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jessi1
04-08-2005, 05:56 AM
Looking for good advice on flying the jug online. Convergence is not a factor i have that set ,i would like to know rudder adjustments,aileron adjustments(clicks)and how to fight while flyin a heavy bird such as the jug.Altitude heights, speed, and prop pitch,radiator settings etc etc.Thanks in advance.Also see my question on this forum for the trackir3/vector expansion advice i receive it today. Thanks all

jessi1
04-08-2005, 05:56 AM
Looking for good advice on flying the jug online. Convergence is not a factor i have that set ,i would like to know rudder adjustments,aileron adjustments(clicks)and how to fight while flyin a heavy bird such as the jug.Altitude heights, speed, and prop pitch,radiator settings etc etc.Thanks in advance.Also see my question on this forum for the trackir3/vector expansion advice i receive it today. Thanks all

LLv34_Stafroty
04-08-2005, 07:11 AM
Trims: trim elevator so the "ball2 stays in center while u are in level flight, then ailerons that ur plane doesnt try to roll, check ball again, trim if needed.
Elevator, for climb, trim it tail heavy, so u dont have to pull from stick while climbimg, set it so that plane keeps some 300kmh ias while climbimb, climb over 4500m alt, at those alts it starts to rock. in DF servers where bases often are close to each other, make ur climb away from enemy base till u got some 4000m alt, then turn back and climb some more, u never got alt enought, and u can quite freely dive with Jug, cos its max dive speed is so high(over 900kmh ias?) when u are climbimb, do not fly straight if its possible that there might be enemies around, make S turns time after time to check whats in ur low 6 and high 6, as well what is behind ur nose, so no one can make surprise to u. when u arrive at war zone, keep ur eye peeled, and try to spot enemies(gunfire etc) always give highest priority to dots and planes which are highest, if one gets at same alt as u are, or even higher, keep him in ur eyes and look if he has seen u, if not, fly away and climb some more, come back with alt advantage, if he has seen u, coming towards, keep him at ur 10 or 2 o clock so its quite hard for him to shoot at u, when close to merge, turn gently towards him and keep level to gian speed, while bandit most likely tries to make tight turn to get lead or to turn in ur 6. Jug is almost faster than any other at hi alts, so no worries, climb away and use water boost as well. its limited amount of water in board so use it when u really need it.

dive attacks best to make against highest enemies, or if there is many of em, start dive at them, pick the one who makes himself a nice target, like climbimb steeply up at slow speed etc. dont pull much when u attack, u just lose ur precious speed. always climb back at hi alt, never start to turn with enemy, no matter if u can turn better with the one u just shot at wings, but there might come other with wings ok, then u got troubles, Jug aint TnB plane.

best and most efficient is to fight in pairs with Jug, when other dives, other stays at hi alt and waits till other starts to climb back up, now, its time for other to dive and shoot enemies which ur mate is draggin behind him whuile he is climbing, nothing is as easy to shoot that plane that mate is draggin, just remember (all of u) that whenu got enemy in ur tail, never turn towards friendly plane, instead, fly away from mate, so its MUCH easier for mate to shoot at that enemy, make gentle climb etc.

that should help u a bit.

LLv34_Stafroty
04-08-2005, 07:53 AM
trim elevator so the "ball2 stays in center while u are in level flight, then ailerons that ur plane doesnt try to roll, check ball again, trim if needed.
Elevator, for climb, trim it tail heavy, so u dont have to pull from stick while climbimg, set it so that plane keeps some 300kmh ias while climbimb, climb over 4500m alt, at those alts it starts to rock. in DF servers where bases often are close to each other, make ur climb away from enemy base till u got some 4000m alt, then turn back and climb some more, u never got alt enought, and u can quite freely dive with Jug, cos its max dive speed is so high(over 900kmh ias?) when u are climbimb, do not fly straight if its possible that there might be enemies around, make S turns time after time to check whats in ur low 6 and high 6, as well what is behind ur nose, so no one can make surprise to u. when u arrive at war zone, keep ur eye peeled, and try to spot enemies(gunfire etc) always give highest priority to dots and planes which are highest, if one gets at same alt as u are, or even higher, keep him in ur eyes and look if he has seen u, if not, fly away and climb some more, come back with alt advantage, if he has seen u, coming towards, keep him at ur 10 or 2 o clock so its quite hard for him to shoot at u, when close to merge, turn gently towards him and keep level to gian speed, while bandit most likely tries to make tight turn to get lead or to turn in ur 6. Jug is almost faster than any other at hi alts, so no worries, climb away and use water boost as well. its limited amount of water in board so use it when u really need it.

dive attacks best to make against highest enemies, or if there is many of em, start dive at them, pick the one who makes himself a nice target, like climbimb steeply up at slow speed etc. dont pull much when u attack, u just lose ur precious speed. always climb back at hi alt, never start to turn with enemy, no matter if u can turn better with the one u just shot at wings, but there might come other with wings ok, then u got troubles, Jug aint TnB plane.

best and most efficient is to fight in pairs with Jug, when other dives, other stays at hi alt and waits till other starts to climb back up, now, its time for other to dive and shoot enemies which ur mate is draggin behind him whuile he is climbing, nothing is as easy to shoot that plane that mate is draggin, just remember (all of u) that whenu got enemy in ur tail, never turn towards friendly plane, instead, fly away from mate, so its MUCH easier for mate to shoot at that enemy, make gentle climb etc.

that should help u a bit.

jessi1
04-08-2005, 08:49 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LLv34_Stafroty:
trim elevator so the "ball2 stays in center while u are in level flight, then ailerons that ur plane doesnt try to roll, check ball again, trim if needed.
Elevator, for climb, trim it tail heavy, so u dont have to pull from stick while climbimg, set it so that plane keeps some 300kmh ias while climbimb, climb over 4500m alt, at those alts it starts to rock. in DF servers where bases often are close to each other, make ur climb away from enemy base till u got some 4000m alt, then turn back and climb some more, u never got alt enought, and u can quite freely dive with Jug, cos its max dive speed is so high(over 900kmh ias?) when u are climbimb, do not fly straight if its possible that there might be enemies around, make S turns time after time to check whats in ur low 6 and high 6, as well what is behind ur nose, so no one can make surprise to u. when u arrive at war zone, keep ur eye peeled, and try to spot enemies(gunfire etc) always give highest priority to dots and planes which are highest, if one gets at same alt as u are, or even higher, keep him in ur eyes and look if he has seen u, if not, fly away and climb some more, come back with alt advantage, if he has seen u, coming towards, keep him at ur 10 or 2 o clock so its quite hard for him to shoot at u, when close to merge, turn gently towards him and keep level to gian speed, while bandit most likely tries to make tight turn to get lead or to turn in ur 6. Jug is almost faster than any other at hi alts, so no worries, climb away and use water boost as well. its limited amount of water in board so use it when u really need it.

dive attacks best to make against highest enemies, or if there is many of em, start dive at them, pick the one who makes himself a nice target, like climbimb steeply up at slow speed etc. dont pull much when u attack, u just lose ur precious speed. always climb back at hi alt, never start to turn with enemy, no matter if u can turn better with the one u just shot at wings, but there might come other with wings ok, then u got troubles, Jug aint TnB plane.

best and most efficient is to fight in pairs with Jug, when other dives, other stays at hi alt and waits till other starts to climb back up, now, its time for other to dive and shoot enemies which ur mate is draggin behind him whuile he is climbing, nothing is as easy to shoot that plane that mate is draggin, just remember (all of u) that whenu got enemy in ur tail, never turn towards friendly plane, instead, fly away from mate, so its MUCH easier for mate to shoot at that enemy, make gentle climb etc.

that should help u a bit. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

What do you mean the ball2 centering, do you mean look at a certain gauge and see if its centered??? Thanks for the good advice and quick response mate

LStarosta
04-08-2005, 08:54 AM
Turn Coordinator:

http://home.swipnet.se/~w-65189/AP_images/tc.JPG

See the little black ball under the "2 MIN". Keep that ball centered by using rudder input. Remember the little saying "step on the ball". When the ball is drifting to the right, add right rudder. When drifting to the left, add left rudder. Makes me wish all gunsights had these installed on them.

jessi1
04-08-2005, 09:28 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LStarosta:
Turn Coordinator:

http://home.swipnet.se/~w-65189/AP_images/tc.JPG

See the little black ball under the "2 MIN". Keep that ball centered by using rudder input. Remember the little saying "step on the ball". When the ball is drifting to the right, add right rudder. When drifting to the left, add left rudder. Makes me wish all gunsights had these installed on them. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Great thanks mate 1 question do you use prop pitch if so what and for what? Thanks for all

LStarosta
04-08-2005, 09:34 AM
Yes, as a matter of fact, I do. I enjoy setting it to 100% to tear up some major butt. Basically what prop pitch does is change the angle your propeller makes, which in turn changes the air resistance the propeller experiences, which in turn varies the engine RPM's. Lower your engine RPM's to either slow down on a landing approach, keep from overreving and overheating in a really fast dive (you could probably get away with just cutting throttle a bit) or if your engine is damaged, it's best to keep it on low RPM's as you return to base so it doesn't cut out on you prematurely and leave you dead in the water, so to speak.

BuzzU
04-08-2005, 10:19 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LStarosta:
Turn Coordinator:

http://home.swipnet.se/~w-65189/AP_images/tc.JPG

See the little black ball under the "2 MIN". Keep that ball centered by using rudder input. Remember the little saying "step on the ball". When the ball is drifting to the right, add right rudder. When drifting to the left, add left rudder. Makes me wish all gunsights had these installed on them. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You probably confused him by saying to adjust the elevator trim to center the ball. I'm sure you meant the rudder trim.

LStarosta
04-08-2005, 10:38 AM
lol Buzz, I think you quoted the wrong person :P.

BuzzU
04-08-2005, 11:12 AM
That comes from being old.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

LLv34_Stafroty
04-09-2005, 04:07 AM
well, center the ball af different alts with trims (aileron & rudder trim) and when u got gun solution, forget the **** ball, theres much more important things to look at that **** ball, like enemy AC and sky. i never look ball after its trimmed or if they is any trims at all, just blast away when u got close enough of enemy. still, my hit % goes between 10-25% on online, depends.

GUARD4000
04-09-2005, 05:49 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LLv34_Stafroty:
well, center the ball af different alts with trims (aileron & rudder trim) and when u got gun solution, forget the **** ball, theres much more important things to look at that **** ball, like enemy AC and sky. i never look ball after its trimmed or if they is any trims at all, just blast away when u got close enough of enemy. still, my hit % goes between 10-25% on online, depends. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

How did u do that?I mean your hitrate goes between 10-25% online,I cant do that when using .50s.Do u have any tips?

LLv34_Stafroty
04-09-2005, 10:18 AM
quit sprayinng and praying(im atheist btw), shoot only when u hit the enemy for sure, dont engage em at long distances, not wise, cos lil chance in flight direction of enemy makes ur precisly aimed rounds go off. shoot at close distances, i got my guns convergence range set at 100m with every plane there is, FW, spit, P-47, so, it means, i start to fire real close at enemies, when u got target as size of ur reticle, its good time to shoot. hard to miss.

p1ngu666
04-09-2005, 10:45 AM
tnb, and slow speed climb and stuff http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

NorrisMcWhirter
04-09-2005, 11:23 AM
It's a lot like the 190 in that you need to get plenty of alt and try to stay fast.

Pick and choose carefully what you go after because escape isn't so easy in this plane. Use repeated bnz passes with a decent extend phase to destroy your opponents. Use teamwork wherever possible because getting caught on your own isn't going to be favourable.

I have convergence set to 150m in the Jug but I often open fire at 400-500m just to help correction (you have plenty of ammo, especially if you take extra). You can normally cripple any aircraft on the first pass...don't just think that because it didn't blow up or disintegrate that it's going to still be a threat....most planes you have hit first time are only left in the position of running for home.

Cheers,
Norris

Avid_
04-09-2005, 12:15 PM
Ahh the Jug, I just love this plane. As most posters have said you need to fly this plane with an E advantage as much as possible.

The Jug is a BnZ plane. However, if you fly it you will get into situations where the E advantage is not yours, so what do you do then?? If you don't have a wing man to help you your in a bad a situation, but not an impossible one as some folks think. First and foremost get fast. This means your first move is to firewall it and dive. Your next move is to scissor. Remember that the jug has a very good roll rate and can out scissor most fighter. The majoy exception to this rule is the 190, it is a scissoring machine!!

So you are scissoring like hell and getting nowhere as the guy behind you is good. What the hell do you do now?? At this point you have one last ditch effort to shake the guy... try to force a overshoot. How you ask? Chop the throttle and pop the flaps. Remember though this is a LAST DITCH EFFORT!! if you do this you will be slow and in a very bad situation. Once you opponent overshoots you have one chance to fill his a$$ with lead so do it. If you have any altitude left after this move DIVE to get E back.

So what about the 190's since you can't scissor with them. The answer is to spiral climb them. You can out climb the 190's in a spiral. But before you do this you need to be at an even, or preferably better, E state then him. If he has better E then you and you start spiral climbing, your in for a 20mm enema.

Lastly, keep flying the jug till you perfect it. The Jug is a tough plane to fly, especially in the furball environment of DF servers. The best advice I can give is to be patient. Pick and choose your targets wisely and don't give in to the temptation to turn!

Avid

Papa_K
04-10-2005, 03:16 AM
P-47 is a great fighter-bomber in this game. Good load carrying, good speed, stable platform.

It holds together, and is stable, even at 4-digit (kph) speeds in a dive.

Fragility is not one of the P-47's negative points. (If survival is one of your priorities.)

Stay high, stay fast. The higher and faster, especially relative to bad guys, the better.

The only thing (almost) I'd prefer at 20K+ (ft) in the game is a Spit, and that one may be unrealistic in its relative high-alt maneuverability -- but if you can't out-turn it, you can outrun (Sp)it at high alt in a Jug.

It's one of the few aircraft in the game that will let you get away with looking for head-on passes with enemy aircaft.

Negatives:

1) The 50-cals aren't, and probably never will be, as lethal as they should be (IMO) in the game. (If you look at real gun camera film from P-47s, you don't get as much effect out of them in-game.) Get the target to your convergence range, plus or minus a bit, and give it a sustained, on-target burst. It's not a one-shot kill aircraft, like some others in the game.

2) The P-47 can be out-turned by some bombers in the game. (It can be out-climbed by some ground vehicles in the game -- but a zoom-climb, starting from high speed, is pretty good.)

The above are, of course, personal opinions -- and are not based on what the real aircraft did or could do. (Similarities may, or may not, exist.)

Papa_K

drose01
04-10-2005, 07:34 AM
Very informational thread, thanks to all.

My question is: how do you fight boredom flying these tactics?

I love the p47, with its power and ruggedness, and knowing its historical impact.

But how many minutes does it take to takeoff and climb to 4000 meters? Ten or more?

Then, how many targets can you find from there on most servers? Usually it is very hard, because the furball is usually down low and you can't see it from those alts.

I wish that more servers employed airstarts, really high ones, so that we could better enjoy the P47 and other high alt/b and z'ers.

In the meantime, does anyone else have this boredom issue when climbing, climbing, climbing?

F19_Ob
04-10-2005, 08:05 AM
All previous posters have some good thoughts.
However its always up to u to judge the situation and what to do and if to take risks or not in certain situations, all depending on your objective.

You also must decide your style of firing. Close or long range?
While its more likely to hit on short range, long ranges sometimes offer good solutions aswell, depending on the situation.

One thing I would advice u to do is practising on best turn and turning in slow speeds with combat and takeoff flaps to explore the limits of your maneuvering and the flaps jamming speed so u dont accidently jam them with enemies close.
This practise is for emergencies and extraordinary situations.
Always watch your speed and dont let experienced enemies sucker u into dogfighting.

If U are bounced, try to outdive or run and aim to keep your distance even if fired upon. Head for friendly lines and if u have to evade shots, do that by a gentle decending turn. If u have some distance between u and the bandit this will make it more difficult to hit u aswell as it allows u to keep speed and thus the distance.
If u start bleeding energy with turns he'll catch U because all german fighters do most things better and even if u throw him off aim once he will accellerate from a standstill much faster than u.
So dont give your speed up.
In an extreem emergency and preferably with friendlies around this can however be done but then u rely on that your friends are aware of u and eager to engage the enemy when u give your enrgy up for a maneuver out of harms way.
------------------------------

Because of the slower accelleration and worser climb aswell as general maneuverability compared to german fighters U should gain good hight close to home base.
Always climb in 'gentle' turns so u cans see behind+below and behind+above in the turn.
This is much better than the alternatives and also enables that important allround vision.

Aways record tracks of your online session so u can review it in detal later so u can detect your own mistakes aswell as others but also to see how your deflectionshooting works.
Since the p47 is a BnZ plane u do fast slashing attacks and cant always detect your hits. the track is a big help in many ways.

some thoughts.

LStarosta
04-10-2005, 08:36 AM
Actually, the point of centering the ball is not to keep staring at the instrument but to get used to flying the aircraft in a coordinated manner. You have no idea how much it affects your gunnery.