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View Full Version : Warlord needs a rework.



NikolajSlav
08-16-2018, 11:37 PM
He is the second weakest character in the game now.
He has 0 legitemate mix ups. He has 2 basic combos which are plain and predictable,
he has no soft feints and he has THE WEAKEST parry punish in the game.
Headbut is too risky, since it barely drains any stamina at all, and his mistakes are too punishable.
In the current meta he cannot actively compete.

PC. btw

dinosaurlicker
08-16-2018, 11:42 PM
I agree that he needs a rework, but some of your statements are wrong. Aramusha and Shugoki are weaker and LB and Warlord are tied for third worst.

Warlord doesnít have weakest parry punish, he gets like 30 on lights and 25 on heavies

Armosias
08-17-2018, 12:30 AM
25 on heavy parries? I don't know where you picked those numbers but they're fake. Also Shugoki is not in a so bad state even though his kit is way too basic. And Warlords can HB spam to death

NikolajSlav
08-17-2018, 12:36 AM
@Armisias He has a 50 50 headbut/guardbreak and thats it. Spamming isnt fun for anyone. I want some mix up, I want a better parry punish and more basic combos.

Warlord only has 2 basic combos, and 0 soft feints.
He also has ultra short range and the least amount of damage out of any heavy... By far.
Lawbringer has more damage, more range and 20 more hp.

How is this ok?

TSCDescon
08-17-2018, 12:59 AM
His OOS game is insane. Unlock charge or guard break.

TSCDescon
08-17-2018, 01:01 AM
25 on heavy parries? I don't know where you picked those numbers but they're fake. Also Shugoki is not in a so bad state even though his kit is way too basic. And Warlords can HB spam to death

Lol.

Light > headbutt 24/7 (1v1)

Spam Unblockables and DE (4v4) risk of dying.

Horrible OOS game.

Yeah, heís not in a bad state at all.

Hormly
08-17-2018, 01:47 AM
25 on heavy parries? I don't know where you picked those numbers but they're fake. Also Shugoki is not in a so bad state even though his kit is way too basic. And Warlords can HB spam to death

Parry heavy, zone for 25 dmg

Armosias
08-17-2018, 08:42 AM
Parry heavy, zone for 25 dmg
Oh **** I just learned I can do this okay sorry.


Lol.

Light > headbutt 24/7 (1v1)

Spam Unblockables and DE (4v4) risk of dying.

Horrible OOS game.

Yeah, heís not in a bad state at all.
He somehow managed to keep a not so terrible winrate so he was not the worst hero in the game that's why he haven't been reworked yet. Conq and Kensei was both the weakest characters before rework, PK was way too strong(And nerfed too hard) and Orochi was highly requested, Valkyrie was also the worst hero in For Honor before being reworked. Shugoki always managed to be in the weak but not so bad state all this time. This somehow stands for Warlord too, and although he has no mixups his kit allows him to attack and defend well even when facing DLC or post-rework heroes

Halvtand
08-17-2018, 11:17 AM
The biuggest problem with WL is that he no longer is the character in his description. He was supposed to be a beast with lots of stamina and a godly OOS-punish. He has neither. I am to this day convinced that someone copy-pasted the description for cent into WL's bio and no one noticed until release. Big portions of WL's parry punish-game has need nerfed as well, his gb-range, even his headbutt. Right now he is just too predictable. He has no combos, no unblockable attack, no way to punish after dodge... The fact that WL still has high win rates i think speaks a lot more about the players than the hero. Hell, even his punish on fullblock is blockable by many heroes, how TF did that get through balancing?

There is a thread over on the suggestion forum that outlines what is to me a pretty decent rework idea. Check it out.
https://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1889205-How-to-fix-Warlord,

EDIT: I just went over to the official page to get the description for WL and noticed that they've changed it. It used to say something along the lines of "He'll drain the enemies stamina and then punish them with his own huge stamina pool". They still have not managed to change his weapon from a gladius to a norse sword though.

Armosias
08-17-2018, 11:24 AM
I've been reading the first post, and that rework doesn't require much effort and would probably be good but it may lack some turtle opening abilities

HazelrahFirefly
08-17-2018, 03:10 PM
I think the WL still does decently because of ledging capability and that's it. I tried him out for the first time a few weeks ago and... yeah, no thanks.

Halvtand
08-17-2018, 04:03 PM
I think the WL still does decently because of ledging capability and that's it. I tried him out for the first time a few weeks ago and... yeah, no thanks.

That is his only real expertise, the one thing he is better at than any other character in the game (or maybe he's second to Shaman's GB-pounce?). Even then you have to land a GB and be at least semi-close to a ledge and have that ledge at such an angle that you can throw the enemy in that direction.

HazelrahFirefly
08-17-2018, 04:41 PM
That is his only real expertise, the one thing he is better at than any other character in the game (or maybe he's second to Shaman's GB-pounce?). Even then you have to land a GB and be at least semi-close to a ledge and have that ledge at such an angle that you can throw the enemy in that direction.

I'll just wait for a rework until I give him another go. I dont want to solely rely on ledging lol.

Tyrjo
08-17-2018, 05:22 PM
I wrote a more concise rework a while back and the discussion has been keeping on going:

How to fix Warlord
https://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1889205-How-to-fix-Warlord?p=13635463#post13635463

TSCDescon
08-17-2018, 05:35 PM
Donít bring up the winrate. Thatís not even accurate. The last time someone showed me the winrate chart, it only shows 2% of the top players for each character.

In all honesty, LB, WL, and Shug should all get reworked in one season, then Raider and Nobu next.

bannex19
08-17-2018, 06:13 PM
LB and Warlord have some fantastic tools and aren't actually terrible. A large rework might ruin them tbh. I think number adjusting and breaking one of their moves to do insane damage or make it impossible to react to should be sufficient ubi.

After all we're balancing around the shaman right?

Hormly
08-17-2018, 07:01 PM
@Armisias He has a 50 50 headbut/guardbreak and thats it. Spamming isnt fun for anyone. I want some mix up, I want a better parry punish and more basic combos.

Warlord only has 2 basic combos, and 0 soft feints.
He also has ultra short range and the least amount of damage out of any heavy... By far.
Lawbringer has more damage, more range and 20 more hp.

How is this ok?

Headbutt is not a 50/50 sir, if you could feint the headbutt into a gb it would be, but you can't, so it's not. Headbutt is reactable, does poor damage, costs much stamina and earns you 12 dmg

Tyrjo
08-17-2018, 07:42 PM
Don’t bring up the winrate. That’s not even accurate. The last time someone showed me the winrate chart, it only shows 2% of the top players for each character.

In all honesty, LB, WL, and Shug should all get reworked in one season, then Raider and Nobu next.

The reason it shows the top 2% is because those players are assumed to know the ins and out of the game. In lets say the top 25% bracket, Centurion and Raider are probably ranked a lot higher.

TSCDescon
08-18-2018, 01:54 AM
The reason it shows the top 2% is because those players are assumed to know the ins and out of the game. In lets say the top 25% bracket, Centurion and Raider are probably ranked a lot higher.

That is why the top 2% is bs. That is so little. You can have 2 best player in the world, same skill level, go against each other in 1v1, one guy picks conq the other shugoki. Whose more likely going to win? Definitely, Conq because Conq has more tools in his kit to use in the long run than Shugoki.

You might say, "oh you're comparing an S tier to an D tier." Tier lists are based on what the character can do with their kit, not the player's skill level. Shugoki is D tier because he has only 2 VIABLE moves, light - headbutt and demons embrace off from wallsplat which 90% will never happen in duels. His heavy feints are predictable. Sure, he has HA to trade hits, but who would throw out an attack to get rid of it?

NikolajSlav
08-18-2018, 10:06 AM
The reason only the 2% stats are valid is because people that don't know what they are doing cant be expected to show a good indicator of balance.
Ubisoft says they will only balance around the best players, because they want everyone to learn the game better.

Even stats from season 5, before mayor buffs/reworks to non warlord fighters showed warlord to be among the weakest both winrate and pickrate wise.
People that say warlord is fine where he is have 0 idea what they are talking about and shouldn't be taken seriusly. Most of the people that claim warlord is fine dont even have 3 reps on him.

Lord_Cherubi
08-18-2018, 12:08 PM
In all honesty, LB, WL, and Shug should all get reworked in one season, then Raider and Nobu next.

Words of wisdom.

NikolajSlav
08-18-2018, 12:23 PM
Words of wisdom.

3 reworks in such a short time probably wouldn't be very high quallity.

NikolajSlav
08-18-2018, 07:51 PM
Buff lawbringer threads get Ubisofts attention but suggesting a rework for Warlord apperantly doesnt get Ubisofts glance at all.
Good to know where we stand.

David_gorda
08-18-2018, 07:59 PM
Buff lawbringer threads get Ubisofts attention but suggesting a rework for Warlord apperantly doesnt get Ubisofts glance at all.
Good to know where we stand. i have both prestige 20+ and warlord is much stronger. He has fast lights all directions and a fast zone attack among other things. He Also has a very good (50/50) when opponent put if stamina, either running shield crush or stop and guardbreak. He is much stronger then lawbringer, it would be nice Of you back up your not so good Claims with actuall Readon why warlord needs more buff then lawbringer because everyone that has a slight clue about the Game Knows that lawbringer is the Worst hero except shugoki.

NikolajSlav
08-18-2018, 09:17 PM
i have both prestige 20+ and warlord is much stronger. He has fast lights all directions and a fast zone attack among other things. He Also has a very good (50/50) when opponent put if stamina, either running shield crush or stop and guardbreak. He is much stronger then lawbringer, it would be nice Of you back up your not so good Claims with actuall Readon why warlord needs more buff then lawbringer because everyone that has a slight clue about the Game Knows that lawbringer is the Worst hero except shugoki.

Allright prove your point. Play a few games and show me what I am doing wrong with Warlord, that makes me lose.
Show me how to play Warlord your way, and then I will withdraw my claim.

The_B0G_
08-18-2018, 09:32 PM
Lb and Shugo are without a doubt the weaker of the 3, I still do well with warlord against all heroes, usually at the top of the scoreboard with him.

I have LB rep 25 and I can't even use him any more, without the bomb bringer loadout, he really has nothing, I've gotten so many people down to one bar of health with him, then they just turtle up, and I can do absolutely nothing to open them up.

Shugo is basically just the least fun hero to fight against in the game, his entire style is sleep inducing, I got him to rep 7, but stopped after that, he's not very fun to play either.

Since this is a Warlord rework thread I suppose I should share my thoughts there, Warlord doesn't need too much IMO, he needs more versatility in his attack mixups, light+heavy and heavy+light is all he has, it makes him very predictable.

He should get a light+light, heavy+heavy, and light+light+heavy that has unblockable properties on the combo finisher, you could even take a page out of the Valk rework and have the light+light+heavy use a shield jab that does light damage and stuns instead of a heavy by pressing the GB instead of heavy at the end.

Hormly
08-19-2018, 06:06 AM
Personally I'm fine with WL being the last to be reworked. Especially if that means hell get a proper one.

I have a bad feeling hell get the conq/warden treatment though 😕 if that happens im finished with this game

RexXZ347
08-19-2018, 07:24 AM
Shugoki and aramusha are the worst. These 2 needs rework first.

Hormly
08-19-2018, 07:26 AM
Shugoki and aramusha are the worst. These 2 needs rework first.

If a dlc hero gets a rework before all the OGs are done I will personally go on a killing spree

RexXZ347
08-19-2018, 07:31 AM
If a dlc hero gets a rework before all the OGs are done I will personally go on a killing spree

They just did. cough*Highlander*cough

Hormly
08-19-2018, 08:27 AM
They just did. cough*Highlander*cough

*loads gun*

RexXZ347
08-19-2018, 01:55 PM
*loads gun*

*Me watching news of a man on a killing spree*

NikolajSlav
08-19-2018, 06:53 PM
*Me watching news of a man on a killing spree*

This forum post has been turned into a joke.
No wonder Ubisoft doesnt take the forums seriusly.

Hormly
08-19-2018, 08:02 PM
This forum post has been turned into a joke.
No wonder Ubisoft doesnt take the forums seriusly.

Feel free to get it back on track sir

NikolajSlav
08-19-2018, 08:05 PM
Feel free to get it back on track sir

Im just glad there is people still paying attention.

The_B0G_
08-19-2018, 08:06 PM
Feel free to get it back on track sir

*Shoots Hormly* Thread should now return to normal.

NikolajSlav
08-19-2018, 09:41 PM
*Shoots Hormly* Thread should now return to normal.

At this point no one will ever read this. I kinda feel like hiding an easter egg in a comment.

DefiledDragon
08-19-2018, 09:50 PM
At this point no one will ever read this. I kinda feel like hiding an easter egg in a comment.

It's not Easter.

RexXZ347
08-19-2018, 11:34 PM
At this point no one will ever read this. I kinda feel like hiding an easter egg in a comment.

do not be disappointed because of jokes in this thread. People gets your point. Ubisoft reads your post. It's just that most of the time ubisoft doesn't reply.

NikolajSlav
08-19-2018, 11:50 PM
do not be disappointed because of jokes in this thread. People gets your point. Ubisoft reads your post. It's just that most of the time ubisoft doesn't reply.

@Admins @Ubisoft Is that true or not?

DefiledDragon
08-20-2018, 12:41 AM
@Admins @Ubisoft Is that true or not?

Not sure they respond to hashtags either tbh.

Velentix
08-20-2018, 01:56 AM
I honestly think warlord and raider need close to complete overhauls, and maybe even classes for them to switch. I think that the raider with a good kit could make for a frightening heavy, while adding some mobility to warlord and making him a vanguard would be best. Those classes for them make more sense to me anyway. I would love for warlord to use his shield as an actual weapon, and raider to use his axe stave to clothesline/trip people.