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SnizzyWizzy
09-17-2018, 04:24 AM
I like the Hylander but I do kinda feel like his damage is a bit overturned based on how good he is. I don't care that his sword is big...yada yada... simply for gameplay I just feel like maybe its a bit high. Any thoughts on this? Or am I alone in my thinking here?

iadvisoryi
09-17-2018, 06:28 AM
I like the Hylander but I do kinda feel like his damage is a bit overturned based on how good he is. I don't care that his sword is big...yada yada... simply for gameplay I just feel like maybe its a bit high. Any thoughts on this? Or am I alone in my thinking here?

I agree, but only because 4v4 modes exist. Cuz he is reactable, everything in his stance is a risk from poke, but in 4v4 when attention isn't on him, it's an unblockable every half second for 40-60 dmg (idk the exact dmg) the only thing I find absolutely dumb is his kick cancel into toss, if someone is out of stamina against a Highlander you lose instantly. And he gets a lot of free heavys out of things that I don't think he should get free if it's a setup.

BadBOO17
09-17-2018, 07:39 AM
hes fine

mrmistark
09-17-2018, 08:34 AM
You mean Highlander? haha. Being serious though, Iíll bite here.

For how slow he is comparitively, I think his damage is fine in all categories. His UB OS heavies deal 40 damage. This is the only thing I would say I wouldnít mind if it was tone down. Anywhere between 30-35 damage doesnít seem unreasonable for these OS heavies due to their ability to chain, the decent speed and circumstances in which it can be guaranteed and soft feinted out of. The thing to consider is that there is definitely a level of skill needed to be able to utilize these heavies and many match ups that make the utilization harder even more so. With this in mind, I donít think the damage should be nerfed into the dirt, just maybe slightly.

As far as in 4v4, he can be hit out of OS by friendly fire and his heavies donít lock you into guaranteed damage which by all rights makes it better than cut scenes like skewer, jabs, demons embrace, carry and knee into wall, ect. Itís his throw that is good in this regard but only works well when teammates arenít hailing aimlessly which is rare because they usually screw up the punish of caber toss for you.

The kick into caber toss is actually very easy to counter. The problem is you dodge too early. Youíre not the only one, thatís why everyone says itís so good because they dodge too early or spam dodge attacks which get caught by the toss. Wait until just before the kick would hit. At this point he would miss the kick, and as far as feinting into caber toss if you dodge at this time he will miss and be punished for it. The way dodging works is for each attack, if you are dodging during the start up, you will get hit. The trick is to wait until last minute and practicing the timing. If he goes to soft fient and you dodge at the start up of it youíll still dodge it as long as the dodge was initiated during that attack if that makes sense. Moral of the story, dodge as late as possible and youíll both 1) dodge the kick and 2) dodge soft fient into toss.

Siegfried-Z
09-17-2018, 09:38 AM
You mean Highlander? haha. Being serious though, Iíll bite here.

For how slow he is comparitively, I think his damage is fine in all categories. His UB OS heavies deal 40 damage. This is the only thing I would say I wouldnít mind if it was tone down. Anywhere between 30-35 damage doesnít seem unreasonable for these OS heavies due to their ability to chain, the decent speed and circumstances in which it can be guaranteed and soft feinted out of. The thing to consider is that there is definitely a level of skill needed to be able to utilize these heavies and many match ups that make the utilization harder even more so. With this in mind, I donít think the damage should be nerfed into the dirt, just maybe slightly.

As far as in 4v4, he can be hit out of OS by friendly fire and his heavies donít lock you into guaranteed damage which by all rights makes it better than cut scenes like skewer, jabs, demons embrace, carry and knee into wall, ect. Itís his throw that is good in this regard but only works well when teammates arenít hailing aimlessly which is rare because they usually screw up the punish of caber toss for you.

The kick into caber toss is actually very easy to counter. The problem is you dodge too early. Youíre not the only one, thatís why everyone says itís so good because they dodge too early or spam dodge attacks which get caught by the toss. Wait until just before the kick would hit. At this point he would miss the kick, and as far as feinting into caber toss if you dodge at this time he will miss and be punished for it. The way dodging works is for each attack, if you are dodging during the start up, you will get hit. The trick is to wait until last minute and practicing the timing. If he goes to soft fient and you dodge at the start up of it youíll still dodge it as long as the dodge was initiated during that attack if that makes sense. Moral of the story, dodge as late as possible and youíll both 1) dodge the kick and 2) dodge soft fient into toss.

He is just not that easy to perform with at a decent level.

HL requires some works to be good with.

But common, once you get good with him, in the right hand he is an absolute beast.. While in defensive stance he's got HA on everything and while in offensive one UB or Bash on everything... The kick into grab whatever you say works very well too.

He's got a crushing counter in any direction.

I don't play him just because i enjoy playing char with a good mobility and HL is far too static for me. I aslo really dislike HL current way of fight which are back light and wait in offensive stance for your opponent to lost patience.

In my Opinion HL is among TOP 3 char of the roaster.

Vrbas1
09-17-2018, 04:28 PM
I'm ok with his damage as it stands. He's slow AF so in 1v1 scenarios it can be a real struggle to actually connect those heavy hitters. In 4v4 I can understand the frustration, but his speed remains my arguing factor. This and the fact he can be knocked out of his unblockables by nearby teammates. He's kinda like Shugoki in these instances, he needs to be the focus if you are defending yourself in group fights... otherwise you could have a bad time (French Fried instead of Pizza'd)

The_B0G_
09-17-2018, 04:50 PM
He is just not that easy to perform with at a decent level.

HL requires some works to be good with.

But common, once you get good with him, in the right hand he is an absolute beast.. While in defensive stance he's got HA on everything and while in offensive one UB or Bash on everything... The kick into grab whatever you say works very well too.

He's got a crushing counter in any direction.

I don't play him just because i enjoy playing char with a good mobility and HL is far too static for me. I aslo really dislike HL current way of fight which are back light and wait in offensive stance for your opponent to lost patience.

In my Opinion HL is among TOP 3 char of the roaster.

His defensive heavies are painfully slow, and the HA on them doesn't activate until too late into the attack to be very useful, he can't trade with any light attacks with it, he'll be staggered.

If you're good enough to land his crushing counters he can be very good, I'm not one of those people, I land them when people are being predictable, but 400 ms attacks on console along with the huge amount of unblockables bashes in the reworks make his crushing counter game similar to Aramushas blade blockade, it's good when it works, but you're better off using his other options.

Like others, I think his unblockable damage could go down to 35, but his defensive heavy's are slow and have high parry potential, they should pack a punch, all you need to do is block to stop it.

I think HL isn't in such a bad place right now, anything more than a slight unblockable heavy damage nerf and he would need to be buffed some place else.

Siegfried-Z
09-18-2018, 12:49 AM
His defensive heavies are painfully slow, and the HA on them doesn't activate until too late into the attack to be very useful, he can't trade with any light attacks with it, he'll be staggered.

If you're good enough to land his crushing counters he can be very good, I'm not one of those people, I land them when people are being predictable, but 400 ms attacks on console along with the huge amount of unblockables bashes in the reworks make his crushing counter game similar to Aramushas blade blockade, it's good when it works, but you're better off using his other options.

Like others, I think his unblockable damage could go down to 35, but his defensive heavy's are slow and have high parry potential, they should pack a punch, all you need to do is block to stop it.

I think HL isn't in such a bad place right now, anything more than a slight unblockable heavy damage nerf and he would need to be buffed some place else.

While slow i don't agree his defensive stance heavies are useless.
First, in a group fight a HL just switching with side heavies can score hard dammage.
Agaisnt assassins they are even kind of efficient as you can only block the second hit if caught by the first and that's a trap which still works.
His HA can be super usefull if mixed smartly with UB mix up as Well.
Ive met once a terrible HL really good at it and it was a nightmare .
And yes they are easy to parry but they can be feinted too so no special punishemnt for using it.
But anyway i agree he just need a nerf on his ub dmg.

UbiInsulin
09-18-2018, 02:00 AM
Thanks everybody for the nuanced feedback. I'll keep monitoring this thread.

DefiledDragon
09-18-2018, 02:33 AM
Thanks everybody for the nuanced feedback. I'll keep monitoring this thread.

Any chance you could monitor this thread?

https://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1933201-How-did-this-EVER-get-through-testing

;)

ChampionRuby50g
09-18-2018, 02:41 AM
Tone down the UB heavy damage, and then we are laughing. Thatís the only issue I have with HL.

Haplo_Bane
09-18-2018, 03:44 AM
Every character has different strengths and weaknesses. It's like everyone wants the character they have problems with to be nerfed. I personally have always had problems with the berserker. But I never wanted a nerf despite my many deaths by his hands. It's simply my play style. The beserker is almost a perfect counter to how I play. It should be like this. Yes,the Highlander does do massive damage. And so he should. What do want? Every character to be the same but just look different? It seems that way. Bring Back Team Shuffle

Vrbas1
09-18-2018, 04:40 AM
Tone down the UB heavy damage, and then we are laughing. Thatís the only issue I have with HL.

Why?

The_B0G_
09-18-2018, 09:13 AM
While slow i don't agree his defensive stance heavies are useless.
First, in a group fight a HL just switching with side heavies can score hard dammage.
Agaisnt assassins they are even kind of efficient as you can only block the second hit if caught by the first and that's a trap which still works.
His HA can be super usefull if mixed smartly with UB mix up as Well.
Ive met once a terrible HL really good at it and it was a nightmare .
And yes they are easy to parry but they can be feinted too so no special punishemnt for using it.
But anyway i agree he just need a nerf on his ub dmg.

Besides in group fights with target switching, while in a 1v1 situation his defensive heavies are pretty useless; unless you use it only for feinting. Throwing defensive heavies in a 1v1 is asking to be parried, even mediocre players can parry them.

I know the rest of his kit is good, and about the mind games and mix ups, I was only saying his defensive heavies aren't very useful, I think if HA activated a little earlier in the heavy if would be good.

Specialkha
09-18-2018, 10:01 AM
Listening to certain ppl, we might even think the HL is trash tier, this is funny.