PDA

View Full Version : Hurricane MkII & Burma



Archer_F4U
03-25-2006, 11:12 PM
I'm most looking forward to Burma to make and fly some long-range Beaufighter missions - out to hunt down trains, boats, and whatever else I see hidden in the jungle. It may not be the right variant of the Beaufighter, but it's close enough. I'd love to be able to fly the entire range of RAF 3rd Tactical Air Force missions once we get the Burma map though, from tactical reconnaisance to ground attack and tactical bombing.

I realize there's likely no chance of a Beaufighter MkVI or TF.X, a Vultee Vengeance, a Hurricane IID or IV, any other plane we don't have, or tropical air filters added to IIBs and Cs. The one thing I hope will be changed before or with the release of the Burma map is the weapon loadouts for the Hurricane IIB and C.

I'm far from an expert on Hurricanes, but after a quick look at several internet sites that range from personal sites with and without references to organizations that (hopefully) know what they're talking about, it seems they are almost all in agreement that Hurricane IIBs and Cs could carry two 250lb bombs, two 500 lb bombs. From sometime in 1941 after April, they could carry external fuel tanks, and, from September 1943, eight RPs.

The best I've found in my readings of the 3rd TAF in the past few days is that of No.224 Group, most of their fighter-bomber squadrons were Hurricane MkIICs, which makes the inclusion of at the very least bombs for the Cs quite important.

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/History/1940s/Images/Hurri-Burma-Cart.jpg
An RAF Hurricane II [obviously a C from the cannons] armed with bombs at a forward airfield.
From: http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/History/1940s/Hurris.html

Can we expect the Hurricane IIB and IIC to gain weapon loadouts by the time the Burma map is released to allow somewhat accurate missions of the 3rd TAF to be made and flown?

Archer_F4U
03-25-2006, 11:12 PM
I'm most looking forward to Burma to make and fly some long-range Beaufighter missions - out to hunt down trains, boats, and whatever else I see hidden in the jungle. It may not be the right variant of the Beaufighter, but it's close enough. I'd love to be able to fly the entire range of RAF 3rd Tactical Air Force missions once we get the Burma map though, from tactical reconnaisance to ground attack and tactical bombing.

I realize there's likely no chance of a Beaufighter MkVI or TF.X, a Vultee Vengeance, a Hurricane IID or IV, any other plane we don't have, or tropical air filters added to IIBs and Cs. The one thing I hope will be changed before or with the release of the Burma map is the weapon loadouts for the Hurricane IIB and C.

I'm far from an expert on Hurricanes, but after a quick look at several internet sites that range from personal sites with and without references to organizations that (hopefully) know what they're talking about, it seems they are almost all in agreement that Hurricane IIBs and Cs could carry two 250lb bombs, two 500 lb bombs. From sometime in 1941 after April, they could carry external fuel tanks, and, from September 1943, eight RPs.

The best I've found in my readings of the 3rd TAF in the past few days is that of No.224 Group, most of their fighter-bomber squadrons were Hurricane MkIICs, which makes the inclusion of at the very least bombs for the Cs quite important.

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/History/1940s/Images/Hurri-Burma-Cart.jpg
An RAF Hurricane II [obviously a C from the cannons] armed with bombs at a forward airfield.
From: http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/History/1940s/Hurris.html

Can we expect the Hurricane IIB and IIC to gain weapon loadouts by the time the Burma map is released to allow somewhat accurate missions of the 3rd TAF to be made and flown?

ImpStarDuece
03-26-2006, 04:47 AM
Hurricane IIb and IIc also operated as "Hurribombers" out of Malta by mid 1942. Initially they used 250lbrs, but later 500lbrs were used with some sucess as well.

Interestingly, most of the Hurricanes flying out of Malta after the first quarter of 1942 had their outboard cannons and all the associated fittings removed to increase performance and range. Doing so shaved around 220 kg off their take off weight, with a subsequent small increase in both rate of climb and manouverability.

Grey_Mouser67
03-26-2006, 10:14 AM
We need the oxen and cart!

Just don't overmodel it please!

Anyone have a link or some good data on the performance of Hurricanes? They are quite slow in this game and maybe they are close to accurate, but I can't help feeling that they aren't when I'm getting tracked down by Oscars.

Stigler_9_JG52
03-26-2006, 01:40 PM
Just be sure and do your research before you go slapping cannon-armed Hurricanes in willy nilly.

Burma and the DEI area were relative backwaters of the British empire, and the better aircraft were rarities. I'd be shocked if it wasn't the case in Burma, as it definitely was on Malta, that there were many, many more IIBs than IICs.

In fact, if the scenario or server or coop couldn't be written to limit the number of IICs from player (over)use, I'd write the scenario only with IIBs. That is, if you're interested in any historicity.

Beaufort-RAF
03-27-2006, 12:19 AM
This has been discussed before on this forum but the threads were hijacked by people asking for rockets, 40mm anti-tank guns & Sea Hurricanes. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

That just ain't gonna happen.

This needs to be kept simple.

2 x 500lbs was sometimes carried but 2 x 250lbs was the the standard, common loadout.

What we need is a 2 x 250lb loadout for the IIC.

That's all.

ianboys
03-27-2006, 07:01 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Stigler_9_JG52:
Just be sure and do your research before you go slapping cannon-armed Hurricanes in willy nilly.

Burma and the DEI area were relative backwaters of the British empire, and the better aircraft were rarities. I'd be shocked if it wasn't the case in Burma, as it definitely was on Malta, that there were many, many more IIBs than IICs.

In fact, if the scenario or server or coop couldn't be written to limit the number of IICs from player (over)use, I'd write the scenario only with IIBs. That is, if you're interested in any historicity. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, there were far more IIC's than IIB's.

And is "historicity" a real word?

JG53Frankyboy
03-27-2006, 07:36 AM
so, giving the IIc also bombs like the IIb would be even be more welcome http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

i find a Mk.IV loadout very interesting:
left wing with 44 impgal Droptank
right wing 4 rockets http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Archer_F4U
03-27-2006, 09:30 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Beaufort-RAF:
2 x 500lbs was sometimes carried but 2 x 250lbs was the the standard, common loadout.

What we need is a 2 x 250lb loadout for the IIC.

That's all. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Even if 250lb bombs were normally used, I'd like 500lb bombs as an option as well for the odd mission that they were used. I realize online people would rarely take the 250lb bombs except in Coop missions with locked loadouts, but it isn't like all of the planes in FB have realistic ordnance loads (looks over to the F4U-1A).

I have no clue how ordnance is dealt with in PF, but in CFS2 the pylons and weapons are seperate models that are coded to appear in the correct positions. If PF deals with ordnance in the same manner, would it be possible to just use the Beaufighter's rocket rails and rockets on the Hurricanes? I have no clue if they used the same rails, but they're the right rockets http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

That said, I'd be happy with just the 250lb bombs for the IIC, anything beyond that for the IIB or C would be a nice bonus.

Stigler_9_JG52
03-27-2006, 05:40 PM
I stand corrected, on both counts.