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View Full Version : I Thought Breach Would Bring Change. It Didnít.



Chobbsy99
10-30-2018, 05:05 PM
Breach just doesnít live up to the hype. Having finally played it (been away since MF dropped) I found it to be just like all of the other 4v4 game modes.

Hear me out here. Breach is mechanically different; different objectives, different stages, longer matches. But the way players play is the same. Winning doesnít matter, itís about enjoying the experience. This leads to very ganky gameplay.

Ganking is not an effective method of winning. There are too many lanes and therefore too much to do. But this doesnít matter at all! It is still plenty fun enough for a group of 4 to do.

As an attacker, all three phases must be completed for the game to end. Even if the ram takes no damage and moves quickly, the game still takes 20 minutes. Thatís 20 minutes being repeatedly ganked and executed, then having to wait sometimes a full 30 seconds before I can respawn. Thereís nothing fun about that!

Iíve learned my lesson. Hoping that 4v4 will change is a waste of time. Itís still a remarkably un-fun experience.

Devils-_-legacy
10-30-2018, 05:10 PM
Breach just doesnít live up to the hype. Having finally played it (been away since MF dropped) I found it to be just like all of the other 4v4 game modes.

Hear me out here. Breach is mechanically different; different objectives, different stages, longer matches. But the way players play is the same. Winning doesnít matter, itís about enjoying the experience. This leads to very ganky gameplay.

Ganking is not an effective method of winning. There are too many lanes and therefore too much to do. But this doesnít matter at all! It is still plenty fun enough for a group of 4 to do.

As an attacker, all three phases must be completed for the game to end. Even if the ram takes no damage and moves quickly, the game still takes 20 minutes. Thatís 20 minutes being repeatedly ganked and executed, then having to wait sometimes a full 30 seconds before I can respawn. Thereís nothing fun about that!

Iíve learned my lesson. Hoping that 4v4 will change is a waste of time. Itís still a remarkably un-fun experience.

This is always going to happen in a team mode more so if it's a pre made team we need solo ques would make breach so much more enjoyable

Vordred
10-30-2018, 10:32 PM
unfortunately, 4v4 will never be anything but a gank fest now. the core gameplay has changed and has been balanced for duels.

back in the beta and S1, ganking was less effective, because well you might 3 on 1 someone and kill them, it will take awhile. a heavy like the conq or warlord could easily stay alive for quite some time against multiple people, which meant well they were wasting their time killing that guy the rest of the team are off doing work. and of course in S1 we had the super revenge builds (not that, that was a good thing, as it was way too much)

now there are so many unblockable attacks, bashes and grabs, that ganking works far to well, as you can just pinball someone around and kill them quick.


and it's only gotten worse with the new cast, personally i i think marching fire should have been like a relaunch of for honour, rather than add a new faction (that's really not needed) they should have focused that effect of updating the old cast and focusing on balance, refresh the game with a brand new game mode and all new balancing.

instead, we got a new gear system and a bunch of new characters that can do everything the old cast can, plus a load of new stuff.

it feels like for honor has just become a testing ground for the devs, just to see what they can come up with and what's possible, players and balance be damned.

CRIMS0NM0NKEY
10-30-2018, 10:40 PM
The gank fest happens in the defending team when the Ram is too strong and the lives of the attacking team are being spent too quickly...or at the very beginning it's easy to gank because the attacking team has two objectives.
The attacking team should get full health on revive during the first part. 75 percent on the second and 50 percent on the last. This might help balance the breach.

SirRegisKeg
10-30-2018, 10:55 PM
I've been saying this in like 4 threads now , I feel you brother. It's not really the new cast fault. It's the fact we took away gear stats for cheap perks. Base stats are perfect in 1v1. But in 4v4 gear stats allowed you to create a build that could be put to the task you yourself feel you're good at , attacking, defending etc. The real unbalance is the fact gear stats are gone. Now we're left with base hero stats that are clearly wayyy too different to match up with each other. Why play warlord when you have berserker

SirRegisKeg
10-30-2018, 11:22 PM
Buy hey , like all the new happy wu lin wankers would say "git gud". Or pay to win. For Hinor was never balanced. And if you love this game, or at least its concept . Learn to deal with the amazing frame datas and better game stats / feats

HerrNein
10-30-2018, 11:38 PM
You realize that you can buy Wu Lin heroes with steel now right?

If you genuinely keep whining that Wu Lin took your lunch money, more people will play Wu Lin and take more of your lunch money because you can be bothered to learn to fight them properly

Velentix
10-30-2018, 11:49 PM
I agree that it is a gankfest. Imo the way out of this is to remove tickets for the first two phases. If ubi wanted an objective mode then the focus should be an objective I.e. the ram, not making ganking a viable strategy via the ticket system. Then you end up with dominion 2.0.
Granted if you have a group to play with then you're probably not going to have this problem as much, as teamwork actually happens with a group.

Vordred
10-30-2018, 11:56 PM
personally, for breach i think there should be ramparts and archers on both sides, have 3 lanes, at the moment there aren't enough things to make teams split up.

Chobbsy99
10-31-2018, 12:44 PM
Thanks for all the responses guys. Glad to see people agree! Breach is such a good idea, it just needs tweaking to make it fun for all. After all, being killed in a fair matchup isn't irritating in the slightest; if anything, there's something kinda cool about being beaten totally fairly. It's just ganking that feels really cheap.

I feel the main issue is that ganking is just so damn fun. As a casual player with little stake in winning the match, it's more enjoyable to get a load of kills cheaply than die lots but eventually win. This could be fixed by making rewards for losing rubbish, but the rewards aren't exactly brilliant anyway and I certainly don't want them lowered for anyone.

I reckon the best way to fix breach (and possibly all 4v4) is to change executions. Make it so that minions can no longer interrupt (except officers) but make executions unavailable for gank situations. If a battle is more than a 2v1 (so this would affect 3v1 and 4v1 engagements) the killer cannot execute. This would prevent the 'gank squad' from gaining health, would allow revives for the attacking team and would make the game less fun when ganking. I think this would be a step in the right direction.

SangLong524
10-31-2018, 01:44 PM
it seem people has a problem with the term 'ganking", so let me reword it.
Breach is just a massive Dominion being more objective-oriented. AND it is a team mode. So expect yourself to be teamworked more often than not.

I reckon the best way to fix breach (and possibly all 4v4) is to change executions. Make it so that minions can no longer interrupt (except officers) but make executions unavailable for gank situations. If a battle is more than a 2v1 (so this would affect 3v1 and 4v1 engagements) the killer cannot execute. This would prevent the 'gank squad' from gaining health, would allow revives for the attacking team and would make the game less fun when ganking. I think this would be a step in the right direction.
what is the perimeter/range of this "gank situation"? a dueling pair and a guy at the ballista, is that situation a gank situation?
Futhermore, does pikemen now count in? they sure are a serious threat now.
no offense OP, teamworking and being teamworked is the nature of..... being in a team. you know, collectivism vs individualism. For me, there can certainly be a "me" in a team, as long as "me" doesnt stand in the way of "we". There are enough risks and hurdles in a gank already, any more would ruin the spirit of mode.
About ganking is not fun, I disagree, sincerely. I have random matches when each teammate move in a out like a dance.

Lord_Cherubi
10-31-2018, 01:55 PM
I see that im in the great minority here but in my time at Breach i've never had issues with ganking. In the rare occasion that there's a 4-man premade running around deathballing, they can't be everywhere and because of the clear map layout it's very easy to locate the death squad any given time.

So if i can't push the ramparts i will go to the ram (or other objectives in later stages). They simply can't be everywhere at the same time.

I also stay VERY cautious every time im roaming alone so that even if they try to gangrape me i'll always have an escape route available.

In Dominion they would obiviuously chase me to death even if it means running after me for 15mins straight but in Breach this never happens as there's too much going on for anyone to bother with just one kill.

SixAxe505
10-31-2018, 03:10 PM
First of all it sounds stupid and secondly it's called Jolly Cooperation! Jokes aside, it really is team based combat in a team based game mode. Labeling something as Ganking and asking for a fair fight when you are challenging objectives and what not is absolutely silly. If you came up in my house trying to throw hands you better believe it won't just be me fighting you. Honor and respect your teammates, help them at all cost because their success is your success. Show no mercy or privilege to the enemy, doing so can result in a loss. Winning is what it's all about. If you want honorable fights go and play duel. That's not me being facetious either, seriously go play duel. But for the love of common sense, stop complaining about muti-enemy fights in a multiple enemy game mode! You cannot force your skewed code of honor on anyone but yourself. I say skewed because if you are willing to watch a teammate die, you are the worst kind of person. There is nothing more dishonorable. In any case, if you made it this far, perhaps you should start a thread for a new game mode. One that caters to what you want, a 8 man round robin, where it plays out as 1-1 duels and the Victor takes on all challengers while the others must watch as if in spectator mode until it's their turn to fight.