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Casper5632
07-18-2018, 06:38 AM
How can a lawbringer break the wardens shoulder bash and quick attack combo? Top light, my fastest attack, does not hit before I get another shove. A dodge is just asking for trouble as they will just cancel and guard break. A roll is the only option and you need to be able to roll back. Is this new buff really make the fight hopeless if I let them start it?

ChampionRuby50g
07-18-2018, 07:24 AM
If Warden does the SB from neutral (700ms) LBs top light (500ms) will stop it on reaction. If you use block shove > light, Warden will be able to dodge SB you since itís basically a dodge attack. Youíd have to block shove > GB to catch them. If Warden hits you with a light then SB your best bet is rolling.

If you need any other tips Iíd be happy to help, they are my two highest characters. Rep 50 LB and rep 24 Warden.

Casper5632
07-18-2018, 08:30 AM
If Warden does the SB from neutral (700ms) LBs top light (500ms) will stop it on reaction. If you use block shove > light, Warden will be able to dodge SB you since it’s basically a dodge attack. You’d have to block shove > GB to catch them. If Warden hits you with a light then SB your best bet is rolling.

If you need any other tips I’d be happy to help, they are my two highest characters. Rep 50 LB and rep 24 Warden.

But I regularly have the warden just guard break before the roll actually makes me immune. A roll AWAY is the only hope I have of getting out of the combo. If I am exhausted and a warden shows up it feels like almost a guaranteed 50% health lost.

So really my only hope is to light attack and make sure it lands before the first SB? Once they start the combo I am forced to just run away? Doesnt that put me at a huge disadvantage since my top light is my only chance to stop it, but they can riposte my top light for a ton more damage than it would do. SB ignores shove, and the warden is able to follow up while I cant get a free light in.

I guess thats why they are the best dueling hero in the game.

AzureSky.
07-18-2018, 06:21 PM
just block and shove then mixup (light, grab or side heavy), lawbringer is really binary sadly, i hope they rework him.

Casper5632
07-19-2018, 12:33 AM
just block and shove then mixup (light, grab or side heavy), lawbringer is really binary sadly, i hope they rework him.

I'm looking for ways to stop the Warden combo. You cant block the SB. If the warden was OP he would be played more often, but when I run into one its almost always a loss because they can do that combo 2-4 times based on their current stamina.

Arekonator
07-19-2018, 12:42 AM
You dont "stop" the warden combo, as LB you simply dont have the tools to do it.
You just have to bite bullet, manage your stamina and roll whenever you get hit by it. Then you have to keep the proper spacing and dodge out whenever warden initiates with the dodge. You should be out of range of the GB if he decides to cancel into it.
As annoying as it is, you have to keep at it until he gives up on his SB mixup and attempts to combat you with other means and go from there.

ChampionRuby50g
07-19-2018, 12:46 AM
But I regularly have the warden just guard break before the roll actually makes me immune. A roll AWAY is the only hope I have of getting out of the combo. If I am exhausted and a warden shows up it feels like almost a guaranteed 50% health lost.

So really my only hope is to light attack and make sure it lands before the first SB? Once they start the combo I am forced to just run away? Doesnt that put me at a huge disadvantage since my top light is my only chance to stop it, but they can riposte my top light for a ton more damage than it would do. SB ignores shove, and the warden is able to follow up while I cant get a free light in.

I guess thats why they are the best dueling hero in the game.

Yeah Iím not too sure on the timing for getting someone in a GB after they roll. I think they are vulnerable as they straighten up at the end of their roll.

From Neutral, yeah thatís the safest thing. Thereís always the chance the Warden could go SB-GB from neutral so dodging straight away is still risky, and the top light will stop that. If youíve been hit by the SB and then the double lights, roll immediately. The Warden wonít land the SB or GB if they go for it again, unless itís a fully Charged SB which could track your roll. But itís rare for a Warden to use that outside of a gank situation.

Do you play on PC or console? Itís pretty hard to Crushing counter the top light, but a few good players can do it.

Jazz117Volkov
07-19-2018, 05:27 PM
Lawbringer's shove will beat the vortex in my experience. The Warden's counter is to feint their bash, then dodge into a new bash to punish the Lawbringer's shove, but rarely do Wardens do that mid vortex, that's more of an opening tactic: feint bash from neutral.

Warden's guardbreak cancel can catch back rolls if you do them late. The back roll is performed in two stages, first the back dodge, then the roll, if the guardbreak catches you in the back dodge portion of the animation, you'll be guard broken.

KSI_TheMadKing
07-19-2018, 08:56 PM
I dont know if this was said I didn't read any of the other posts.

But throw out a top heavy and perry the light. Use your shove combo and if hes dodging alot and going into his vortex use a side heavy rather that a poke or GB. If your in the vortex side dodge shove. If he goes into it from neutral side dodge shove. You can also tank it till you guess right or just role away.

Works on petty much every warden.

Arekonator
07-19-2018, 10:03 PM
Lawbringer's shove will beat the vortex in my experience. The Warden's counter is to feint their bash, then dodge into a new bash to punish the Lawbringer's shove, but rarely do Wardens do that mid vortex, that's more of an opening tactic: feint bash from neutral.Heavily depends on exact timing. if they colide head-on yes the shove got priority, but because landing a shove doesnt guarantee you anything unless oponent lets you, its kinda moot point. Shove startup is also too slow, so when you do it by reaction he can cancel into GB and still get you before the shove hits him more often than not.


Warden's guardbreak cancel can catch back rolls if you do them late. The back roll is performed in two stages, first the back dodge, then the roll, if the guardbreak catches you in the back dodge portion of the animation, you'll be guard broken.
If you get hit by the double light, you unlock and when the hitstun wears off and warden initiates next bash, you roll, skipping the dodge-into-roll entirely. With bit of practice you can do it whenever he tries to initiate his bash in other situations. By doing that you remove that window of vulnerability and also save tiny bit of stamina that the dodge would consume.

Armosias
07-19-2018, 10:31 PM
Side dodge shove got me out of some vortex already, but the timing seems really tight and you cannot avoid the bg if Warden feints his SB.

Casper5632
07-20-2018, 10:23 PM
Also a good question when did lawbringers become the only ones you are vulnerable to guard breaks during a heavy attack. I get guard broken all the time during heavy attacks, but other classes are immune to a guard break during a heavy attack, even if they feint out of it. If I guard break a raider during a heavy attack feinted to light top they get the damage and my guard break just fizzles. I have seen most classes interrupt my heavy attack with a guard break. I have even seen my light attack fail to interrupt a guard break or SB. Is this just a symptom of hosted servers? I see a lot of laggish issues come out in the last few months of playing, and my ping is pretty low.