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HART_dreyer
12-12-2005, 03:23 AM
Hello,

I'm thinking of purchasing TrackIR now, I was browsing naturalpoint.com and discovered they now offer a new model. Does anyone own the TrackIR 4? Is it worth the extra money compared to the TrackIR 3?

HART_dreyer
12-12-2005, 03:23 AM
Hello,

I'm thinking of purchasing TrackIR now, I was browsing naturalpoint.com and discovered they now offer a new model. Does anyone own the TrackIR 4? Is it worth the extra money compared to the TrackIR 3?

hamselv2
12-12-2005, 09:27 AM
I have both a TrackIR3 Pro and a TrackIR4.
I think that the TrackIR4 is a better product as I dont have to recenter the view as often as in the earlier model: TIR4 rarely 'lose contact' with the game.
The TIR4 is 'born' with the 6dof feature that is not fully supported by Pacific Fighters, but will work in other applications. With a TrackIR3 you will have to buy the 6dof as an 'extra'.
I can only recommend TIR4, but the TrackIR3 Pro is not bad either. With both you will probably have to make an effort to find a profile that fits you and your needs. The software/driver has improved a lot since I bought my TIR3 Pro.

blairgowrie
12-12-2005, 10:49 AM
This is very good information to know as the question has come up fairly often in the past few days.

Thanks for posting this hamselv2

BM357_TinMan
12-12-2005, 12:20 PM
Too bad, with all of these patches, no 3-d cockpits were made for this game so 6dof is not supported in IL2 series... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

sorryroper
01-13-2006, 09:34 PM
So do I understand right that the latest trackir will support 6DOF when playing PF+IL2+AEP?, even though the game would normally only support 2DOF?

I had no idea this kinda thing existed until today! I can't stop thinking about it! As if I don't already have a "problem" (according to my wife) now I can look out the cockpit just by moving my head? Why I am I wasting my time typing this? I should be online and buying one 5 minutes ago... I gotta go... Must buy TrackIR and roses for wife....

Sorryroper

Owlsphone
01-13-2006, 10:01 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sorryroper:
So do I understand right that the latest trackir will support 6DOF when playing PF+IL2+AEP?, even though the game would normally only support 2DOF?

I had no idea this kinda thing existed until today! I can't stop thinking about it! As if I don't already have a "problem" (according to my wife) now I can look out the cockpit just by moving my head? Why I am I wasting my time typing this? I should be online and buying one 5 minutes ago... I gotta go... Must buy TrackIR and roses for wife....

Sorryroper </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You are mistaken. Although the newest TrackIR 4 comes with 6dof support, the game must support the feature. Since PF doesn't have 6dof support, it will go unused in this game (it only supports 2dof). Other games that support 6dof will work fine with the TrackIR 4 however.

dieg777
01-14-2006, 12:42 AM
TIR4 initial review at airwarfare-

http://www.airwarfare.com/AWX/features/reviews/trackir4_review.htm

TIR3 and TIR3+VE also reviewed on the site for comparison

I will be updating this soon as I have BOB 2 WOV and this supports 6DOF.

IMHO the VE and better centering control of TIR 4 is worth the extra- much smoother control. TIR 4 also fits better on flat screens.

ytareh
01-14-2006, 03:18 AM
I see under the specs of the TIR4 it says resolution is something low (like 700x600)Is this what you are looking at on screen?Surely thats very grainy?Or does it mean something else?

dieg777
01-14-2006, 04:12 AM
your screen resolution is unaffected-you can play normal resolutions- so must relate to unit.

sukebeboy
01-14-2006, 09:39 AM
I just got my Track IR 4 a few days ago and I have to say I don't really feel it's worth the money. It's more like a neat little toy or a gimmick than a really useful tool, in my opinion. I find that I prefer using padlock when in the cockpit and disabling TrackIR and using mouselook with external views.

FluffyBunnies
01-14-2006, 12:24 PM
20 minutes after I started using my TIR2(maybe 3 years ago?) I switched off padlock and have never used it since.
Why bother with switches on your joystick etc when all you have to do is follow the target by moving your eyes(head follows naturally)???

Pig_Mac
01-14-2006, 12:40 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sukebeboy:
I just got my Track IR 4 a few days ago and I have to say I don't really feel it's worth the money. It's more like a neat little toy or a gimmick than a really useful tool, in my opinion. I find that I prefer using padlock when in the cockpit and disabling TrackIR and using mouselook with external views. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Are you comparing to the older models or just comparing to padlock? (I'm about to buy a TIR4 and i'm a bit curious)

sukebeboy
01-14-2006, 06:53 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xallo_72:

Are you comparing to the older models or just comparing to padlock? (I'm about to buy a TIR4 and i'm a bit curious) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm comparing it to padlock. I've never used a TrackIR before this.

LStarosta
01-15-2006, 10:40 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sukebeboy:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xallo_72:

Are you comparing to the older models or just comparing to padlock? (I'm about to buy a TIR4 and i'm a bit curious) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm comparing it to padlock. I've never used a TrackIR before this. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's stupid. You've never used a TrackIR before in your life and you've had it for, and I quote, "a few days", and you're already passing judgement by calling it nothing but, and I quote, "a neat little toy"?

Give it two weeks, be sure.

sukebeboy
01-15-2006, 03:56 PM
Well thanks ever so much for forming my opinions for me. Shall I just vet everything by you before posting then and you can edit so my statements more closely reflect your own beliefs?

Pig_Mac
01-18-2006, 06:10 AM
I went ahead and ordered a TIR4. I just hope it's worth it .. since the money I have left for food and booze for the rest of the month, after paying for the TIR4, is almost the same amount I just spent on the thingie.

Nigel_Woodman
01-18-2006, 06:49 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xallo_72:
I went ahead and ordered a TIR4. I just hope it's worth it .. since the money I have left for food and booze for the rest of the month, after paying for the TIR4, is almost the same amount I just spent on the thingie. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You will not be sorry. TIR4 doubles or triples the fun/immersion/playability/enjoyment of any flight sim that can employ it. Once you have TIR4 you will NEVER use padlock again.

IL-2 does not allow for the 6dof that TIR4 can deliver, but never mind. The results it delivers in IL-2 are worth it anyway. I also fly BoB Wings of Victory that does allow 6dof. To be honest, it's a little much at times. You can actually open the canopy and stick your head out, you can look around struts, you can move your head toward the gunsight to get a closer view....it's all enough to make a person airsick.

TIR4 - get it, you won't be sorry.

Pig_Mac
01-18-2006, 08:23 AM
I havn't used padlock since i considered it cheating in WWII fighters http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif . and I a little starvation will only do me good, I'm getting too lazy from spending all my spare time in virtual planes.

Worf101
01-18-2006, 08:52 AM
Well, I've got Track IR 3 Pro and while I use it, it does have it's problems. Mine loses center a lot. When I first log on a game with it it works wonderfully and smoothly. As the mission goes on it gets jerkier and jerkier and harder and harder to make it register. I almost always lose the ability to turn my head to the right.

There's no way to really adjust the tracking during a game so I'm ususally stuck with little or no head movement. Perhaps I don't have it set up right. I've other squad mates who don't like it much either altought they have it. It's "alright" but quirky if you ask me.

Worf101 99th Pursuit Squadron. 332nd V.F.G. "Spit Fire"

JG52-6High
01-18-2006, 09:29 AM
I went from TackIR 1 to 4 2 weeks ago....unbelievable!
Really worth the upgrade, i was a little sceptical http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
Centering, smoothness, tracking, has all improved ALOT!

BTW Worf:
Given the fact that a certain (small) amount of people just cannot get used to the Tracker, i find , in most cases, it`s an issue of setting it up to your liking....I too did a lot of tweaking and fiddling, until it worked out(main thing was the "disable" button i use for aiming sometimes..).

Oh, and...padlock?? What does using padlock have to do with a TrackIR? I mean , if you`re gonna fly "cheating" http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif , you surely won`t need a TrackIR. Thats like someone flying wonderwomanview and complaining the TrackIR gets him confused http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif
Try flying full-switch, then compare TIR to hatswitch/numpad/mouse/whatever, then come back and state your opinion.....

Armhunter
01-18-2006, 11:02 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LStarosta:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sukebeboy:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xallo_72:

Are you comparing to the older models or just comparing to padlock? (I'm about to buy a TIR4 and i'm a bit curious) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm comparing it to padlock. I've never used a TrackIR before this. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's stupid. You've never used a TrackIR before in your life and you've had it for, and I quote, "a few days", and you're already passing judgement by calling it nothing but, and I quote, "a neat little toy"?

Give it two weeks, be sure. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I would have to agree, although I would not call anyone stupid, but making a decision on a very short time frame is not going to be taken serious.

I got my Track IR4 for Christmas and I wont fly anymore without it.. I used to use the hatswitch to look around and now will never go back. I can keep my eyes on the enemy while doing all the crazy moves during a dogfight at the same time, I keep my hands on the controls.... Well Worth the Money!

Jetbuff
01-18-2006, 11:50 AM
TrackIR is, by far, the best accessory I have ever purchased for a flight sim. No, not even my HOTAS X45 (which I love btw) can best it.

If you have purchased trackIR and not have it revolutionize your simming, you're doing something terribly, terribly wrong!

Common mistakes for reference:

1. Extraneous sources of IR behind or even on you: be especially aware of reflections that only appear at certain head angles, e.g. my glasses caused a little 'hiccup' at certain lookup angles.

2. Improperly set up profile: Take your time and note that just because a profile works great for someone else doesn't mean it will for you. Indeed, I almost always recommend starting from scratch and developing your own custom setup. Good tips though are to always set 0 speed for the innermost edit point(s) which makes the look forward (through the gunsight) a tad steadier and make sure you can get to the full range of in-game movement well before you're looking at the edge of your monitor.

3. Forgetting to actually use TrackIR enhanced mode: this is the oft complained about 'lack of centering' issue. It never happens in enhanced mode but is quite common in mouse emulation mode. To use the former, you need to check that your conf.ini contains the line 'trackIRUse = 1' and that your profile is set to use enhanced mode. PS: mouse-emulation mode is also more 'jittery' while enhanced tracking is silky smooth unless you are having fps issues.

4. Bad/small reflective dots: always use the tracking window to find just how far you can move before the reflective material is no longer in view. This problem is far less severe when using Vector and/or TrackIR 4. In the TrackIR software, you may also want to play around with your filtering parameters to make sure that your dot, and only your dot, gets tracked. e.g. you can set the filters to ignore certain size dots, static dots, etc...

5. Incorrect tracker unit placement: you need to place it at least 60cm from your head, i.e. 2 feet. Any closer and you simply won't have the desired FoV/range of motion available. Think 30? tracking angle (~ 40? for the TrackIR 4) and expand it outwards from the device and you'll understand just how important sitting far back from the device really is.

Pig_Mac
01-18-2006, 12:23 PM
Ever since the days of pre-DOOM 1* I've had a tendancy(sp?) to almost flip out of my chair 'trying-to-see-whats-beyond-the-corner'

In less then a week I prolly know!



*or was it wolfenstein?.. bah doesn't matter Doom were a lot more fun in multiplayer!

Worf101
01-19-2006, 11:38 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jetbuff:
TrackIR is, by far, the best accessory I have ever purchased for a flight sim. No, not even my HOTAS X45 (which I love btw) can best it.

If you have purchased trackIR and not have it revolutionize your simming, you're doing something terribly, terribly wrong!

Common mistakes for reference:

1. Extraneous sources of IR behind or even on you: be especially aware of reflections that only appear at certain head angles, e.g. my glasses caused a little 'hiccup' at certain lookup angles.

2. Improperly set up profile: Take your time and note that just because a profile works great for someone else doesn't mean it will for you. Indeed, I almost always recommend starting from scratch and developing your own custom setup. Good tips though are to always set 0 speed for the innermost edit point(s) which makes the look forward (through the gunsight) a tad steadier and make sure you can get to the full range of in-game movement well before you're looking at the edge of your monitor.

3. Forgetting to actually use TrackIR enhanced mode: this is the oft complained about 'lack of centering' issue. It never happens in enhanced mode but is quite common in mouse emulation mode. To use the former, you need to check that your conf.ini contains the line 'trackIRUse = 1' and that your profile is set to use enhanced mode. PS: mouse-emulation mode is also more 'jittery' while enhanced tracking is silky smooth unless you are having fps issues.

4. Bad/small reflective dots: always use the tracking window to find just how far you can move before the reflective material is no longer in view. This problem is far less severe when using Vector and/or TrackIR 4. In the TrackIR software, you may also want to play around with your filtering parameters to make sure that your dot, and only your dot, gets tracked. e.g. you can set the filters to ignore certain size dots, static dots, etc...

5. Incorrect tracker unit placement: you need to place it at least 60cm from your head, i.e. 2 feet. Any closer and you simply won't have the desired FoV/range of motion available. Think 30? tracking angle (~ 40? for the TrackIR 4) and expand it outwards from the device and you'll understand just how important sitting far back from the device really is. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well far be it from me to live with a closed mind. I went home and tried all the things you suggested and lo and behold my TrackIR 3 Pro experience has improved greatly. My biggest problem was that I was way to close to the monitor/receiver. Once pushed back to around 2.5 feet, things got rosey right quick. Thanks Jetbuff for helping educate me and improve my simming experience.

Worf101 99th Pursuit Squadron. 332nd V.F.G. "Spit Fire"

blakduk
01-19-2006, 06:30 PM
Worf- dont feel bad, i had the same problem. It turned out that i had the unit too close to my head- i use a laptop and had the TrackIR camera attached to my monitor. I put it further back and 'hey presto' problems solved.
Occassionaly i still have a problem of the tracking getting messed up if i turn too far away- usually by my having to do something away from the computer mid-game (did Galland ever have his mother-in-law telephone him just when he'd manouverued for a perfect tracking shot?????). If use the 'F12' default key for recentering the tracking it works quite well.
I have the TrackIR3 with vector expansion- i assume from the specs that the TrackIR4 would be able to be placed closer to your head as it has a greater angle of view. For me, using a laptop, it would probably be better but its certainly the tool that has increased my fun most with this game.

BadA1m
01-19-2006, 07:54 PM
For any one who has Track IR2 or 3 without Vector, I have a great tip (besides all the good ones from Jetbuff). Order up the strip of reflective material from Natural point, then head down to the local craft store and get a 3/4" wooden ball (you'll probably have to get a bag of 4 or 5). Proceed then to hardware store (or garage) for a small finish nail and nip the head off said nail with side cutters or something (DO NOT use wife's scissors). Pilot drill the ball a little smaller than the nail (and please hold the ball in a vice or ANYthing other than your hand) and tap the nail in backwards with something soft enough that it won't smash up the tip of the nail. Now take your reflective material and cover the side of the ball opposite the nail with it (you only need to cover half) try to get it somewhat neat but the wrinkles wont hurt it as much as handling it too much. Now take this goofy looking comtraption and stick it into the edge of the visor on a ball cap (I use an open top clerk visor)right in the center. You now have a monster dot that stays the same size no matter how much you turn your head, the tracker will never loose it and it makes adjusting much less fiddly. Try it, you'll like it.
Hope it was helpfull. ~S~

Hiriyu
01-19-2006, 08:45 PM
TIR4='teh pwnzer' http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif. I have just upgraded my old TIR2 to a new TIR4 (awash in the spirit of self-indulgence, I bought myself a complete CH Products controller suite as well http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif). What an astounding difference it has made... Tracking is extremely smooth and consistent compared to my old TIR2 - graphical 'tearing' due to refresh (I run with no V-synch) is so much reduced that it really feels for all intents and purposes like I've picked up 20+ fps. I am really impressed with this purchase, it performs far better than I had dared imagine. Highly recommend!

(Word to the wise, there is a $30.00 discount on TIR4 for SimHQ members at gogamer.com)

Armhunter
01-20-2006, 12:12 AM
BadA1m, Nice!! I can picture what you are saying in my head.. I dont think I need this, since Tir4 came with a nice reflector, but I would love to see pictures of yours...

WTE_Ibis
01-20-2006, 02:05 AM
I have a half ball mounted on a set of glasses and my TRIR2 works perfectly, I won't be upgrading it till Bob.
It is the single best component I have ever bought for simming but you need a good profile
I use "General_Purpose_Profile_777_Burnin_AVG" and most of my squad uses it as well.
Setting your own profile can be very tedious and frustrating to get it right.
I keep a spare set of frames with no glass in them to demonstrate to friends that dont wear glasses.
I centre it once on starup and from then on it holds centre untill you start another session.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

The last photo shows the reflection of the flash.

.
http://premium1.uploadit.org/Ibissix//P1010056.JPG
http://premium1.uploadit.org/Ibissix//P1010057.JPG
http://premium1.uploadit.org/Ibissix//P1010058.JPG

Doctor-Pain
01-20-2006, 04:20 AM
Hi,
I can only say, by the TrackIR4 or at least the 3 WITH vector expansion. I bought the TrackIR3pro last summer, first without vector. It was not bad, but also ablolutely not perfect. The problem is if it gets hot, I tend to move around in my chair and this bring the view out of center alot. I later bougt the Vector expansion, and I have to say, nor it's nearly perfect, as all the sideway and up and
down movement is not translated into game view, but only real rotation. It usually is enough to center it once after starting the game and it stays centered and is very precise. The only problem is,that I sometimes get out of the view of the tracking unit. So I wich I would have the 4 Version with its wider view angle.
--- Best Product for the feeling in a game I ever bought ---

Jetbuff
01-20-2006, 11:16 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Worf101:
Well far be it from me to live with a closed mind. I went home and tried all the things you suggested and lo and behold my TrackIR 3 Pro experience has improved greatly. My biggest problem was that I was way to close to the monitor/receiver. Once pushed back to around 2.5 feet, things got rosey right quick. Thanks Jetbuff for helping educate me and improve my simming experience. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
That'll be $40 please... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

Glad it worked out for you because sometimes it takes a while, esp. when it's a combination of issues. Cheers...

Scen
01-20-2006, 01:45 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sorryroper:
So do I understand right that the latest trackir will support 6DOF when playing PF+IL2+AEP?, even though the game would normally only support 2DOF?

I had no idea this kinda thing existed until today! I can't stop thinking about it! As if I don't already have a "problem" (according to my wife) now I can look out the cockpit just by moving my head? Why I am I wasting my time typing this? I should be online and buying one 5 minutes ago... I gotta go... Must buy TrackIR and roses for wife....

Sorryroper </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Trust me... You will be so glad you did! It is really that good.

Scen
01-20-2006, 01:47 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sukebeboy:
I just got my Track IR 4 a few days ago and I have to say I don't really feel it's worth the money. It's more like a neat little toy or a gimmick than a really useful tool, in my opinion. I find that I prefer using padlock when in the cockpit and disabling TrackIR and using mouselook with external views. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Are you serious? Padlock? hehee.... Try doing that on a server that disables it. I guess you play mostly single player.

Dude you should keep trying it out.

Padlock...lol

F19_Orheim
01-21-2006, 08:56 AM
I have been a very happy camper with my old TIR 1 for the past couple of years.. and so far I have seen no reason to upgrade. However, due to all the good words written about the TIR 4 and me maybe going to FS2004 a bit more I have recently ordered the new 4 version so I can take advantage of 6DOF. I see many ex TIR1 owners who have said it's a great streo between 1 and 4, and me beeing so happy with 1, I guess I will be even more happy now.

I concur with many posters here, the TIR is maybe the most important "gadget" for sims since the joystick. When I try to fly without it these days I get the impression of Tunnel vision... gotta use it.. gotta use it...