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View Full Version : Quick test to confirm 4.01 is like 4.0 (confirmed, no major difference!)



Jetbuff
06-16-2005, 10:50 PM
Take a plane, any plane except the 190's or the SBD. Fly it for a bit in the QMB. Record the track and play it back in the version you played it in to confirm it runs properly. Then, install the other version and play the track there. If there are no differences, well... there you have it.

Jetbuff
06-16-2005, 10:50 PM
Take a plane, any plane except the 190's or the SBD. Fly it for a bit in the QMB. Record the track and play it back in the version you played it in to confirm it runs properly. Then, install the other version and play the track there. If there are no differences, well... there you have it.

crazyivan1970
06-16-2005, 11:01 PM
Bingo... Actually lead programmer of MG suggested that i pass this along but i forgot. Also he said to pay attention to controls as they move in one version versus another. If it`s a perfect match...then patch difference is just an imagination http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Kasdeya
06-16-2005, 11:08 PM
Ivan go to bed

Old_Canuck
06-16-2005, 11:26 PM
Just played a track in 4.01 that was recorded in 4.0 where an F4U went into a kind of torque-induced snap roll during a violent maneuver. Played back exactly the same in 4.01 as it was in 4.0.

msalama
06-17-2005, 12:44 AM
...but you don't really need to do even that to notice that the FMs are similar (apart from those 2 announced changes). I did some back-to-back testing yesterday night, and whaddaya know - no differences!

msalama
06-17-2005, 12:45 AM
But it's a funny thing, this mass hysteria. Almost got me too for a minute, I must admit...

knightflyte
06-17-2005, 12:53 AM
Ya know.........(not dissing anyone in THIS topic).....If the creator of the game says theres no difference other than the 2 stated between patch 4.0 and 4.1, why do some INSIST on not believing him?

He's got NO reason to lie.

Tvrdi
06-17-2005, 01:37 AM
I think the best proof that FM of 4.01 isnt the same like in 4.0 is to look at the dog servers...again we have a lot of spits and bfs there http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif...in 4.0 we had more Fws...and even P38s (ok we hav more P38s now also but not as before)

AWL_Frog
06-17-2005, 02:26 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tvrdi:
I think the best proof that FM of 4.01 isnt the same like in 4.0 is to look at the dog servers...again we have a lot of spits and bfs there http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif...in 4.0 we had more Fws...and even P38s (ok we hav more P38s now also but not as before) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, Tvrdi, the best proof would be a track, as stated above.

SeaFireLIV
06-17-2005, 02:31 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tvrdi:
I think the best proof that FM of 4.01 isnt the same like in 4.0 is to look at the dog servers...again we have a lot of spits and bfs there http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif...in 4.0 we had more Fws...and even P38s (ok we hav more P38s now also but not as before) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Reread what you`ve written, Tvrdi. This proves nothing at all. If that`s the best you can do you should give up now instead of stubbornly sticking with it.

Tvrdi
06-17-2005, 02:33 AM
Frog,..sure, thats what they want you to think....anyway, for few planes FM didnt change alot...but for others.....I think ill take a long rest from il2 now....after 4 years of playing... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif


Seafire..your enjoying in your old/new spit? have a nice wild kiddy maneuvers...and hell, ull even recover faster from the stalls after your wild supertrooper realistic maneuvers than you could in 3.04...are you happy?? (the same think goes for all planes...stalls - no prob - well recover fast hahaha)

SeaFireLIV
06-17-2005, 02:42 AM
What you`ve gotten yourself into here is a deep hole and now you feel too far down it to turn around and say, "I`m sorry, I made a mistake I was wrong." Don`t you?

Be brave, admit you were mistaken. Then you`ll be a real man.

SeaFireLIV
06-17-2005, 02:48 AM
Oh, and if you haven`t already left, try installing 4.01 over FB+AEP+PF+3.03+3.04+4.01 (without 4.00).

Then you can return and apologise.

Tvrdi
06-17-2005, 02:53 AM
Ok seafire...Il try that, but i heard no diffrence..btw, im cheater than..with 4.01 over 4.0

Retrofish
06-17-2005, 06:31 AM
Just one question.

How do you playback *.TRK files from 4.01 in 4.00?

As far as I know (which I admit isn't very far http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif) *.ntrk files can be played in any version...and you will see the same result..which means FM changes means nothing...

Remember a while ago someone in ORR posted sample ntrks of the new FM?

Sorry that was 2 questions...

Deedsundone
06-17-2005, 06:59 AM
Do you really have to have the 3.04 patch? It says it can install from either 3.03 or 3.04,so I guess that 3.04 content is in the 4.01 patch.Whatever,I went from 3.03 to 4.01 and it works and thats the main thing.(though a bit suspicious,computer hypocondria or something http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif)

Yskonyn23
06-17-2005, 07:04 AM
Tvrdi, RE-read SeaFire's post. He said WITHOUT 4.0.
Install v4.01m over 3.04m. I guess the letters are all moving across your screen now, right? Making it hard to read after such a long time on the forums without any breaks. :P

Retrofish
06-17-2005, 08:01 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Bingo... Actually lead programmer of MG suggested that i pass this along but i forgot. Also he said to pay attention to controls as they move in one version versus another. If it`s a perfect match...then patch difference is just an imagination http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you open a TRK file with a text editor you'll see the mission parameters and below that a lot of numbers...so those numbers are control inputs?

So that means to be able to confirm any FM changes you'll have to somehow have two identical TRK files, one from 4.00 and one from 4.01.

Or?

Jetbuff
06-17-2005, 08:04 AM
Retrofish, that's the point. Use the regular offline track saving to produce the .trk file. (not quick track, which has .ntrk extension) These will break and run screwy if there are any FM changes. (and that's why they are completely incompatible between versions)

Only two caveats:
1. Confirm the track was not corrupted during recording by playing it back first in the same version you recorded it in.

2. Avoid the planes which have obviously been tampered with. (190's and SBD)

Now, as far as different install orders affecting the FM, I'm not sure, but I don't think so - afterall, the 4.01m.exe over-writes all the same files supplied by 4.0m.exe. It would be a very tall stretch that a properly installed 4.01's FM would vary depending on whether you installed 4.0m first or not.

Capt._Tenneal
06-17-2005, 08:06 AM
Ivan, if I may suggest, since different folks will have different tracks to use as testbeds (with different planes, weather, maps, altitude, etc.) can Oleg or one of the other devs. have a standard test track they can have to download that everyone can use and post their findings. Kind of llike what the Black Death serves for testing framerates.

Maybe we can already use an existing track in the game ?

Retrofish
06-17-2005, 08:18 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jetbuff:
Retrofish, that's the point. Use the regular offline track saving to produce the .trk file. (not quick track, which has .ntrk extension) These will break and run screwy if there are any FM changes. (and that's why they are completely incompatible between versions)

Only two caveats:
1. Confirm the track was not corrupted during recording by playing it back first in the same version you recorded it in.

2. Avoid the planes which have obviously been tampered with. (190's and SBD)

Now, as far as different install orders affecting the FM, I'm not sure, but I don't think so - afterall, the 4.01m.exe over-writes all the same files supplied by 4.0m.exe. It would be a very tall stretch that a properly installed 4.01's FM would vary depending on whether you installed 4.0m first or not. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ah..I see you missed my point...or I missed yours..again.

How do you playback a TRK file from one version in a later version?

Not possible to my knowledge as it simply is a mission text with added control inputs...?
Something in the text reveals which version it was recorded in?

Ntrks however can be played in any version because it records everything, and therefore does not need to use the FM of the version it is being played back in. (As far as I know)

The only way would be to compare those control inputs? in the TRK files.

Maybe CrazyIvan could ask this Lead Programmer to elaborate?

Jetbuff
06-17-2005, 08:39 AM
Errr... TRK files do play back in different versions. Only time they fail to run at all is when there is a large discrepancy in how inputs and/or mission objects are formatted in the file. There is no trick to it. Record it in one version, check it and play it back in the other version. No problem.

Retrofish
06-17-2005, 08:46 AM
Hmmm...not possible for me.

Ntrks plays flawlessly.

Howelse could we still use the Blackdeath track, which is a ntrk, as a benchmark track?
As well as all the other stock ntrks from original FB.

Jetbuff
06-17-2005, 08:52 AM
That's funny, worked a short while ago on a different track, not repeatable now. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Figured it out: at the start of the track file, where it starts recording inputs, there is a section noting your game difficulty settings, convergence settings, etc. Change the first number from 118 to 119 to avoid version incompatibility message.
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">[$$$record]
118 (change this to 119 for 4.01, 118 for 4.0)
27262207
150.0
150.0
500.0
3.0
0.0
34
1</pre>
Oh, and I just confirmed it. Picture-perfect playback of a track recorded in 4.0 in 4.01.

knightflyte
06-17-2005, 08:58 AM
See ya Tvrdi, don't let he door hit ya on the way out.

Sorry, but I'm tired of the pissin n moanin.
I can live with it, but now it's just stupid when the designer of the game himself says there were 2 minor changes to 2 planes, and idiots call him a liar.

The Spit whining and taunting is getting OLD and HOARY. Grow up already.

Buh Bye

Retrofish
06-17-2005, 09:15 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jetbuff:
That's funny, worked a short while ago on a different track, not repeatable now. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Figured it out: at the start of the track file, where it starts recording inputs, there is a section noting your game difficulty settings, convergence settings, etc. Change the first number from 118 to 119 to avoid version incompatibility message.
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">[$$$record]
118 (change this to 119 for 4.01, 118 for 4.0)
27262207
150.0
150.0
500.0
3.0
0.0
34
1</pre>
Oh, and I just confirmed it. Picture-perfect playback of a track recorded in 4.0 in 4.01.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

lol..brilliant. Thanks.

I'd like to say that I suspected that was it...but I didn't.

LStarosta
06-17-2005, 09:20 AM
Oleg said there is no problem with installing 4.01 over 4.0. I'm not going to spend half my day uninstalling and then reinstalling all this because some whiny dipsh!t can't admit he's wrong so now he makes up an alternate theory to cover up the fact that there are no differences in the FM between 4.0 and 4.01.


Until someone does a track test and shows me definite proof that 4.0-&gt;4.01 is somehow different than 3.04-&gt;4.01, I'm not going to uninstall and reinstall three frickin games.

Thank you for listening so patiently.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Jetbuff
06-17-2005, 09:32 AM
I have 2 tracks that prove 4.0m and 4.01m FM's are the same at least for the 109E-4, F-4, Hurricane MkIIb and Spit Vb if that helps LStarosta? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Each track includes an engagement, shoot-down and a lame attempt at a 3 point landing.

I wonder how long the naysayers will hold out against the obvious? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Jetbuff
06-17-2005, 01:17 PM
CrazyIvan, I think it's time you followed through with your threat of banning the propagators of mass hysteria regarding the "dumbing down" of 4.01's torque from 4.0's. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif