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View Full Version : Shaolin Sweep makes Valk Weep



Music_4_Therapy
06-21-2018, 08:09 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50wD0yKjcpA

@ 3:35

Look at that fast startup and recovery, and it confirms a heavy as well. Even if Shaolin didn't have a sweep its kit is beastly, unlike Valk who's kit seems to centralize around her ability to disable opponents with massive recovery shield bashes (which confirm nothing) and sweeps (which confirms 25 damage but is easily predicted and reacted to and give the opposing player a guardbreak even if they are OOS)

Lets just delete Valkyrie, I'll take the ability to go into hidden stance over full guard on backstep and the 400ms lights and the infinite chains and the massive mix up game (as opposed to being forced to light spam and risk massive parry punish)

No mention of Valk in the Warrior's Den makes Valk weep.

Wes8504
06-21-2018, 08:25 PM
I agree. Feels Valk man...

Knight_Raime
06-21-2018, 09:31 PM
Valks sweep can come from 2-3 seperate combo variations. Shaolin can only do the sweep after his kick. And we don't know if it's confirmed after the kick or if it's dodgable. Also valks sweep gives a top heavy too.

Music_4_Therapy
06-21-2018, 10:58 PM
Valks sweep can come from 2-3 seperate combo variations. Shaolin can only do the sweep after his kick. And we don't know if it's confirmed after the kick or if it's dodgable. Also valks sweep gives a top heavy too.



Shaolin Sweep also confirms a Top Heavy, and while yes the Sweep must follow the Kick there are many ways he can do the Kick due to it being able to be used from his Hidden Stance. It has a much faster recovery making it much safer (Valk's recovery is so bad that even an OOS character can guardbreak her if they dodge the sweep, which is incredibly easy for experience given the slow startup making it dodgeable on reaction), and a faster start-up. Speaking of, his Kick is very similar to the Shield Charge Valk can use to cancel/follow her heavies with, but better due to again faster start-up and faster recovery. Yet both are Unblockables that you want to side-dodge and can both be followed by Sweeps. Sweep also must follow a Guardbreak (not worth it, should use a Heavy Attack in this situation), a Shield Bash that actually lands (can also be dodged and punished with a GB and confirms nothing, whereas Shaolin Kick confirms a light), or be the 3rd attack in a chain.. thus is predictable. Esp when considering the 2nd attack of each chain must be a light.

Valk's Sweep is only confirmed when she lands a guardbreak, and even then you don't want to Sweep because all Sweeping gets you is a Heavy... which you can also do following a Guardbreak. Aside from that, very dodgeable with a huge punish window. Her Sweep being accessible in a wide variety of ways is their excuse for making her damage so low and her combos so bad (No L-H-X or H-H-X combos) yet her Sweep is literal garbage tier due to the risks associated with using it and the minimal reward (You actually get the Sweep, you deal 25 damage. They sidestep and Guardbreak you, most the cast is going to slap you with a 35-45 damage top heavy) ... and her Sweep is her go to move for an otherwise poor kit aside from her dodges, unlike Shaolin who seems as though he'd be top tier with or without the Sweep.

Knight_Raime
06-22-2018, 12:42 AM
Shaolin Sweep also confirms a Top Heavy, and while yes the Sweep must follow the Kick there are many ways he can do the Kick due to it being able to be used from his Hidden Stance. It has a much faster recovery making it much safer (Valk's recovery is so bad that even an OOS character can guardbreak her if they dodge the sweep, which is incredibly easy for experience given the slow startup making it dodgeable on reaction), and a faster start-up. Speaking of, his Kick is very similar to the Shield Charge Valk can use to cancel/follow her heavies with, but better due to again faster start-up and faster recovery. Yet both are Unblockables that you want to side-dodge and can both be followed by Sweeps. Sweep also must follow a Guardbreak (not worth it, should use a Heavy Attack in this situation), a Shield Bash that actually lands (can also be dodged and punished with a GB and confirms nothing, whereas Shaolin Kick confirms a light), or be the 3rd attack in a chain.. thus is predictable. Esp when considering the 2nd attack of each chain must be a light.

Valk's Sweep is only confirmed when she lands a guardbreak, and even then you don't want to Sweep because all Sweeping gets you is a Heavy... which you can also do following a Guardbreak. Aside from that, very dodgeable with a huge punish window. Her Sweep being accessible in a wide variety of ways is their excuse for making her damage so low and her combos so bad (No L-H-X or H-H-X combos) yet her Sweep is literal garbage tier due to the risks associated with using it and the minimal reward (You actually get the Sweep, you deal 25 damage. They sidestep and Guardbreak you, most the cast is going to slap you with a 35-45 damage top heavy) ... and her Sweep is her go to move for an otherwise poor kit aside from her dodges, unlike Shaolin who seems as though he'd be top tier with or without the Sweep.

I think time will have to tell here. Valk can fake someone out with a soft feint and then sweep follow up.
Where as Shaolin has no soft feints in his kit and half of his kit is locked behind his stance.

Not saying valk isn't in a poor spot rn. Just saying I think it's too early to say who's got the better sweep.

Music_4_Therapy
06-22-2018, 01:24 AM
I think time will have to tell here. Valk can fake someone out with a soft feint and then sweep follow up.
Where as Shaolin has no soft feints in his kit and half of his kit is locked behind his stance.

Not saying valk isn't in a poor spot rn. Just saying I think it's too early to say who's got the better sweep.

What's sad is that it's even a comparison. Valk's whole kit is designed around the sweep and the mixups that lead up to it. She's supposed to be a disabler thats able to control opponents and wittle them down with confirmed damage, hence her chains only having 1 Heavy and dealing only 25 damage per heavy.

I want her Sweep to be just as fast, startup and recovery wise, and for her to have a L-H-L and H-H-L chain. That way she can have more options following her confirmed hit following a sweep/GB. That and either a confirmed light following a Shield Bash or giving it Superior Block property like her dodges/Shield Charge so she can use it to trade. I think that'd fix her.