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CandleInTheDark
11-22-2018, 04:25 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfxC2RO7B7k

His Popeness had this to say about it yesterday



Tomorrow we've got Stefan coming back to share insights into the State of Balance data from Season 7, and to answer some more Q's from U! We've already compiled the Q's but if you want to drop some Fight specific ones in the comments here we might grab a couple last minute, no promises though!


Hey also, get hyped for tomorrow's Black Friday sale, more deets on the show. Yeah, I said deets.



Rip, let \m/<(-.-)>\m/

So we start with tournaments

For Honor Esports | PC | 1v1 EUROPE | Sat 24th November at 7PM CET/1PM EST
For Honor Esports | PC | 1v1 Turkey Amateur | Sun 25th November at 6PM CET
For Honor Arena | PC | 2v2 | Sun 25th November at 3PM EST
For Honor Arena | PS4 | 2v2 | Sun 25th November at 1PM EST

Ranked vanquisher faction order

Black friday sale of the week, all mask outfits and executions.

Content of the week, 7k gets you elite outfits.

We have a release of the state of balance blog, this time the data comes from ranked platinum level and above, this is post the guardswitch fix patch.

https://ubistatic19-a.akamaihd.net/resource/en-au/game/forhonor/fh-game/s7---fixed---1v1-win-loss-matrix---flat_340662.jpg

They went with ranked because the expectation here is that people are playing seriously and platinum and up gives them a good data spread, they get each of the faceoffs with a decent number of matchups.

The characters you would have expected to fall at the guard switch fix have fallen, Warlord is dead bottom, Shugoki and Lawbringer have fallen hard. Peacekeeper and Nobushi are still low. Top five are Conqueror, Valkyrie, Shinobi, Aramusha and Orochi.

No one has fallen below 44% so in terms of the numbers at least they have no huge outliers.

They want to emphasise that data is only a single part of what they look at, they share the data to be transparent with us to see what the team are looking at there.

They made the point that they would perhaps like to go above platinum for their data spread, platinum plus was a matter of needing meaningful data.

The dominion win rate didn't have many changes, top five shuffled a bit.

They showed us the competitive subreddit tier list from a year ago and the current, that is a third party thing they haven't touched.

Full blog is here https://forhonor.ubisoft.com/game/en-au/news-community/detail.aspx?c=tcm:185-340641-16&ct=tcm:185-76770-32

They answered some questions, full credit to The_Filthy_Spaniard for these

Reducing reactability and improving offence: Currently top priority - opener lights, and many mix-ups are too reactable.
Revenge build up: Revenge build up in 1v1 scenarios in team matches is another top priority. Sounds like they want 1v1 revenge to be removed almost entirely.
Improved targeting: Improving targeting with 3+ opponents is 3rd top priority, allowing better control and not just pinging back and forth between same 2 opponents
Moving to 33ms increments in attack speed, parry + feint windows? Currently under development, and promising, but no specific news as of now. Will eventually be in the game. Might not be noticeable at slower attacks (600 to 566ms) but more important at attacks that are at the border of reaction speeds (500-466-433ms). Feint windows - looking at 366ms window with 166ms parry window (from 400 and 200) for example. Raider changes in the closed test were a general test case - not specifically to do with Raider.
Unparriable attacks? Not keen on adding unparriable attacks - unblockable melees like toe stabs do the same job. Chip damage is good , but then why add a new mechanic when bashes do the same job? Hints that Shugoki will be able to attack with his rework (with the implication that his attacks aren't "super fast").
Progress on the stamina overhaul? (Eg. Tech test removal of stamina drain on some moves, that was accidentally included in a Season 7 patch and then later removed) Stamina overhaul is still being worked on, but at a lower priority at the moment. OOS stamina damage is a "pain point" for regular players, so it's something they are still looking at changing.
Changes to prevent unlock sprinting to regen stamina? Currently hard to keep an enemy in combat. OK if an opponent is 10m away in team modes, but rubbish if an opponent can disengage to escape mix-ups. Seems to prefer giving each character options to chase down, rather than global changes.
Deflects: Why do i-frames take priority? Can this be changed to make side deflects easier? Something that they have been looking and discussing. Ran a test a while ago, that worked well in a single 1v1 scenario. Didn't work well with multiple players. Want to improve it, but lower priority.
Reducing the "gank meta" of powerful CC moves? Eg. Shaman bite, LB impale? Shaman bite is being nerfed in the next patch - after 1 ally hit, you will be able to block subsequent attacks. So 80-90 damage instead of 130+. Shugoki's hug is being changed in a similar way. If this is successful on shaman's bite + hug, it may be rolled out to other CC moves (LB impale + Shinobi sickle rain mentioned). No indication of global damage reduction or revenge in CC, will be changed on a per-move basis.
Have you considered running a beta testing server more often, to get faster feedback and testing of balancing changes? This is something that many people on the team want to do - and in active discussion for 2019. Definitely not happening for the Shugoki rework, as Christmas gets in the way, but might be a more common occurrence in future. Running a test server is always a production question - not wanting to take resources away from other aspects of development and reduce efficiency and slow down teams. But it's something that a lot of the devs want to do more of.
Max Punishes: They can change a lot from patch to patch, are they a conscious design decision? Max punishes are now a more considered aspect than early in development. For the new characters (Wu Lin) light + heavy parry + GB punishes were specifically designed. Out of stamina punishes were looked at based off attack timings as a consequence of earlier design constraints, and subsequently altered if they were problematic. The reason max punishes can occasionally change without documentation/intention is that they are dependent on lots of variables that designers who aren't specifically in the fight team or don't know the combat system really in depth, might not be aware of. If some of these are changed (as a bug fix - for example, movement during an attack animation) it may have consequences on max punishes. But without all the designers aware of max punishes, it can be hard to tell QA department to test if they have changed. They are working on making this less a common occurrence.
Feint Windows: Does anything other than gameplay determining when feint windows are? Early in FH's development, "best looking" feint windows were prioritised. Example being Kensei's top heavy feint 600ms before landing. Currently most feints are standardised at 400ms before the impact. They are looking at making the window shorter to be more difficult to tell.
Console vs PC, high level vs low level in balance data: State of balance data is from consoles + PC combined. Internally they look at platform specific data, and data from all skill levels, from "higher" skill to overall. Whilst characters do fluctuate between platforms and skill levels, they don't see huge changes. An example of a big change was Season 3 Kensei - 30% win rate at top levels, but a "noob stomper" at low levels. Currently they do not see as big changes between skill levels and platforms.
Per Character questions: Shugoki is priority no.1, followed by characters who can't initiate and sustain like lawbringer. Also nerfing of out of lock power of Shinobi + Warlord.
Shaman: Bite is being nerfed in the next patch - will only guarantee 1 ally heavy before putting opponent in reduced hitstun.
Raider: His light chain is bad, and acknowledges that his zone mix-up is lacking in duels. However he points out that Raider is really good in breach at the moment, and because there is a mode where he excels, is therefore a lower priority. They still want to get round to balancing him in duels eventually.
Centurion: Shugoki's charged heavies are being changed in his rework, if this turns out successful, could be similar changes made to Cent.
Warlord: Unlocked charge is the source of his power - and will get nerfed. Do not want an unlocked playstyle. They want to improve him to compensate for reduction in unlocked playstyle.
Aramusha: Why was guaranteed top light after side heavy removed instead of teaching players better? They decided that the guaranteed top light was not worth coming up with a new mechanic to properly communicate to new, confused players (eg. Different coloured or removed indicator), as whether or not the top light was "guaranteed" would be altered by external attackers or multiple attacks landing at the same time, etc. It seemed a better use of resources to simply make it no longer guaranteed, and buff the damage of the side heavy to compensate, than to tutorialise and implement a whole new mechanic. This would not be the case if the attack was like a guaranteed light from the same side (eg. Shinobi). Aramusha still has problems, but he'd rather not make new problems to solve by adding a new official mechanic.
Wu Lin
Are you happy with them, planning fixes soon, or will we have to wait a long time? Looks like they are doing well balance-wise. Data: Shaolin, Tiandi and Nuxia are ~54% win rate in plat+ duels. Expectation that these will drop over time as people learn their movesets. Jiang Jun is currently high win rate ~62%, which is a big discrepancy from tier list placement. Partially this could be due to his animation bugs, which will be fixed in the next patch (Title update).
Tweaks to damage - lower on JJ and Shaolin? Buffed damage on Wu Lin before launch, as it was too low in tests. They are going to wait a bit, see if the JJ animation bug fixes normalise the win rates before making any changes.
Nuxia's Traps can be punished on reaction, maybe reduce recovery? Reducing recovery would be one way of doing it, but it seems that Stefan prefers altering Traps along with "reaction reduction" of 33ms, etc - making them from a reaction to more of a read. This would end up being more of a guess - is it a heavy, feint, or a trap. Damage would have to be reduced if this is the case.


Dev talks

Frederic-Antoine Marcous, production manager

Been on the team two and a half years, viking faction.

He is in charge of the player engagement team, they do a lot of the progression such as the visual collection and he works closely with a lot of the teams in general to see what is important to the player base as a whole.

He has a background in management but got his entry in the industry in recruitment.

They made the point for those looking into gaming that there is a lot of hard work and often there is a lot of sacrifice, selling cars, getting a room mate, there is no one path and it is something you have to invest time and work in to make it happen.

They have had a bunch of things, such as the visual collection, where people are asking for it, they were already working on it but couldn't say anything on it, they want this kind of thing to be in a good state and make an impact, timing is key in this.

Community corner and wrap

Knight_Raime
11-23-2018, 05:48 AM
I love how they actually answered quite a few questions I had.

MrB3NX
11-23-2018, 11:16 AM
can someone summarize it please ?

EvoX.
11-23-2018, 11:04 PM
can someone summarize it please ?

Just read the second provided reddit link...

EvoX.
11-23-2018, 11:43 PM
Overall this looks extremely bad. Between this and last week's stream, there was a lot of ''we're discussing it'', ''we've thought about it'', ''we'll monitor things'', implying progress is in the very beginning stages, if any, and they definitely don't feel like making regular updates. Hell, he said it himself outright, they will continue with the same or worse pace, meaning at least 3 months between significant changes. Seeing how many questions and issues there are in contrast to the speed of the balance team makes me think this game won't even scratch the surface of balance for another two years.

What irritated me the most was his seemingly complete unwillingness to directly change how heroes work. ''PK will maybe get some damage'', ''Raider is not on our radar right now'', ''If Conq ever gets a better kit outside of SB...'', ''Centurion will perhaps get a better charge heavy''. What's with the total noncommittance? Doesn't he realize that literally everyone wants heroes improved and that there are tons of completely useless moves in the game? Their little 33ms cop out, the laziest attempt to fix everything all at once, will do absolutely zilch to change that. Every hero below A-tier needs an in-depth look and improvement, not: ''here's maybe one new thing and the global speed up, we're done here'', which seems to be exactly what they're aiming for.

Is Ubisoft not paying them enough, do they just hate their jobs, or..? He's acting like squeezing out the tiniest damn changes will cost him a liver, and there's just zero want to better the game. That ping pong effect he excused it with is one thing, not rolling out anything for months in a AAA PvP game is ludicrous.

Blitzwarrior771
11-24-2018, 06:19 AM
Well you mentioned kensei . Now let me tell you kensei is broken he had great moves and sets but he depends on heavy attacks . Everything is blocked parried thatís what u didnít mentioned . I hate that he is in a ****ing denial . Game will not be fixed . Talk about real problems . U gonna buff heroís as that gonna change something ? Parry is the real problem .

Laogaeth
11-24-2018, 11:45 AM
Can someone explain me why the Wu Lin Order Only Outfits are now being sold?

The_B0G_
11-24-2018, 01:11 PM
Can someone explain me why the Wu Lin Order Only Outfits are now being sold?

$$$

CandleInTheDark
11-24-2018, 05:43 PM
Recap is up

UbiInsulin
11-24-2018, 08:31 PM
I love how they actually answered quite a few questions I had.

You and Filthy Spaniard (https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitiveForHonor/comments/9zjezn/followup_to_the_balance_qa_in_the_warriors_den/) over on r/competitiveforhonor were extremely helpful for us in getting substantial questions that Stefan could answer. Thanks! :)

UbiInsulin
11-24-2018, 08:41 PM
Recap is up

Thanks once again, Candle. Didn't get a chance to watch WD directly during my Thanksgiving break, so I'm relying on you.

https://media.giphy.com/media/i3MXz2NWXzrVK/giphy.gif

Knight_Raime
11-24-2018, 09:36 PM
You and Filthy Spaniard (https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitiveForHonor/comments/9zjezn/followup_to_the_balance_qa_in_the_warriors_den/) over on r/competitiveforhonor were extremely helpful for us in getting substantial questions that Stefan could answer. Thanks! :)

I bet Spaniard would be over joyed to hear that. He doesn't think the devs read that reddit much. :f

The_B0G_
11-24-2018, 10:57 PM
Thanks once again, Candle. Didn't get a chance to watch WD directly during my Thanksgiving break, so I'm relying on you.

https://media.giphy.com/media/i3MXz2NWXzrVK/giphy.gif

I noticed a lot of people got shout outs on the stream for compiling questions for the devs(last weeks WD), it's odd that the person who didn't get mentioned was doing it on the official forums for the game, I know that Candle would never bring this up himself, but I think next time something like this goes on he should get the credit he deserves.

bannex19
11-25-2018, 01:35 AM
Warlord main... feels bad man.

44% vs 58% is a horrible spread. C'mon ubi I don't care what kind of standard you use you should be embarrassed

UbiInsulin
11-25-2018, 02:05 AM
I noticed a lot of people got shout outs on the stream for compiling questions for the devs(last weeks WD), it's odd that the person who didn't get mentioned was doing it on the official forums for the game, I know that Candle would never bring this up himself, but I think next time something like this goes on he should get the credit he deserves.

Fair point, I'll make sure to keep an eye out for this going forward.

The_B0G_
11-25-2018, 04:24 AM
Fair point, I'll make sure to keep an eye out for this going forward.

Thank you.

p0wn3rki11
11-26-2018, 05:16 AM
Hold up....REDUCE reactability of opener lights?? How the hell will that fix anything? Characters should be at least mildly reactable, changing lights will make light spam even worse. This raises great concern from a person who plays console where light spam is a plague. Unless the light opener change comes with some counters otherwise the game will devolve to orochi's mashing rb till their fingers fall off.

Siegfried-Z
11-26-2018, 10:29 AM
Hold up....REDUCE reactability of opener lights?? How the hell will that fix anything? Characters should be at least mildly reactable, changing lights will make light spam even worse. This raises great concern from a person who plays console where light spam is a plague. Unless the light opener change comes with some counters otherwise the game will devolve to orochi's mashing rb till their fingers fall off.

Yep.

This part was the one which afraid me the most in the recap...
They already start as Tiandi and JJ while beiing Vanguard and Heavy have 400ms lights... (SF for JJ)

OwenWilson1
11-26-2018, 04:44 PM
Is there any actually news about shugoki? I am a big shugo main and feel that the character is being swept under the rug especially with the recent stamina nerf. Can shugo expect any sort of rework?

Kryltic
11-26-2018, 08:09 PM
Is there any actually news about shugoki? I am a big shugo main and feel that the character is being swept under the rug especially with the recent stamina nerf. Can shugo expect any sort of rework?

It's been confirmed he is getting a rework for Season 9.