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View Full Version : Wu Lin Characters make Assassins feel Irrelevant on Console



IlluminatiIzzy
10-28-2018, 02:13 PM
My issue is the title. Not just assassins, either, more like every "type" of hero, meaning Vanguard, Assassin, Hybrid and Heavy. All the Wu Lin characters have incredibly fast lights, superior movesets and fast dodge attacks. Characters like Tiandi, who is a Vanguard with 400ms side lights and 500ms top lights which don't slow down in a chain, make characters such as Gladiator, an assassin, feel irrelevant. This is because Tiandi can do almost everything Gladiator does as well as every other assassin, but better. But he's a Vanguard. Why have the new characters been designed to be superior to the existing characters? I'm not just talking about the movesets; the animations, aswell. I don't know if the animations are an issue on PC (I imagine not), but on console, there are definitely some janky and unfair animations which precede some attacks from characters in the Wu Lin faction - an example is Shaolin's top light (in my experience). Whether this be because of 30fps on console or a matter of my own perspective, I don't know.

Although a balancing team for PC and Console separately is obviously the ideal solution, we all know that's not happening because who cares about console, right?

MuscleTech12018
10-28-2018, 07:39 PM
It's a pay to win DLC. Stop complaining.

PepsiBeastin
10-28-2018, 09:05 PM
Your stupid.
*you'wer

iadvisoryi
10-28-2018, 09:58 PM
My issue is the title. Not just assassins, either, more like every "type" of hero, meaning Vanguard, Assassin, Hybrid and Heavy. All the Wu Lin characters have incredibly fast lights, superior movesets and fast dodge attacks. Characters like Tiandi, who is a Vanguard with 400ms side lights and 500ms top lights which don't slow down in a chain, make characters such as Gladiator, an assassin, feel irrelevant. This is because Tiandi can do almost everything Gladiator does as well as every other assassin, but better. But he's a Vanguard. Why have the new characters been designed to be superior to the existing characters? I'm not just talking about the movesets; the animations, aswell. I don't know if the animations are an issue on PC (I imagine not), but on console, there are definitely some janky and unfair animations which precede some attacks from characters in the Wu Lin faction - an example is Shaolin's top light (in my experience). Whether this be because of 30fps on console or a matter of my own perspective, I don't know.

Although a balancing team for PC and Console separately is obviously the ideal solution, we all know that's not happening because who cares about console, right?

Sorry but gladiator doesn't have the moveset or style of any assassin. Everyone thought he should be a hybrid and centurion should be the assassin, so that comparison is off. I'm a rep 7 tiandi, he's fast yea, but don't act like it's an orochi light, the speed in this case doesn't matter, he has to go through a Dodge animation first so you can see it coming. Don't Dodge tiandi, block and Parry him.

They all have good dodges yes, also glad and tiandis kit have zero correlation. I play on console FYI. Just practice and play the new characters are fine, it's some of the old characters suck. Look at pk, warlord, shugoki, etc, all bad. But shaman, zerker are top tier in all modes, nuxia would fall behind them, tiandi and warden are more similar, since they both Excel off of a Dodge punish.

Wookiescantfly
10-28-2018, 10:20 PM
How exactly is it pay to win when the new characters are free (in the same sense that the year 1 heroes were free)?

Literally all you paid for with the Marching Fire preorder was Arcade mode, and early access to the new heroes without having to pay steel for them directly (which effectively saves you $15 worth of steel, which is 16k steel, in unlocking the new heroes.)

If you add up 15k steel per character, the year one DLC characters totaled to about 90k steel. Convert that to the cheapest possible steel pack buys and you're looking at $70 worth of steel. IIRC the year one season pass was $50, which means you saved $20 worth of steel (25k steel) by buying them all up front and got one week early access to playing them on top of that. The marching fire DLC and everything in it (Breach, Wu Lin heroes, etc) are all free. Literally the only thing that you cannot get without purchasing the marching fire DLC is the Arcade mode. Which, btw, is not worth being the reason you spend your $30. Why did I bring up year one stuff? Because it's the same thing as buying the season pass for early access to the dlc heroes.

Rhyza.
10-28-2018, 10:33 PM
It is P2W atm. When everybody has access to the characters, then it'll stop being so, but for the moment, it's P2W.

Wookiescantfly
10-28-2018, 10:59 PM
Mate, you have a gross misunderstanding of what pay to win means. Early access is not pay to win, especially when they'll be available for steel purchases on Oct 30th

Blitzwarrior771
10-28-2018, 11:23 PM
Yeah and assassins make us also irrelevant vanguards and hybrids and heavy . How much I talk about aramusha and orochi itís insane . I donít want to say anything bad about wulin you got what u deserve . I can deal with wulin better so they are not so bad .

iadvisoryi
10-29-2018, 05:16 PM
Yeah and assassins make us also irrelevant vanguards and hybrids and heavy . How much I talk about aramusha and orochi itís insane . I donít want to say anything bad about wulin you got what u deserve . I can deal with wulin better so they are not so bad .

Yea that makes sense, there's not even an assassin in the top 5 hero's right now, it's not assassin meta, the ONLY assassin's that are viable right now is zerker, shaman, and nuxia. Warden, conq, glad, top 3 in dual, Highlander, warden, and honestly raider or shaman, debatable top 3 in breach, point is assassin's aren't meta right now. Kensei is insane, warden is insane, valk is insane, Shaolin, conq, all insane.

I have no idea how your making your point tbh and I'm in console.with the better frames ls isn't that bad of a problem.

Wookiescantfly
10-30-2018, 01:53 AM
Yea that makes sense, there's not even an assassin in the top 5 hero's right now, it's not assassin meta, the ONLY assassin's that are viable right now is zerker, shaman, and nuxia. Warden, conq, glad, top 3 in dual, Highlander, warden, and honestly raider or shaman, debatable top 3 in breach, point is assassin's aren't meta right now. Kensei is insane, warden is insane, valk is insane, Shaolin, conq, all insane.

I have no idea how your making your point tbh and I'm in console.with the better frames ls isn't that bad of a problem.

and yet Assassin's make up roughly 32% of the picks in 1v1s going by season 6's 1v1 pick results in the "top 2.5%" of duels. I'd reckon that number is still a good fair estimate considering the only real hero changes that have happened since are the season 7 reworks and Wu Lin. Based on just the oversaturation of assassin's and hybrids compared to heavies and vanguards, you have about a 32% chance someone is going to pick an assassin in duels. If their objective was competitive play, why isn't everyone just playing Conqueror since he's apparently the best pick period with his apparently incredibly safe "too stronk, plz nerf" shield bash?.

People claim there's an assassin meta for 2 reasons.
> They make up one of the largest chunks of the roster at 7/22 heroes

> Any time a hero is good to the point of being extremely overplayed, it's generally an assassin. Any time there's a complaint about light spam, it's generally an assassin, or an assassin hybrid. (Centurion, Valkyrie, Nobushi, and Shaolin are assassin hybrids). PK was so strong that she was still getting nerfed come season 6 and they're only now looking at buffing her after seeing how badly she did in season 6. At one point pre-rework Orochi was so common on console, I could almost fight one with my eyes closed because I had their entire move set memorized. Post rework Berserker's feint mixup game is so incredible the community considers him a top tier character. Gladiator's zone is so safe that when the state of balance for season 6 came out and the devs said they were thinking of potentially making it stronger if not just leaving it alone entirely, people were actually mad about that. Season 2 Shinobi was so strong that after buffing him in May, they had to turn around and immediately nerf him in June. Shaman is arguably the safest pick in any 4v4 environment and is essentially an almost perfect marriage of Shugoki, Peacekeeper, and Orochi in terms of her kit

Vendelkin
10-30-2018, 02:39 AM
It is P2W atm. When everybody has access to the characters, then it'll stop being so, but for the moment, it's P2W.

Buuuuuut..... It's still not. IMO the new hero release of wu lin has been one of the most balanced of new hero releases. They are scary until you know what you're dealing with this is true. But honestly I still am for more intimidated by a good zerker/warden/kensei than any of them. I think some of the shaolin feats are BS, but his moveset (despite its massive versatility) really isnt that tough to overcome.

I do agree with the OP about assassins kinda, only on the basis that literally every Wu Lin character has strong dodges. I really want some kkinda cool dodge or better opener on the aramusha haha

SixAxe505
10-30-2018, 02:56 AM
Being able to do a Dodge attack is the reason most feel that way. I used to think dodge attacks were the assassin calling card until I saw kensei. How do they even justify classing heroes? What makes a vanguard a vanguard, a heavy a heavy, an assassin an assasin? Because honestly, shinobi does not have a dedicated dodge attack to beat out guardbreak and he IS an assasin. I am just asking some questions.

YoMemesAintDank
10-30-2018, 05:00 AM
sorry your point is invalid it appears that aramusha is incredibly easy to beat

Buggy.Blaster
10-31-2018, 08:28 AM
i feel like the new meta and heroes is all spam characters, honestly I'm not having fun with the game anymore. :/