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Sombraziel
10-19-2018, 10:59 AM
3 - A Faction and Causes system,
Adding missions and a reputation-based reward system :

. Research of religious artefacts, treasure hunts, industrial spying - using the photography tool -, attack of cargaisons, steeling of technology, assassinations, gangs wars, gang cleaning, sabotages, kidnapping, "recrutment" for slave dealers... etc... to improve your reputation in those factions or guild :

. Leaders and NPC members of religions ; neutral gangs ; individual traders, merchants, mechanos and other artisans ; trade guild ; slavery guilds ; industrial companies ; ressource extraction companies ; political camps and politician leaders ; defenders of environments ; union of workers ; pro humans militia, gangs or politicians ; pro hybrid militia, gangs or politicians ; anti-segregationist associations, gangs or politicians... etc... ;
A better reputation with those crews can gives you special advantages :

. Payments and bribes first, but also price drops in some markets, or for the repair of your spaceships, discounts on specific brands, new types of spaceships or/and pieces, weapons, clothes, partners / crewmates... special skills or abilities...

Different types of new allies you can send a signal during a chase;
Politicals, who can offer you a "Joker Card" in case of arrestment by the law guardians of their jurisdiction...
Traders, who can send cargo spaceships to block your pursuers...
Gangs, who directly attacks the spaceships of your pursuers and create a diversion...
Or whatever else developpers want to add ;-)

And of course these factions are allies or ennemies;

Caution ! All factions don't always make one. Excepted the unique, essential and massive Trade Guild, factions are actually many individual groups. Mostly divided and even ennemies for some. But because they share the same roles and/or ideas, they also share the same faction name.

So for exemple, when you work for an Industrial Company or a Ressources Extraction Company, because of their constant market war, they will suspect you to do industrial spying if you start working for them, after have work for another one in the past. Then you will have a % decrease of reputation gain for all others companies of the same factions.
This is nearly the same for most politicians, religions, militias and gangs, who are constantly fighting for more influence, members or territories.

From tensions between hybrids and humans, 4 causes emerged, going beyond factions;
Neutral :
Neutral politics, religions/ associations/ militia and gangs don't care of tensions between humans and hybrids, they only care for their own power without picking a cause other than their own interests, fighting for more influence, members or territories.
Neutral militias are angaged by neutral politicians to fight crimes and gangs.

Pro-Humans :
Because of their conservative or racist education, religious dogmas, personnal believes, lack of reflexion and self-opinion, or simply because only hate gives a sense to their lives... Many humans, considering the segregation of hybrids as natural, chose to go to war against them on the day when some hybrids wanted to reverse the roles, and began to violently attack humans. Now, they use the supremacist violence of some hybrids as a good reason to finally release theirs on all hybrids crossing their path.

Pro-Hybrids :
Tired of still being considered as dangerous beasts, some hybrids have decided to give reason to their tormentors.
They yielded to their thirst for vengeance and began to attack the most virulent segregators, using all their ferocity and all the brute force conferred by their genetic modifications. They realised than being endow by much higher physical capacities with an undeniably equal intelligence gived them a huge superiority on humans. Thus, in parallel to the first bestial and bloodthirsty movement, born a new supremacist trend, some hybrids considering their species the next evolution of humanity.
Pro-Hybrids are now divided in two major trends ;
One aimed at proving to humanity the superiority of hybrids by taking power as much by force as by politics. In order to reduce the humans to slavery that the hybrids suffered, till decimate them to the last for the most extremes.
Another one seeing humans as prey, which they enjoy hunting down. Some going as far as devouring them... Only some gangs declare to indulge in these slaughter games. Lurking in the shallows of cities and space, taking advantage of the fear they inspire to commit their larcenies in tranquility.
But no one is fooled, many politicians and other hybrid citizens avail the cover of night in town to join the hunt.

Pro-Humans and Pro-Hybrids are of course in war against each others. But they are also both disparate and disorganized factions, with divided political leaders, religions and militias, and their Pro-[Something] gangs are constantly in war for territories, inside of their own factions.

Anti-Segregationist :
Anti-Segregationist have enough of all this hate and anger and fights for equality between hybrids and humans. They are the most disparate factions, composed of humans and hybrids from differents horizons fighting together for the same ideal of peace. And because they are in war against both Pro-Humans and Pro-Hybrids to protect innocents and prevent these supremacist factions from coming to power, they are also the most united. All their politicians, religions, associations and militias work hand in hand, even their gangs support each others and are loyal allies for any other anti-segregationists faction. Even if they are conscious to be only a star among the immensity of sky, they hope shining enough to guide some on the good way.

Pro-[Something] militias and anti-segregationist militias only fight politicians, gangs, and militias of others politicals sides, and are allies of politicians and gangs of the same political side.
All militias, Neutral, Pro or Anti, are often engaged as guardians by politicians and public figure of the same side.

Galakseeowonder
10-22-2018, 04:27 PM
I found your idea a bit extreme, of course you would have the brutal fight that is upon reaching the end of all negociation possibilities.
So I'd like to add a lot to your idea, all the political side and you could just make votes change by doing some investigations (using the photo mode) and then you'd have some investigation detail level that would show you the impact of what you found from the evidences you have, the source of it the legality of these investigations (it will change for the evidence types from a planet to another showing the change in the law of it) of course in none democratic political systems, you'll have to use blackmarcket and underground ways to broadcast your investigations.
So mainly you would take picture and see if you can add them to an investigation you're already paid to make depending on which it could have a better impact than in another, an evidence used twice would have less impact.
You could have either documents or photos of it (original would have more impact but used only once then a copy that would be used multiple times) voice recording that could be live (more impact but you would have to be prepared and choose the broadcast mean quickly.
Open to a lot of possible evidences(video same system as audio recordings but with more impact right from the start) .
Then you could either broadcast bit by bit or have a long full broadcast.
You would have technological mean to enhance credibility of your evidence like facial recognition attached to video recording, voice recognition to audio and video, fingerprint extraction for documents, gps position for any evidence,... That would enhance the power of each evidence
At the end you would have your investigation with it's credibility ratio and you would have to choose the mean of broadcast to adapt it to the targeted readers/viewers.
Add the crime scene investigation pack to that too.

So you would work for a faction by doing deep journalist jobs for them. That would have much more power on the population than an outer mercenary company that can be quickly pointed out by your "enemy" target as an external invasion attempt.

But violent action should be a part of it but as it would be less complex, it would be less rewarding in term of political impact.

I think it could be a good way to have a deep core mechanic that is so close to kinda the ADN of the BGE serie

Of course you would have interaction with NPCs too like indicators, accomplices, mere witnesses...

Sombraziel
10-23-2018, 12:15 AM
Your ideas are great but they go maybe a little too far in the investigation gameplay, and by a way probably to complex to drive by devs in a whole universe, to be used in a video-game with this new atmosphere... Honestly I don't played first BGE (which is the only one game, for now, of the "serie")... So I understand that fans of the first game want to play in the same investigation style of the first. But actually I think that what we seen from BGE for now, is far away from the first... And so this new huge universe seems to me to be a more welcoming support for a multiplayer game than for a solo game with a complex and political plot...

Sombraziel
10-23-2018, 01:48 AM
Je viens de voir l'une de tes réponses où tu dis être aussi français, j'écris donc dans notre langue pour être plus à l'aise, la commu aura une traduction google relue et corrigée comme j'ai pu...

J'ai eu l'impression de voir 2 univers différents en voyant les 2 jeux, ce qui ne me pose pas de problème, c'est du nouvel univers dont je suis tombé amoureux, et qui m'a fait connaitre le premier. Seulement, je sais aussi ce que c'est que d'être fan de l'univers d'un jeu, et d'être confronté à la déception de le voir revivre d'une autre façon que celle avec laquelle nous avons grandi (cf Trilogie Fable -> Fable Legends)... Ce qui m'amène à penser qu'il faudrait que les développeurs acceptent enfin une chose, ils ne pourront pas satisfaire tout le monde avec un seul jeu proposant de façon cohérente;
A la fois une trame complexe, axée sur la politique et l'investigation côtoyant le storytelling, comme celle que toi et tout les fans du premier BGE semblent vouloirs...
Et un jeu en monde ouvert, aux possibilités de personnalisations incroyables et laissant les joueurs incarner des pirates de l'espace, partant à la chasse aux trésors cosmiques dans un univers inconnu en compagnie de leurs vieux ou nouveaux amis, autre joueurs ou pnjs...
Ce que les nouveaux Space Monkeys semblent vouloir...
Cela permettrait de diviser l'univers en 2 approche différentes, celle du jeu de rôle immersif d'investigation, suivant la voie du premier jeu, et celle née des rêves de grandeure de Michel Ancel et de beaucoup de fans dont je fais moi-même partie, ouvrant l'univers à un Space-Opéra, voyant s'affronter de nombreuses faction...
La première approche serait celle que les fans du premier attendent, et pourrait trouver comme support un jeu à part entière, le véritable Beyound Good and Evil 2 et proposant aux joueurs, pouquoi pas, de réincarner Jade lors d'une ultime enquête.
Tandis que la deuxième prendrait vie des cendres de ce titre. Se basant sur ce qui a été montré pour l'instant dans le Space Monkey Programme, et n'usurpant plus le statut de " suite du premier ", pour arborer fièrement sa nouvel nature plus Space-Opera, avec un nouveau nom, Beyound Good And Evil Universe, ou, plus original, System3...
Enfin, si, et uniquement si, cela est réalisable, ce serait une joie de voir ces 2 jeux arborer la même jacquette, un premier disque pour la campagne solo, un autre pour la campagne multijoueur, proposant cette fois d'incarner son propre personnage dans cet universe beaucoup plus vatse, tout aussi axé jeu de rôle, mais d'une façon différente et accordant peut-être plus de place à la coopération et au multijoueur.

I just saw one of your answers where you say you are also French, so I write in our language to be more comfortable, the commu will have a Google translation read and corrected as I could ...

I had the impression to see 2 different worlds seeing the 2 games, which does not pose a problem for me, it's the new universe that I fell in love with, and that made me know the first. Only, I also know what it is like to be a fan of the world of a game, and to be confronted with the disappointment to see it revive in another way than the one with which we grew up (cf. Fable Trilogy -> Fable Legends) ... Which leads me to think that the developers should finally accept one thing, they will not be able to satisfy everyone with a single game proposing a coherent way;
At the same time a complex plot, focused on politics and investigation alongside storytelling, like the one you and all the fans of the first BGE seem to want ...
And an open world game, with incredible possibilities of customization and letting players play space pirates, going on a hunt for cosmic treasures in an unknown universe with their old or new friends, other players or NPCs. .
What the new Space Monkeys seem to want ...
This would divide the universe into 2 different approaches, the one of immersive role-playing game, following the path of the first game, and that born of the dreams of greatness of Michel Ancel and many fans of which I make myself part, opening the universe to a Space-Opera, seeing confronting many faction ...
The first approach would be the one fans of the first wait, and could find support as a full-fledged game, the real Beyound Good and Evil 2 and offering players, why not, reincarnate Jade in a final investigation.
While the second would take life from the ashes of this title. Based on what has been shown for the moment in the Space Monkey Program, and no longer usurping the status of "sequel to the first", to proudly display its new nature more Space-Opera oriented, with a new name, Beyound Good And Evil Universe, or, more original, System3 ...
Finally, if, and only if, it is workable, it would be a joy to see these 2 games sport the same jacquette, a first disc for the single player campaign, another for the multiplayer campaign, proposing this time to embody our own character in this universe much more vatse, still axed role-playing, but in a different way and perhaps giving more space to cooperation and multiplayer.

UBI-Zuzu
10-23-2018, 10:54 AM
Please mind this is English speaking forums, so please stick to using this language. If you prefer discussing in French, we have forums in this language as well:
https://forums-fr.ubi.com/

ElPrimordial
10-23-2018, 04:35 PM
Honestly I don't played first BGE (which is the only one game, for now, of the "serie")...

Then, what are you waiting for? You now have plenty time to play it until BGE2 be released, and you can take vantage of Halloween and other end year sales in almost all online stores to grab it very cheap.
Its really worth it to be play it.

Galakseeowonder
10-29-2018, 12:45 PM
Je viens de voir l'une de tes réponses où tu dis être aussi français, j'écris donc dans notre langue pour être plus à l'aise, la commu aura une traduction google relue et corrigée comme j'ai pu...

J'ai eu l'impression de voir 2 univers différents en voyant les 2 jeux, ce qui ne me pose pas de problème, c'est du nouvel univers dont je suis tombé amoureux, et qui m'a fait connaitre le premier. Seulement, je sais aussi ce que c'est que d'être fan de l'univers d'un jeu, et d'être confronté à la déception de le voir revivre d'une autre façon que celle avec laquelle nous avons grandi (cf Trilogie Fable -> Fable Legends)... Ce qui m'amène à penser qu'il faudrait que les développeurs acceptent enfin une chose, ils ne pourront pas satisfaire tout le monde avec un seul jeu proposant de façon cohérente;
A la fois une trame complexe, axée sur la politique et l'investigation côtoyant le storytelling, comme celle que toi et tout les fans du premier BGE semblent vouloirs...
Et un jeu en monde ouvert, aux possibilités de personnalisations incroyables et laissant les joueurs incarner des pirates de l'espace, partant à la chasse aux trésors cosmiques dans un univers inconnu en compagnie de leurs vieux ou nouveaux amis, autre joueurs ou pnjs...
Ce que les nouveaux Space Monkeys semblent vouloir...
Cela permettrait de diviser l'univers en 2 approche différentes, celle du jeu de rôle immersif d'investigation, suivant la voie du premier jeu, et celle née des rêves de grandeure de Michel Ancel et de beaucoup de fans dont je fais moi-même partie, ouvrant l'univers à un Space-Opéra, voyant s'affronter de nombreuses faction...
La première approche serait celle que les fans du premier attendent, et pourrait trouver comme support un jeu à part entière, le véritable Beyound Good and Evil 2 et proposant aux joueurs, pouquoi pas, de réincarner Jade lors d'une ultime enquête.
Tandis que la deuxième prendrait vie des cendres de ce titre. Se basant sur ce qui a été montré pour l'instant dans le Space Monkey Programme, et n'usurpant plus le statut de " suite du premier ", pour arborer fièrement sa nouvel nature plus Space-Opera, avec un nouveau nom, Beyound Good And Evil Universe, ou, plus original, System3...
Enfin, si, et uniquement si, cela est réalisable, ce serait une joie de voir ces 2 jeux arborer la même jacquette, un premier disque pour la campagne solo, un autre pour la campagne multijoueur, proposant cette fois d'incarner son propre personnage dans cet universe beaucoup plus vatse, tout aussi axé jeu de rôle, mais d'une façon différente et accordant peut-être plus de place à la coopération et au multijoueur.

I just saw one of your answers where you say you are also French, so I write in our language to be more comfortable, the commu will have a Google translation read and corrected as I could ...

I had the impression to see 2 different worlds seeing the 2 games, which does not pose a problem for me, it's the new universe that I fell in love with, and that made me know the first. Only, I also know what it is like to be a fan of the world of a game, and to be confronted with the disappointment to see it revive in another way than the one with which we grew up (cf. Fable Trilogy -> Fable Legends) ... Which leads me to think that the developers should finally accept one thing, they will not be able to satisfy everyone with a single game proposing a coherent way;
At the same time a complex plot, focused on politics and investigation alongside storytelling, like the one you and all the fans of the first BGE seem to want ...
And an open world game, with incredible possibilities of customization and letting players play space pirates, going on a hunt for cosmic treasures in an unknown universe with their old or new friends, other players or NPCs. .
What the new Space Monkeys seem to want ...
This would divide the universe into 2 different approaches, the one of immersive role-playing game, following the path of the first game, and that born of the dreams of greatness of Michel Ancel and many fans of which I make myself part, opening the universe to a Space-Opera, seeing confronting many faction ...
The first approach would be the one fans of the first wait, and could find support as a full-fledged game, the real Beyound Good and Evil 2 and offering players, why not, reincarnate Jade in a final investigation.
While the second would take life from the ashes of this title. Based on what has been shown for the moment in the Space Monkey Program, and no longer usurping the status of "sequel to the first", to proudly display its new nature more Space-Opera oriented, with a new name, Beyound Good And Evil Universe, or, more original, System3 ...
Finally, if, and only if, it is workable, it would be a joy to see these 2 games sport the same jacquette, a first disc for the single player campaign, another for the multiplayer campaign, proposing this time to embody our own character in this universe much more vatse, still axed role-playing, but in a different way and perhaps giving more space to cooperation and multiplayer.

I know what you mean, I'm not a full fan of the first game, I don't really remember the investigation system they had it's been a long time since I played it over to my cousin's place, it was fun but this 2nd looks like it's gonna be a whole lot different,more like some kind of AC, fallout or elderscrolls but having something different could be cool, I know what I was say8ng was a bit in depth, but if you look at the AC serie there is always a choice like being silent and invisible and kill no one or be deadly kill everyone, you could do the same here by solving big problems either by taking down opponent faction main managers or something more legal, less letal like doing investigations and that would have a link with first game (cause it is still BGE2 and if you wanna do another game why do you use the name if the two games have nothing in common).
The idea would be to have a fun mechanic, that would be rewarding but isn't the only choice to go through the game. Something like EVE in which you can gain money and reputation through a lot of different activities.

Sombraziel
10-30-2018, 06:33 AM
It sounds really good, but it doesn't solve the multi-player problem, even with instanced rooms, I think it would be difficult to have coherent quests where you "can" change the world... Because if it becomes a kind of mmorpg (what is too far for me, I prefer a kind of Destiny multi-player system, even if I don't know how it works), so like SWTOR, DC Universe Online etc... I think the main problem of these games is that even if they have cool stories and worlds, finally your acts during quests don't change at any point things for other players... Actually they just all play to a solo rpg, but on the same map than other players... With some multi-players area and mini-games, there's cooperation, but that's not like being a part of the same story together... It is totally incoherent that a NPC needs being help to "change the world" by divulging a scandal on a particular politician, as many times there's players to do the quest... And then, I don't have any idea to have at the same time a real solo adventure, fitting with a such multi-player system. Which is even not an option to me, not at all because I prefer mmorpg and only want to play to multi-player games, it more tends to be the opposite... But because in such a vaste universe I fear we feel alone, in a game without soul, doing indefinitely hundreds of little side-quests (as I feel playing Skyrim and fallout 3). A cooperative multi-player mode add colors, life and diversity to a vaste universe like this one...

Galakseeowonder
11-07-2018, 12:45 PM
Ok I get your point I really don't know what the online/multiplayer will look like in this game but you could have some conquest meters that would move either with some kind of turf wars or investigations, but you could choose either side and so this could be the core to some pvp either with mechanics like APB reloaded with the cop/thief gameplay so you could steal supplies, investigate and all, and people would need to counter you or something only pve but competitive that would gain points from several actions political or guerilla wise...
Cities and even planets would change their political and military system because of this actions, from a pacifist open democracy to an expansionist/nationalist dictature for exemple that would attack other countries and planets.
You would then end up in some planetary and interplanetary conflict with spy and military actions to take on.
Maybe not the whole system but a part of it as a rewarding pvp/competitive PVE
In the end it's important to have this core investigation mechanic to the serie or why keep the name BGE, and this is a gameplay no one else have and it is important to not be another same game.