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View Full Version : Light attacks should do 3-5 damage



DoctorMcBatman
11-30-2018, 10:04 PM
Saw this idea from a YouTuber, and I very much so agree. Fast lights would still be viable as openers, but players could not rely on light spam to win fights. Fights would be a lot more skill based because they would be focused around landing heavy/slower attacks when opportunities arise and tempting your opponent to make a mistake, instead of button mashing.

Illyrian_King
11-30-2018, 11:47 PM
I am also for a light damage nerf, but lowering them TO 3-5dmg instead of lowering them BY 3-5dmg is crazy.

DoctorMcBatman
11-30-2018, 11:53 PM
I am also for a light damage nerf, but lowering them TO 3-5dmg instead of lowering them BY 3-5dmg is crazy.

3-5 lower isn't enough. JJ would still do 13-15 damage per light, that's what PK does now at the same speed without a nerf! Lights need to be relatively equalized. I don't know for sure what values would work best because I'm unable to test it. But I do really think light attacks do far too much damage now. A 50% nerf at least is needed IMO. Lights need to be less reliable as damage-delivery attacks, and more used as openers (as the devs say they intend 500ms lights to be).

Roseguard_Cpt
12-01-2018, 12:16 AM
Counter Proposal, give all these "Legendary Heroes" more health and stamina

RenegadeRasta
12-01-2018, 02:51 AM
Dude, yes. I was thinking about this yesterday. I would like all light attacks to be reduced to 8 damage.

ArchDukeInstinct
12-01-2018, 03:09 AM
An insane suggestion.

DoctorMcBatman
12-01-2018, 03:48 AM
Counter Proposal, give all these "Legendary Heroes" more health and stamina

That would also "nerf" Heavy attacks though (if they were to remain at their current levels).


An insane suggestion.

Why?

CRIMS0NM0NKEY
12-01-2018, 04:15 AM
It's not going to happen though I agree that light and are to much damage for their speed. But there are also blinding attacks that should just cause stamina drain. I don't see a point to a game being skill based when it's all blinding, 400ms lights, bash/free light, free second light. It's just a bit too much cheese.

Hormly
12-01-2018, 08:01 AM
The issue with this game is that slow attacks simply cannot be used once you reach a high skill bracket.

Lowering the dmg of lights will do nothing to remedy this issue, since people will still be unable to throw heavies without being parried. People would still solely rely on lights and bashes, only now the combat would be much slower and far less enjoyable.

The only thing that will fix this game is to
A) make parries less threatening
B) make guard breaks MORE threatening
C) speed heavies up

Vendelkin
12-01-2018, 10:03 AM
... what? Light attack nerfed to 3-5? This is a terrible idea. Have you really thought about the outcome this would have? Also speeding up heavies to balance wouldnt work across the board with all characters. Think about the overall effect of this on the battle system. Every. Single. Character. Would have to be completely overhauled.


This is very poorly thought out such that i dont even feel like actually discussing anything, but i still feel a DRASTIC NEED to say something.

The something i say is:
NO. THIS IS STUPID.

Goat_of_Vermund
12-01-2018, 10:43 AM
What generally should be done in my opinion:

1. Stronger heavy attacks. Every heavy should deal at least 30, 40 should be the avarage, higher end at 60.

2. No guaranteed damage on any counter (unless exhausted), almost instant recovery for the attacker. Instead, the player countering should get an immense advantage for the next seconds. Not all counters should give the same amount of advantage however. If the character has access to a dedicated counter, their general parries should give less advantage.

Examples:

Warden: crushing counter blinds with pommelstrike for 4 seconds and deal high stamina damage. Acts as a light chainstarter, now available on all sides.
Parries drain low stamina, and the warden deals more block damage for 3 seconds.

Lawbringer: parry chained into a 50 damage blind justice with hyperarmor. Softfeintable into spikes on any side for 15 damage+carry, both are hardfeintable for very low stamina cost. Fast recovery on miss. Also chained into Make way (not guaranteed on main target, deals 35 damage, feintable, unblockable).

Conqueror: fullblock counter chained into an unlockable heavy for 50 damage softfeintable into shield uppercut and fullblock. His actions cost no stamina for 4 seconds.
His zone is unfeintable until the second hit (if the first blocked, second will be countered).
His parries increase his damage for 3 seconds while draining some stamina. His superior heavies are unblockable, but not guaranteed. His superior dodges should be chained into a slow shieldbash guaranteeing a heavy- since it is dodgable, this should be feintable and softfeintable into a fullblock.

Peacekeeper: Deflects chained into a heavy stab that deals 25 direct and 25 bleed damage. Unblockable, hyperarmored and breaks hyperarmor. Feintable and softfeintable into anything a normal heavy is.
Parries make her regain stamina, and they drain stamina.


3. General stamina buff (at least double), and far more chains, or other ways enabling fluid offense.

4. Counterguardbreaks deal damage now (about 10), and there is no frames where guardbreak is uncountarable. However, countering it now requires more than just pressing counter, some mind games should be set up.


These changes would make the light meta quite obsolete.

Herbstlicht
12-01-2018, 11:03 AM
Don't forget something major here. The games pacing actually is quiet good. It would change drastically. Besides, on the casual side of things, everything is viable. When people no longer can enjoy their Orochi, Warden or Aramusha, there wont be players left to have fun with. I think a lot of Youtubers are inside their crowdpleasing, monochrome bubble only seeing one side of the coin. But this game is big, multiplatform and consists within a diverse skillbracket. And Ubi needs to cater to everyone. And I am very sure about this change to be hated by the majority of the community. If you want to nerf lights to 3-5 damage, we need a combat system where you can speed them up or slow them down. When used as unreactable chain starter, low damage is ok. But righ now, its 500ms except monk top light. Everything else means you already failed with the initial light, thus 400ms lights is ok. When you fail to dodge highlander mixup and eat a 40damage heavy, its the same. But if you nerf lights into oblivion, heroes like Highlander would outclass assassins soo hard,it wouldnt be funny.

Last:Ubis data is clearly telling that besides jj dominance, the roster isnfairly balanced. Where does this heavys are so weak always come from? Shugi too will see his rework in near future. Until then, he will still hug some people to deah,

UbiInsulin
12-01-2018, 08:46 PM
The team is looking to improve offense at the moment, and this clearly goes against that for the obvious reason of being a game-wide nerf to damage.

We're not seeing that light spam is a successful enough strategy to warrant this kind of drastic change. It works for some players at lower levels, and it's something we're paying attention to as we don't want it to dominate casual play (see the recent Aramusha changes for an example of this), but this proposed change seems pretty extreme.

CRIMS0NM0NKEY
12-01-2018, 10:35 PM
What does damage have to do with opening up a turtle? Nothing. It has more to do with the speed to which you kill your opponent. Lowering damage across the board would prolong fights and maybe feed revenge if your getting light spammed to death. I don't agree with 3 to 5 damage but I do agree light spam is an issue in casual play.
It's like saying lowering touchdown points across the board would affect the Miami dolphins offense.

The_Sun_Danc3
12-02-2018, 08:07 AM
Whoever had this terrible idea clearly just isnít good at the game in general.
I land far more heavies than lights and if you were in the platinum bracket too, youíd understand.
Lights are just a way to pressure someone to A. Stop spam dodge attacking. B. Stop guardbreak spamming C. To close the gap when someone is trying to turtle you to death.
Unless itís an orochi top light or an infinite combo (with hyper armor) itís relatively hard to light spam any player decent at defending since you have to switch guards before attacking again.
I used to main peacekeeper before she was nerfed unviable. Trust me try to play peacekeeper and light spam in gold or above and see how far you get these days lmao 😂

SangLong524
12-02-2018, 09:26 AM
I dont want to spend half the match hacking away a single opponent.

ArchDukeInstinct
12-02-2018, 10:11 AM
Why?

Of course it's insane. The average light parry punish would do such a proportionally high amount of damage if lights only did 3-5 damage. Take for example the pitiful 3 damage lights, a lot of characters do 30 damage with their heavies, so they parry one light out of 10 and they're now on top or at least even. It wouldn't be worth using lights at all.

Goat_of_Vermund
12-02-2018, 10:20 AM
Maybe buffing heavy attacks very slightly across the board would help a little without light nerf. 25-30 damage on light parries is very low, some chars can't do more.

CRIMS0NM0NKEY
12-02-2018, 11:12 AM
Whoever had this terrible idea clearly just isnít good at the game in general.
I land far more heavies than lights and if you were in the platinum bracket too, youíd understand.
Lights are just a way to pressure someone to A. Stop spam dodge attacking. B. Stop guardbreak spamming C. To close the gap when someone is trying to turtle you to death.
Unless itís an orochi top light or an infinite combo (with hyper armor) itís relatively hard to light spam any player decent at defending since you have to switch guards before attacking again.
I used to main peacekeeper before she was nerfed unviable. Trust me try to play peacekeeper and light spam in gold or above and see how far you get these days lmao 😂

If your so good why do you care if lights are Nerfed? After all "I land far more heavies than lights". I'm calling shenanigans, LMAO 🤗!

CRIMS0NM0NKEY
12-02-2018, 11:14 AM
I dont want to spend half the match hacking away a single opponent.

By "hacking" you mean "spamming"

Han-Singular
12-02-2018, 05:38 PM
Saw this idea from a YouTuber, and I very much so agree. Fast lights would still be viable as openers, but players could not rely on light spam to win fights. Fights would be a lot more skill based because they would be focused around landing heavy/slower attacks when opportunities arise and tempting your opponent to make a mistake, instead of button mashing.

No such thing as light spam. learn to block and stop trying to parry everything.

The_Sun_Danc3
12-03-2018, 08:09 AM
If your so good why do you care if lights are Nerfed? After all "I land far more heavies than lights". I'm calling shenanigans, LMAO 🤗!
Iíll link vids on my Xbox captures tomorrow. This season I think Iíve killed more people with 2 or less lights than Iíve killed people with more than that.
Lights are almost the only way you can pressure a turtle without a bash move. Even with lights itís hard to pressure an advanced turtle because, believe it or not, in platinum and higher play people are partying lights, especially if you spam

teddy0teddy
12-03-2018, 04:54 PM
I personally think lights should reflect their speed, if all lights were 3-5 dmg then 600ms lights would be straight up worthless in all manners.
600ms lights could do 15 or 20 dmg
500ms lights 10 or 15 dmg
400ms lights 5 or 10 dmg

CRIMS0NM0NKEY
12-03-2018, 11:18 PM
Iíll link vids on my Xbox captures tomorrow. This season I think Iíve killed more people with 2 or less lights than Iíve killed people with more than that.
Lights are almost the only way you can pressure a turtle without a bash move. Even with lights itís hard to pressure an advanced turtle because, believe it or not, in platinum and higher play people are partying lights, especially if you spam

Here is the thing.... I don't care about adamantium rank or whatever. That's not a battle. Why people keep telling others to git gud when they are only fighting one person at a time. Judging this game on ranked is like judging how well a off-road vehicle handles rocks by driving it on the street.

The_Sun_Danc3
12-04-2018, 12:20 AM
If your so good why do you care if lights are Nerfed? After all "I land far more heavies than lights". I'm calling shenanigans, LMAO 🤗!

https://xboxdvr.com/gamer/the-sun-danc3/video/64814029

https://xboxdvr.com/gamer/the-sun-danc3/video/64814091

https://xboxdvr.com/gamer/the-sun-danc3/video/64814156

The_Sun_Danc3
12-04-2018, 12:33 AM
Here is the thing.... I don't care about adamantium rank or whatever. That's not a battle. Why people keep telling others to git gud when they are only fighting one person at a time. Judging this game on ranked is like judging how well a off-road vehicle handles rocks by driving it on the street.

The game is based around 1v1 fighting. There are moves added that help in a more-v-1, but even in 4v4 the core and basis of the game is you fighting another person.
And even after showing you those videos and how little I light attack, Iím defending light attack because itís a necessary component. If light attack did 3-5 damage it would actually help me as a pk main because I could just cheese and spam dodge heavy to bleed (bleed would now do more damage than light attacks) and I would be dodging ALL of your heavies, because you would no longer be using meaningless light attacks.
I suggest that to combat your problem with light spam that you get more aggressive. Unless youíre REALLY good at defense, itís not a good strategy again faster character that have 3 or more chained lights. The only way to crack down on them is to be more aggressive than them, because light spammers rarely have a good defense.

Soldier_of_Dawn
12-04-2018, 12:33 AM
I personally think lights should reflect their speed, if all lights were 3-5 dmg then 600ms lights would be straight up worthless in all manners.
600ms lights could do 15 or 20 dmg
500ms lights 10 or 15 dmg
400ms lights 5 or 10 dmg

100% spot on!

CRIMS0NM0NKEY
12-04-2018, 01:25 AM
https://xboxdvr.com/gamer/the-sun-danc3/video/64814029

https://xboxdvr.com/gamer/the-sun-danc3/video/64814091

https://xboxdvr.com/gamer/the-sun-danc3/video/64814156

I was right it was shenanigans.

The_Sun_Danc3
12-04-2018, 08:22 AM
I was right it was shenanigans.

Check every clip in my Xbox dvr. Iím willing to bet you wonít find one with light spam

Telemork
12-07-2018, 08:13 PM
How about 1 dmg per ms its takes to throw the attack? like a 400ms attack, does 4 dmg? While an 800ms attack does 8 dmg.