PDA

View Full Version : Stupid questions from a stupid person



koivis
11-20-2006, 01:17 PM
Wow... seriously, I've never heard any of these before! But, these clearly show that Brits had also good clever engineers:

http://www.flitzerart.com/images/WW2%20BRITISH%20SECRETP/24.jpg
I mean... seriously... 46 litre Rolls-Royce Eagle H-24 engine, boosted to 4020 hp ("only" 3200 hp in Wyvern TF.1 proto http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif ), and top speed of 509 mph...

http://www.flitzerart.com/images/WW2%20BRITISH%20SECRETP/29%20.jpg
And another variation... now "only" 3550 hp, but check the top speed... 546 mph!!!!! How is that even possible? Isn't that nearly supersonic (the prop tips must be nearly supersonic)? That's faster than even the famous Rare Bear...<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Redguys Air Racing Team
Member A4
www.simairracing.com (http://www.simairracing.com)

"The fastest pilots of the online world..."

ARCHIE_CALVERT
11-20-2006, 01:42 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif Thats estimated speed mind you...<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v187/Secudus/ChiefBlueMeanie.jpg
Now if, in the folding, I ESP the tesseract a half twist around myself and-

SlickStick
11-20-2006, 01:48 PM
http://img55.imageshack.us/img55/3873/homerdroolingmh8.jpg <div class="ev_tpc_signature">

__________________________________
????????k??t????k??? ????2006

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/8847/tsigspitixcw6cq.jpg
Coming Soon to a Full Six near you...http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif
Track Library (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/1171010994)

Viper2005_
11-20-2006, 02:52 PM
http://avia.russian.ee/pictures/england/havilland_vampire.jpg

Designed to specification E.6/41

First flight on the 20th of September 1943. Top speed well over 500 mph. Made largely of wood.

Fighter version first flown in April 1945, into Squadron service by 1946. That's reality.

As for "what if?" try the Miles M.52

Jaws2002
11-20-2006, 03:02 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by koivis:
Wow... seriously, I've never heard any of these before! But, these clearly show that Brits had also good clever engineers:

http://www.flitzerart.com/images/WW2%20BRITISH%20SECRETP/24.jpg
I mean... seriously... 46 litre Rolls-Royce Eagle H-24 engine, boosted to 4020 hp ("only" 3200 hp in Wyvern TF.1 proto http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif ), and top speed of 509 mph...

http://www.flitzerart.com/images/WW2%20BRITISH%20SECRETP/29%20.jpg
And another variation... now "only" 3550 hp, but check the top speed... 546 mph!!!!! How is that even possible? Isn't that nearly supersonic (the prop tips must be nearly supersonic)? That's faster than even the famous Rare Bear... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Some really nice projects there. This two could have been awesome birds.


But they have a really ugly FW-190 wannabe there http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif:
http://www.flitzerart.com/images/WW2%20BRITISH%20SECRETP/11.jpg

http://www.flitzerart.com/images/WW2%20BRITISH%20SECRETP/12.jpg <div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v258/&lt;FA&gt;Jaws/Shot1.jpg

TIR 4 Pro -$25 Off- From Forgotten Assassins (http://trackir.naturalpoint.com/forgottenassassins/)


Hunter 82's Uber PC Component Shop (http://www.magnum-pc.com/)

ploughman
11-20-2006, 03:06 PM
Oh, I dunno, a few pints and she might start looking alright. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

ARCHIE_CALVERT
11-20-2006, 03:23 PM
http://www.flitzerart.com/images/WW2%20BRITISH%20SECRETP/5.jpg

http://www.flitzerart.com/images/WW2%20BRITISH%20SECRETP/6.jpg

http://www.flitzerart.com/images/WW2%20BRITISH%20SECRETP/27.jpg

http://www.flitzerart.com/images/WW2%20BRITISH%20SECRETP/28.jpg <div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v187/Secudus/ChiefBlueMeanie.jpg
Now if, in the folding, I ESP the tesseract a half twist around myself and-

SlickStick
11-20-2006, 03:28 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ploughman:
Oh, I dunno, a few pints and she might start looking alright. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

As the saying goes, "They all look good at closing time." http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

__________________________________
????????k??t????k??? ????2006

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/8847/tsigspitixcw6cq.jpg
Coming Soon to a Full Six near you...http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif
Track Library (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/1171010994)

ploughman
11-20-2006, 03:39 PM
Yeah, hur-hur.

Beer's gotten me into more scrapes than it's gotten me out of that's for sure.

465mph for a 1937 design sounds a tad optimistic.

mandrill7
11-20-2006, 04:24 PM
Yes, gotta bear in mind that all a/c designs look a sight better on the drawing board than they end up in real life. The P-39 Aircobra was estimated to go over 400 MPH on the drawing board. The final production version was mid 300's and that's with its supercharger stripped out to save weight and make it feasible at all.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hello, Little Friends. So glad you decided to join us.
http://mission4today.com/index.php?name=Downloads&c=19

horseback
11-20-2006, 05:31 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by mandrill7:
Yes, gotta bear in mind that all a/c designs look a sight better on the drawing board than they end up in real life. The P-39 Aircobra was estimated to go over 400 MPH on the drawing board. The final production version was mid 300's and that's with its supercharger stripped out to save weight and make it feasible at all. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>This is why reading comprehension is so important.

The prototype P-39 did get into the high 380s-390s at over 20kft using the General Electric turbocharger we recognize on the P-38's booms and the undersides of the B-17 and B-24's nacelles. However, the Army, fearing the wrath of an isolationist congress, decreed that the Airacobra would be a medium to low level fighter with a useful ground attack capability, and stripped it of the turbocharger.

Unfortunately, a less than ethical Bell sales type sold the British Aircraft Purchasing Commission the Airacobra by using the prototype's performance figures, and failing to mention that the turbocharger that was responsible for that performance got pulled from the design...

I think his descendents are selling cell phone plans these days.

cheers

horseback<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

"Here's your new Mustangs, boys. You can learn to fly'em on the way to the target. Cheers!" -LTCOL Don Blakeslee, 4th FG CO, February 27th, 1944

BfHeFwMe
11-20-2006, 07:18 PM
There was one YP-39A with a turbo out of 13 YP-39's total. At no time did it ever outpreform a later varient. NACA advised Bell to dump the turb for greater speed and performance, not the Army. This was the only non-publicly funded fighter program to produce a fighter that went into mainstream service. The Army had no say, they only had specifications Bell had to shoot for.

Sometimes it helps to actually have something worthwhile to read. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

DomJScott
11-20-2006, 07:47 PM
Regarding the speeds, high 500's are definatly feasible. The highest wartime speed ( not sure if it's stilla record ) was 606mph by a spit. It did lose it's prop and did a glide landing. That show's however that high 500's are believeable ( that 606 was in a 45 degree dive ).

horseback
11-20-2006, 11:33 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by BfHeFwMe:
There was one YP-39A with a turbo out of 13 YP-39's total. At no time did it ever outpreform a later varient. NACA advised Bell to dump the turb for greater speed and performance, not the Army. This was the only non-publicly funded fighter program to produce a fighter that went into mainstream service. The Army had no say, they only had specifications Bell had to shoot for.

Sometimes it helps to actually have something worthwhile to read. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>My original source was Green & Swanborough's American Army Air Force Fighters of WW2, Vol.1, but I'm 300 miles from my library, so I'll quote from another source, easily referenced, on the web:

http://home.att.net/~jbaugher1/p39_1.html (http://home.att.net/%7Ejbaugher1/p39_1.html)

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">The XP-39B resumed flight trials on November 25, 1939. Empty weight had grown from from 3995 lbs to 4530 lbs, and normal gross weight was up to 5834 pounds from 5550 pounds, and the aircraft STILL didn't have any armament. The removal of the turbosupercharger was to have fateful consequences for the future of the Airacobra. Although the Allison engine was more reliable and more easily service when the turbosupercharger was eliminated, the engine only performed well at low and medium altitudes and lost power quite rapidly at altitudes over 15,000 feet. Even in spite of the improved streamlining, the XP-39B suffered a severe degradation in high-altitude performance. Maximum speed fell from 390 mph at 20,000 feet to 375 mph at 15,000 feet, and it now took 7.5 minutes to reach 20,000 feet rather than five minutes. However, there was an increase in low-altitude maneuverability because of the reduced wing span, and the decrease in low-altitude performance was only marginal. The XP-39B was damaged in a belly-landing at Wright Field, Ohio on January 6, 1940. It was repaired and resumed flying, later to be demonstrated at Bolling Field in Washington, DC. Unfortunately, the XP-39B was destroyed in an accident after only 28 flying hours. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've read similar confirming information from several different sources over the last 40+ years, so I don't believe I'm wrong. If you can quote a source for your version, put it out there.

cheers

horseback<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

"Here's your new Mustangs, boys. You can learn to fly'em on the way to the target. Cheers!" -LTCOL Don Blakeslee, 4th FG CO, February 27th, 1944

Viper2005_
11-21-2006, 12:20 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DomJScott:
Regarding the speeds, high 500's are definatly feasible. The highest wartime speed ( not sure if it's stilla record ) was 606mph by a spit. It did lose it's prop and did a glide landing. That show's however that high 500's are believeable ( that 606 was in a 45 degree dive ). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Come back when you've done your sums.

thrust = prop efficiency * power/velocity

Gravity is pretty mighty when compared with piston/prop combinations at high (&gt;~375 mph) speeds.

In fact, since I've got time on my hands, I'll give you an order of magnitude estimate.

606 mph ~ 271 m/s.

In a 45?? dive that gives a rate of descent of about 192 m/s.

Taking g to be 9.81 m/s^2, and considering that the gravitational potential energy of an object varies as m*g*h, we can therefore conclude that gravitational potential energy was liberating a useful power of 1879 W

OD_79
11-21-2006, 02:22 AM
LEts see...Canberra, Vampire along with the newer Meteors - would have made an interesting force.

OD.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/tom1502/HurricaneSig2.jpg (http://www.79vrafhangar.co.uk)

zbw_109
11-21-2006, 02:58 AM
With the SOM and '46 add-ons having new code and joystick settings will it still be possible to play online 4.04 & 4.05 servers?

On the Pe-2 download page it says 'Flak 18 88mm AAG' I thought this was a error until Isaw it was a re-textured grey one, is this a new object (Grey and Bronze 88s) or does this apply to the 88 we'

zbw_109
11-21-2006, 02:58 AM
With the SOM and '46 add-ons having new code and joystick settings will it still be possible to play online 4.04 & 4.05 servers?

On the Pe-2 download page it says 'Flak 18 88mm AAG' I thought this was a error until Isaw it was a re-textured grey one, is this a new object (Grey and Bronze 88s) or does this apply to the 88 we'

LEXX_Luthor
11-21-2006, 04:40 AM
I've heard of two sides in the P-39 Debate, and I'm not sure which is true, or both, or none. Here is where I first heard anything of the issue, strongly pro P-39 Porked

How America's Best Pre-War Single Engine Fighter Was Ruined By The Air Corps
~&gt; http://home.att.net/~C.C.Jordan/XP-39.html (http://home.att.net/%7EC.C.Jordan/XP-39.html)

But I've also read otherwise. Not sure now.

As for missing Brit46, DuxCorvan poasted a working theory that Spain joined the Axis and sent an Armada that conquered Britain sometime after 1940, thus leaving Rocket Rudel and Buck Ivan to duke it out in the East with rockets and ramjets. YP-80 can be used as a Lend Leace 46 aircraft for Eastern Front.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

__________________
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif Flyable Swedish "Gladiator" listed as J8A...in FB Gold...and...Aces Expansion Pack

"You will still have FB, you will lose nothing" ~WUAF_Badsight
"I had actually pre ordered CFS3 and I couldnt wait..." ~Bearcat99
"At the altitudes this community flies at, diving is not an option." ~Stiglr
"Gladiator and Falco, elegant weapons of a more civilized age" ~ElAurens
"109Z flew briefly, after being hit by a bomb. Go-229 also saw combat, when the factory was overrun." ~pingu666
:
"Where you did read about Spitfire made from a wood?
Close this book forever and don't open anymore!" ~Oleg_Maddox http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

Thanatos833
11-21-2006, 07:13 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">That's faster than even the famous Rare Bear... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>IIRC the bear can reach 575 miles an hour.

stathem
11-21-2006, 07:19 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Thanatos833:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">That's faster than even the famous Rare Bear... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>IIRC the bear can reach 575 miles an hour. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not that Bear;

http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/russia/bomber/tu-95-bear_p3.jpg

This Bear!

http://www.rarebear.com/bear2.jpg <div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/griffnav/Gallery/MossiePRsig.jpg