PDA

View Full Version : How consistently can you land on the escort carrier w/o dmg?



Superjew1
06-15-2009, 09:55 AM
Ive tried this over and over and I am very inconsistent, I crash alot more than i land, kill myself about 1/4th the time and damage the plane about 7/8 times. I just cant get it down.

BTW Im mainly concentrating on using the F4U Corsair, for some oddreason it stalls out at below 170kmh when according to wikipedia, it was designed to not stall out til below 110 kmh so I think that either wikipedia is wrong or the game is wrong, but either way it makes it harder to land than an SBD since your approach needs to be significantly faster to remain stable.

I kinda quit playing this game for a few months cuz I couldnt get multip[layer to work with vista, but I came back, bought a TrackIR, and am getting a 2nd harddrive with Windows XP on it, just so I can hopefully play online dogfighting and coops. Im hoping the TrackIR will help me land better so I dont have to touch my mouse to look around.

orville07
06-15-2009, 11:10 AM
Hi Superjew (lol). The Corsair is notoriously awkward in landings (as it apparently was in real life), and one of the more difficult to get on a carrier. Are you aware that you can adjust the pilot seat/view in this particular plane so as to have a better visibility for landing? Don't recall the keys for it offhand, but it can be done and its very helpful. There is also a red light which gives you a stall warning, not far below your gunsight. Take a look here http://www.darts-page.com/ If you look in the movies section (or it may be files) dart gives an very good example of the "Circuit" or "racetrack" method of carrier landing in a Corsair. You wont always have the time or opportunity to do this (especially online when vultures are perching), but it is worthwile learning as the principles are sound, and will lead to consistency. Practice, practice practice is the order of the day, persevere and you will eventually get there I guarantee. You will 'click' eventually, be sure. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

EDIT: You must assign a key to "Toggle seat position" in "controls" yourself, there is no default.

RAF_OldBuzzard
06-15-2009, 01:22 PM
If landing on a stationary carrier in a Corsair, I will use @100 MPH through out the landing pattern and toughdown. 110 KPH is WAY too slow in a Corsair.

If it's a moving carrier I will increase that to 115-120 MPH, since it still leaves me about 100 MPH relative to the carrier.

Having a bit of extra speed helps with control, and will also help if you bolter. Getting stopped is no problem. That's what the hook is for.

EDIT:

I just did a quick run through the Navy Training video for the Corsair on Zeno's site, and according the them the Corsair stalls at 77 KTS/88 MPH with gear and flaps down, and at 85 KTS/97 MPH in the clean condition.

... according to wikipedia, it was designed to not stall out til below 110 kmh so I think that either wikipedia is wrong or the game is wrong Whoever put those numbers in wikipedia is an idiiot.

I'd trust this video from the US Navy, done DURING WWII more than I'd trust anything in wikipedia.
http://www.zenoswarbirdvideos.com/F4U.html

slipBall
06-15-2009, 02:14 PM
Originally posted by Superjew1:
Ive tried this over and over and I am very inconsistent, I crash alot more than i land, kill myself about 1/4th the time and damage the plane about 7/8 times. I just cant get it down.

BTW Im mainly concentrating on using the F4U Corsair, for some oddreason it stalls out at below 170kmh when according to wikipedia, it was designed to not stall out til below 110 kmh so I think that either wikipedia is wrong or the game is wrong, but either way it makes it harder to land than an SBD since your approach needs to be significantly faster to remain stable.

I kinda quit playing this game for a few months cuz I couldnt get multip[layer to work with vista, but I came back, bought a TrackIR, and am getting a 2nd harddrive with Vista on it, just so I can hopefully play online dogfighting and coops. Im hoping the TrackIR will help me land better so I dont have to touch my mouse to look around.


My first question would be to ask if you always land safely on dry land, but seem to have this problem only on ships. If you fail a land landing, you most likely are altering some aspect of your landing approach. You should be at 100% landing success on dry land with any aircraft that you are familiar with, then progress to ship landings. Really the only way that states you fully understand what's at play in landing...good luck http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Ba5tard5word
06-15-2009, 02:36 PM
You just have to practice and get a feel for it, and it's useful to figure out the best speed and throttle to be at when coming in. I've been practicing landing a Corsair on a regular carrier and it was tough. Eventually I found it could be done if at around 30% throttle and at about 200kph or a bit less. Maybe I could come in slower but when I do I start dropping like a rock and crash down on the deck or crash into the carrier under its deck. I try and float down with my nose up a bit and pull back on the stick when I touch down so my hook catches...it's still tough but I can do it more regularly now.

VW-IceFire
06-15-2009, 04:27 PM
Escort Carriers were meant for FM-2 Wildcats and TBM/TBF Avengers. So already you are at a disadvantage...the Corsair (or the Ensign Eliminator) is historically a handful to land on the deck of any ship nevermind a tiny escort carrier.

If you can get a Corsair down on one in any way then you're already ahead of the game.

jayhall0315
06-15-2009, 04:52 PM
I am pretty adept with the Corsair and I tend to approach escort carriers just as real naval aviators do, which is to approach full flaps down, prop pitch slightly lower, radiator on open and if no foul weather, then canopy open and seat up. You must accurately land and hit the second or three wire in order to do well consistently, and if you fail, throw throttle forward, pull flaps up to take off and touch and go. Its a little bit of a speed and timing issue to, so practice it.

WTE_Galway
06-15-2009, 05:35 PM
If you think escort carriers are hard ... try some of the landing missions in this ...



http://www.mission4today.com/i...file=details&id=3102 (http://www.mission4today.com/index.php?name=Downloads&file=details&id=3102)


http://combat-asylum.com/uploads/downloads/images/2007/10/369_7_grab0001_resize.jpg

http://combat-asylum.com/uploads/downloads/images/2007/10/369_7_grab0002_resize.jpg

BillSwagger
06-15-2009, 05:40 PM
I would first practice in an F6F before trying to land a Corsair.

Wiki, isn't always the most accurate source, but for airplane performance stats they tend to be consistent with other sources.

If you are using full landing flaps you should be okay at 170kph as long as your in a steady descent. I normally roll/stall a Corsair cause ill be short on my approach, and there is a tendency to nose up to compensate, so my speed drops and SWOOSH,,,,, splash!!!

Waldo.Pepper
06-15-2009, 06:28 PM
Everytime. It is easy.

http://video.google.ca/videopl...=4165453209967617232 (http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=4165453209967617232)

P.FunkAdelic
06-15-2009, 06:36 PM
He probably was misreading 110 mph as kph.

Carrier landings are hard in general. Escort carriers are even harder. They are the precision test. No room for error really. You probably want to practice on the larger ones til you can easily land as close to the beginning of the deck and once thats down to a science where you can literally control where you touch down you can start gambling on the smaller ones.

Superjew1
06-16-2009, 01:32 AM
Nope, copy and pasted from wikipedia

"In February 1938, the U.S. Navy Bureau of Aeronautics published two requests for proposal, for twin-engined and single-engined fighters. For the single-engined fighter the Navy requested the maximum obtainable speed, and a stalling speed not higher than 70 miles per hour (110 km/h)"


I have very little problem landing on a full sized carrier or land, I am mainly concentrating on the escort carrier with the corsair because I like a good challenge.

Im starting to find that if I kick the rudder opposite the side of the deck I am heading towards I am much less likely to go off and crash into the ocean, but other than that its still difficult as all hell.

GIAP.Shura
06-16-2009, 04:37 AM
I don't know much about the Corsair but the Wikipedia article, assuming it is accurate, only mentions what the requested stall speed was, not the actual stall speed. It also doesn't mention if this request was for a dirty or clean stall speed.

Personally, in game, if the aircraft has a hook I find it pretty easy to get them down undamaged on a carrier.

Tully__
06-16-2009, 06:39 AM
Originally posted by GIAP.Shura:
Personally, in game, if the aircraft has a hook I find it pretty easy to get them down undamaged on a carrier.

Same. You have to get them slow enough that the tail is low to get a good chance of hooking a wire, set up the glide path and hold it there. As you touch down, smoothly cut throttle and as soon as you're stationary put in chocks.

The only hard part is learning how to judge where the carrier deck is when you can barely see it. If you're holding the right speed and on the right glide path, the aircraft attitude will be sufficiently nose high that it's difficult to see the deck.

Slow enough is about 160 - 170km/h. You can fly the F4U down to about 150 without stalling with flaps and gear down, but you really have to dance on the rudder as you adjust throttle or it drops a wing tip at that speed. Get used to paying attention to using rudder / rudder trim to keep the aircraft straight (centre the ball on the slip indicator) during normal flying and this will become easier. Note that every throttle change will require you to compensate with rudder until you trim for the new throttle setting.

Superjew1
06-16-2009, 07:18 AM
I just did it 10x and had 5 succesful landings. I guess Ill see if I can break that record for myself.

BTW, I prefer the F4U-1D, is it any easier to fly than the F4U-1A? What are the differences between the two?

SterlingX
06-16-2009, 07:42 AM
What works best for me is to pull briefly on the stick when passing over the wires; the tail goes down and hook engages. I also find it easier to land at zero throttle - the glide path is steeper and you can see the carrier all the way.

(edit: made track - http://www.datafilehost.com/download-4d2f399c.html )

UgoRipley
06-16-2009, 05:44 PM
There is also this magic "Paul Wilson's landing tutorial" that should enlighten some.
http://www.87th.org/modules.ph...viewarticle&artid=22 (http://www.87th.org/modules.php?name=Sections&op=viewarticle&artid=22)
When I first read it, it opened my mind !!
It is THE method real F-16 pilots use.
Now, before asking yourself why I should post it here then, give it a read (hint) ;-)

In that guide there is all you need to know about this unusual "inverted" controls (Throttle for altitude and Pitch for speed) shown in Waldo Pepper's video.
Of course all those electronic things apply to F-16s, but the theory is the same. Once you grasp the method, you can easily translate it to IL-2.

If you use a (kind of) cheat in IL-2, you can get that FPM, or Flight Path Marker too. It's all about flying in no-cockpit view, one of those things that we all did when we were noobs and learning the secrets. In that way you'll get a well documented - though not historical - visual aid, the FPM, a floating little circle in the middle of your view, showing you where your aircaft is actually >going to impact<. You want to put that FPM right on top of the first few meters of the carrier deck and keep it there.

After learning this method, you'll get the feeling and you can revert back to full closed cockpit view.
You'll be able to reproduce the correct glide anyway.

VW-IceFire
06-16-2009, 07:29 PM
Originally posted by Superjew1:
I just did it 10x and had 5 succesful landings. I guess Ill see if I can break that record for myself.

BTW, I prefer the F4U-1D, is it any easier to fly than the F4U-1A? What are the differences between the two?
The F4U-1D has rocket rails and reduced fuel capacity and at the same fuel percentage will be lighter than the F4U-1A. Also there are additional cockpit braces in the 1A that are removed for the 1D. Other than that...not much.

wheelsup_cavu
06-16-2009, 07:40 PM
I would have thought someone would have suggested Zeus-cat's Straight from the Farm (http://www.mission4today.com/index.php?name=Downloads&file=details&id=2147) campaign already.

I believe this is the tutorial of Dart's suggested earlier in streaming video if you don't want to download it.
How To Land a Corsair on a Carrier (http://il2mdb.montydan.com/how-to-land-a-corsair-on-a-carrier)


Wheelsup

Blindman-
06-17-2009, 02:29 PM
I have practiced landing on carriers with the Corsair ALLOT! and the one thing I found is that it helps to slowly and progressively make the conditions harder and harder. Start with longer and faster moving carriers and move toward shorter and slower moving carriers. At this time I have only but a very few times been able to land a Corsair on a stationary Jeep carrier and have gone back to 25kph where I can land about 80% of the time. Add some weather or battle damage and the likelihood of landing successfully goes way down.

For anyone just learning to take-off and land on carriers I would recommend the Training Missions linked to my signature. There is allot of instruction and advice in the Mission Briefings for those missions (at different levels of difficulty) to help anyone getting started with carrier landings.

DKoor
06-17-2009, 02:33 PM
If I really am paying an attention, I can land on carrier successfully almost every time. Of course with some aircraft that is more difficult than the others.... say D3A and A6M are among easiest to land very low approach speed, also SBD-5 because you have a nice telescopic sight...