but annoying situations.
I'm sure that for other people like me, the announced AI FM improvement truely is the greatest news.
Generally my opinion is: Let them be good & challenging, but within limitations of the plane "they" are flying.

FinnBird
04-06-2005, 01:39 PM
Do the AI pilots suffer from blackouts?

I some times doubt they won't - can anyone tell for sure?

Antonio_MRZ
04-07-2005, 01:31 AM
AI pilots don't suffer blackout/redout, can see at night, through clouds and even through their aircraft.

Antonio

stubby
04-07-2005, 07:33 AM
The AI is truly in its element when doing campaign oriented coops where the AI changes to reflect the survival status of the AI plane. DCG tweaks AI settings over the course of the AI life in a campaign. The longer the AI lives, the more 'ace' like it becomes. Thrown into the mix are AIs of different levels. The other nice thing about coops is a certain level of unpredictability (ie SA issues). In QMBs, all these things are lost and the AI is not in its optimal environment. The AI is very challenging if one plays with a 'dead-is-dead' mentality. The proof of how challenging the AI can be is in the online coops I fly. Most missions are mostly populated with AI planes and some humans thrown in. After flying more than a 1000 online coop missions as part of varioius campaigns, the average life expectancy of most flyers I've flown with is about 3 to 4 missions. Most of the time, it's an AI plane that ends the streak of a pilot persona.

BaldieJr
04-07-2005, 06:47 PM
I like the challenge of flying in formation.

Longjocks
04-08-2005, 10:44 PM
The AI has ups and downs. Mostly it is stupid and predictable with occasional leaps of super-human abilities. I think it can primarily be looked at through two perspectives - the gamer and the simmer. A gamer needs greater control over the situation and would only expect to die upon their mistakes. A simmer might welcome the random behaviour to more accurately simulate the war experience where sometimes one might die thanks to another's lucky shot. Of course that is a black & white perspective.

When menitoning the new FM, I'm hoping it fixes that AI's ability to fly a crippled bomber sideways to a safe belly landing. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif