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sakai2005
03-25-2010, 05:39 PM
this may have been posted before not sure tho.
fritz von opel 1929 jet flight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...gE-o&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEyf1KFgE-o&feature=related)

sakai2005
03-25-2010, 05:39 PM
this may have been posted before not sure tho.
fritz von opel 1929 jet flight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...gE-o&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEyf1KFgE-o&feature=related)

Bremspropeller
03-25-2010, 05:45 PM
Rocket-plane, not a jet-plane.

Choctaw111
03-25-2010, 05:53 PM
The Heinkel 178 was the first plane to use jet power.
That rocket plane thing was pretty neat though.

TinyTim
03-25-2010, 06:20 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bremspropeller:
Rocket-plane, not a jet-plane. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Doesn't rocket propulsion fall into the jet cathegory by definition?

Dance
03-25-2010, 06:28 PM
Oh no, I see a debate on semantics coming, but broadly speaking I think TT is right.

Daiichidoku
03-25-2010, 06:41 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coand%C4%83-1910

Choctaw111
03-25-2010, 07:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coand%C4%83-1910 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is pretty amazing. I never knew about this.

sakai2005
03-26-2010, 03:32 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coand%C4%83-1910 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Id love to see that on film.
thanks.

Bremspropeller
03-26-2010, 09:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Doesn't rocket propulsion fall into the jet cathegory by definition? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No.
They both work kinda similar, but jet-engines are a different bag of fleas, concerning complexity and difficulties of development.

Mixing two fluids for a bang is quite a bit easier (though not "easy") than figuring out how to build and comfortably run a turbojet/ turboprop/ turbofan.

Heliopause
03-26-2010, 11:16 AM
Interesting clip Sakai, thanks for posting.

The Coanda engine had an compressor driven by a piston engine. (later the Caproni Campini (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caproni_Campini_N.1) used the same method).

M_Gunz
03-27-2010, 12:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coand%C4%83-1910 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Beat me to it. However in an earlier non-web account his wings caught fire before leaving the ground,
the surprise was how hot the exhaust was.

There was an Italian piston-engine-driven-turbine jet, IIRC a Caproni that flew but didn't benefit enough
to go beyond flying prototype. And wonder of wonders, here's the Wiki. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caproni_Campini_N1)
First -successful- jet flight goes to Italy!

TinyTim
03-27-2010, 01:58 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bremspropeller:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Doesn't rocket propulsion fall into the jet cathegory by definition? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No.
They both work kinda similar, but jet-engines are a different bag of fleas, concerning complexity and difficulties of development.

Mixing two fluids for a bang is quite a bit easier (though not "easy") than figuring out how to build and comfortably run a turbojet/ turboprop/ turbofan. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Of course.

But like Dance said, it's purely a matter of semantics. I only wondered if in aeronautics rocket engines are considered as jet engines or not - by definition of the term "jet propulsion". In general language they certainly are - since it's hot gases or fluid which exit some kind of nozzle that propell the plane forward due to reaktion force (or conservation of momentum if you will). Even some animals use jet propulsion in this sense. A very broad term and I find it no wonder they narrow it down in aeronautics and omit the rocket engines from other, much more complex engines that breathe air.

BTW, how's with ramjets then? Still incredibly simple - an open tube moving through air, inside which you burn fuel. No compressor, no moving parts at all. I'd dare to say they are even simpler than rocket engines. Yet the do breathe air. What's the consensus here?

Bremspropeller
03-27-2010, 04:36 AM
The're called "rocket-engines" "jet-engines" and "ramjets".

Haven't heard anyone of my professors referring to rocket-engines as "jets".
They're just calling it by their exact names.

VF-17_Jolly
03-27-2010, 05:55 AM
You try running a jet engine in space.
The rocket engine is defined by the fact that it carries it's own oxidant where as a jet engine be it turbine, ram or scram compresses atmospheric gas as an oxidant http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

TinyTim
03-27-2010, 10:37 AM
Thanks for claring that up Brems, sounds logical.

Daiichidoku
03-29-2010, 11:44 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by M_Gunz:
There was an Italian piston-engine-driven-turbine jet, IIRC a Caproni that flew but didn't benefit enough
to go beyond flying prototype.
First -successful- jet flight goes to Italy! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

?

Caproni Campini N.1
first flight 27 aug 1940

Heinkel He 178
first flight 27 aug 1939

Bremspropeller
03-29-2010, 11:53 AM
Beat by an "italian minute" http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/inlove.gif

M_Gunz
03-29-2010, 04:01 PM
I thought it flew earlier. My bad. I like Heinkel better anyway, too bad for Germany
the establishment there did not but good for most of the rest of the world.

WTE_Galway
03-29-2010, 04:18 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by M_Gunz:
There was an Italian piston-engine-driven-turbine jet, IIRC a Caproni that flew but didn't benefit enough
to go beyond flying prototype.
First -successful- jet flight goes to Italy! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

?

Caproni Campini N.1
first flight 27 aug 1940

Heinkel He 178
first flight 27 aug 1939 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Video with commentary by the pilot ERICH WARSITZ:


http://www.firstjetpilot.com/HE178firstjetflight.html